I'm not one, hope he stays his entire career, stability within the program. Reason for this topic, I live in FL and the three top programs (Miami, Florida and FSU) all brough in new high priced, tough guy coaches and they are no better off with the odds of transforming not looking great. Actually, PSU was the beneficiary of the Miami move, Diaz to PSU was like adding a 5***** recruit.
For those unhappy with Franklin
- Thread starter psulongago
- Start date
3-6 vs UM, 1-7 vs OSU. 1 conference title in 8 (soon to be 9) seasons. Your witness, counselor…
Yes we know, we could be like Nebraska. Eventhough they dont have any decent recruits within hundreds of miles.
Don't understand the hate, are you Paterno leftovers, or some other reason. By the way I was at PSU during the Rip Engle years. Georgia, Alabama, OSU are football institutions, don't know much about academics, Michigan is a good academic school, but not top tier football every year.
No hate at all; Coach Franklin is an under-performing head coach based on the only 3 success metrics for PSU football:
1. He is 3-6 vs UM
2. He is 1-7 vs Ohio State (soon to be 1-8; unfortunately)
3. He has one Conference title in 8 (soon to be 9) seasons.
As for Coach Paterno, RIP, I was a strong advocate for his forced retirement after the meltdown of 1999, where he couldn’t win the conference with a team where almost half the starters were drafted. He also, as a Big Ten head coach, underperformed based upon the 3, and only 3, and only THESE 3, success metrics.
I was happy with the hire and the first 4 years, but since then the program has not taken a step forward and has plateaued (you can argue that it has taken a step back.) I think he has taken the program as far has he can. We have been a fringe top ten team on an annual basis with some really bad losses. CFJ has always stated the goal is a consistent "elite" program and to be in contention for a natty every years. I bought into that and thought we were on track those first several years, but he has failed to live up to his own expectations. Heck he got 10 more years to get us closer though!!😒
If we can beat OSU Franklin will have us back on track. If not we will have lost to OSU and Mich and the season will essentially be over.
AHH, 1999, Minnesota, who was there, Glen Mason woefully outcoached Joe, from my seat in the West stands, i could see the catch, it was good.
There is no defense for a Penn State Football Head Coach to be 4-13 (soon to be 4-14, if history is our guide) vs UM and OSU. None. You are representing an overwhelmingly guilty defendant. You should have sought a plea agreement. No way you‘ll ever prevail at trial. 4-13. That’s the only case the prosecution need make. 4-13. Pathetic, and GUILTY!
I was there behind the game winning fg posts. I remember a fan yelling "everybody blow" to try to blow the ball away. It didnt work.
I was there, with my wife who had never been to a PSU football game. It was Homecoming, as I recall - and we had great seats. After the loss, I sat there stunned, head in hands. My better half, who is a kind and compassionate woman said”why do you get so upset about a game for college kids”? I believe I’m entitled to some kudos for my restraint…
Depends, are you a football only school, or a strong academic institution that produces money to support other sports. Need to accept 9 - 3, 10 -2 and a bowl every year as the norm. I'm not sure someone like Bob could recruit at the level to win 9 games every year. I initially cited what is happening in FL to the big three, big money and mediocre results, looming big buyouts to try it again.
From what I’m reading and seeing in college rankings, my beloved alma mater, Dear Ole State, is in danger of becoming neither.
I demonstrating to you that my client's performance is better than the performance for some other high profile people in his profession.
Further, the schools that have hired the people on my list regret their hires and wish they had stuck with their previous coaches who were doing a better job for less money.
Not sure which was our toughest loss in recent memory. '99 Minne, 2005 Mich, 2008 Iowa, '17&'18 OSU. or '17 MSU. Id probably go with '99 Minnesota. I think we would have won the Natty if we win that game.
Totally agree, would have won the last three games and no Nixon to give the National Championship to whomever. If I recall, weren't Brown and Arrington 1 - 2 in the draft?
Which of course doesn’t address the charge against your client - that he is an underperforming Head Coach due to his unacceptable and pathetic record of 4-13 vs UM and OSU. You are presenting what’s categorized as “mitigating circumstances” to get your clearly guilty client a reduced sentence. So what if he’s better than complete failures? He is still terrible vs the only 2 teams we play that truly matter. Verdict stands: Guilty of being an underperforming Head Coach of PSU. Besides, if my case wasn’t air-tight as the prosecution, I could present this as an aggravating circumstance to increase the severity of the sentence:
$8+ million a year, and the guy is 4-13 vs PSU rivals? Add to the sentence…
IMO, 2005 to UM was the worst, because unlike the other losses, this one was massively impacted by the damn referines.
Do you remember the play where the mich wr rolled for 5 yards to get out of bounds and the ref called him out to stop the clock.
Hey hater why don’t you cite us the records of the coaches the poster mentioned who have worse overall records than Franklin against the dominant programs in their conferences?
Why? Because other schools failures have no bearing on this case and this charge: Franklin is an underperforming Head Coach. That’s the charge, and he is manifestly GUILTY. Other coaches being failures or underperforming is not relevant to this case, and this charge. That’s why. Your client has a lousy lawyer…
I think the problem in part resides in recruiting and player development. Specifically, we have had some good recruiting classes. But Alabama, OSU, Michigan are regularly at the top and with a host of 5 star recruits. Next, we are not getting the OL and DL recruits we need. In big games, we rarely control the line of scrimmage. You cannot, I repeat cannot beat Mich., OSU, Alabama, etc. without OL and DL that can match up. Last, PSU used to be known as a very physical team. Win or lose, the other team knew who they had played. PSU was known in the 60's, 70's, 80's for some very physical players that could tackle and hit. We seem to have lost that quality.
You haven't proven that he is below "the standard of the industry". You can't say a "well, this BMW isn't as fast as I want it to be so I'm suing BMW".
Hope you aren't actually an attorney.
Underperforming means performing below average. In order to calculate an average, you have to determine the performance of the population. That's why the other schools matter. When you consider head coaches in his "price tier", I would actually argue he's performed quite well, certainly NOT below average.
He is at #9 in salary, #30 in wins. That would be underperforming.
What are the other Big 10 coaches records against Ohio State and Michigan?
As John McEnroe so aptly phrased it, "ANSWER THE QUESTION!"
Who cares? Are we trying to be like Maryland or trying to be like OSU or Mich?
Are we going through this again? I assume you are referring to winning percentage.
There are two issues with your methodology.
First, you are including coaches with very short tenures. I think it is fair to exclude coaches who have been at their schools for three years or less because that isn't long enough to determine how successful they actually are.
Also, you are using his overall winning % not just as PSU (at PSU is higher).
If you do it based on his record at PSU (and exclude the short term coaches), he is 11th which is pretty spot on in terms of his compensation.
But keep parroting data that makes no sense but fits your BS narrative.
Obviously dealing with the topic at hand is anathema to you. If you want to start your own thread to whine about Franklin knock yourself out.
Some people want to hinge the verdict on whether Penn State as a huge underdog defeats one of the best teams in the country this Saturday. That's called stacking the deck...rigging the jury.
I understand the criticism, but this is a young team. If they play competitively with the Bucks and finish 10-2 with a big bowl invitation, that's more than good enough for me this year...and far more than most people expected.
Honestly, we never really recovered from the 2017 and 2018 breakdowns that blew a 4th-quarter lead against Ohio State to end up losing by one point. However, even with that, our record against the Bucks has been better than Michigan's over the last 17 years.
At the end of the day, all this nattering about Franklin is hot air. I've been increasingly critical of him, but the fact is that he's a great recruiter...has three 11-win seasons and three NY6 bowl invitations under his belt...and is not going anywhere regardless of Internet bloviation.
I understand the criticism, but this is a young team. If they play competitively with the Bucks and finish 10-2 with a big bowl invitation, that's more than good enough for me this year...and far more than most people expected.
Honestly, we never really recovered from the 2017 and 2018 breakdowns that blew a 4th-quarter lead against Ohio State to end up losing by one point. However, even with that, our record against the Bucks has been better than Michigan's over the last 17 years.
At the end of the day, all this nattering about Franklin is hot air. I've been increasingly critical of him, but the fact is that he's a great recruiter...has three 11-win seasons and three NY6 bowl invitations under his belt...and is not going anywhere regardless of Internet bloviation.
Here's the source - looks to include all games through last week:30th you say. This includes the last two down years.
https://www.coacheshotseat.com/WinningestActiveCoachesIA.htm
Oh yes by all means include his record at football powerhouse Vanderbilt. Sheesh.
So I guess these 3 coaches records elsewhere doesn’t count. Look in the mirror for the BS narrative.
I
'm just not sold on Diaz.......yet. Say what you want about Pry but he generally kept it close v OSU. Eager to see how the defense does this Saturday
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