LOL "Rose Bowl Champion" LOL
Yeah, that's significant.
It's like teams that hang division banners in pro sports. It's pathetic.
There's 3 games that matter the rest of the way. Everything else is an exhibition. Deal with it.
FC: Grier skipping wvu bowl game to focus on the draft
- Thread starter BobPSU92
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LOL "Rose Bowl Champion" LOL
Yeah, that's significant.
It's like teams that hang division banners in pro sports. It's pathetic.
There's 3 games that matter the rest of the way. Everything else is an exhibition. Deal with it.
Some people, especially athletes who actually enjoy the game, have something called pride. They want to play in and win these games because they have some pride and want to go out and win with their team.
For some of these guys, it's the last organized football game they are ever going to play. You don't think it means something to them to go out and win these games?
Are you even going to watch the Citrus Bowl? If so, why? I'm going to watch it, and I'm going to enjoy it. To me, this is the biggest game of the season, other than maybe the Ohio State and Michigan games. Citrus Bowl champs would be quite nice.
Not sure if this was posted or not, but I guess a few more Michigan players read 2020's posts.....
I've said multiple times. The only thing they're playing for is pride. I don't believe that's worth risking an injury for if you're entering the draft. If certain guys want to play in those games that's great but it shouldn't be the expectation for all of them.
Will I watch the Citrus Bowl? Yes, because I'm a football junky. I'll watch any football. I watched Army-Navy last Saturday. I'll watch some of the 5 games we have on Saturday. I won't care who wins any of the games but I'll watch and hope to see some decent football played
I have no idea how this game could be "bigger" than any regular season game which actually determined if we could be in the running for a division, conference or national title. Win or lose are you really going to feel any differently about the 2018 season?
Really? Teams change year to year. Plus, as I said, QB is different. This is a bad look for him IMO.
Yes.
So a Big Ten East title is important, but being Rose Bowl champs is not? Ok. I'm sure that makes sense to someone, somewhere.
So, if we lose to Kentucky you're going to feel worse about 2018? Why?
I don't even understand how you could feel better about it. We still have the same problem moving forward. Michigan, Michigan State and Ohio State.
Some years we'll beat them, others we won't. Not sure it's a problem, but it's exaggerated by some as being one.
Okay, I can agree with this but beating or losing to Kentucky doesn't alter that we need to start beating those teams more often nor does it give us any insight into what the future holds.
So any QB that skips his senior season should be penalized in the draft, but it’s okay for everyone else....got it.
Skipping an entire year where you may accomplish great things is not the same as skipping the Kumquat Bowl because you’ve already had a mediocre season and can’t accomplish anything else.
Dude, your arguments are nonsensical. There is a big difference between off season changes and in season changes—especially at a position like QB. If you don’t understand that as well as how much teams change year to year, then you probably have not been on one.
But if the main argument against skipping a bowl game is they’re letting their teammates down, then how is it not worse when a great player with a year of eligibility left skips an entire year? Yes rosters change, but if a player is due back then that seems to me a bigger case of letting your teammates down than missing one bowl game that means nothing.
There is a massive difference between off-season changes a team can plan for and in-season changes—especially at QB where reps are critical. Rosters also change significantly year to year. That is expected. Having your QB decide to leave the team in-season is not. Again, fair or not, QB is different. It just is. The QB is the captain of the ship and a season is like a massive voyage IMO, Grier is abandoning the ship before bringing the ship back safely to port. That is a bad look.
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No it is not. Just like the fools that thought Fournette or McCafferty would be looked down upon for skipping the bowl games. Your rah rah routine would have held up in the 60's and 70's but these kids know damn well it's a business by the time they enter college, never mind as juniors. There won't be an NFL team that gives that decision a second thought and if you think they will, you're out of your mind. They will care if he can toss the ball and win games, not that he didn't play in a bowl game against SU....sorry but your pissing into the wind here.
What rah rah routine are you talking about, Dude? I never said I have a problem with sure fire first rounders sitting out a bowl. (Which Grier isn’t by the way). My point is that QB is different. That is why Grier’s decision is getting talked about. It might not hurt his stock. That is to be seen. But it most definitely raises red flags that he will be repeatedly asked about during interviews. QB is viewed differently than other positions. That is just a fact. If you don’t get that, then you have probably never been on a team (certainly not a college team).
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so you are wrong. no NFL GM is going to give a second thought to a senior entering the draft not playing in a bowl game, especially QB. Where Grier get drafted (and every board has him in the first round so no idea what you are talking about that he isn't) in the first round will depend on his senior bowl work-outs and interviews and his combine performance and interviews. Nothing he can do in a bowl game that is going to effect his stock in a positive way, only can be negative if he gets dinged up a little bit or has some type of catastrophic bad game.
He will definitely be drafted in the first round. And NFL GM’s will draft a bank robber if he can help their team. No one will give a rat’s ass if he skipped a bowl game if they think he has the skill set to help them win. They overlook entire mediocre seasons if they appear to have the skill set (see Hackenberg) so skipping one game won’t even be a blip on the radar.
This is a VERY weak QB class and Grier could easily work his way up or the Senior Bowl could actually backfire on him....but the bowl game sure as sh!t won't change a GD thing with his draft status. At the senior bowl he can show he can run a Pro style offense or maybe he can't in front of every NFL team around.
This is how f--king stupid you sound about your incredible college days....Did you win a MNC in college on a team sport...No, well I did and I have the ring...so you can't talk about any sports here at all. Not joking, have the ring which means nothing here at all in this discussion. You actually thought that brings anything to the table in this discussion. Sorry but I don't care about your college credentials unless you're a scout, GM, or coach in the NFL...you're not telling me what they are thinking. That is the reality of this discussion board. That may have been the weirdest way someone has tried to validate their opinion on this site...just odd.
Bottom line is the NFL doesn't care one bit about bowl games, not at all. They have seen Grier run that system now for a couple of years. There isn't going to be some new revelation there. Maybe you believe GM's do care about bowl games, but the draft will once again show they don't. Where Grier goes is up to what he does in the last couple months now...sink or swim, but it won't matter if he hangs 50 on SU in a bowl game.
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I bet you think the Scarlett and Grey game is very important though, right?
Sigh, Ohio State-Washington has the same meaning as our game. None. I've said there's 3 games with relevance left but good try Jammie
Ok, tough guy. LOL. If you don’t think he will be asked by every team he interviews with about being the first QB to skip a bowl game, then I don’t know what to tell you. The last thing a QB wants to to do when going into interviews with NFL teams is do something that will make teams question his leadership, competitiveness, and love for the game. Again, QB is different. I am sorry if you can’t get that through your head. But it is. Will it ultimately hurt him? That remains to be seen. But it certainly doesn’t help him. I am sorry if this sentiment is above your level of comprehension.
LOL, you simply are making sh!t up as it’s already been shown the NFL doesn’t care about kids skipping these bowls. Maybe you’re just not very smart or were asleep the last few years. You really do think the position is the real kicker here. LOL, Santa isn’t real either BTW.
That’s funny. “Why did you skip the bowl game?” “Because I’m serious about making football my career.” “Oh, OK....good answer.”
Exactly right. That is the first question he will get and they will love that answer. They want a QB that takes it serious. He’s not out playing or partying.
NFL GM to NC State’s Ryan Finley “We have you rated similar to Will Grier. Why should we take you over him?” Finley “I love the game. I don’t just say I am a leader and competitor, I go out and prove it. I am the QB of my team. The leader. I could never imagine not leading my guys on the field. I love playing the game and would do it for free. If you draft me, I will show up and give you my best no matter what.”
You see how this goes? Here is the deal. Grier is not a sure fire first or second rounder. He has questions. He is not particularly big and comes from a gimmicky B12 offense who has recently produced a draft bust who also looked like a world beater in college. Many folks have Grier rated somewhere between the 4th and 6th QB in this class. If a team is making a close call between multiple QBs on their board, this is the stuff that can make a difference. This is the kind of stuff that can make a QB drop a couple of slots on a teams board—and that can be the difference between the second and fourth round.
Look no further than Conner Cook. He tumbled in the draft in part due to rumors that he wasn’t a good leader. Don’t take my word for it. Attached below is an article that sheds some light on things teams consider when evaluating QB prospects.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.sb...nfl-draft-2016-quarterback-analysis-character
It's a bowl game. If there's a GM in the league that lowers Grier on their board because he skipped a bowl game I'm going to wager he won't be a GM in the league for very long.
Cook had issues other than his "leadership" but the difference was he was questioned throughout his time at Michigan State. He wasn't even a captain.
I do tend to agree that Grier isn't a first round pick for sure. Maybe not even a second. But playing in the bowl game wasn't going to raise his stock. Grier's best option is to prepare for the combine and senior bowl practices. That's the best option for a lot of people and in a few years I think this will become the norm.
I agree it might become the norm with QBs over time. But I wouldnt want to be the first QB to tackle this slippery slope. I believe it will be held against him to a certain extent. And Grier is someone with baggage. He left UF because of PEDs. That put the UF program in a terrible spot at QB and likely contributed to the firing of a coach. That alone is going to raise red flags about his judgment and leadership (arguably put himself above the team by getting suspended as a result of taking illegal substances). Sitting out a bowl game isn’t going to help his agent sell teams on Grier being an amazing leader who can be counted on and will lift the entire organization.
I think what happened at Florida and a lot of other things are much bigger factors than him sitting out a bowl game. I really believe this is a non-factor. I'm in the minority that can't wait for the day that most of these kids skip the bowl games
He’s 6’3....you know, the same size or bigger than almost all the other QB’s that will be in the draft including Ryan Finley. If you don’t think Grier will be a first rounder, then you really don’t know much about football. He’s the best passer in college football and better than most of the QB’s last year. He’s proven himself a leader and much more mature than all the other QB’s in the draft.
His leadership at WVU over the past two seasons will help his agent sell teams on his leadership skill. And his suspension for using an over the counter supplement will hardly hurt his draft spot. If GMs really have a problem with his time at Florida, then playing in a bowl game will do nothing to overcome that. Do you not think his agent or anyone advising him doesn’t want him to maximize his future money and if so, why would they advise him to do something that would hurt him? I would take the word of someone who knows over your opinion on a message board and I’m sure Grier would too.
I agree with you 100% on this topic aside from the fact I'm not sure anyone's a lock to be a first round pick at QB. Yeah, I believe Grier, Haskins, Lock and Herbert probably go in the first but I'm not sure there's really a "first round QB" in this draft. Daniel Jones is in the mix too.
Ok, Dude. I will bet anything that he doesn’t go in the first round (especially if Haskins and Herbert come out).
Did you watch any WVU this year? They have guys running wide open all over the field. And Grier rarely faces a pass rush in B12. Look at the OU game. He was sitting back there all day because OU was often going with a 3 man pass rush. He also throws a ton of quick passes and underneath stuff that artificially boosts completion percentage.
I remember watching him in the Kansas game. Kansas was in the game until the 4Q largely because Grier threw three picks inside his own 5 yard line and fumbled a couple of times. WVU kept on throwing it in that game despite the fact they were gaining great yardage every time they ran the ball. My buddy who is a former WVU player would constantly complain how he felt Holgerson was calling plays to pad Grier’s stats for the Heisman. He is thrilled that Grier retuned the favor by bailing on the bowl game.
Got it. So there are a bunch of guys jumbled together in terms of how they are viewed by scouts in this draft. Grier is the only one who made a business decision to sit out their bowl. And you don’t think there is a chance that will hurt him? Ok. We can agree to disagree.
His draft status will have nothing to do with the Bowl game. You don’t understand what the NFL cares about. Teams will grade him based on his abilities, not this decision. Sorry you cannot deal with that reality but that is how the NFL works. You can pretend some GM is fretting over the Bowl game he didn’t play in. Keep thinking that.
There's no chance it will hurt. None. The key is how he performs in the Senior Bowl, the combine and at his pro day. The NFL knows he committed to football by preparing for his future.
Yep. NFL teams don’t consider the whole picture when evaluating QBs. Ok. Tell that to Conner Cook. (See article below). Why does Chad Kelly not have a job? From a talent standpoint, he probably has more skills than Grier. Why does Kaepernick and Tebow not have jobs? They are probably better than some of the backups in the league. But the off the field decisions / stuff makes it not worth having them on the roster.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.sb...nfl-draft-2016-quarterback-analysis-character
Got it. There are all sorts of things that can make a team choose one QB over another when deciding their board. Sometimes the calls are razor thin. If you think there is zero chance that Grier’s decision to bail on his team could make a scouting department favor someone else who they believe is similarly talented, then I don’t know what to tell you.
Imagine two very close candidates for a job. One left his last employer in a little bit of a lurch by leaving before finishing out a project he was in charge of. The other candidate finished every project he started. Do you honestly think there is zero chance that those factors could impact who gets the job?
Again, QB is different. Teams factor both tangible and intangibles into their decision making. This could hurt him. To dismiss that notion outright is naive. Listen to Greg McElroy’s show. He talked about this today. In his view, Grier’s decision could possibly hurt him. You should call into his show and explain why you think there is ZERO chance Grier’s decision could bite him a bit. It would be great to hear you stumble through that argument.
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