Watch from 25 minutes to 45 minutes especially. This is what the OP is talking about , stop it already with the diversions. This should be shown in every high school in the US.
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Ha! Reminds me of a statement made by a Park Ranger in California. "Humans! The worst thing that happened to this planet."I wonder how many of today's young adults can tell you what Jim Crow laws were, and when.
Fair enough. 1619 did happen though. We as humans will just debate what happened that year and it's significance.All the above
That wasn’t when slavery started. It is just politics. Tell the 1619 project people to take it up with the British or the Spanish in the 1500’s.Fair enough. 1619 did happen though. We as humans will just debate what happened that year and it's significance.
https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/first-african-slave-ship-arrives-jamestown-colony
Some parts of the past stink! Hopefully we can work toward not doing the same crap in the future. Evil, no matter the source, the time, or how many it impacted, is still evil.
Cheers!
The title is misleading because the black people were slaves in Africa but indentured servants in Virginia. Slavery was not codified in Virginia until about 1660. The body of the article does mention their indentured servants status however.Fair enough. 1619 did happen though. We as humans will just debate what happened that year and it's significance.
https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/first-african-slave-ship-arrives-jamestown-colony
Some parts of the past stink! Hopefully we can work toward not doing the same crap in the future. Evil, no matter the source, the time, or how many it impacted, is still evil.
Cheers!
Fair comments. Quite often the story starts before the actual events. That is why timelines are often important in history.The title is misleading because the black people were slaves in Africa but indentured servants in Virginia. Slavery was not codified in Virginia until about 1660. The body of the article does mention their indentured servants status however.
The United States had nothing to do with this so called 1619 project. In 1860’s Lincoln freed the slaves and the north beat the south ending slavery in the United States. That is what needs to be taught. Anything else is rewritten history to fit a narrative.
Does 1607 matter? Does 1775 matter? Does 1776 matter? Of course it does.The United States had nothing to do with this so called 1619 project. In 1860’s Lincoln freed the slaves and the north beat the south ending slavery in the United States. That is what needs to be taught. Anything else is rewritten history to fit a narrative.
Or by who.I wonder how many of today's young adults can tell you what Jim Crow laws were, and when.
And the Dutch and Portuguese. And African tribal leaders that sold people into slavery.That wasn’t when slavery started. It is just politics. Tell the 1619 project people to take it up with the British or the Spanish in the 1500’s.
Hence the question: 1619? or 1619 project?That wasn’t when slavery started. It is just politics. Tell the 1619 project people to take it up with the British or the Spanish in the 1500’s.
We are often confused by what we tolerate.And the Dutch and Portuguese. And African tribal leaders that sold people into slavery.
What are you implying. That Jefferson was a bad man? The memorial to him should be changed?We are often confused by what we tolerate.
https://www.monticello.org/thomas-jefferson/jefferson-slavery/
Sorry, I forgot this link:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crispus_Attucks
Slavery was an essential part of human societies for 99.9% of human existence once you humans had evolved into community and city beings. Emphasizing it in the US when it ended more that 150 years ago and was still ongoing in some African countries in the 1960s is a serious misdirection and a diversion from most of the problems that are at issue today in the US.And the Dutch and Portuguese. And African tribal leaders that sold people into slavery.
Not at all! For the record, I'd rather everything regarding Jefferson stand. What I'd also like is that advanced history courses (High school and above) acknowledge that he had contradictions. Like many men before and after he had flaws. That doesn't take away his achievements, it just shows that he was human. It also facilitates understanding regarding our Union. That it always has been and currently is a work in progress.What are you implying. That Jefferson was a bad man? The memorial to him should be changed?
Is it? Perhaps this should be a separate thread. A common theme in this thread is human atrocities. This is one of them. It is still an open wound.Slavery was an essential part of human societies for 99.9% of human existence once you humans had evolved into community and city beings. Emphasizing it in the US when it ended more that 150 years ago and was still ongoing in some African countries in the 1960s is a serious misdirection and a diversion from most of the problems that are at issue today in the US.
Not at all! For the record, I'd rather everything regarding Jefferson stand. What I'd also like is that advanced history courses (High school and above) acknowledge that he had contradictions. Like many men before and after he had flaws. That doesn't take away his achievements, it just shows that he was human. It also facilitates understanding regarding our Union. That it always has been and currently is a work in progress.
“Honesty is the first chapter of the book wisdom.”
― Thomas Jefferson
Thomas Jefferson Quotes
We are having dialog, so I hope you don't take this the wrong way. To some, Hitler was just a flawed human. To many others he was an evil monster with no redeeming qualities! To many, it is all but impossible to look past those flaws. I can understand that in both examples. For clarity, I am not comparing Jefferson to Hitler, just stating that both men have done things that many can't get past. Short of Jesus telling me directly to forgive Hitler and look past all of his flaws, I don't see myself doing this.The problem is that he and other founders are shown to be more than people with contradictions but as down right evil people. You don't tear down statues of people with contradictions.
They were not evil people that did some good things. And they were not good people that did some bad things. They were people that reflected the norms of humanity at that time. Slavery was a well established behavior world wide. And had been for centuries.
What should be taught is that these were great men that did great things but also followed accepted human norms at the time. That humanity has evolved since then just as it has for eons and will continue to evolve. What is accepted behavior constantly changes and will continue to do so.
A hundred years ago it was common for 20 yr old men to marry 14 yr old girls. Now we put them in jail. 20-30 years from now we may imprison people that eat meat. Will the people of that period hate all of us evil meat eaters? A hundred years from now they may outlaw eating vegetables and look at us as disgusting, evil beasts.
When looking back in history it is difficult to keep things in context. We look with our current eyes and morals instead of their environment.
Deal! Make it happen!Holocaust yes absolutely. 1619? Only if you start with 1492 and work your way up
Each year lol.
This will be my last comment, since I realize it will lead to a major sidetrack of this thread. I don't think slavery which ended in 1865 is an open wound. It is used as an excuse for lack of family responsibility and academic achievement because it has a very strong emotional and dramatic component that can excuse negative behaviors. Discrimination is a continuing problem, but slavery itself is virtually irrelevant in today's United States.It [Slavery] is still an open wound.
The fact that real history isThe students today are being taught the “new history.” Things like the Holocaust, the communist regime’s, etc. are being glossed by due to more important themes such as anti-war movements. My kids really didn’t learn much in school about the world wars and other “old” history. The Nazis were socialists with a right of center slant and lead by a dictator (Nazi is short for the Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei or National Socialist German Workers Party) and Communist Russians were socialists with a leftist slant and dictator.
Good lordA few years ago, a granddaughter was assigned by her elementary school teacher to write a paper on Nelson Mandella as part of a "great Americans" series.
I was actually going to mention this. The Holocaust and the slaughter of Jews was horrible and needs to be remembered, but at least it was generally well reported. The genocide of Armenians (and Greeks and Assyrians) in the early part of the 20th century in Turkey is virtually ignored in the history books and Turkey denies it to this very day.
Nothing like a nice Holocaust reminder to get us all happy and fired up for football season. What's your favorite song? Wreck Of the Edmund Fitzgerald?It’s one of the defining incidents of the 20th Century, along with Hiroshima and the moon landing, and too many people are ignorant about it. Beyond sad and disturbing.
Then leave. No one is stopping you! 24 year Army Veteran!!!!!!I hate U.S.
Are you allowed to laugh in a Holocaust thread?Nothing like a nice Holocaust reminder to get us all happy and fired up for football season. What's your favorite song? Wreck Of the Edmund Fitzgerald?
What’s 9-11????? (Jk)An awful lot of kids today are taught how bad the US is. They ignore WWII and Korea and start with Vietnam. Then the Gulf Wars are sold as "dead American soldiers for oil". The only time the citizenry wakes up is when we are attacked (like Pearl Harbor and 9-11.
I agree that it is a complex topic. One we can't do justice in this thread.This will be my last comment, since I realize it will lead to a major sidetrack of this thread. I don't think slavery which ended in 1865 is an open wound. It is used as an excuse for lack of family responsibility and academic achievement because it has a very strong emotional and dramatic component that can excuse negative behaviors. Discrimination is a continuing problem, but slavery itself is virtually irrelevant in today's United States.
I agree that it is a complex topic. One we can't do justice in this thread.
Cheers!
American or U.S. History?Can we at least answer whether it is American History or not?
American or U.S. History?
I was joking, but I remember in my travels (haven't really traveled that much) someone bringing to my attention that all the countries listed and of course more are part of the Americas. The question was why. It was genuine and not an intended slam. After that, I usually would say USA/ US.I've never heard Canadian, Mexican, or the myriad of South American countries histories referred to as American History. Is that next?