Ironically, one of Roberto's hits broke Gibson's leg. It resulted in the call up of some left handed kid from their farm system, Lefty Carlton.
For those of you that saw Sandy Koufax pitch.....
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Ironically, one of Roberto's hits broke Gibson's leg. It resulted in the call up of some left handed kid from their farm system, Lefty Carlton.
Saw Sandy pitch in person several times. The batters were helpless. The curve ball would be eye high and drop off the table to the knees. Long slender fingers allowed him to pose easily with four baseballs in hand. He did it after pitching his fourth no hitter. He was a thrill to watch and tickets were scarce when he was on the mound. Best I ever saw without a doubt.
Went to that game, sort of. We pulled up to Three Rivers and turned the radio on just before we paid to park. It was 5-0 early in the game so we turned around. We ended up just getting stoned, riding the incline up to Mt Washington, gawking at the view etc. On our way hone we switched to the Pirate game and listened to the finish. Laughed the rest of the way home.
I can't say I blame you. With the Bucs down 5-0 and Gibson pitching, their fate was sealed. Too bad though you missed being a part of history.
I once rear that when Koufax pitched in an away game attendance increased by 20,000.
Koufax's last no hitter was a perfect game against the Cubs at Dodger Stadium on September 9, 1965.
He struck out the side in the top of the 8th and started the 9th with the score 1-0. Joey Amalfitano and Harvey Kuenn, who were near the end of their careers, were sitting at the end of the bench as the Cubs manager was looking for 2 pinch hitters. Neither of them wanted to be called on as Koufax's jugular was popped out an inch on his neck and he was bringing it.. Amalfitano was called on first, followed by Kuenn.
The first batter struck out, as did Amalfitano. As he walked past Kuenn on his way back to the dugout he told him, geeze Harvey, be careful up there. Kuenn never saw the first 2 pitches for called strikes and he mentally prepared himself to swing on the next pitch. Koufax let it loose and before Kuenn could get the bat around he heard the ball hit the mitt and the Umpire call steeeerike. (Just checked my memory with records and it took 5 pitches to strike Kuenn out.)
Game over.
He struck out the side in the top of the 8th and started the 9th with the score 1-0. Joey Amalfitano and Harvey Kuenn, who were near the end of their careers, were sitting at the end of the bench as the Cubs manager was looking for 2 pinch hitters. Neither of them wanted to be called on as Koufax's jugular was popped out an inch on his neck and he was bringing it.. Amalfitano was called on first, followed by Kuenn.
The first batter struck out, as did Amalfitano. As he walked past Kuenn on his way back to the dugout he told him, geeze Harvey, be careful up there. Kuenn never saw the first 2 pitches for called strikes and he mentally prepared himself to swing on the next pitch. Koufax let it loose and before Kuenn could get the bat around he heard the ball hit the mitt and the Umpire call steeeerike. (Just checked my memory with records and it took 5 pitches to strike Kuenn out.)
Game over.
Best I've seen live? Bob Gibson, Sandy Koufax, Steve Carlton, Tom Seaver, J.R.Richard, Nolan Ryan, Vida Blue, Pedro Martinez. All had great control, kept the ball down, threw hard, could break your back with a slider or curve, and ALL of them were extremely tough with men on base.
In that game the Dodgers only had one hit and scored their only run without getting a hit.
Kuenn, a former AL batting champion, also was the final out of Koufax's second no-hitter -- against the Giants in 1963. That time Kuenn managed to ground out to first base.
The other final outs of Koufax no-hitters:
1962 -- Felix Mantilla (Mets), grounded into force, shortstop to second.
1964 -- Bobby Wine (Phillies), struck out swinging.
You should bread Koufax's biography. He was a freak athlete -- think Lavar Arrington! Koufax was a superb basketball player and had a full scholarship to Cincinnati which was the top basketball school at the time. He actually worked out with the Knicks when he was 16. He never played baseball until he was 17 years old! Within a year he was playing in the minors for the Dodgers and then was in the majors a year after that. He talks about how his body is uniquely suited for throwing a baseball. His bio is fascinating.
While he was nowhere near as exciting to watch pitch as those mentioned in this thread, check out Greg Maddux' numbers in the mid-90's. I think the one year his ERA was a run lower than that of the 2nd lowest guy. I certainly wasn't a Braves fan, but his results were really impressive.
This is also true of Pedro. His numbers vs. those of his peers are remarkable. There is some question of his PED use, but he was also going against hitters who were using as well.
This is also true of Pedro. His numbers vs. those of his peers are remarkable. There is some question of his PED use, but he was also going against hitters who were using as well.
It'd have been interesting to see some modern guys pitch in that era, really just a generation or two prior. Huge ballparks, higher mound, etc.
The game is different today certainly but I still really enjoy it (even though the Phillies are going to be bad again).
Koufax never pitched in the minors. As I said in an earlier post, he signed as a Bonus Baby, which meant he had to be kept on the 25-man roster all season as a rookie. (He took Tommy Lasorda's spot on the roster.) Koufax didn't make an appearance until June 24 and only pitched in 12 games in 1955.
Also all were tough sonsabitches. I loved reading in October 1964 how Gibson once sent Seaver sprawling and Seaver telling him, "Listen, old man, you want to keep this going, just remember that I throw a hell of a lot harder than you do now." In the long run, toughness always trumps talent, always.
As I posted above, he only went out for the Cincinnati baseball team because they were playing at Tulane and he wanted to visit New Orleans...
I saw Sandy pitch (I was 7 y/o) and recall my 1st baseball game at Ebbetts field. The Brooklyn Dodgers played the Chicago Cubs who had a rookie shortstop named Earnie Banks. He turned out to be pretty good
True story about Sandy. His mother lived on Kings Highway in Brooklyn. We kids would ride our bikes over to her apartment, ring the bell and ask for Sandy. That very sweet woman would patiently tell us that he was on a road trip and try back next week. Then came the treat, she always had candy for us. Talk about great memories....
Where you from? I'm from Ave P and West 9th, block from Kings Highway. Where on KW was he? My father graduated from Lafayette, but was there before Sandy. I know from the neighborhood stories how great he was.
As for Ryan, he was a .500 pitcher with the Mets. Would strike out 12 but walk 14 in a game. He didn't get great til later in his career.
Mention of intimidation, do any of you remember Dickie Noles in the 1980 series and flipping George Brett. I believe that pitch/moment won the series for Philadelphia. For those who may recall Noles, not a particularly good pitcher and one who had issues but straightened his life and I believe works for the Phils counseling players.
That's nothing.
I saw Carlton, Tom Seaver, The Big Unit, Steve Blass, J.R. Richard, Pedro Martinez, Nolan Ryan, Ferguson Jenkins, Everybody who pitched for THE Big Red Machine, Gary Gentry, And, many, many others!! (Mostly all Pirate pitchers since 1966) No kidding!Also saw and had in my hand, the ball that the Candy man pitched his no-hitter with against the Dodgers.
Jerry Koosman was the best cold-weather pitcher I ever saw. John Matlock (Matlack)? was no day at the beach either in any weather.
I believe Joe Adcock hit the homer with bases loaded, runners from second and third scored but Hank Aaron on first left the field. This is strictly from memory over 50 years ago, someone please verify the actual facts.One night in 1959 there was Harvey Haddix. He pitches 12 perfect innings and then loses
1-0 on a 2 run homer.
I laugh how Dave Winfield would charge the mound on a brush back pitch, he would have found MLB difficult in the 60's . I can see pitchers like Duren, Gibson, Drysdale, and Marichal respecting his right to the plate.
Adcock hit it out with 2 runners on. One was Bad Henry (Jim Woods' moniker for Aaron)who was passed by Adcock. Adcock awarded a double, Mantilla scored. Might need ckecking
The details are faded a bit now, but I seem to remember the story on how Tug McGraw got to the big leagues. Someone will have to refresh, but as I recall it was McGraw's brother who attracted the attention of the scouts. Tug was given a courtesy look almost and did well in a game that resulted in him getting a contract. The story is something like that.
In what may have been his initial Spring Training game he actually got a hit off Koufax. To the day he died, he loved to talk about him getting a hit off Koufax versus all the success he had as a pitcher for the Mets and Phillies. He used to say a lot of people made the Bigs but a far less number of people got a hit off Koufax.
In what may have been his initial Spring Training game he actually got a hit off Koufax. To the day he died, he loved to talk about him getting a hit off Koufax versus all the success he had as a pitcher for the Mets and Phillies. He used to say a lot of people made the Bigs but a far less number of people got a hit off Koufax.
I read that book when it came out (1994?). We were staying with relatives in Ligonier and while I was reading it I went over to Champion Lakes to golf. Had a great chat with Dick Groat about the book and the old days. Groat was adamant that Clemente was the best player he had ever played with/against.
Koufax had control issues early in his career. Bob Gibson did it day in and day out. Gibson set the standard.
First runner was an error by Don Hoak. Next runner was an intentional walk. Then Adcock. The other pitcher was Lew Burdette - complete game, scattered eight or so singles.
I read that that Alston didn't really like playing him since he didn't consider him an All American boy. There was a lot of conflict about that.
Remember reading that the secret to his strength and leverage was his back. Supposedly he had incredible back muscles.
I read that that Alston didn't really like playing him since he didn't consider him an All American boy. There was a lot of conflict about that.
Remember reading that the secret to his strength and leverage was his back. Supposedly he had incredible back muscles.
Being a Dodgers fan and old enough to have been a kid following baseball when Koufax was finishing up, I have several of his autobiographies. They all mention what a superb all around athlete he was, but one of them mentions that he could stand flat footed in front of the basket, do a standing leap, and dunk it with authority. The guy was, what, 6'1"? That's just crazy. I'm 6'-5" and, even in my heyday (long ago!), needed a little bit of a run up in order to dunk it.
One thing I don't quite understand about Koufax, as great an athlete he was, he couldn't hit a lick, had an lifetime .097 average.
Sandy Koufax had the greatest six year run as anyone in history. I don't think anyone will match what he did in the six years!!!
E="TheGLOV, post: 2673895, member: 4834"]That's nothing. I saw Carlton, Tom Seaver, The Big Unit, Steve Blass, J.R. Richard, Pedro Martinez, Nolan Ryan, Ferguson Jenkins, Everybody who pitched for THE Big Red Machine, Gary Gentry, And, many, many others!! (Mostly all Pirate pitchers since 1966) No kidding!
Also saw and had in my hand, the ball that the Candy man pitched his no-hitter with against the Dodgers.
Jerry Koosman was the best cold-weather pitcher I ever saw. John Matlock (Matlack)? was no day at the beach either in any weather.
The Big Red Machine had average to adequate pitching at best, it was their hitting that made them as good as they were. As a Mets fan in the 70's, I always wished we could trade our position players for theirs and keep our pitching staff.
[/QUOTE]
I saw Carlton, Tom Seaver, The Big Unit, Steve Blass, J.R. Richard, Pedro Martinez, Nolan Ryan, Ferguson Jenkins, Everybody who pitched for THE Big Red Machine, Gary Gentry, And, many, many others!! (Mostly all Pirate pitchers since 1966) No kidding!Also saw and had in my hand, the ball that the Candy man pitched his no-hitter with against the Dodgers.
Jerry Koosman was the best cold-weather pitcher I ever saw. John Matlock (Matlack)? was no day at the beach either in any weather.
The Big Red Machine had average to adequate pitching at best, it was their hitting that made them as good as they were. As a Mets fan in the 70's, I always wished we could trade our position players for theirs and keep our pitching staff.
[/QUOTE]
In 1989, I'm at Lackawanna County Stadium for an exhibition game between the newly formed Red Barons and the Phillies. As I'm going up the ramp to my seat, who's coming down but Tug McGraw. I of course asked for an autograph and he kindly obliged. As he was signing, I told him that I was a Mets fan and they broke my heart when they traded him. He handed me his autograph, smiled and said "They got over it!"
[/QUOTE]E="TheGLOV, post: 2673895, member: 4834"]That's nothing.
Also saw and had in my hand, the ball that the Candy man pitched his no-hitter with against the Dodgers.
Jerry Koosman was the best cold-weather pitcher I ever saw. John Matlock (Matlack)? was no day at the beach either in any weather.
The Big Red Machine had average to adequate pitching at best, it was their hitting that made them as good as they were. As a Mets fan in the 70's, I always wished we could trade our position players for theirs and keep our pitching staff.
Adequate at best? No.
Sure, their hitting and field was the mark of their team but they had a very good staff.
I also saw Koufax and Drysdale at a double header at Forbes Field 1965 Same double header ? Summer after I graduated from PSU
