2019 NFL combine thread

[creamery freak]

I'm very happy for Miles. He didn't piss and moan about sitting behind Saquon, he just kept working hard while waiting for his shot. I hope he ends up with a team that lets him reach his full potential. Great representative of PSU, imo.

Agree with everything you said. The biggest difference to me is Saquon didn't fumble and continued with that into his rookie NFL season, which is another way he is a freak athlete. If Miles can clean that part of his game up he should have a nice career.

 

[TiredOldLion]

Just watched the video of 10 RBs

at the combine with the best 40yd dash times.
Why don’t they put these guys in cleats and a two point stance? And maybe have them look back for a pass at the twenty yd mark.
Just the difference in starting skill/technique makes the top guys undividable for speed.

 

[heckmans]

at the combine with the best 40yd dash times.
Why don’t they put these guys in cleats and a two point stance? And maybe have them look back for a pass at the twenty yd mark.
Just the difference in starting skill/technique makes the top guys undividable for speed.

That's what the game film is for. Combine is pure measurables.

 

[N&B4PSU]

Just changed the channel and caught Miles doing one of the drills, got a wow from one of the announcers!

Not surprising at all. Somebody halfway knowledgeable (or so it seemed) predicted he'd turn out to be the best RB of the draft and would kill it in the combine. Love that he catches the ball so easily.. he hangs onto the rock, he's gonna make some pro team very happy (and he blocks).

 

[N&B4PSU]

From Sluggo:

http://www.nfl.com/combine/tracker#day=friday

Ryan Bates ran a 5.09 40.

on Bates:
Overview
College tackle lacking the physical profile to stay at tackle in the NFL but deficient in leverage and power that could make a transition to guard too challenging. Bates was an unassuming run-blocker but showed some life in pass pro. His down blocks don't create much push and he rarely plays under the pads of his opponents. He's not as broad or strong as teams will want along the interior, but he could be given a shot at center for a move-oriented run team. His ability to be an emergency tackle could help his roster cause.
on McGovern..
Overview
Reliable run blocker with NFL-ready size and strength but exploitable holes in his pass sets that need to be addressed as quickly as possible. His starting experience at both center and guard could bring additional interest in McGovern, who would be a bigger, stronger option at center for teams facing odd-front power in their division. He is a good fit in gap and inside-zone run schemes, but his tendency to over-set in pass protection could be challenging to correct. He's an early starter as a Day 2 pick, but Year 1 could have ups and downs

Sounds like both would have benefitted from another year... more so Bates. We'll see how they draft... hope this wasn't a bad move.

 

[Ranger Dan]

at the combine with the best 40yd dash times.
Why don’t they put these guys in cleats and a two point stance? And maybe have them look back for a pass at the twenty yd mark.
Just the difference in starting skill/technique makes the top guys undividable for speed.

They do other drills to simulate skills, but they also want to measure raw speed.

 

[canuckhal]

Sanders winning day. "Seen as mid-round selection, Sanders’ performance on Friday as well as his game tape may have solidified himself as a top-5 running back in this year’s draft class."

https://draftwire.usatoday.com/2019...-losers-friday-andre-dillard-miles-sanders/4/

Did Sanders’ lack of experience and mental processing speed limit his play speed and hide his athleticism? It’s possible; Sanders only has 276 rushing attempts to his name. Or did I just flat out miss how special of an athlete he was? User error is always a possibility.

https://www.bleedinggreennation.com...s-results-philadelphia-eagles-draft-prospects

 

[sss]

Sounds like both would have benefitted from another year... more so Bates. We'll see how they draft... hope this wasn't a bad move.

I don't know, people suggest this all the time. If Sanders is one of the top 5 RBs off the board would he have improved that with another year back? Maybe he would have had a monster year, maybe not. Maybe he would have gotten hurt. Plus there is a new crop of RBs next year to compete against. And one thing that is more of a benefit this year than next is number of career carries. Same as Bates. How much more film can he put out there? Wherever he gets drafted may be his ceiling for this year or last. His testing numbers will not hurt him, and being able to get 3-5 more reps on the bench next year also would not change it. Sometimes the minimal upside coming back has to be weighed vs the catastrophic downside that could happen. Just my opinion, of course.

 

[sluggo72]

I don't know, people suggest this all the time. If Sanders is one of the top 5 RBs off the board would he have improved that with another year back? Maybe he would have had a monster year, maybe not. Maybe he would have gotten hurt. Plus there is a new crop of RBs next year to compete against. And one thing that is more of a benefit this year than next is number of career carries. Same as Bates. How much more film can he put out there? Wherever he gets drafted may be his ceiling for this year or last. His testing numbers will not hurt him, and being able to get 3-5 more reps on the bench next year also would not change it. Sometimes the minimal upside coming back has to be weighed vs the catastrophic downside that could happen. Just my opinion, of course.

Except of course the NFL disagrees with you. If you are not a sure fire 1st or 2nd round pick like a SB, they think you should stay in school so out of our guys who declared who is that? So other than that guy they should have come back to school. They can get insurance against injury and PSU can pay for it.

 

[interrobang]

In this class though, a top 5 RB may go in the 3rd round.

 

[sss]

Except of course the NFL disagrees with you. If you are not a sure fire 1st or 2nd round pick like a SB, they think you should stay in school so out of our guys who declared who is that? So other than that guy they should have come back to school. They can get insurance against injury and PSU can pay for it.

Except that sanders and bates have graduated, correct? The question I was asking was whether they would improve their draft stock at all by coming back. No way to possibly answer that, but each player must. My opinion is that they may not have been able to improve their stock much. Bates is not going to become a top OL pick by playing next year, and very few RBs go in the 1st round. I don’t think anyone wants to count on an insurance check and could Bates even get a policy? For selfish reasons I would love for them to come back, but for draft reasons I am not sure how much sense it makes. Again my opinion.

 

[sluggo72]

Except that sanders and bates have graduated, correct? The question I was asking was whether they would improve their draft stock at all by coming back. No way to possibly answer that, but each player must. My opinion is that they may not have been able to improve their stock much. Bates is not going to become a top OL pick by playing next year, and very few RBs go in the 1st round. I don’t think anyone wants to count on an insurance check and could Bates even get a policy? For selfish reasons I would love for them to come back, but for draft reasons I am not sure how much sense it makes. Again my opinion.

Again the NFL disagrees with you. I’ll rephrase, if you have eligibility left and are not a first or second sure pick you should come back. Another year practicing your craft is the way to go
Not my opinion the NFLs opinion

 

[interrobang]

Except that sanders and bates have graduated, correct? .

Sanders is still a year away from graduating

 

[LionJim]

Again the NFL disagrees with you. I’ll rephrase, if you have eligibility left and are not a first or second sure pick you should come back. Another year practicing your craft is the way to go
Not my opinion the NFLs opinion

I’d appreciate a link quoting some NFL DPPs to this effect.

 

[sss]

Sanders is still a year away from graduating

Thanks for that. If he gets drafted in the 2nd or 3rd round still hard to argue that he should have come back, except from a fans perspective. Can always finish that one year later if the millions he makes in the NFL are not enough.

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

I’m not sure why, but PSU fans as a group never seemed to recognize what a high-end college RB Sanders was.
Maybe they didn’t recognize that he was playing in a - relatively - crap offense. IDK.

But his skills as a RB where - IMO at least - pretty obvious.

Without even thoroughly considering EVERY other available back, I never had any hesitation is seeing him as a “top 5” caliber RB.
The NFL - As even a casual observer knows - doesn’t place a lot of value on RBs in the draft..... but Sanders will still certainly be in the “multiple millions of dollars” rookie contract group.

Unless he placed a lot of value in finishing his college degree (and you never know how each kid views that), the idea of NOT entering the draft woulda’ been pretty dumb.
IMO

Agree with this but his fumbles killed us last year. We probably beat OSU if he doesn’t cough it up before the half. Some team is going to love having him in their backfield though.

 

[sluggo72]

I’d appreciate a link quoting some NFL DPPs to this effect.

I’ve posted many times. But give me a few to find it again

 

[Raffycorn]

Sanders winning day. "Seen as mid-round selection, Sanders’ performance on Friday as well as his game tape may have solidified himself as a top-5 running back in this year’s draft class."

https://draftwire.usatoday.com/2019...-losers-friday-andre-dillard-miles-sanders/4/

Did Sanders’ lack of experience and mental processing speed limit his play speed and hide his athleticism? It’s possible; Sanders only has 276 rushing attempts to his name. Or did I just flat out miss how special of an athlete he was? User error is always a possibility.

https://www.bleedinggreennation.com...s-results-philadelphia-eagles-draft-prospects

Sanders has apparently been very impressive when teams have put him in front of a chalkboard in the interview process. He considers it one of his biggest strengths.

 

[searay26]

I'd argue that it makes sense to go if you will be drafted period. If you are good enough to last 2 years on an NFL roster, you'll make over a million dollars. A pretty good head start in life. If you're not good enough, another year in college probably wasn't going to help. Decent players drafted later will make the big money after their rookie contract.

The four-year minimum base salaries for players in this year's draft are as follows: $480,000 (Year 1), $555,000 (Year 2), $630,000 (Year 3) and $705,000 (Year 4). If eventually signed to a contract, each rookie drafted will get a four-year deal, whereas undrafted rookies are only eligible for three-year contracts.

 

[LongJakk]

I think the NFL will love Miles. He's got good measurables and highlights with "low mileage". I think that's part of why teams devalued RBs. Most great ones come out of college having been rode hard and put away wet.

 

[sluggo72]

I’d appreciate a link quoting some NFL DPPs to this effect.

Well here’s one, I’ll let you figure out who Phil Savage is.,.
https://www.philsavagefootball.com/?p=6387

 

[djr4rebs]

The NFL is learning from it's mistakes of literally running RBs into the ground. The Panthers are on the record saying that they want to compliment McCaffrey because of the amount of touches he had this past season. You have Bell sitting out. Cleveland extending the second chance to Hunt.

Sure, the dime a dozen plug a guy in and he does the same is still around, but teams are after the next Gurley. The next Hunt. The next Saquon.

 

[ILLINOISLION]

The NFL is learning from it's mistakes of literally running RBs into the ground. The Panthers are on the record saying that they want to compliment McCaffrey because of the amount of touches he had this past season. You have Bell sitting out. Cleveland extending the second chance to Hunt.

Sure, the dime a dozen plug a guy in and he does the same is still around, but teams are after the next Gurley. The next Hunt. The next Saquon.

Well, sorry, there is no next Saquon!

 

[Art]

Except of course the NFL disagrees with you. If you are not a sure fire 1st or 2nd round pick like a SB, they think you should stay in school so out of our guys who declared who is that? So other than that guy they should have come back to school. They can get insurance against injury and PSU can pay for it.

No they can't. Policies are only available for players projected to go in the first or second round.

 

[sluggo72]

No they can't. Policies are only available for players projected to go in the first or second round.

Not true they can design them for anyone and then it comes. Down to who pays the school or the kid.
ere are NCAA rules that allow athletics department officials to help secure policies and there are also funds available at each university that can be used to pay for the insurance policies if the programs want to allocate money for that purpose.

The student assistance fund is money provided to every university by the NCAA that can be used for a variety of scenarios to help student-athletes financially for everything from travel for funerals to formula for babies. The NCAA allows universities to pay for the insurance policies out of this fund, but not every university chooses to do so. Texas A&M, for example, paid $50,000 from this fund to help offensive lineman Cedric Ogbuehi secure insurance. Butt and his family secured loans to pay for the premium instead of using the student assistance fund at Michigan.

"It's subject to institutional and conference-level parameters," Wille said. "The Mountain West conference doesn't have a cap, so we could provide for that premium for the student in full if we wanted to."

hen it comes to underwriting a policy, every case needs to be built from the ground up where I present a case to the underwriters why an individual needs coverage," Chenowith said. "We need to build a case saying how much coverage and if he's a permanent total disability guy, a PTD plus LOV guy. We build it from the ground up with the underwriters and it's my job to give them as much information as possible and it's their job to keep me accountable."

Once a college program or athlete contacts Chenowith, he and his coworkers names of college football players they think will be within the top 90 or 100 picks in the upcoming draft. They look at the past three drafts and assess what positions are premium positions and typically drafted within the first rounds.

Certain positions are valued higher within the NFL and Chenowith and his team can identify trends to separate top prospects. They then rank the players out in the top 15, the top 30, 45, 60 and 90.

 

[Art]

Not true they can design them for anyone and then it comes. Down to who pays the school or the kid.
ere are NCAA rules that allow athletics department officials to help secure policies and there are also funds available at each university that can be used to pay for the insurance policies if the programs want to allocate money for that purpose.

The student assistance fund is money provided to every university by the NCAA that can be used for a variety of scenarios to help student-athletes financially for everything from travel for funerals to formula for babies. The NCAA allows universities to pay for the insurance policies out of this fund, but not every university chooses to do so. Texas A&M, for example, paid $50,000 from this fund to help offensive lineman Cedric Ogbuehi secure insurance. Butt and his family secured loans to pay for the premium instead of using the student assistance fund at Michigan.

"It's subject to institutional and conference-level parameters," Wille said. "The Mountain West conference doesn't have a cap, so we could provide for that premium for the student in full if we wanted to."

Insurance companies need a basis against which to establish loss. Without an evaluation there is no basis.

 

[interrobang]

No they can't. Policies are only available for players projected to go in the first or second round.

That's not true. Even Nyeem Wartman-White had one (and subsequently sued when the insurance company wouldn't pay up after he tore his ACL)

 

[sluggo72]

LSHIPM

Phil Savage (who didn’t even say what you think he did) = NFL.

Prior to 2012, the early entry list never topped 60 total prospects. In the last three drafts alone, 297 players have declared and that’s an average of 99 per year, just a staggering trend for college football and a number that the NFL is concerned about as well.

 

[sluggo72]

LSHIPM

Phil Savage (who didn’t even say what you think he did) = NFL.

I would say he’s more plugged in to the NFL thinking than say you are.
Football Timeline

• 1987-89: University of Alabama, Graduate Assistant/TE Coach
• 1990: UCLA, Graduate Assistant/TE Coach
• 1991-93: Cleveland Browns, Defensive Assistant/Defensive Backs
• 1994-95: Cleveland Browns, Area and National Scout
• 1996-02: Baltimore Ravens, Director of College Scouting
• 2003-04: Baltimore Ravens, Director of Player Personnel
• 2005-08: Cleveland Browns, Senior VP and General Manager
• 2010-12: Philadelphia Eagles, Player Personnel Executive
• 2012-Present: Reese’s Senior Bowl,

 

[Art]

That's not true. Even Nyeem Wartman-White had one (and subsequently sued when the insurance company wouldn't pay up after he tore his ACL)

That policy was written before the NFL Advisory Committee changed the format of its evaluations.

 

[sluggo72]

That policy was written before the NFL Advisory Committee changed the format of its evaluations.

The NFL gives 3 grades
A first round
B second round
C stay in school don’t be a fool
So you are saying that anyone getting a C cant get insurance?

 

[Raffycorn]

Acting as though the NFL in its prospect valuation process is interested in anything close to what’s best for the *prospect* - as opposed to what’s best for NFL front offices - is laughable to say the least.

 

[Art]

The NFL gives 3 grades
A first round
B second round
C stay in school don’t be a fool
So you are saying that anyone getting a C cant get insurance?

I imagine they could, but it would be for a flat amount if the insured suffered certain injuries and would be expensive. I'd be surprised if schools agreed to pay for these.

 

[sss]

Well here’s one, I’ll let you figure out who Phil Savage is.,.
https://www.philsavagefootball.com/?p=6387

Well, that says if you are not drafted in the top3 rounds it is better to go stay in school. It looks like Sanders will be in the top3 (I know things can change between now and the actual draft, but it lookd like he is a 2nd or 3rd round choice), so I guess he was right on that account. In the original post we were talking about Bates and Sanders. I have no idea where Bates will get drafted, but do you think he improves his draft statues by coming back and playing another year at OT? He will be drafted as an interior OL, and he has already graduated. His testing numbers were fine. I doubt they improve drastically next year, and he already has started for almost 3 yrs. My opinion, as I stated originally is he is a 3rd day draft pick this year or next year. So what is he coming back for? If he wanted one more year of college life, I would be all for it. If he wants one more year of earning potential, then he made the best choice he could.

 

[interrobang]

The NFL gives 3 grades
A first round
B second round
C stay in school don’t be a fool
So you are saying that anyone getting a C cant get insurance?

Compared to the old system which was 1st, 2nd, 3rd, other, or you ain't getting drafted.

 

[PSUNYGNYY]

Personally I think only Sanders and McGovern should have come out. Bates looked like he would be a high draft pick, probably not 1st round, after his RS freshman season in 2016. Injuries and switching positions really hurt him the last two years. I thought he may move back to LG this year which appears to be his most natural position on the line. I would have liked to have seen an Oline of LT Fries LG Bates C Menet RG Gonzalez RT Walker this year.

 

[sluggo72]

I imagine they could, but it would be for a flat amount if the insured suffered certain injuries and would be expensive. I'd be surprised if schools agreed to pay for these.

Then that’s different than this isn’t it

No they can't. Policies are only available for players projected to go in the first or second round.

 

[sluggo72]

Well, that says if you are not drafted in the top3 rounds it is better to go stay in school. It looks like Sanders will be in the top3 (I know things can change between now and the actual draft, but it lookd like he is a 2nd or 3rd round choice), so I guess he was right on that account. In the original post we were talking about Bates and Sanders. I have no idea where Bates will get drafted, but do you think he improves his draft statues by coming back and playing another year at OT? He will be drafted as an interior OL, and he has already graduated. His testing numbers were fine. I doubt they improve drastically next year, and he already has started for almost 3 yrs. My opinion, as I stated originally is he is a 3rd day draft pick this year or next year. So what is he coming back for? If he wanted one more year of college life, I would be all for it. If he wants one more year of earning potential, then he made the best choice he could.

I think McGovern and MS were toss ups coming out. The rest should have stayed in school, IMO.

 

[Art]

Then that’s different than this isn’t it

What I described is a disability policy, ever hear of them, that would be available to anyone.

 

[mcgunns]

The NFL is worried about misguided kids leaving early without a degree and without a great shot of making it as a pro. Tony Carr comes to mind. Disingenuously pretending it’s universal advice that should apply to every situation is obviously ridiculous so let’s all stop responding to that argument.