Tesla - exited short sale
- Thread starter blion72
- Start date
It does. But on the other hand, cars do very little damage to roads compared to the fuel tax the drivers pay. Getting tractor trailers off of roads is the easiest (maybe not really the easiest thing to do) way to reduce the costs of maintenance.
I agree with all of this. The main reason I went with a hybrid is because I make too many trips per year that are right at or slightly over the typical range of EVs in my price range. If they get this down where I can quickly recharge in the time it takes to hit the men's room and get a cup of coffee and have many more charging stations that are convenient to the trips I make I'll be all in on an EV when I trade in my hybrid.
I am not pro or con EV cars. I just know that I need a reliable range of 300 miles daily. I don't need it everyday but I do make regular 150 mile one way trips. Currently the infrastructure is not in place to know that when I am in Potter County I can recharge.
As far as the expense goes, maybe I am jaded but everything has to balance. Once the majority have switched service will be the same as the rates will increase. Electricity is not a price controlled commodity and as demand increases so will the cost. That doesn't even count the infrastructure upgrades needed as many high density population centers struggle with on demand power during the high use months.
There is no panacea in capitalism. If you want it costs will increase.
As far as the expense goes, maybe I am jaded but everything has to balance. Once the majority have switched service will be the same as the rates will increase. Electricity is not a price controlled commodity and as demand increases so will the cost. That doesn't even count the infrastructure upgrades needed as many high density population centers struggle with on demand power during the high use months.
There is no panacea in capitalism. If you want it costs will increase.
Understand your issues with Potter County charging.
Expenses also has to do with the significant reduction in parts requiring replacement/maintenance. Not just electricity costs.
All I am saying is that those expenses will increase per item because that garage isn't going to go out of business. They need to make their money as well. Economically everything is so intertwined that the consumer is always going to pay and that is ok because that is how it should be.
Disagree. I do expect many garages to go out of business as this technology matures and vehicles won't be sold through traditional dealerships who require huge shop profits to keep their doors open.
As far as the expense goes, maybe I am jaded but everything has to balance. Once the majority have switched service will be the same as the rates will increase. Electricity is not a price controlled commodity and as demand increases so will the cost.
If they jack my electric rates up too high I'll just put in solar panels. With an EV you do have options.
That doesn't even count the infrastructure upgrades needed as many high density population centers struggle with on demand power during the high use months.
Shouldn't be a problem because most charging will be done in middle of the night when electric usage is low.
Depends on the EV.
With a Tesla using their supercharging network you do not stop for hours to recharge. Most likely 20 minutes or less.
Tough to get excited when you lose this much.
At the end of the year, short-sellers betting against Tesla lost $2.9 billion on a mark-to-market basis, according to a Friday tweet from Ihor Dusaniwsky, managing director of predictive analytics at S3 Partners, a financial-analytics provider.
The second half of the year was particularly painful for short-sellers as the stock rallied nearly 70% from its 2019 low in June through December. Short-sellers lost nearly $8 billion mark-to-market as shares surged over the seven-month period, according to S3 data.
The second half of the year was particularly painful for short-sellers as the stock rallied nearly 70% from its 2019 low in June through December. Short-sellers lost nearly $8 billion mark-to-market as shares surged over the seven-month period, according to S3 data.
I have a day trip from State College to Scranton area and back coming up. The Tesla map tells me I would need to stop at Bloomsburg (assuming way back) to charge for 20 minutes. Not horrible but I still does take some planning at this point. I was surprised not to see any charging stations near Scranton so I could charge while in my meeting.
I'm sure that map is only going to show Tesla super chargers. You will need to check the locations of level 2 chargers around where you will be.
Plugshare is a pretty good phone app for this.
According to the “ Plugless Power “ site I visited, charging a Model S or X Tesla from empty to full takes anywhere from “ 6 - 30 “ hours on a level 2 charger. I have no idea why there was such a big range.
Alternately, you can reportedly get 170 miles of range at a level 3 charger in 30 minutes. Assuming there is not a line to use such a charger.
Obviously, this is a big disadvantage versus an ICE if you have to do a lot of driving in a short period of time. But if the promised battery improvements materialize, the end of the automotive industry as we know it will be nigh.
Charge car overnight in your garage, full 'tank' when you depart. Figure out where to stop on your route or let the smartphone app do it for you.
Not sure what 'a lot of driving in a short period of time is.' Seems to me that would burn a lot of gas
According to the “ Plugless Power “ site I visited, charging a Model S or X Tesla from empty to full takes anywhere from “ 6 - 30 “ hours on a level 2 charger. I have no idea why there was such a big range.
Well that's because technically level 2 chargers really aren't chargers at all. They are just fancy extension cords basically.
A level 2 charger just supplies AC power to an EV and then the on board charger charges the EV battery. All EV's have different size chargers, most have between 7 and 10 kWh chargers. They used to let you add a second charger(that doubles the charging speed) on the Model S, not sure if that is still possible or not.
Also the level 2 charging may be throttled depending on how many amps the system can deliver to the car.
So for a standard model 3 you need a level 2 charger that can supply 32 amps for max charging speed to be attained. For the long range model 3 48 amps.
Level 3 chargers directly connect to the car battery, bypassing the built in charger. They are all DC and the older v1 Tesla superchargers could charge up to 124 kWh. The newer v2 supercharges can do 250 kWh.
Alternately, you can reportedly get 170 miles of range at a level 3 charger in 30 minutes. Assuming there is not a line to use such a charger.
How can there be lines of Tesla's at super chargers if they aren't selling any cars?
Two points: What happens if the superchargers are in use when you need a charge, do you have wait 20 minutes until the person in front of you is done and then your own 20-30 minutes to charge. That would suck. Not like there isn't ever a line at a gas station, it just takes only 5 minutes to fill up the tank of gas, not 30 minutes.
Electricity price will not skyrocket up as EV comes into play. Gas pricing is so crazy based on OPEC and crude oil costs that are so variable based on many things not related to oil production or refineries. Electricity pricing won't ever be like that. Not saying it won't go up, but the amount of electric usage for cars compared to home usage and industry usage will not allow widely fluctuating pricing.
Electricity price will not skyrocket up as EV comes into play. Gas pricing is so crazy based on OPEC and crude oil costs that are so variable based on many things not related to oil production or refineries. Electricity pricing won't ever be like that. Not saying it won't go up, but the amount of electric usage for cars compared to home usage and industry usage will not allow widely fluctuating pricing.
Two points: What happens if the superchargers are in use when you need a charge, do you have wait 20 minutes until the person in front of you is done and then your own 20-30 minutes to charge. That would suck. Not like there isn't ever a line at a gas station, it just takes only 5 minutes to fill up the tank of gas, not 30 minutes.
You have to wait.
Telsa has implemented some stuff to help out though.
The route planning software in the car can show you exactly how many charging stalls are in use/empty so you can avoid the busy chargers.
They have also started charging an idle fee if you don't move your car off the charger when it's done.
Just a note on this. Trip to StCollege for me from Philly area (Pa Turnpike- 322) I have 100 rated battery, Full charge out of the house can get me to SC (bellefonte charger) to recharge without stopping --in the summer and without spirited driving (keeping it to 65mph avg) but would require a slightly longer charge time as the battery is depleted.
So to be safe --Stop at Harrisburg 25 minutes to get enough charge to get to Bellfonte to charge 30 minutes to get back to harrisburg to charge for 20 minutes to get back to philly. So 3 stops to make a round trip to state college that is roughly 220 miles each way or 440 round trip in any weather and spirited driving including up Potters Mills Hill. (like riding on rails at 80mph all the way up)
The key to distance driving is stopping often and charging less. The battery once it gets close to 80 percent charge slows down so if your in the sweet spot zone of say 70-80 miles of range left you can get to 210 in 25 minutes. so stopping to charge after 120 -140 miles worth of driving as been the optimal long distance cadence for me.
There are occasions where people drive many miles in a day : ferrying relatives from one place to another, going on trips, doctor visits in different towns, vacationing,etc.
People generally don’t want to stop every couple of hours for a extended break when trying to get somewhere or accomplish something, unless they happen to be retired and have all the time in the world.
This is the biggest disadvantage of EV’s currently versus ICE vehicles.
There are plenty Tesla owners that take trips with no problems. The advantages for most people far outweigh the disadvantages.
People generally don’t want to stop every couple of hours for a extended break when trying to get somewhere or accomplish something, unless they happen to be retired and have all the time in the world.
Are you sure about that?
My man has to drive 200 miles to get to a doctor and regularly ferries relatives across 3 states. But he never has to stop for gas. Quite an interesting fellow
let's not be stupid on the opposite side. Stopping three times on a trip back and forth to State College (and bellefonte is out of they way to state college so factor that in also). And waiting 15-20 minutes per stop (and that assumes the chargers are open which if three stops I doubt is the case so one of those times might be a 30 minute stop) is going to suck. I stop once on the way too/from Penn State from greater Philly and that stop is never more than about 6-8 minutes, enough to gas up and goto the bathroom and grab a soda or some chips. I don't really have that kind of time to waste nor would I want to take that many stops with kids for an EV trip. I think right now EVs are great for your local driving where you are not going long distances and can charge your car in your driveway at night. And then you have your second vehicle be a normal car with gas for long distances.
In a 15-20 years from from now when the mileage on a charge has increased and charging time more approaches the time it takes to fill up a car with gas (5 minutes) and the charging stations are plentiful akin to gas stations, then everybody goes full on EV.
In a 15-20 years from from now when the mileage on a charge has increased and charging time more approaches the time it takes to fill up a car with gas (5 minutes) and the charging stations are plentiful akin to gas stations, then everybody goes full on EV.
And waiting 15-20 minutes per stop (and that assumes the chargers are open which if three stops I doubt is the case so one of those times might be a 30 minute stop) is going to suck.
But you will waste time going to a gas station every time your tank is empty? Maybe, just maybe the stuff you think is a problem/is not a problem is based more on what you are used to doing?
Well just like with an EV, if I know I am going to Philadelphia I start with a full tank and drive to Philly non-stop. Leave Philly stop at Clarks Ferry for 5 minute fill up and then home to State College. Plus I have fuel for a few days.
Right now you cannot equate the convenience of gas vs EV. I need to fill my tank 3 times a week to equal one 15 minute charging stop. I drive a lot and don't fill my tank three times a week.
EV is definitely on its way to being a better model. I don't think it is there yet.
What is one charged for an EV fill up?
This is why I went with a hybrid instead.
My hybrid gets over 500 miles on a 10 gallon fill up. I'm not stopping very often and could easily make that trip on one tank (one stop or five minutes, not three totaling 75 minutes).
I'm not arguing against EVs -- I think they are great and hopefully will fit my driving patterns much better within the next few years.
You comment reminded my of this funny story written by the Tesla club in Sweden. It's about an electric car owner test driving a gasoline car for the first time.
Having heard so much good about petrol cars, we decided to test drive one. They are said to combine cheap price with long range and fast charging. A winning formula on paper – but how are they in real life?
We sat us in the loaner car at the car salesman’s office. Automakers do not sell the cars themselves, only through independent car repair shops as middlemen. It may sound like a bad omen to buy the car from a car repair shop that you want to visit as seldom as possible. But you apparently can’t buy the car directly from the manufacturer but must go through such intermediaries. The seller was very “pushy” and tried to convince us to buy the car very forcibly, but the experience is perhaps better elsewhere.
So we sat in the car and pressed the START button. The car’s gasoline engine coughed to life and started to operate. One could hear the engine’s sound and the car’s whole body vibrated as if something was broken, but the seller assured us that everything was as it should. The car actually has an electric motor and a microscopically small battery, but they are only used to start the petrol engine – the electric motor does not drive the wheels. The petrol engine then uses a tank full of gasoline, a fossil liquid, to propel the car by exploding small drops of it. It is apparently the small explosions that you hear and feel when the engine is running.
The petrol engine consists of literally hundreds of moving parts that must have tolerance of hundredths of a millimeter to function. We begun to understand why it is car repair shops that sell the cars – they might hope for something to break in the car that they can mend?
We put in a gear and drove away with a jerk. The jerk came not from any extreme acceleration, but gasoline engines apparently cannot be driven as smoothly as electric motors. The acceleration did not occur at all, because we could not get the car to go faster than 40 km/h! By then the petrol engine literally howled and the whole car shook violently. Convinced that something must have broken we stopped the car. The seller then explained that with petrol engines you need to “change gears” on a regular basis. Between the engine and the wheels are not a fixed ratio gear, but a variable one. The petrol engine can produce power only in a limited speed range, and must therefore be geared with different ratios in order to continue to accelerate. There are 5 different gears we can select with increasing speed as result. It is -as we learned quickly- very important that each time select a suitable gear otherwise the engine will either stop or get seriously damaged! You need a lot of training to learn to select the right gear at the right time – though there are also models with automatic transmissions that can do this themselves. In the manual transmission car, we needed to constantly guard the engine from damaging it. Very stressful.
We asked if the constant sound of the engine -that frankly disturbed us from being able to listen to the radio- could be turned off. But it couldn’t. Very distracting.
After getting the car up to speed through intricate changing of gears we approached a traffic light. Releasing the accelerator pedal resulted in no significant braking, we had to use the brake pedal very much to slow down the car. We were surprised to hear the brakes are completely mechanical! The only thing they generate is heat – braking gives no regeneration of gasoline back into the tank! Sounds like a huge waste, but it would soon get even worse.
When we came to a stop the engine continued to run and the car vibrate – even though the car was standing still! The engine continued to burn gasoline without moving the car forward. Can it really be true? Yes, the seller explained, it is so with gasoline cars: the engine is always running and burning gasoline – even when the car is stationary. Some models however switches off the engine at a red light, he explained. Well that certainly makes more sense.
After a while we came to a gas station where we could charge the car. The car claimed that it still had half a tank left, but we wanted to try the famous super-fast charging of petrol cars!
So we drove to the gas station and opened the fuel cap. The filling nozzle is very similar to a charging connector, but it is not electrons that come out of it but gasoline. Gasoline is a highly carcinogenic, smelly and flammable liquid derived from plants and animals extinct since millions of years ago. The gasoline is pumped to a tank in the car, which then drives around with about 50 liters of this hazardous liquid in it.
We put the nozzle to the car, but nothing happened. The seller then explained that we must pay to fuel! Much like those extremely expensive fast chargers some electric utility companies have set up. After we put the credit card in the reader we could start fueling. It was extremely fast! In just two minutes we filled the gas tank to the max! But there were two counters on the pump: one that showed the number of liters we have fueled and one that showed how much it would cost us. And that counter was spinning so fast that we could hardly keep up with its pace! Sure we filled the tank full in two minutes, but it did cost us an unbelievable €30! A full charge would thus cost us double that – a whopping €60! We cursed our luck that we apparently have chosen one of the most expensive gas stations, and began to ask the seller what other alternatives are there? How much does it cost to fill up at home, and how many free stations are there?
The seller looked very puzzled at us and explained that it is not possible to refuel gasoline cars at home, and there are no free gas stations. We tried to explain our questions, in case he had misunderstood, but he insisted that you can not. Apparently you have to several times a month drive to the gas station to recharge your petrol car at extortionate prices – there are no alternatives! We thought it was very strange that no gasoline car manufacturers have launched their own free gas stations?
There are no gas stations either where you can fill up more slowly at a cheaper price. We started calculating price versus consumption and came to the shocking conclusion that a petrol car costs unimaginable €12 per 100km! Sure, electric cars could also theoretically come up to these amounts if they quick charged at one of the most expensive charging stations in the country – but for petrol cars there are no cheaper alternatives! While electric cars are comfortably charged at home every night for €2 per 100km petrol cars must make detours several times a month to fill up at these extortionate rates – without exception! Monthly cost for a petrol car can -just for the gasoline alone- easily exceed one hundred Euros! We begun to understand why they are so cheap to purchase – operating them is extremely expensive instead.
We also begun to understand why there must be so many petrol stations everywhere, if all petrol cars always have to drive to them to refuel. Imagine if you could charge your electric car only at the power companies’ most expensive fast chargers – and nowhere else!
With this in mind we ended up in a traffic jam and was horrified that the gasoline engine continued to burn these expensive gasoline drops even when the car was standing still or moving very little. With gasoline vehicles it is easy to run into cost anxiety – the feeling that the car literally burns up your money! No cheap home charging and no regeneration of gasoline back to the fuel tank when braking sounds like economic madness – especially given that all gasoline must be imported from abroad.
We returned the car to the dealer’s premises, pulled the handbrake and step out of the car. The petrol engine continued to run! Apparently one must manually switch off the combustion of the precious liquid. But we wanted to see the petrol engine, so the seller opened the bonnet. The entire front portion of the car was completely cluttered with hoses, fittings, fluid reservoirs, and amid all a huge shaking cast iron block which apparently constituted the motor’s frame. There was no space for luggage in the front of the car! Despite its enormous size, high noise and vibration, the engine barely delivered one hundred horsepower. The engine was also extremely hot, we burned ourselves when we touched it. Even though this was on a warm summer day so the engine did not need to generate heat to the passenger compartment.
We became also worried about what would happen if we crashed with a petrol car? The cast iron block that occupied most of the engine compartment was sitting in the middle of the collision zone! Where would it go if we collided – would we get it in our lap? The salesman assured us that the motor in such case somehow gets folded down under the car but we could not escape the impression that the engine block was very much in the way at the front – the safety beams were built around it, which surely impairs their functionality. Avoiding that one hundred kilo iron lump in the front of the car makes it so much easier to build safe cars. In addition, we have seen on the Internet hundreds of pictures and videos of burning gasoline cars. The petrol tank apparently often leaks after an accident so the flammable liquid pours out and becomes ignited!
From the engine, under the car runs an exhaust system – a kind of chimney for engine exhausts. When you burn the carcinogenic gasoline a lots of noxious gases are produced. The car cleans away the most dangerous gases, but what remains is released into the open air behind the car. It is still unhealthy to breathe in – and smells very bad! And petrol cars are allowed to emit these harmful gases in the middle of our cities? Do not confuse petrol cars’ exhaust pipes with fuel cell cars’ – while hydrogen powered fuel cell vehicles emit only water vapor gasoline cars spew out noxious gasses, and even fossil carbon dioxide that contribute to Earth’s future-catastrophic warming!
We thanked the seller for the display, shook our heads and gave back the ignition key (yes, it’s called that) to him. He realized that there would be no business for him so except for one lame attempt he did not try to sell us the car any more.
On the way home in our electric car we looked with completely different eyes at our poor fellow commuters, who still had to put up with their gasoline cars. But soon it will be their turn to trade up, too!
We sat us in the loaner car at the car salesman’s office. Automakers do not sell the cars themselves, only through independent car repair shops as middlemen. It may sound like a bad omen to buy the car from a car repair shop that you want to visit as seldom as possible. But you apparently can’t buy the car directly from the manufacturer but must go through such intermediaries. The seller was very “pushy” and tried to convince us to buy the car very forcibly, but the experience is perhaps better elsewhere.
So we sat in the car and pressed the START button. The car’s gasoline engine coughed to life and started to operate. One could hear the engine’s sound and the car’s whole body vibrated as if something was broken, but the seller assured us that everything was as it should. The car actually has an electric motor and a microscopically small battery, but they are only used to start the petrol engine – the electric motor does not drive the wheels. The petrol engine then uses a tank full of gasoline, a fossil liquid, to propel the car by exploding small drops of it. It is apparently the small explosions that you hear and feel when the engine is running.
The petrol engine consists of literally hundreds of moving parts that must have tolerance of hundredths of a millimeter to function. We begun to understand why it is car repair shops that sell the cars – they might hope for something to break in the car that they can mend?
We put in a gear and drove away with a jerk. The jerk came not from any extreme acceleration, but gasoline engines apparently cannot be driven as smoothly as electric motors. The acceleration did not occur at all, because we could not get the car to go faster than 40 km/h! By then the petrol engine literally howled and the whole car shook violently. Convinced that something must have broken we stopped the car. The seller then explained that with petrol engines you need to “change gears” on a regular basis. Between the engine and the wheels are not a fixed ratio gear, but a variable one. The petrol engine can produce power only in a limited speed range, and must therefore be geared with different ratios in order to continue to accelerate. There are 5 different gears we can select with increasing speed as result. It is -as we learned quickly- very important that each time select a suitable gear otherwise the engine will either stop or get seriously damaged! You need a lot of training to learn to select the right gear at the right time – though there are also models with automatic transmissions that can do this themselves. In the manual transmission car, we needed to constantly guard the engine from damaging it. Very stressful.
We asked if the constant sound of the engine -that frankly disturbed us from being able to listen to the radio- could be turned off. But it couldn’t. Very distracting.
After getting the car up to speed through intricate changing of gears we approached a traffic light. Releasing the accelerator pedal resulted in no significant braking, we had to use the brake pedal very much to slow down the car. We were surprised to hear the brakes are completely mechanical! The only thing they generate is heat – braking gives no regeneration of gasoline back into the tank! Sounds like a huge waste, but it would soon get even worse.
When we came to a stop the engine continued to run and the car vibrate – even though the car was standing still! The engine continued to burn gasoline without moving the car forward. Can it really be true? Yes, the seller explained, it is so with gasoline cars: the engine is always running and burning gasoline – even when the car is stationary. Some models however switches off the engine at a red light, he explained. Well that certainly makes more sense.
After a while we came to a gas station where we could charge the car. The car claimed that it still had half a tank left, but we wanted to try the famous super-fast charging of petrol cars!
So we drove to the gas station and opened the fuel cap. The filling nozzle is very similar to a charging connector, but it is not electrons that come out of it but gasoline. Gasoline is a highly carcinogenic, smelly and flammable liquid derived from plants and animals extinct since millions of years ago. The gasoline is pumped to a tank in the car, which then drives around with about 50 liters of this hazardous liquid in it.
We put the nozzle to the car, but nothing happened. The seller then explained that we must pay to fuel! Much like those extremely expensive fast chargers some electric utility companies have set up. After we put the credit card in the reader we could start fueling. It was extremely fast! In just two minutes we filled the gas tank to the max! But there were two counters on the pump: one that showed the number of liters we have fueled and one that showed how much it would cost us. And that counter was spinning so fast that we could hardly keep up with its pace! Sure we filled the tank full in two minutes, but it did cost us an unbelievable €30! A full charge would thus cost us double that – a whopping €60! We cursed our luck that we apparently have chosen one of the most expensive gas stations, and began to ask the seller what other alternatives are there? How much does it cost to fill up at home, and how many free stations are there?
The seller looked very puzzled at us and explained that it is not possible to refuel gasoline cars at home, and there are no free gas stations. We tried to explain our questions, in case he had misunderstood, but he insisted that you can not. Apparently you have to several times a month drive to the gas station to recharge your petrol car at extortionate prices – there are no alternatives! We thought it was very strange that no gasoline car manufacturers have launched their own free gas stations?
There are no gas stations either where you can fill up more slowly at a cheaper price. We started calculating price versus consumption and came to the shocking conclusion that a petrol car costs unimaginable €12 per 100km! Sure, electric cars could also theoretically come up to these amounts if they quick charged at one of the most expensive charging stations in the country – but for petrol cars there are no cheaper alternatives! While electric cars are comfortably charged at home every night for €2 per 100km petrol cars must make detours several times a month to fill up at these extortionate rates – without exception! Monthly cost for a petrol car can -just for the gasoline alone- easily exceed one hundred Euros! We begun to understand why they are so cheap to purchase – operating them is extremely expensive instead.
We also begun to understand why there must be so many petrol stations everywhere, if all petrol cars always have to drive to them to refuel. Imagine if you could charge your electric car only at the power companies’ most expensive fast chargers – and nowhere else!
With this in mind we ended up in a traffic jam and was horrified that the gasoline engine continued to burn these expensive gasoline drops even when the car was standing still or moving very little. With gasoline vehicles it is easy to run into cost anxiety – the feeling that the car literally burns up your money! No cheap home charging and no regeneration of gasoline back to the fuel tank when braking sounds like economic madness – especially given that all gasoline must be imported from abroad.
We returned the car to the dealer’s premises, pulled the handbrake and step out of the car. The petrol engine continued to run! Apparently one must manually switch off the combustion of the precious liquid. But we wanted to see the petrol engine, so the seller opened the bonnet. The entire front portion of the car was completely cluttered with hoses, fittings, fluid reservoirs, and amid all a huge shaking cast iron block which apparently constituted the motor’s frame. There was no space for luggage in the front of the car! Despite its enormous size, high noise and vibration, the engine barely delivered one hundred horsepower. The engine was also extremely hot, we burned ourselves when we touched it. Even though this was on a warm summer day so the engine did not need to generate heat to the passenger compartment.
We became also worried about what would happen if we crashed with a petrol car? The cast iron block that occupied most of the engine compartment was sitting in the middle of the collision zone! Where would it go if we collided – would we get it in our lap? The salesman assured us that the motor in such case somehow gets folded down under the car but we could not escape the impression that the engine block was very much in the way at the front – the safety beams were built around it, which surely impairs their functionality. Avoiding that one hundred kilo iron lump in the front of the car makes it so much easier to build safe cars. In addition, we have seen on the Internet hundreds of pictures and videos of burning gasoline cars. The petrol tank apparently often leaks after an accident so the flammable liquid pours out and becomes ignited!
From the engine, under the car runs an exhaust system – a kind of chimney for engine exhausts. When you burn the carcinogenic gasoline a lots of noxious gases are produced. The car cleans away the most dangerous gases, but what remains is released into the open air behind the car. It is still unhealthy to breathe in – and smells very bad! And petrol cars are allowed to emit these harmful gases in the middle of our cities? Do not confuse petrol cars’ exhaust pipes with fuel cell cars’ – while hydrogen powered fuel cell vehicles emit only water vapor gasoline cars spew out noxious gasses, and even fossil carbon dioxide that contribute to Earth’s future-catastrophic warming!
We thanked the seller for the display, shook our heads and gave back the ignition key (yes, it’s called that) to him. He realized that there would be no business for him so except for one lame attempt he did not try to sell us the car any more.
On the way home in our electric car we looked with completely different eyes at our poor fellow commuters, who still had to put up with their gasoline cars. But soon it will be their turn to trade up, too!
My current ICE car has a range of around 425 miles and takes maybe 3 minutes to refuel.
I think EV’s are likely to replace ICE vehicles once the ranges, and especially charging times improve. People who plunked down huge sums of money for EV’s with earlier generation batteries will find resale options very limited unless these carmakers want to spend the capital on retrofitting them with new batteries.
I'm not arguing that having an EV for local driving where I don't have to map out and stop at charging station every few hours for 15-30 minute stops won't be convenient. But if you are a person who drives long trips frequently, that level of stopping and time charging is really inconvenient and you cannot tell me that it isn't. And for my normal driving now, I stop once about every 7-10 days at the gas station on the way to work and I am never there for longer than about 3-5 minutes to fill up so not having to do that isn't going to unlock my life with a ton of time.
Let me get this straight, you think evs will replace ICE vehicles but somehow ev resales value will suck but ICE resale values will be ok? How does that work exactly?
Tesla Model 3 is going to retain its value better than the competition, according to a new report from Kelley Blue Book – though to be fair, it’s based on very little data.
The California-based vehicle valuation and automotive research company released its 2019 Best Resale Value Award Winners and Model 3 topped the electric vehicle category – though it would have also taken the top positions in other categories if it would have been included.
They said about the Model 3:
“The Tesla Model 3 has a cultural magic and desirability about it that made people willing to wait months and even years to own one. People don’t like Tesla Model 3s — they crave them — and that’s how you hold on to your resale value over time.”
Kelley Blue Book projects a resale value of 69.3% at 36 months and 48.7% at 60 months for Model 3.
The California-based vehicle valuation and automotive research company released its 2019 Best Resale Value Award Winners and Model 3 topped the electric vehicle category – though it would have also taken the top positions in other categories if it would have been included.
They said about the Model 3:
“The Tesla Model 3 has a cultural magic and desirability about it that made people willing to wait months and even years to own one. People don’t like Tesla Model 3s — they crave them — and that’s how you hold on to your resale value over time.”
Kelley Blue Book projects a resale value of 69.3% at 36 months and 48.7% at 60 months for Model 3.
Ok. I don't see the logic in buying your car based on the 20-30 days per year you need to drive more than 200 miles per day instead of the 320-330 days per year you don't. But happy driving!
where I don't have to map out and stop at charging station every few hours for 15-30 minute stops won't be convenient.
Well you don't really have "map it out" as the car pretty much does it all for you.
Hey evs aren't for everyone. Where I grew up there are still Amish getting with horses.
What is the logic of paying a premium for a car that can’t meet your needs even if it is only 20 - 30 days a year when you can pay far less and not have this problem ?
Do EV's get to charge for free currently?
There are quite a few free level 2 chargers around. The town I live in has 4 free charges in the middle of downtown. The shopping mall near me also has free level 2 chargers.
Most car dealerships have free level 2 charges.
Older Tesla Model S and X's had free lifetime supercharging with the purchase of the vehicle.
If so who eats the energy costs?
Usually the businesses that are near the charger, or in my case the city.
It's not quite the same thing as giving out free gasoline now. If you were plugged in for an hour you might be draw 10 kWh of electricity. I pay about 11 cents a kWh so about a buck at my retail rate. What does a shopping mall or a business pay for electricity? Way less than I do that's for sure.
Here is a guy who drove a model S from Minnesota to New Hampshire - 30 hours straight. He knows how to hit the chargers to minimize charge times.
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