Kolat in high school

mcpat

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I didn’t really want to start a new thread on this but didn’t see a good one to post it

On tHR there has been a few posts on which I participated comparing SLee’s high school career to Kolat’s.

I found the old Midlands brackets; see https://nusports.com/sports/2015/6/26/MIDLANDS_0626155320.aspx

Kolat wrestled there in 1989 as a 10th-grader and in 1990 as an 11th grader, placing 3rd and 4th, respectively.

In 1990, he lost 2-1 to 1988 Olympian Ken Chertow. Chertow would go on to win Midlands that year, beating that season’s NCAA Champ Terry Brands 7-4 in the final.

In the consolation semi-final, Kolat beat Shawn Charles, who would place 5th at NCAAs that season.

In the consolation final, he lost in OT to Adam DiSabato, who would go on to place 6th at NCAAs that year.

I just can’t imagine a high school junior entering an open tournament and, say, losing 2-1 to Gilman in the QFs, beating Pat McKee in the consolation semifinal, and then losing in SV to Brandon Courtney in the 3rd place match. Unreal.
 

tullfan68

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I didn’t really want to start a new thread on this but didn’t see a good one to post it

On tHR there has been a few posts on which I participated comparing SLee’s high school career to Kolat’s.

I found the old Midlands brackets; see https://nusports.com/sports/2015/6/26/MIDLANDS_0626155320.aspx

Kolat wrestled there in 1989 as a 10th-grader and in 1990 as an 11th grader, placing 3rd and 4th, respectively.

In 1990, he lost 2-1 to 1988 Olympian Ken Chertow. Chertow would go on to win Midlands that year, beating that season’s NCAA Champ Terry Brands 7-4 in the final.

In the consolation semi-final, Kolat beat Shawn Charles, who would place 5th at NCAAs that season.

In the consolation final, he lost in OT to Adam DiSabato, who would go on to place 6th at NCAAs that year.

I just can’t imagine a high school junior entering an open tournament and, say, losing 2-1 to Gilman in the QFs, beating Pat McKee in the consolation semifinal, and then losing in SV to Brandon Courtney in the 3rd place match. Unreal.
All these flo losers saying Gable is the best HS wrestler ever are wrong,Kolat was and still is the greatest HS wrestler ever!
 

oldcougar65

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I saw Lee and Kolat for all 4 years of their HS runs.
I used to go to AAA exclusively, and only saw AA when we weren't out drinking and needed something to do.
But when Kolat was a freshman, he was all you heard about. So I made an exception in his case. I've seen a lot of wrestling over the years. But when I walked away from that first Kolat bout, it was the first time I felt afraid for his opponents.
He was brutal. He got a forward headlock and almost tore the kid's head off at the root. Yikes! Although he won by decision, he pinned his way through the rest of the tournament. As a Freshman.
Lee was always impressive and super efficient. He put a hurting on most of his opponents, and his only loss had a number of mitigating circumstances. I'd like to see any other wrestler go against ADS on one leg and a few week's worth of practice.

But final judgement time: I gotta go with Kolat. With Spencer Lee you admired a great and efficient wrestler. With Cary Kolat you know you witnessed a force of nature.
 

District four

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I didn’t really want to start a new thread on this but didn’t see a good one to post it

On tHR there has been a few posts on which I participated comparing SLee’s high school career to Kolat’s.

I found the old Midlands brackets; see https://nusports.com/sports/2015/6/26/MIDLANDS_0626155320.aspx

Kolat wrestled there in 1989 as a 10th-grader and in 1990 as an 11th grader, placing 3rd and 4th, respectively.

In 1990, he lost 2-1 to 1988 Olympian Ken Chertow. Chertow would go on to win Midlands that year, beating that season’s NCAA Champ Terry Brands 7-4 in the final.

In the consolation semi-final, Kolat beat Shawn Charles, who would place 5th at NCAAs that season.

In the consolation final, he lost in OT to Adam DiSabato, who would go on to place 6th at NCAAs that year.

I just can’t imagine a high school junior entering an open tournament and, say, losing 2-1 to Gilman in the QFs, beating Pat McKee in the consolation semifinal, and then losing in SV to Brandon Courtney in the 3rd place match. Unreal.
I watched several kolat high school matches. He is the best high school wrestler ever and it wasn't even close
 

oldcougar65

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All these flo losers saying Gable is the best HS wrestler ever are wrong,Kolat was and still is the greatest HS wrestler ever!
Gable was great. But he was there in a time when there wasn't much in the way of wrestling publicity. There was that wrestling newsletter that every college wrestler in the country followed (Amateur Wrestling News, maybe?), since they put each dual meet with results in every issue. That was often the way you found out about your opponents that weren't local to you.
High school kids didn't get publicity, but Gable did. Iowa fans touted his superiority to all comers. It was just assumed he was the best wrestler of the time because you never heard of anyone else, mostly.
The wrestling community was just starting to interact nationally when Kolat came along. He had the audacity to go to Midlands as an 11th grader, and place 3rd.
First, you should maybe re-evaluate your opinion of Midlands. Now Midlands is just another tournament. Back then, it was THE early season tournament, period, and almost everyone wanted to go. Parenthetically, after the season, the Wilkes Tournament was pretty big, too.

So yes, Gable was great. And people then were willing to think he was the best ever. (I still favored Uteke even then.) But he never blew you away like Kolat did.
 

BrockBronson

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I agree 100 with this. No HS kid could do that now. Feldman might be the closest but still very far off
 
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BigFella235

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But when Kolat was a freshman, he was all you heard about. So I made an exception in his case. I've seen a lot of wrestling over the years. But when I walked away from that first Kolat bout, it was the first time I felt afraid for his opponents.
He was brutal. He got a forward headlock and almost tore the kid's head off at the root. Yikes! Although he won by decision, he pinned his way through the rest of the tournament. As a Freshman.
Borrowing from your YouTube page, this match is a prime example of Kolat nearly decapitating one of his HS opponents as a sophomore

 

Rocky_Smith

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Borrowing from your YouTube page, this match is a prime example of Kolat nearly decapitating one of his HS opponents as a sophomore

Thanks for posting. Brutal. Maybe I don’t understand the rule, the headlock looked really clean, and the only reason it was potentially dangerous was that his opponent didn’t immediately go to his back. In other words, it seemed the opponent has the opportunity to yield and succumb to the move, or to deal with the pain and aftermath.

Using the same argument, the ref would have called Dean’s bow and arrow against Warner potentially dangerous and stopped the move.
 

District four

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His state final match as a senior was so amazing to watch. He in that moment became the greatest high school wrestler 🤼‍♂️ ever in my mind. So thankful I didn’t wrestle him.
The back flip match is that the one your speaking about. I watched that live but don't remember if it was the finals
 
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mcpat

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The back flip match is that the one your speaking about. I watched that live but don't remember if it was the finals
It was the finals. Vs Boiling Springs Chris Bohn. Kolat’s senior year.

His junior year, he pinned returning state champ Greg Budman in the finals. 90 secs-ish, if I recall.
 

oldcougar65

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Was it a shock when Bono tied Kolat in the Dapper Dan?
I wonder if you remember that Bono was from Norristown. I have a picture of a scene from the ICWL championships where a bunch of wrestlers are standing near the mat. I guess my daughter took the picture because a lot of the kids were my kids, but Bono was in it, too.
He moved to Florida and transformed himself, or something happened.
 

PSUAllTheWay

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I was at both Nationals when Kolat lost and in both of those bouts he was the better wrestler. Mental mistakes cost him in each bout.

There is no doubt in my mind that Cary should have been a 4x NCAA Champ and be considered one of the all-time greatest college wrestlers. His semi-final win against defending champ Troy Steiner when he was a freshman was epic.
 

ac98

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I grew up in the Chicago suburbs and went to the midlands every year for many years. I don’t think people appreciate the level of talent that was there in those years. This was long before the days of RTCs. You would have Olympic gold medalist like Kenny Monday and Bruce Baumgartner competing against the best college teams. It would not be unusual to see returning national champs seeded 2nd or 3rd. The midlands in those years was tougher to win then the NCAAs.

I remember watching Kolat compete in those tourneys. Everyone stopped to watch him because there was no YouTube, he was already a legend and all you heard about how he destroyed kids his age. He was right there with the best in college as a 10th grader.
 

PSU James

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Simple question: If weight was identical and you could choose your opponent, Spencer or Kolat.

Who else would rather wrestle Spencer Lee than face the force that is Cary Kolat?
 

nitlion6

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Simple question: If weight was identical and you could choose your opponent, Spencer or Kolat.

Who else would rather wrestle Spencer Lee than face the force that is Cary Kolat?
Spencer would beat everybody, Kolat would maul everybody. I would rather have received my beating from Spencer.
 
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tullfan68

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Simple question: If weight was identical and you could choose your opponent, Spencer or Kolat.

Who else would rather wrestle Spencer Lee than face the force that is Cary Kolat?
easy Spencer, Kolat was an animal!
 

District four

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It was the finals. Vs Boiling Springs Chris Bohn. Kolat’s senior year.

His junior year, he pinned returning state champ Greg Budman in the finals. 90 secs-ish, if I recall.
His senior year he was running a lap in warmups and did a forward flip while running and never missed stride. He also wore two different color shoes while wrestling at states which was pretty cool.
 
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zzs006

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Simple question: If weight was identical and you could choose your opponent, Spencer or Kolat.

Who else would rather wrestle Spencer Lee than face the force that is Cary Kolat?
Rather wrestle Spencer and it’s not even a debate. Kolat just physically punished kids while being so much better than everyone.Spencer was just better than everyone and scored a ton of points. Chance was obviously very good but I don’t have him on this level. Not far behind though
 
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mcpat

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Some people may disagree by marsteller was pretty good in high school as well not many people could hang with him.
I was in Hershey watching the District 3 individual tournament. It was Marstellar vs one of the Peppelmans. I think it was the final but it might have been the semi-final. Time was winding down at the end of the first period. Peppelman relaxed because there was just a few seconds left. Marstellar saw this and went for a throw. Scored (I think 4) with just a few secs left. It was very impressive.
 
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psualt

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I was in Hershey watching the District 3 individual tournament. It was Marstellar vs one of the Peppelmans. I think it was the final but it might have been the semi-final. Time was winding down at the end of the first period. Peppelman relaxed because there was just a few seconds left. Marstellar saw this and went for a throw. Scored (I think 4) with just a few secs left. It was very impressive.
You may remember, marstellar snapped him down at one point that was like a rag doll.
 

royboy

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You may remember, marstellar snapped him down at one point that was like a rag doll.
Yeah, Peppelman ended up with 2 AAA titles, but a 17-5 loss to Marsteller in the 160 finals in 2013 wrecked any idea of Peppelman's reputation of being an all-time great.

IMO, Marsteller deserves to be ranked with Kolat as PA's greatest high school wrestler. 4 AAA championships in weights from 152 to 170 and he dominated.
 
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CJFisJoePaII

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I didn’t really want to start a new thread on this but didn’t see a good one to post it

On tHR there has been a few posts on which I participated comparing SLee’s high school career to Kolat’s.

I found the old Midlands brackets; see https://nusports.com/sports/2015/6/26/MIDLANDS_0626155320.aspx

Kolat wrestled there in 1989 as a 10th-grader and in 1990 as an 11th grader, placing 3rd and 4th, respectively.

In 1990, he lost 2-1 to 1988 Olympian Ken Chertow. Chertow would go on to win Midlands that year, beating that season’s NCAA Champ Terry Brands 7-4 in the final.

In the consolation semi-final, Kolat beat Shawn Charles, who would place 5th at NCAAs that season.

In the consolation final, he lost in OT to Adam DiSabato, who would go on to place 6th at NCAAs that year.

I just can’t imagine a high school junior entering an open tournament and, say, losing 2-1 to Gilman in the QFs, beating Pat McKee in the consolation semifinal, and then losing in SV to Brandon Courtney in the 3rd place match. Unreal.

Jimmy Carr not only won Midlands while still in High School, he made the US Olympic Team as a 16 year old.
 

nitlion6

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Yeah, Peppelman ended up with 2 AAA titles, but a 17-5 loss to Marsteller in the 160 finals in 2013 wrecked any idea of Peppelman's reputation of being an all-time great.

IMO, Marsteller deserves to be ranked with Kolat as PA's greatest high school wrestler. 4 AAA championships in weights from 152 to 170 and he dominated.
Marsteller was great, but he was not Kolat. Kolat would have toyed with and mauled Weircioch and Marsteller for that matter. Kolat graduated HS and immediately became an NCAA title threat. The same can not be said for Marsteller.
 
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nitlion6

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Jimmy Carr not only won Midlands while still in High School, he made the US Olympic Team as a 16 year old.
Yet, Jimmy could not get through the NW regional until his senior year when he did win his only state title. Even then as his gas tank emptied he had to hang on to barely pull that out.
Jimmy Carr was unbelievably athletic and obviously outside the PIAA quite accomplished, but nowhere near the best wrestler in PIAA history. Heck, Jimmy was only the second best Carr, ranked behind Nate.
 
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oldcougar65

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Yeah, Peppelman ended up with 2 AAA titles, but a 17-5 loss to Marsteller in the 160 finals in 2013 wrecked any idea of Peppelman's reputation of being an all-time great.
IMO, Marsteller deserves to be ranked with Kolat as PA's greatest high school wrestler. 4 AAA championships in weights from 152 to 170 and he dominated.
I never bought into the Peppelman mystique. There were 4 of them and I guess they grabbed maybe 6 PIAA titles between them. But they were part of that Central Dauphin surge. CD had two moves that they did to perfection that no one caught onto for a long time: the dump and the tilt. For 3-4 years they dominated PA wrestling, till people got it, and it abruptly stopped. I ask you, how did those CD studs do in college?

Of the 3 Peppelman's that won state titles, Garrett was the least talented, even though he won 2 titles. Anyone who was at the 2012 semi's knows that a referee handed Garrett a win over Casey Kent of LaSalle. The biggest royal screw-job I ever saw at states. (LaSalle College HS's venerable coach Vic Stanley grabbed some talent from Greater Norristown and assaulted the states in 2011 when these audacious kids came hunting for bear. It's one of my favorite States memories --- a District 12 team with 4 place winners. That might never happen again. The two that were left over in 2012 still grabbed a 3rd and 4th, but that 3rd place finish was a personal gift from a referee to Garrett Peppelman and it still pisses me off. )

Rant ended.

Chance Marsteller was a fine wrestler, slick as snot on his feet. But he's not at quite the same level as Kolat and Lee. I'd place him just above guys like Mike Johnson, Jeremy Hunter, Ty Moore. Which is not a bad place to be.
 

mcpat

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Walter P was a two-time AA for Harvard. K Courts was an AA for Ohio State. T Dallago was a 4x NQ and the all-time leader in falls for Illinois. T Dippery was a NQ and won over 100 matches at Rider. Z Elvin was a starter for Navy. S Brown was a two-year starter for MD. A Rose was a three-year starter and NQ for Drexel. G Peppelman was a two-year starter for UVA. M Peppelman was a NQ, a two-year starter for Cornell and a 1-yr starter for Lehigh.

I’m sure I’m missing some but that’s a pretty good haul for a public high school over a 5ish year period, IMO.

CD as a team is almost always in the state tourney. They went 1-2 this year but were state runner-ups last year.
 
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nitlion6

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Yeah, Peppelman ended up with 2 AAA titles, but a 17-5 loss to Marsteller in the 160 finals in 2013 wrecked any idea of Peppelman's reputation of being an all-time great.

I never bought into the Peppelman mystique. There were 4 of them and I guess they grabbed maybe 6 PIAA titles between them. But they were part of that Central Dauphin surge. CD had two moves that they did to perfection that no one caught onto for a long time: the dump and the tilt. For 3-4 years they dominated PA wrestling, till people got it, and it abruptly stopped. I ask you, how did those CD studs do in college?

Of the 3 Peppelman's that won state titles, Garrett was the least talented, even though he won 2 titles. Anyone who was at the 2012 semi's knows that a referee handed Garrett a win over Casey Kent of LaSalle. The biggest royal screw-job I ever saw at states. (LaSalle College HS's venerable coach Vic Stanley grabbed some talent from Greater Norristown and assaulted the states in 2011 when these audacious kids came hunting for bear. It's one of my favorite States memories --- a District 12 team with 4 place winners. That might never happen again. The two that were left over in 2012 still grabbed a 3rd and 4th, but that 3rd place finish was a personal gift from a referee to Garrett Peppelman and it still pisses me off. )

Rant ended.

Chance Marsteller was a fine wrestler, slick as snot on his feet. But he's not at quite the same level as Kolat and Lee. I'd place him just above guys like Mike Johnson, Jeremy Hunter, Ty Moore. Which is not a bad place to be.
Ahead of Mike Johnson? The same guy never taken down in HS and who was national runner-up once?
 
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