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Time to give Iowa credit where credit is due?

On this site you are very easy to silence.
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In every great super hero movie there is a great villain ... we are lucky to live in a world with sequels! Every year is different, every year brings new excitement. 8 weeks from today brings the greatest show to all of us fans ... get ready KC, the swarms of bad ears and puffed up lats will be in town.
 
Every dynasty needs a whipping boy and Iowa is the PSU whipping boy. It will continue as long as Cael is in charge and the NLWC is thriving which has no end in sight. Its all about the room....
 
Every dynasty needs a whipping boy and Iowa is the PSU whipping boy. It will continue as long as Cael is in charge and the NLWC is thriving which has no end in sight. Its all about the room....
It’s not just Iowa. Every other program gets whipped by PSU right now.
 
I didn’t read the OP’s full post, but yeah - hard to not be impressed with how they’ve done thus far. But we’ll see how March goes.

Let’s not lose sight of the fact that all their best guys, absent maybe Ayala, are transfers. Their fans complain about our use of the portal but check their starting lineup as per wrestlestat:

125 Drake came to Iowa from high school
133 Teske is a transfer
141 Woods is a transfer
149 Voinovich is a transfer
157 Franek is a transfer
165 Caliendo is a transfer
174 Kennedy/Arnold came to Iowa from high school
184 Riggins came to Iowa from high school.
197 Glazier came to Iowa from high school. (But they wanted to start a transfer)
285 Hill came to Iowa from high school

Half their starting lineup are transfers and the coaches tried for 60%. But Iowa fans decry Cael “recruiting over” guys.
 
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It’s not just Iowa. Every other program gets whipped by PSU right now.
Would love it if somebody could link the article by the Iowa columnist that was written when Cael was hired (even if the comment section is long gone).

There's a reason why Iowa is the whipping boy. Don't recall any other programs that reacted to the situation in such a condescending manner.

For everybody that's confused about our "obsession" with Iowa: Please read this article, if it's posted, and you will find your answer.
 
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It’s not just Iowa. Every other program gets whipped by PSU right now.
This year we will whip the 2nd and 3rd teams combined. We can realistically finish with 10 AAs and anywhere from 3 to 6 Champions at the NCAAs. We could set such a fantastic record that it will never be broken (until we break it a few years from now). How's the view from GIA now?
loop playing GIF by Sam Jack Gilmore
 
This year we will whip the 2nd and 3rd teams combined. We can realistically finish with 10 AAs and anywhere from 3 to 6 Champions at the NCAAs. We could set such a fantastic record that it will never be broken (until we break it a few years from now). How's the view from GIA now?
loop playing GIF by Sam Jack Gilmore
With Davis's emergence, if SVN hadn't gotten hurt, there would have been a nonzero chance that the nationals finals would have been a PSU dual match vs "Field". And that PSU would have won it.
 
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Iowa is the exact same program today that they were 15 years ago. They have neither improved, nor regressed. The only difference is PSU, and it's gonna stay that way for a while because of the leadership chasm between the two programs.

Yes, Iowa is the same program they were 15 years ago. But not only has Penn State changed, but the sport has changed as well.
 
Iowa has a tough dual team, but they will be hard-pressed to get a trophy this year.

At nationals, they will need more than a few kids to score double digits. Woods and Franek are the only two to reach that last year, and I see only 2 or 3 others who might get there this year. Missou, Mich, and NCS have more scoring potential, IMO.
 
Iowa has a tough dual team, but they will be hard-pressed to get a trophy this year.

At nationals, they will need more than a few kids to score double digits. Woods and Franek are the only two to reach that last year, and I see only 2 or 3 others who might get there this year. Missou, Mich, and NCS have more scoring potential, IMO.
So you have Iowa 5th at best? Interesting.
 
So you have Iowa 5th at best? Interesting.

Potentially, yes.

After Woods and Franek, Ayala is the most likely to go deep. Caliendo parlayed his AA finish into 6.5 points last year, and he appears to be the same wrestler against a similar field. Kennedy scored 1.5 points last year, and his best win at 174 this year is over #23 Gaitan ... he got majored by #7 Incontrera.

Like I said, though, they are a much better dual team. Kennedy, for instance, might hand-fight and stall his way to a 6-point decision loss to Star but get outscored by 20 team points at NCAAs.

Maybe they will surprise, we'll see.
 
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Iowa has a tough dual team, but they will be hard-pressed to get a trophy this year.

At nationals, they will need more than a few kids to score double digits. Woods and Franek are the only two to reach that last year, and I see only 2 or 3 others who might get there this year. Missou, Mich, and NCS have more scoring potential, IMO.
Cornell?
 
Potentially, yes.

After Woods and Franek, Ayala is the most likely to go deep. Caliendo parlayed his AA finish into 6.5 points last year, and he appears to be the same wrestler against a similar field. Kennedy scored 1.5 points last year, and his best win at 174 this year is over #23 Gaitan ... he got majored by #7 Incontrera.

Like I said, though, they are a much better dual team. Kennedy, for instance, might hand-fight and stall his way to a 6-point decision loss to Star but get outscored by 20 team points at NCAAs.

Maybe they will surprise, we'll see.
Iowa has a favorite to win (Woods) plus Ayala who, while there is no one favorite at 125 this year, is definitely in the top tier of a large pool of contenders. Add Franek likely to go pretty deep in the tournament, Caliendo likely to be an AA somewhere even if the class is too deep for him to realistically challenge to win, Glazier who is looking like he may slip into the AA conversation. Let's say one champion (maybe two) and 5 total AAs. Penn State is going to suck so much oxygen out of the room this year that it's going to be hard to find another team that can match that.

Mizzou has one favorite in KOT, but falls off quickly after that. The Elam brothers and Mocco are a good bet to be low AAs, but who else? Surtin maybe, but he's in a tier below Ayala in the 125 craziness.

Michigan? LOL. They barely even have anyone with an outside chance to win (Gomez maybe? I don't see him beating Lovett...). They have like 5 or 6 Caliendo type low AA scorers in DeAug, Ragusin, Gomez, Amine, Griffith, and Davison. They'll be lucky to sniff the top 5.

NC St.? They also have pretty much no title contenders. Hidlay should be a high AA, potentially runner-up, but like Mich, after him, it's a handful of low AA types like Orine, Jack, Arrington, and Scott.

Ok St. may be able to make a push at Iowa. Fix will be there right to the end, as well as Olejnik and Plott. Their depth falls off after those guys who. Ohio St. unfortunately has too many injuries. If they had both Mendez and Sasso competing for a title with Bouzakis and Kharchla in the high AA range, they could have been contenders but missing half of their major scoring is too much to overcome. Lehigh actually could be interesting with two potential champs at the start in Stanich (if he doesn't RS, LOL) and Crookham and two hammers on the back end with Beard and Taylor. They just need a couple guys in between to overachieve to put themselves in the race.

Cornell is probably the closest if they get a couple breaks. They have two legit contenders in Vito and Shapiro plus high AA candidates in Foca, Cardenas, and Ramirez. They probably also need an improbable run from Ungar or Cornella since they will get zeros from multiple positions.

All in all, I still expect Iowa to be a really uninspiring 2nd place finisher this year.
 
Ayala is going to AA and in the wide-open 125 lb weight class, is a potential finalist

Woods has already been a finalist.

Franek was 4th last year; Caliendo was 7th. I expect better results this year from each.

That looks like 60ish points from those four to me, before bonus. I’ll give them 10 bonus points. Up to 70 now.

R12ish from Teske, Voinovich and Glazier with a few bonus points adds 10ish points. Now we’re at 80 and prob getting a team trophy.

Pull Arnold’s shirt and you’re definitely getting a team trophy and in mix, if not the favorite, for 2nd.

$0.02
 
Ayala is going to AA and in the wide-open 125 lb weight class, is a potential finalist

Woods has already been a finalist.

Franek was 4th last year; Caliendo was 7th. I expect better results this year from each.

That looks like 60ish points from those four to me, before bonus. I’ll give them 10 bonus points. Up to 70 now.

R12ish from Teske, Voinovich and Glazier with a few bonus points adds 10ish points. Now we’re at 80 and prob getting a team trophy.

Pull Arnold’s shirt and you’re definitely getting a team trophy and in mix, if not the favorite, for 2nd.

$0.02
Arnold replacing PK would have them firmly entrenched in 2nd. Teske R12? LMAO. Teske should be happy if he's even still the starter in the postseason.
 
Iowa has a favorite to win (Woods) plus Ayala who, while there is no one favorite at 125 this year, is definitely in the top tier of a large pool of contenders. Add Franek likely to go pretty deep in the tournament, Caliendo likely to be an AA somewhere even if the class is too deep for him to realistically challenge to win, Glazier who is looking like he may slip into the AA conversation. Let's say one champion (maybe two) and 5 total AAs. Penn State is going to suck so much oxygen out of the room this year that it's going to be hard to find another team that can match that.

Mizzou has one favorite in KOT, but falls off quickly after that. The Elam brothers and Mocco are a good bet to be low AAs, but who else? Surtin maybe, but he's in a tier below Ayala in the 125 craziness.

Michigan? LOL. They barely even have anyone with an outside chance to win (Gomez maybe? I don't see him beating Lovett...). They have like 5 or 6 Caliendo type low AA scorers in DeAug, Ragusin, Gomez, Amine, Griffith, and Davison. They'll be lucky to sniff the top 5.

NC St.? They also have pretty much no title contenders. Hidlay should be a high AA, potentially runner-up, but like Mich, after him, it's a handful of low AA types like Orine, Jack, Arrington, and Scott.

Ok St. may be able to make a push at Iowa. Fix will be there right to the end, as well as Olejnik and Plott. Their depth falls off after those guys who. Ohio St. unfortunately has too many injuries. If they had both Mendez and Sasso competing for a title with Bouzakis and Kharchla in the high AA range, they could have been contenders but missing half of their major scoring is too much to overcome. Lehigh actually could be interesting with two potential champs at the start in Stanich (if he doesn't RS, LOL) and Crookham and two hammers on the back end with Beard and Taylor. They just need a couple guys in between to overachieve to put themselves in the race.

Cornell is probably the closest if they get a couple breaks. They have two legit contenders in Vito and Shapiro plus high AA candidates in Foca, Cardenas, and Ramirez. They probably also need an improbable run from Ungar or Cornella since they will get zeros from multiple positions.

All in all, I still expect Iowa to be a really uninspiring 2nd place finisher this year.

DeAug, Gomez, Lewan, Griffith, and Davison have all scored 10 or more points in the past. They might be suffering from the old man's disease this year, but at least they've done it. Only 2 Hawks have done it.
 
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Iowa has a favorite to win (Woods) plus Ayala who, while there is no one favorite at 125 this year, is definitely in the top tier of a large pool of contenders. Add Franek likely to go pretty deep in the tournament, Caliendo likely to be an AA somewhere even if the class is too deep for him to realistically challenge to win, Glazier who is looking like he may slip into the AA conversation. Let's say one champion (maybe two) and 5 total AAs. Penn State is going to suck so much oxygen out of the room this year that it's going to be hard to find another team that can match that.

Mizzou has one favorite in KOT, but falls off quickly after that. The Elam brothers and Mocco are a good bet to be low AAs, but who else? Surtin maybe, but he's in a tier below Ayala in the 125 craziness.

Michigan? LOL. They barely even have anyone with an outside chance to win (Gomez maybe? I don't see him beating Lovett...). They have like 5 or 6 Caliendo type low AA scorers in DeAug, Ragusin, Gomez, Amine, Griffith, and Davison. They'll be lucky to sniff the top 5.

NC St.? They also have pretty much no title contenders. Hidlay should be a high AA, potentially runner-up, but like Mich, after him, it's a handful of low AA types like Orine, Jack, Arrington, and Scott.

Ok St. may be able to make a push at Iowa. Fix will be there right to the end, as well as Olejnik and Plott. Their depth falls off after those guys who. Ohio St. unfortunately has too many injuries. If they had both Mendez and Sasso competing for a title with Bouzakis and Kharchla in the high AA range, they could have been contenders but missing half of their major scoring is too much to overcome. Lehigh actually could be interesting with two potential champs at the start in Stanich (if he doesn't RS, LOL) and Crookham and two hammers on the back end with Beard and Taylor. They just need a couple guys in between to overachieve to put themselves in the race.

Cornell is probably the closest if they get a couple breaks. They have two legit contenders in Vito and Shapiro plus high AA candidates in Foca, Cardenas, and Ramirez. They probably also need an improbable run from Ungar or Cornella since they will get zeros from multiple positions.

All in all, I still expect Iowa to be a really uninspiring 2nd place finisher this year.
Returning NCAA points:
1. PSU 127.5 (does not include Van Ness)
2. Cornell 62.0
3. Missouri 61.0
4. Michigan 58.0
5. NC State 48.0
T6. Nebraska, VT 47.0
8. Iowa 42.5

These include all incoming transfers, except Cannon since he's been replaced by Ragusin. Ayala's 2022 nationals included for Iowa. Freshmen obviously not included.

Iowa will probably break into the top 4 with Ayala + Glazier a lock to improve upon their combined 0.5 returning points. But they are very unlikely to catch Cornell, especially with Shapiro added to the lineup.
 
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Going back to the OP - it’s hard to give credit to TnT for limiting the damage to the chaos THEY CREATED. Its like patting the arsonist on the back for keeping his fire from burning down the entire house.
TnT leadership and decisions have led to their mess.
 
Returning NCAA points:
1. PSU 127.5 (does not include Van Ness)
2. Cornell 62.0
3. Missouri 61.0
4. Michigan 58.0
5. NC State 48.0
T6. Nebraska, VT 47.0
8. Iowa 42.5

These include all incoming transfers, except Cannon since he's been replaced by Ragusin. Ayala's 2022 nationals included for Iowa. Freshmen obviously not included.

Iowa will probably break into the top 4 with Ayala + Glazier a lock to improve upon their combined 0.5 returning points. But they are very unlikely to catch Cornell, especially with Shapiro added to the lineup.
So 127.5 for us PLUS Psycho, Davis and (Kasak?) ??
 
Going back to the OP - it’s hard to give credit to TnT for limiting the damage to the chaos THEY CREATED. Its like patting the arsonist on the back for keeping his fire from burning down the entire house.
TnT leadership and decisions have led to their mess.
That was not the intent here. Absolutely much of the pain this past year was indeed self inflicteded and avoidable. My observation was largely, despite TnTs limitations and the nightmare that has been this past 10 months for the program, they have actually consistently delivered solid performances from a team and individuals that would seem vulnerable.
 
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So 127.5 for us PLUS Psycho, Davis and (Kasak?) ??
How we get to 170:

Likely:
- Returning 127.5
- Psycho 18.5 (3rd + bonus)
- Davis + Kasak 12.0 (5th + R12, no bonus)
- Kerk +4 (2nd --> 1st)
Subtotal = 162.0

Gave Psycho 3rd because he'll very likely get O'Toole or Carr in the semis; last year's highest-scoring 3rd was 18.5 pts.

We'd still need to find 8 more pts out of:
- Levi 2 --> 1?
- Beau 3 --> 2 or 1?
- Truax 4 --> ??
- Nagao 5 --> ??
- More bonus?

Plus no upsets and no more injuries.

Feasible.
 
Going back to the OP - it’s hard to give credit to TnT for limiting the damage to the chaos THEY CREATED. Its like patting the arsonist on the back for keeping his fire from burning down the entire house.
TnT leadership and decisions have led to their mess.
I agree with you and that guy that made post #31. 🤣
 
Iowa will finish 2nd.

You heard it here 67th.
 
How we get to 170:

Likely:
- Returning 127.5
- Psycho 18.5 (3rd + bonus)
- Davis + Kasak 12.0 (5th + R12, no bonus)
- Kerk +4 (2nd --> 1st)
Subtotal = 162.0

Gave Psycho 3rd because he'll very likely get O'Toole or Carr in the semis; last year's highest-scoring 3rd was 18.5 pts.

We'd still need to find 8 more pts out of:
- Levi 2 --> 1?
- Beau 3 --> 2 or 1?
- Truax 4 --> ??
- Nagao 5 --> ??
- More bonus?

Plus no upsets and no more injuries.

Feasible.
We want to beat 170, so we need to find at least 9 pts.
 
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In short, I say yes!

Putting aside the self imposed distractions, destruction and dysfunction, when viewed from a different perspective, as a fan of the craft itself, I am starting to get amazed at how they are performing this season.

Inarguably that program has gone through the most difficult 12 month period of any in history by a long shot. What the Hawks and their fans have endured in one year makes the Surriano spectacle look like a casual walk at sunrise through a spring meadow with butterflies dancing about

I won't catch them all but just a sample:

The somewhat humiliating loss of their legend before his coronation as one of the all timer 4x champions and the spectical of the meme in the stands.

The loss of top recruit superstar Nate Jesuroga to of all things, burnout and the idea of becoming a navy seal.

The gain of a top recruit only to lose yet another hammer Cody Chittum as a consequence.

The blockbuster story of gambling and potential suspensions of what for months was only known as several significant starters. Only to have the program emotions toyed with as the NCAA redefined the punishments, introducing a glimmer of hope. Names were named, and ultimately the punishments came down more severe than most had thought things were trending. Final appeals created anothet sliver of hope only to be dashed as well. Now some are hanging on to investigator malfeasance as if these kids might still get another chance. Colorful press conferences and constant banter excusing the offenses with claims everyone is doing it, Iowa is being singled out unfairly, and that noone is asking the right questions.

Then there is the fast car package deal. Could all three result in a couple of national champions, with one aimed at Aaron Brooks and fielding a lineup that can take on the juggernaut that is Penn State? AJ has the charges dropped and rumors fly for months that the big three are a done deal.

On to the soldier salute and where the program's new savior former 197 National champion will have his coming out party, and demonstrate that the cobwebs of 2 years off are non existent. That expose' could not have gone more poorly. Not only was the performance on the mat lack luster, clarifying that getting AJ back to champion form would say the very least be a work in progress, but AJ did AJ things, far exceeding his worst detectors expectations. Lost in all of this was AJs first introduction to his home fans. He delivered the now infamous FU to the home crowd and a meme that will last no doubt for at least a decade in the spotlight. The dream of the three saviors turns into the spectacle of the three stooges overnight. Down but not out AJ may still come back, but the Iowa faithful now seem firmly split down the middle of not mostly against such an unwise decision.

It was exhausting to write above, but I can say through all of this unrelenting torment, one thing has happened:

The hawks are actually a very damned good patchwork fabrick, bailingwire and duct tape team. In the midst of the constant tornado of what was this off season, I have to give real credit to TnT and what they have accomplished.

They held their own and pulled in some hammers from the Portal. Iowa was arguably the third most successful harvester this year behind PSU and Mich, while far ahead of most other programs. Granted bags of money didn't land several they targeted.

They just landed an awesome new hammer in Deluca.

TnT absolutely have schooled two top coaches strategically jockeying the lineup to pull victory from what could have been defeat in key duals. In particular somewhat embarrassing their #2 most hated enemy in Iowa State. Those wins lay squarely at the feet of Tom Brands.

And, yes it does appear that Iowa can develop wrestlers. PK may have found a home up a weight.
Drake is looking like a potential finalist.

Glazier is one of the bestest stories in the country. His achievements are two-fold. First, he is just a hard worker who is on an upward trajectory, anyone who thinks this kid can't AA is kidding himself right now. Secondly, he may have single handedly given the program the best gift possible. His tenacity and fight exposed AJ for what he really is infront of the whole world and in so doing just might have saved the program from even bigger embarrassment. We will just have to see starting next fall. He showed AJ's game needs work, and he was able to provoke out the narcissistic beast that is AJ Ferrari. AJ delivered in spades, doing honestly what I thought as the unthinkable to a home crowd during essentially what was a combination employment interview/coronation. A classic for the ages.

All in all, I feel for the hard core Iowa fans, the team of dedicated kids sweating it out every day, the staff, and what they have had to deal with.

If you peer through the fog of war that has been 2023 for that program there is a hell of a lot to acknowledge and look upon with a sense of amazement.

You may not hear it from me again anytime soon, but as coaches of these specific kids, on that roster, at this time, I have to raise my glass and toast the Brands for a job well done!
Michigan drubbed them.
 
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