That doesn't make someone with a PhD in theology (even if accedited) qualified to be a high school administrator (or even teach anything that isn't theology).
Question about college degree accreditation
- Thread starter Obliviax
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I always thought is was weird and maybe somewhat pretentious for non-medical doctors to be called doctor. Getting a Doctorate in say Philosophy is no where near the same level as a Cardiologist in my opinion.
I know a guy with a doctorate in chemistry….. doesn’t insist people call him Dr. in fact few people even know it.
Same with a guy in archeology. Another in engineering. There are lots of people with doctorates that aren’t egotistical enough to insist on such a title.
I do see lots of doctors listed in obituaries . A lot of educators, musicians, and religious doctorates. Seems like people in the humanities need that psychological boost.
IMHO, it is about "brand". In today's independent world brand is everything. I know people who feel they get better treatment if they use the Dr. title when making dinner reservations let alone anything else. to me, if you've got a PhD, use it. It is a lot of work and quite an achievement.
I know medical doctors who don’t go by doctor. That’s their right.
Why do you care? Seems insecure.
When in a professional setting it is wise and appropriate to use any title justly earned. But insisting on everyone using that title is shallow and reeks of elitism which is unAmerican .
I don’t like saying President Trump or President Clinton. Proper terminology should be ‘former President’. Same with other former government officials …..Sec State, Senator….. when you are out you are out.
Beer drinking and I pretension enough to demand I be called a Doctor - earned it by drinking 16 oz Stegmaier returnables at PSU - kind if an honorary degree.
You are correct about the "lot of work" comment. I recently earned my 2nd Education based Masters Degree from a PSAC school at age 58. The class hours, along with research time and thesis writing is indeed substantial. Our Cohort of ~25 started the Fall before Covid. The world has changed so much in that time.IMHO, it is about "brand". In today's independent world brand is everything. I know people who feel they get better treatment if they use the Dr. title when making dinner reservations let alone anything else. to me, if you've got a PhD, use it. It is a lot of work and quite an achievement.
And the reality is that you don't turn your "research" on and off...always thinking about it....very consuming if you are doing it right. I wrote about cell phone use in school- always was watching and digesting behaviors and correlations. It can be all consuming and ruin marital relationships for awhile. I'll admit to being in a "fog" last Fall.....the concept of trying to statistically capture within acceptable research methodology- what appears to be an obvious supposition is daunting.
BUT- I'm nowhere near an M.D.- with the years of school/residence/boards etc and I would shudder at propping myself up like that. If my two Master's programs would have happened to run consecutively at the same institution and resulted in a PHd (which they did not) I'd be "Dr." but would likely choose not to use it. Garish for a high school teacher.
Maybe a "Dual Master" handle would work????? "Poppycock" is what my Liverpool-born/tea drinking Paternal Grandmother would've said.....
Right now I'm Master's +30 credits on my payscale and likely will end up at M +45 by retirement. I am investigating a 30 credit MBA program that would fit within our District based Credit compensation and movement parameters. Master's + 60 Credits is the Top of most Education based salary structures- "Doctoral Equivalent" it is called. We'll see. Not sure how much schoolin' on the student side I have left in me....but it is always fun to learn. To get paid a little bit extra to do it is an incentive- but I'll never have an additional title.
Maybe I'll be a "Tri-Master?" That and $2.90 will get me a ride on the NYC Subway.
: )
Was Genesee 16OZ "Kings" returnable bottles for us until we decided to splurge on Budweisers from Hickeys.... made us feel less impoverished as poor college students
Great feedback. And this kind of takes this thread full circle. Those who have done the work and achieved the accomplishment deserve all credit. The challenge with these "paper mills" is that they are getting and using these degrees/titles but they are far less valuable/impactful. We are losing our baseline on how to respect these degrees and titles.
As a STEM PhD, I'd argue that having an MD in cardiology is not where near as impressive as having a PhD in physics, chemistry or biology.
Most MDs do not do research meaning that they are not creating new knowledge. They are more similar to auto mechanics, than they are to scientists. I am greatful for both cardiologists and auto mechanics but you don't need to be a genius to do either.
Furthermore, historically "doctor" was initially for academics not medical professionals. So it's actually more correct to call an academic expert (PhD) than it is an MD.
Whom should we really call a “doctor”?
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
A PSU roommate has a PhD and is now a college Prof. We deridingly call him "The Doctor" but he has indeed earned the handle and is actively doing teaching and research at a major institution. Much of his compensation comes from consulting both for and outside of the university. His Masters was from U of Maryland and his PhD from NC State- both of which are leaders in his field of study. His work is tangible and his clients can see the difference his recommendations make (or not depending on the circumstance).
The original "Dr." in this whole thread has 2 dubious "degrees" from unspectacular places with questionable accreditation and is using their titles in a primary/secondary private religious school setting and on top of that "borrowing" the name of a leading Big Ten school to boost the perception of their "Intelligence." This is total Emperor's Clothes stuff...
Apples and oranges in my mind- as are PhD's and MDs. Education does not = pay or industry respect. When I was leaving the Sports Marketing field in 2002 I met with a state school University Prof with a PhD in Sports Marketing earned from Temple but teaching at another state's flagship school. He told me about his research, classes he taught, and how he needed to be published in a few select Journals to meet his compensation/tenure goals. I had never heard of any of these publications and had been a Sr. VP at the world's largest Sports Marketing firm with Fortune 500 clients who activated the biggest sponsorship platforms in the world.
Educators writing for educators about making money in Businesses that they don't work in nor are read by decision makers in that industry who are guiding the changes and revenue generation.
NOT equivalent of Brain Surgery or The New England Journal of Medicine.
That about sums it up sometimes....quackery.
I can see this point and respect it.As a STEM PhD, I'd argue that having an MD in cardiology is not where near as impressive as having a PhD in physics, chemistry or biology.
Most MDs do not do research meaning that they are not creating new knowledge. They are more similar to auto mechanics, than they are to scientists. I am greatful for both cardiologists and auto mechanics but you don't need to be a genius to do either.
Furthermore, historically "doctor" was initially for academics not medical professionals. So it's actually more correct to call an academic expert (PhD) than it is an MD.
Whom should we really call a “doctor”?
Yep...pre internet, you had a baseline. You attended a university that was accredited by a government-recognized organization. Today you can get your PhD from the University of OnlyFans or Facebook and that is somehow comparable to the University of NameTheState.
True that getting a MD does not entail advanced research or a thesis. But with four years undergraduate work + four years med school + internship/residency + state exams grants them the equivalent of a doctorate.As a STEM PhD, I'd argue that having an MD in cardiology is not where near as impressive as having a PhD in physics, chemistry or biology.
Most MDs do not do research meaning that they are not creating new knowledge. They are more similar to auto mechanics, than they are to scientists. I am greatful for both cardiologists and auto mechanics but you don't need to be a genius to do either.
Furthermore, historically "doctor" was initially for academics not medical professionals. So it's actually more correct to call an academic expert (PhD) than it is an MD.
Whom should we really call a “doctor”?
Plus bring a MD requires knowledge on multiple fields like pharmacology, immunology, oncology, physiology and on and on. That’s different than a field of study focused on a single, in depth point.
STEM doctorates are difficult and well earned. But read Dr Jill’s work and tell me her doctorate is equivalent.
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I think you mean 'does not entail', correct? And this is a great point.
The number of years in school is certainly equivalent, but a STEM PhD creates new knowledge in their dissertation whereas an MD merely learns what others already know (disclaimer: some MDs DO do research, but not as part of their educational process)
I agree that it requires a lot of knowledge (although these days, most things can be googled; I've witnessed an MD google the answer to a question I asked while I was sitting in his office).
I'd also add that some STEM fields require a lot of different disciplines, e.g. if you are studying marine science, you need to understand geology, meteorology, chemistry, hydrodynamics, biology, etc.
I'm am not familiar with her PhD work (I believe it is an E.D.) but would agree that STEM PhDs and non-stem PhD are different animals.
Yep, dropped the ‘not’.
Yes MDs rely on the internet. Once told my mother’s doc about a new gout medicine she hadn’t heard about. Doubt there are any other fields that require as much continuous Ed as the medical field. Law maybe, tax code but those are different.
I looked at her work when it became public that she wasn’t an MD or STEM. Pretty lightweight stuff for a doctorate…. even I understood it!
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Because she’s a school teacher and uses the title Dr to trick low information voters like Whoopie Goldberg into thinking she’s a medical doctor, hence Whoopie embarrassingly endorsing her for Surgeon General on national TV.
It is a form of fraud in the vein of stolen valor. For example, “Dr” Maya Angelou never even attended college let alone earn an advanced degree.
I believe Bill Cosby has earned a real Doctor of Education degree. Same as Jill Biden.
That’s not true for Penn State or anywhere. I know people that went to Harvard (several) and Princeton who have good but not great jobs.
One Harvard guy was a beer salesman for a brewery. Liked his job, did fairly well, but never had better opportunities thrown his way.
In the 70s US "Steal" and other big companies were clamoring for Penn State grads.
Again, the title of doctor was used for PhDs before it was used for medical doctors (see my link above).
She isn't use it to trick anyone, just as me using Dr to denote my PhD in chemistry is not tricking anyone.
Whoopie Goldberg being an idiot isn't the First Lady's fault.
I have no idea what you are talking about, but if you don't want to clarify what you said that's fine. I don't care that much.
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