The talking-heads keep saying it's unprecedented not to take an undefeated P5 Conf Champ... It's way worse than that.....

[PSUSignore]

If only there were a way to actually determine if Liberty is capable of beating those teams...
If only there were a way to actually determine if Ohio State is capable of beating those teams...
If only there were a way to actually determine if Georgia is capable of beating FSU... Oh, wait!

Here's a little twister.

FSU beat Florida 24 - 13
Georgia beat Florida 43 - 20
Alabama beat Georgia

FSU gets to play Georgia. Georgia is a 14 pt favorite.

We'll see whether FSU can compete.

Ah yes, the infallible transitive property. Bulletproof way to determine who's better. Nevermind that in many years you can create a complete infinite circle of teams beating others within some conferences. I guess that shows that all of them are equal?

The whole point of a playing a regular season is to determine who is worthy of the playoffs, and then the single elimination games begin. It is laughable that a team that went undefeated in a P5 conference and is being left out. I don't care if their QB is hurt or not, they've earned it, and with a month of practice as a starting QB nobody knows what their backups are capable of. Upsets can, and do happen.

 

[LandoComando]

If only there were a way to actually determine if Liberty is capable of beating those teams...
If only there were a way to actually determine if Ohio State is capable of beating those teams...
If only there were a way to actually determine if Georgia is capable of beating FSU... Oh, wait!

Here's a little twister.

FSU beat Florida 24 - 13
Georgia beat Florida 43 - 20
Alabama beat Georgia

FSU gets to play Georgia. Georgia is a 14 pt favorite.

We'll see whether FSU can compete.

No we won't. Do you think most of Georgia's top guys will play? We already saw FSU have an opt out. The bowl game don't provide any insight as to what would have happened in a playoff game unfortunately

 

[AWS1022]

I understand that opinion but I don't see it as arbitrary. It still gets back to most deserving vs. best.

Losing a QB is a bid deal. If they look even reasonably good without the first string QB, they are in. But they didn't look good and it was the QB that made that team go. So yeah they are 13-0 but you can pretty much discount that record because they aren't close to the same team that won the previous 11 games. It sucks but that's the way it is.

This whole situation is one of the reasons I don't like a 12-team playoff. Now we need to put in Liberty just because they're undefeated? Give me a break. And guess what, eventually one of these garbage teams will upset the best teams or maybe a star player gets injured in one of these games that shouldn't have to be played and the whole thing is devalued.

It had absolutely nothing to do with the QB getting hurt. There’s video (that ESPN has taken down) of Kirk discussing what would happen if this exact situation played out and Kirk said FSU would be out…this was before the game where the FSU QB got injured was even played. ESPN knew exactly what they were going to do and they likely breathed a huge sigh of relief when the QB did get hurt.

 

[wilbury]

For FSU to be undefeated, it meant they had to beat Clemson, Florida and LSU so….

Only two of those teams were over .500 so. ...

 

[doctornick]

Only two of those teams were over .500 so. ...

The premise was that PSU would never be in the situation FSU is in because we’d have beaten UM and tOSU to get undefeated. But those are teams that are considered as elite as tOSU and UM and just aren’t as good as typical this season. The same could happen to UM or tOSU in any given season.

You can only play who you are scheduled to play.

 

[LemonEars]

I think that the committee's mindset was that Michigan and Washington were locks. That left 2 spots. If they took Alabama then they had to take Texas. If they took FSU then they had to take Liberty. Thus, for the final two spots the choice was Alabama/Texas or FSU/Liberty. The committee picked the Alabama/Texas duo over the FSU/Liberty duo. That may have been the way the decision was made.

 

[AWS1022]

I think that the committee's mindset was that Michigan and Washington were locks. That left 2 spots. If they took Alabama then they had to take Texas. If they took FSU then they had to take Liberty. Thus, for the final two spots the choice was Alabama/Texas or FSU/Liberty. The committee picked the Alabama/Texas duo over the FSU/Liberty duo. That may have been the way the decision was made.

Why in the world would they feel they have to take Liberty? They have left out an undefeated G5 champion in the past, so the precedent was there. Their whole decision was based simply on making sure the SEC had a representative, that’s it. They couldn’t leave Texas out because they beat Bama, so that left FSU. If Bama had not played Texas and had lost to someone else, Texas would have been the one left out.

 

[LandoComando]

The premise was that PSU would never be in the situation FSU is in because we’d have beaten UM and tOSU to get undefeated. But those are teams that are considered as elite as tOSU and UM and just aren’t as good as typical this season. The same could happen to UM or tOSU in any given season.

You can only play who you are scheduled to play.

And when you're in a weak conference, your fault or not, that will held against you

 

[LandoComando]

I think that the committee's mindset was that Michigan and Washington were locks. That left 2 spots. If they took Alabama then they had to take Texas. If they took FSU then they had to take Liberty. Thus, for the final two spots the choice was Alabama/Texas or FSU/Liberty. The committee picked the Alabama/Texas duo over the FSU/Liberty duo. That may have been the way the decision was made.

I think they just took Texas and Bama because they had better resumes and FSU looked mid after without Travis.

 

[AvgUser]

Ah yes, the infallible transitive property. Bulletproof way to determine who's better.

In this case, he’s going to have a hard time finding a team that beat anyone who beat FSU

 

[dailybuck777]

Brian Kelly says he played both Florida State and Alabama and that at the end of they year, Alabama was the better team.

 

[LandoComando]

Brian Kelly says he played both Florida State and Alabama and that at the end of they year, Alabama was the better team.

View embedded media

And we all know that. Someday people will admit it. It's just anti-SEC bias.

 

[NewEra 2014]

The funny part of the FSU situation is that if Georgia had beaten Bama, FSU is in the playoff. It is only because Bama beat Georgia that Texas had to be included as well. FSU’s playoff fate came down to the outcome of the SEC championship game.

How is that for a jacked up playoff system?

 

[LemonEars]

The funny part of the FSU situation is that if Georgia had beaten Bama, FSU is in the playoff. It is only because Bama beat Georgia that Texas had to be included as well. FSU’s playoff fate came down to the outcome of the SEC championship game.

How is that for a jacked up playoff system?

A lot of truth in what you say. Also, if they take FSU because they are an undefeated conference champion with a weak strength of schedule, then how do they shun Liberty who is exactly the same?

The FSU supporters will evaporate when Georgia beats them 63 - 7 in the bowl game.

 

[Erial_Lion]

A lot of truth in what you say. Also, if they take FSU because they are an undefeated conference champion with a weak strength of schedule, then how do they shun Liberty who is exactly the same?

The FSU supporters will evaporate when Georgia beats them 63 - 7 in the bowl game.

I don’t think anyone could actually say with a straight face that Liberty’s resume is “exactly the same” as Florida State’s. Who you play does matter.

 

[NewEra 2014]

A lot of truth in what you say. Also, if they take FSU because they are an undefeated conference champion with a weak strength of schedule, then how do they shun Liberty who is exactly the same?

The FSU supporters will evaporate when Georgia beats them 63 - 7 in the bowl game.

I think Liberty is viewed as not being a worthy CFP contender because they are from a lower-level conference. I’m not saying that is right, but that is how they are viewed.

The CFP committee makes its selections by trying to minimize the criticism it receives. That is the only real criterion that they use. Which is insane, but that is how it is done.

 

[wilbury]

The funny part of the FSU situation is that if Georgia had beaten Bama, FSU is in the playoff. It is only because Bama beat Georgia that Texas had to be included as well. FSU’s playoff fate came down to the outcome of the SEC championship game.

How is that for a jacked up playoff system?

I don't think that gets FSU in. If Georgia beats Bama, Georgia, Michigan and Washington are in. Then that last spot comes down to Texas or FSU. I still think Texas would get that spot and I think they might even have a better argument to get in over FSU than Bama does now.

 

[NewEra 2014]

I don't think that gets FSU in. If Georgia beats Bama, Georgia, Michigan and Washington are in. Then that last spot comes down to Texas or FSU. I still think Texas would get that spot and I think they might even have a better argument to get in over FSU than Bama does now.

I disagree. The committee can put in four undefeated teams at that point and minimize the criticism they receive. That is the committee’s main focus when they choose CFP teams.

 

[doctornick]

I disagree. The committee can put in four undefeated teams at that point and minimize the criticism they receive. That is the committee’s main focus when they choose CFP teams.

Yep. The issue irks they wanted to put Bama in and they couldn’t do that without putting in Texas. So they viewed it as easier to leave out FSU.

If Georgia had won, you just put in the four undefeated teams and you’d be done.

 

[LemonEars]

Yep. The issue irks they wanted to put Bama in and they couldn’t do that without putting in Texas. So they viewed it as easier to leave out FSU.

If Georgia had won, you just put in the four undefeated teams and you’d be done.

Yep, Alabama and Texas were a package deal. FSU was odd man out.

I still think the best (most skilled players, teams most able to consistently perform at the highest level) teams in the country were Michigan, Georgia, Alabama, and Ohio State. If I was king of the committee that is who I would have picked.

 

[JR4PSU]

Ah yes, the infallible transitive property. Bulletproof way to determine who's better. Nevermind that in many years you can create a complete infinite circle of teams beating others within some conferences. I guess that shows that all of them are equal?

The whole point of a playing a regular season is to determine who is worthy of the playoffs, and then the single elimination games begin. It is laughable that a team that went undefeated in a P5 conference and is being left out. I don't care if their QB is hurt or not, they've earned it, and with a month of practice as a starting QB nobody knows what their backups are capable of. Upsets can, and do happen.

Sorry, there is no "earning it". That's like selecting an inferior job candidate because they checked the black or woman or Asian or transgender box on their application.

As I said, the goal is to select the BEST four teams, not the four "most deserving" because of some boxes that were checked. Clearly a subjective task. No matter who is selected, someone isn't going to like it.

And putting up the common opponent of Florida for FSU and Georgia was to show that Georgia beat Florida by a wider margin.

Bottom line, nothing can change things now. Nothing said will all of the sudden get FSU into the CFP, at this point. FSU can make their argument after beating Georgia. We'll see who was right after that game. If they beat Georgia, which they clearly have incredible incentive to now do, then I will submit that they were possibly one of the four best teams. If they don't, well...

 

[CJFisJoePaII]

A lot of truth in what you say. Also, if they take FSU because they are an undefeated conference champion with a weak strength of schedule, then how do they shun Liberty who is exactly the same?

The FSU supporters will evaporate when Georgia beats them 63 - 7 in the bowl game.

That's complete nonsense - G5 Conference teams have never been ranked equivalent to P5. You keep saying it, but it's laughable nonsense (Liberty was ranked 24th prior to the CCGs - FSU was ranked 4th genius). After the CCGs, Liberty is now ranked 23rd in the CFP Rankings - they were never in consideration for the CFP 4-Team Invitational and that is standard practice in regards to G5 teams regardless of their record.

FSU is the 1st team in CFP History to lose their Top 4 ranking despite winning their Conference Championship Game - yet another completely UNPRECEDENTED fact among many others (1st undefeated P5 team to not be invited, 1st P5 team with less loses than a single P5 team that was invited, let alone less losses than two P5 teams invited..... etc, etc, etc....). The reason all these unprecedented facts exists is because the CFP blithely ignored their long established primary selection criteria (as proven by the BCS Computer Algorithm not selecting the exact same 4 teams ordinally for the first time in CFP history - another "unprecedented"). The BCS was the forerunner to the CFP run by the same entities. Contrary to your continued drivel, it is not the first time an undefeated G5 team has been left out - it has happened many, many times including as recently as 2018 when UCF was 12-0 and was not only left out of 4-Team Invitational, but was in back of 4 or 5 other P5 teams with 1 or even 2 losses (Oklahoma who made the 4-Team Invitational was not ranked behind any P5 team with more losses.). That is only one of tons of examples that can be given - Liberty, a G5 team, being ranked behind many P5 teams with more losses IS NOT UNPRECEDENTED! A P5 team, with more losses than another P5 team being selected over the P5 team with less losses is completely UNPRECEDENTED - let alone 2 P5 teams being put into the 4-Team Invitational in front of another P5 team with less losses - off the charts unprecedented.

 

[PSUSignore]

The FSU supporters will evaporate when Georgia beats them 63 - 7 in the bowl game.

I won't. The ends don't justify the means. You could put FSU in and they could lose the semifinals by 100 points and I wouldn't care, they still earned the playoff berth.

 

[PSUSignore]

Sorry, there is no "earning it". That's like selecting an inferior job candidate because they checked the black or woman or Asian or transgender box on their application.

These aren't even close to the same thing but whatever, you do you.

 

[NewEra 2014]

Sorry, there is no "earning it". That's like selecting an inferior job candidate because they checked the black or woman or Asian or transgender box on their application.

As I said, the goal is to select the BEST four teams, not the four "most deserving" because of some boxes that were checked. Clearly a subjective task. No matter who is selected, someone isn't going to like it.

And putting up the common opponent of Florida for FSU and Georgia was to show that Georgia beat Florida by a wider margin.

Bottom line, nothing can change things now. Nothing said will all of the sudden get FSU into the CFP, at this point. FSU can make their argument after beating Georgia. We'll see who was right after that game. If they beat Georgia, which they clearly have incredible incentive to now do, then I will submit that they were possibly one of the four best teams. If they don't, well...

The thing I genuinely don’t understand is if they are picking the best 4 teams, why wouldn’t the CFP field be Michigan, OSU, Georgia, and Bama? They are the four “best” teams by many measures, including talent level. And if that is the case, why play any of the games at all?

 

[LandoComando]

These aren't even close to the same thing but whatever, you do you.

You still can't earn a spot when a committee selects teams. You believe they were more deserving which is fine but nothing is "earned" without auto bids.

Again this is all on the ACC for voting against a 12 team playoff this year. They ruined it not only for FSU but for us.

 

[JR4PSU]

The thing I genuinely don’t understand is if they are picking the best 4 teams, why wouldn’t the CFP field be Michigan, OSU, Georgia, and Bama? They are the four “best” teams by many measures, including talent level. And if that is the case, why play any of the games at all?

In the last game of the season, Michigan beat OSU and Alabama beat Georgia. So that was, in effect, the first round. OSU and Georgia lost the first round. They don't advance. The next two best teams are up. And FSU isn't one of them.

 

[LandoComando]

If yi

In the last game of the season, Michigan beat OSU and Alabama beat Georgia. So that was, in effect, the first round. OSU and Georgia lost the first round. They don't advance. The next two best teams are up. And FSU isn't one of them.

If it's not part of the playoff it's not the first round. It doesn't even make sense.

 

[NewEra 2014]

In the last game of the season, Michigan beat OSU and Alabama beat Georgia. So that was, in effect, the first round. OSU and Georgia lost the first round. They don't advance. The next two best teams are up. And FSU isn't one of them.

Got it. So while UGA played Bama and OSU played Michigan, the “first round game” for Texas was Okie Lite. That is the measure for Texas being better than UGA and OSU. Really?

With all due respect, your logic is about as solid as the logic used by the CFP committee.

 

[JR4PSU]

Got it. So while UGA played Bama and OSU played Michigan, the “first round game” for Texas was Okie Lite. That is the measure for Texas being better than UGA and OSU. Really?

With all due respect, your logic is about as solid as the logic used by the CFP committee.

And the members of the CFP committee are all smarter than you. So, I don't doubt that their logic eludes you. To you it makes perfect sense to advance to the CFP the team that just lost, the day before, to the #1 team. Or to advance to the playoffs any team that just lost the day before. Yeah, that makes perfect sense. No wonder you have such issues with logic.

 

[NewEra 2014]

And the members of the CFP committee are all smarter than you. So, I don't doubt that their logic eludes you. To you it makes perfect sense to advance to the CFP the team that just lost, the day before, to the #1 team. Or to advance to the playoffs any team that just lost the day before. Yeah, that makes perfect sense. No wonder you have such issues with logic.

You miss the point entirely. I am not advocating for the four “best” teams based on talent to make the CFP. I am advocating for the four “best” teams who showed it on the field to make the CFP.

Those teams would be Washington, FSU, Texas and Bama. Michigan gets left out of the postseason for cheating.

 

[JR4PSU]

You miss the point entirely. I am not advocating for the four “best” teams based on talent to make the CFP. I am advocating for the four “best” teams who showed it on the field to make the CFP.

Those teams would be Washington, FSU, Texas and Bama. Michigan gets left out of the postseason for cheating.

Well, the committee's commission was to select the four "best" teams based on their assessment of which includes many aspects, to include their assessment of teams based on injuries as well as performance on the field, not just a binary assessment of wins/losses. And I'm sorry, but FSU would be slammed by all four of the current field of playoff teams. And that isn't just my assessment. That is the overwhelming majority opinion of most people that cover college football, both in the journalism world and in the betting world.

The fact of the matter is that the current 4 team playoff was flawed from the start. There are only 4 spots but 5 major conferences. Eventually there would be the case that a zero-loss conference champion would be left out. Granted, today is not that example, specifically, but eventually a zero-loss team would be left out due to a subjective assessment of each team's performance on the field, with significant weight being placed on the later part of the season.

 

[Chickenman Testa]

We’re still crying about FSU? **** them

Their fans gleefully pounced on the Sandusky hate train and we’ve been screwed far harder in history (e.g. 1994)

 

[NoBareFeet]

And I'm sorry, but FSU would be slammed by all four of the current field of playoff teams. And that isn't just my assessment. That is the overwhelming majority opinion of most people that cover college football, both in the journalism world and in the betting world

Those same people said that Oregon would crush Washington in the Pac 12 title game, and that Georgia would whip Alabama in the SEC game. In other words, it means nothing.

Things should be assessed based on what actually happens on the field.

 

[JR4PSU]

Those same people said that Oregon would crush Washington in the Pac 12 title game, and that Georgia would whip Alabama in the SEC game. In other words, it means nothing.

Things should be assessed based on what actually happens on the field.

That's impossible with only 4 teams to choose. By most measures, the four that got in were the better teams. FSU has only it's win/loss record against an inferior field of opponents when compared to the four that got in.

Also, you base your assessment of the four based on what their body of work up to now, not on what actually happens on the field IN THE FUTURE. Because there is no more future to wait for your assessment. You can't wait for FSU to prove more than they already have. You have to make your choice based on what HAS transpired, not on what MIGHT transpire.

By the way, Washington beat Oregon TWICE. It wasn't a fluke.

It will be better with the 12-team playoff, but you'll hear from #13. Someone will always feel left out and that they are the better team than #12. You will never please everyone. The committee makes their decision based on their assessment, not ours. I happen to agree with their assessment, you don't. Oh well.

 

[NoBareFeet]

I happen to agree with their assessment, you don't.

It's just puzzling to me how everyone can slam Florida State for how they "struggled" with a pretty good Louisville team, and completely ignore the fact that Alabama needed a hail mary to beat a bad Auburn team just two weeks ago! Yet the narrative is how great Alabama was playing at the end of the season. BS!

Having an injured QB should have no bearing on the selections at all. FSU's accomplishments this season are their accomplishments. The results should be what they are judged on. Not some projection on how they MIGHT struggle without a certain player.

 

[JR4PSU]

It's just puzzling to me how everyone can slam Florida State for how they "struggled" with a pretty good Louisville team, and completely ignore the fact that Alabama needed a hail mary to beat a bad Auburn team just two weeks ago! Yet the narrative is how great Alabama was playing at the end of the season. BS!

Yeah, but Alabama had just beaten the #1 team in the land ONE DAY ago. Kind of softens any harsh take on a game two weeks prior.

 

[LandoComando]

You miss the point entirely. I am not advocating for the four “best” teams based on talent to make the CFP. I am advocating for the four “best” teams who showed it on the field to make the CFP.

Those teams would be Washington, FSU, Texas and Bama. Michigan gets left out of the postseason for cheating.

Doesn't using Michigan cheating go against "show it on the field"?

 

[LandoComando]

It's just puzzling to me how everyone can slam Florida State for how they "struggled" with a pretty good Louisville team, and completely ignore the fact that Alabama needed a hail mary to beat a bad Auburn team just two weeks ago! Yet the narrative is how great Alabama was playing at the end of the season. BS!

Having an injured QB should have no bearing on the selections at all. FSU's accomplishments this season are their accomplishments. The results should be what they are judged on. Not some projection on how they MIGHT struggle without a certain player.

FSU struggled with a 5-7 Florida team the same day Bama did with Auburn

The QB being injured absolutely matter when they showed the struggle without him there's no "might" about it

 

[NoBareFeet]

The QB being injured absolutely matter when they showed the struggle without him there's no "might" about it

So if Jalen Milroe breaks his ankle today, should Alabama be taken out of the playoff?