Some positives
- Thread starter bdgan
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Your inability to admit the fact that bowl games are not scrimmages is mind boggling.
As much as you want them to be meaningless, they are not.
I think it will depend greatly on how the 12 team model goes. if the first round games are always blowouts in favor of the higher seed, or if early round attendance/viewership isn't great, then I don't think expansion will occur quickly (if at all).
It's not at all--they're meaningless. I don't understand why you can't admit with a playoff they're no longer important or relevant
Too bad bowl games are not scrimmages, otherwise you might have a real point.
The TV contract money will make it absolutely fine. And games between 5-12 teams aren't going to all be blowouts. Let's be real. The second round games might be rough but the first won't.
Then why are kids skipping them and not playoff games?
If they're the same, which you want to pretend they are, why are they skipping them?
It might be fine. But we won't know that until we see it.
First of all there are only 4 teams that make the playoff right now. That's super different than 32. So your comparison is apples to oranges.
Where did I say "bowls are the same as the playoff?" They obviously are not. But bowls have MEANING. It's a different meaning than the playoff but it is still meaning.
But has anyone skipped a playoff game?
What's the meaning? Not "I bought tickets" or "the players care"--what is the actual meaning of the game? Not the experience but the game?
Honest question: if there was a 12 team playoff this year does anyone think there'd be any discussion about Chop or Olu sitting out?
No because NY6 matchups are "terminal", i.e. there is no next round. I think there is a concern (for some teams) about if you host first round game, will fans (who have limited budgets) come to round 1 or hope they advance to round 2 to attend (i.e. not everyone can afford to go to multiple games). Probably not an issue for the PSU's of the world but certainly a possible concern for other schools.
Depends on many factors. What seed are they? Who is their opponent? Are they both fully healthy?
If it's a 32 team playoff and PSU is at 25 seed, do you think the likelihood of them sitting out changes?
Can you tell me the name of a program you don't believe will be able to attract fans for a playoff game
Definitely not an issue for Penn State--stop with the probably.
I don't think there's any way either of them sit out
Olu came back to win try to win a title
We could be the 32nd seed at Georgia and every single kid that was healthy enough to play would unlike the bowl game.
Define skipped. I'm sure there were injured players who were borderline who didn't play. But that's almost impossible to know.
I really think you have reading comprehension issues. Again, NOTHING has inherent meaning. Things only have meaning or value as we assing them that meaning or value. In other words, many people think the Mona Lisa is great art. I would not choose to hang it on my wall. It has no inherent value/meaning.
If people assign value to the Mona Lisa, that means it has value/meaning to those people. That's fine. It's also fine that I don't find it meaningful.
Back to football:
It is clear that some (many) people assign meaning to bowl games because people buy tickets, people watch on TV, sponsors throw money at games, advertisers pay for TV spots and most players choose to play in them.
If a minority of people (e.g. you), think bowl games are silly/pointless/meaningless, you can think that. But it does affect the ablity of other people to assign meaning to them.
Game reps, playing in a new stadium, playing against a new opponent, getting seen by NFL scouts, being with your teammates for one last time, the thrill of competition...want me to go on?
You are speculating just in the same way you are speculating that Olu will sit out the bowl game.
Has a player announced they were skipping a playoff game to prepare for the draft--like players do all the time with bowl games?
None of that gives the game "meaning"
And all of those are reasons to play--doesn't create meaning.
I've never said he will. I think he should just like i think he should have entered the draft last year but his life and I'll respect whatever he decides. You won't respect his decision if he sits out. That's the problem
Let's say Tulane finishes next year 12-1 and ranked 8th. That means they would host a game at home against the 12th seed, correct?
Tulane has an enrollment of <8000 students. They are not a (recent) historical football power (i.e. not many casual fans regionally or nationally).
the vast majority of players play in bowl games.
Why not? Do you not accept the concept that nothing has meaning until someone assigns it meaning?
Reasons to play give it meaning. See above. You cannot be this dim.
Why is that a problem? if he's healthy he should play. It's not my decision, but I know if I was his teammate, I would be pissed at anyone who sat out (assuming they were fully healthy).
Tulane averaged over 20k this year for home games against teams like North Texas, UTSA, Nicholls State, etc but you don't think hosting a P5 team in a playoff game that they would be able to fill that stadium of 30k to play Texas or Penn State or Alabama at home? Is this a real concern?
Do you see how empty bowl games are?
There was a time not too long ago where that was COMPLETELY UNHEARD OF for bowl games as well.
And all play in playoff games--or have so far
Reasons don't give it meaning. The only meaning is a title. If a post-season game in not part of an existing playoff it has no meaning.
Correct and McCaffrey showed players that NFL scout don't care if you skip a bowl game
The reaction will be different if it's a playoff game because that raises questions on competitiveness. Skipping a bowl game doesn't. If anything, scout think you're smart for that.
I'm about one more horrible post from you away from blocking my second person ever on this site.
NOTHING has inherent meaning.
You saying something doesn't have meaning is irrelevant if other people think it does. I assure you that more people (especially people that matter: coaches, players, those who spend $$) think bowls have meaning than share your weird opinion.
Hard to know. I do know that a lot of fans will have to choose between going to round 1 vs a later round game and that will affect attendance.
Season tickets for Tulane were about $250. I'm guessing a single game playoff ticket would be about $250. That makes a difference.
And people won't pay for that to see them play a P5 School in a player game at home?
Are you being purposefully obtuse or actually missing the point?
Tulane does not have a lot of fans. It's not a big school, they have no been good in recent history and they live in the shadow of LSU (i.e. the "Walmart fans" are almost certainly Bayou Bengals).
If they decide to pony up to see a first round matchup at home against a P5 school, MANY of those fans will not also make the trip to the semifinals (if Tulane wins). The fandom isn't there, people don't have unlimited budgets, the math doesn't support it.
Edit: to be clear, I don't think this will be a big problem with 12 teams. But if you go to 32 teams, how many games do you think the average season ticket holder is going to go to? Are they going to bail on the 1st round and save their $$ for a championship game? Wait for semifinals? Only go to first round? No way to know that.
Tulane's stadium holds 30k. They don't even need to fill it to have a better turnout than most bowl games.
Where we aren't aligned is you think bowls would still host. Playoffs would be at the higher seed until the title game.
I think the stadiums will be packed for all games. But you're also looking at neutral site games throughout apparently which isn't how it's set up anywhere else nor should it be in FBS
Just to follow up, Olu played the second most OL snaps against MSU.
So your assertion that he's sat out a lot is incorrect.
Snap Counts: Penn State vs. Michigan State
61 Nittany Lions played in the regular season finale
www.blackshoediaries.com
4th most per the link you provided. He sat most of the second halfJust to follow up, Olu played the second most OL snaps against MSU.
So your assertion that he's sat out a lot is incorrect.
Snap Counts: Penn State vs. Michigan State
61 Nittany Lions played in the regular season finale
Do we have any board members who are parents, or very close relatives, of a D1 major college football player? If so, and if that player is or has been at a school that played in a bowl game, can that member provide that player's insight as to whether or not said game was meaningless?
The meaningless argument has popped up around bowl season here before. I'm inclined to think that between the vast majority of participants of the involved teams, the 2 universities, parents, alumni, fans, TV networks, advertisers, etc, they are NOT meaningless, nor are they treated as scrimmages.
But I did not play D1 football and neither did either of my kids. Without that perspective a definitive answer is hard to give, but the evidence most certainly lines up on the side of the bowl games meaning something.
The meaningless argument has popped up around bowl season here before. I'm inclined to think that between the vast majority of participants of the involved teams, the 2 universities, parents, alumni, fans, TV networks, advertisers, etc, they are NOT meaningless, nor are they treated as scrimmages.
But I did not play D1 football and neither did either of my kids. Without that perspective a definitive answer is hard to give, but the evidence most certainly lines up on the side of the bowl games meaning something.
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Third most actually. 64, 61 them him. It's funny that when I rarely make a mistake you make an even worse mistake....LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL.
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