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COVID gratuitous dumpster fire thread

LMFAO. Is this thread supposed to be like this? Wtf happened to this forum lol. If this is how we are acting what the hell is going on at hr. Nice touch by the way
This thread can take whatever form it takes. All the other threads are back to normal, right?
 
@El-Jefe - The Fixer
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NOBODY gets paid more to list it as a Covid death.....NOBODY. Wow

USA Today Fact Check

Our ruling: True

We rate the claim that hospitals get paid more if patients are listed as COVID-19 and on ventilators as TRUE.

Hospitals and doctors do get paid more for Medicare patients diagnosed with COVID-19 or if it's considered presumed they have COVID-19 absent a laboratory-confirmed test, and three times more if the patients are placed on a ventilator to cover the cost of care and loss of business resulting from a shift in focus to treat COVID-19 cases.

This higher allocation of funds has been made possible under the Coronavirus Aid, Relief and Economic Security Act through a Medicare 20% add-on to its regular payment for COVID-19 patients, as verified by USA TODAY through the American Hospital Association Special Bulletin on the topic.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ore-covid-19-patients-coronavirus/3000638001/
 
USA Today Fact Check

Our ruling: True

We rate the claim that hospitals get paid more if patients are listed as COVID-19 and on ventilators as TRUE.

Hospitals and doctors do get paid more for Medicare patients diagnosed with COVID-19 or if it's considered presumed they have COVID-19 absent a laboratory-confirmed test, and three times more if the patients are placed on a ventilator to cover the cost of care and loss of business resulting from a shift in focus to treat COVID-19 cases.

This higher allocation of funds has been made possible under the Coronavirus Aid, Relief and Economic Security Act through a Medicare 20% add-on to its regular payment for COVID-19 patients, as verified by USA TODAY through the American Hospital Association Special Bulletin on the topic.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ore-covid-19-patients-coronavirus/3000638001/

Why do you reference an article that say nothing about "Getting PAID MORE to list Covid-19 as a cause of DEATH. "Hospitals charge more and get paid more if the patient is put on a ventilator" Of Course they do. They make more money from a heart transplant than a sprained ankle. ASTOUNDING Deduction. Yes......Congress did.....as part of the Virus relief bill..... allocate money to treat Medicare patients. I responded to this statement: "As long as institutions get more $ for a COVID death than a normal death" with this statement: ......."NOBODY gets paid more to list it as a Covid death.....NOBODY. "
FACT CHECK: Your response and link have nothing to do with my post.








3.3











"
 
Why do you reference an article that say nothing about "Getting PAID MORE to list Covid-19 as a cause of DEATH. "Hospitals charge more and get paid more if the patient is put on a ventilator" Of Course they do. They make more money from a heart transplant than a sprained ankle. ASTOUNDING Deduction. Yes......Congress did.....as part of the Virus relief bill..... allocate money to treat Medicare patients. I responded to this statement: "As long as institutions get more $ for a COVID death than a normal death" with this statement: ......."NOBODY gets paid more to list it as a Covid death.....NOBODY. "
FACT CHECK: Your response and link have nothing to do with my post.








3.3











"

Uh, they got paid more if there was a death, and "if it's considered presumed they have COVID-19 absent a laboratory-confirmed test."

Guidance from the CDC:

"COVID-19 should be reported on the death certificate for all decedents where the disease caused or is assumed to have caused or contributed to death. "

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvss/coronavirus/Alert-1-Guidance-for-Certifying-COVID-19-Deaths.pdf
 
W
Uh, they got paid more if there was a death, and "if it's considered presumed they have COVID-19 absent a laboratory-confirmed test."

Guidance from the CDC:

"COVID-19 should be reported on the death certificate for all decedents where the disease caused or is assumed to have caused or contributed to death. "

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvss/coronavirus/Alert-1-Guidance-for-Certifying-COVID-19-Deaths.pdf
Again.....where does it say you get more money if you declare it a Covid-19 death? Nowhere. Again......Diversion without relevance
 
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W

Again.....where does it say you get more money if you declare it a Covid-19 death? Nowhere. Again......Diversion without relevance

So, a hospital is going to put it was a Covid death on the death certificate of someone that was not tested and presumed to have Covid, but not ask for additional compensation they would be entitled to for treating a Covid patient? Yeah, okay.

This is my last contribution on this subject. You get the last word.
 
USA Today Fact Check

Our ruling: True

We rate the claim that hospitals get paid more if patients are listed as COVID-19 and on ventilators as TRUE.

Hospitals and doctors do get paid more for Medicare patients diagnosed with COVID-19 or if it's considered presumed they have COVID-19 absent a laboratory-confirmed test, and three times more if the patients are placed on a ventilator to cover the cost of care and loss of business resulting from a shift in focus to treat COVID-19 cases.

This higher allocation of funds has been made possible under the Coronavirus Aid, Relief and Economic Security Act through a Medicare 20% add-on to its regular payment for COVID-19 patients, as verified by USA TODAY through the American Hospital Association Special Bulletin on the topic.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ore-covid-19-patients-coronavirus/3000638001/

Did you actually READ this? Did you not question why the word "Medicare" was in there? Trying to determine truth and accuracy these days is very difficult. Both sides cherry pick paragraphs and distort reports to fit an agenda.....or include totally unrelated truths to hide their lies. You have to re-read and think critically. "We rate the claim that hospitals get paid more if patients are listed as COVID-19 and on ventilators as TRUE." How could it NOT be true? Why would someone even waste time "Fact Checking" something so Obvious. Because they have an Agenda. The accompanying statements don't really seem necessary....actually unrelated. Focus on the word "MEDICARE" Look up "Medicare Doughnut" and you will better understand why the Virus relief package included money for Medicare patients ONLY and ONLY if they are being treated for Covid-19 ( It is called Covid Relief for a reason}. The money is reimbursement to the hospital for their Covid Treatment....so the Medicare Patient doesn't have to bear the financial responsibility. THAT is why the hospital needs to declare that the patient was being treated for Covid-19.......so THE PATIENT doesn't have to pay the hospital. SO.....why would someone try to imply that over-reporting Covid Deaths is linked to the Information presented?? You know the answer to that one. It is our responsibility to look closely.....see the words "On Ventilators" and "Medicare".....ask questions....research ...etc. Otherwise we will fall for anything.....led astray by diversions, distortions and in this case...."Unrelated Facts". The Fact Check is true. The Medicare Reimbursement is True. What is totally False is that....somehow these truths have anything to do with Covid Death Reporting Numbers. I took the time to expand on this example in hopes that you will read it....process it....and look for future attempts to guide your/our beliefs with False Information, Diversion, Tunnel Vision etc...........Best Wishes
 
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So, a hospital is going to put it was a Covid death on the death certificate of someone that was not tested and presumed to have Covid, but not ask for additional compensation they would be entitled to for treating a Covid patient? Yeah, okay.

This is my last contribution on this subject. You get the last word.
Funny....was busy writing a detailed explanation as you wrote this. I hope it clarifies some things
 
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YES....I actually read the article. It says that a medical examiner was allegedly ask if someone in their 20's could have factors which might increase Covid susceptibility. the very next sentence says "it is unclear whether or not his death was removed from the overall count in the state. Classic Fox News.
If it his unclear if it was removed, then means it was originally added to the account. Shedding light on the death being a cover death is the only thing that would cause it to be removed. This is an example of good investigative reporting by the folks at FOX 35. I am sure these types of things happen all the time.
 
If it his unclear if it was removed, then means it was originally added to the account. Shedding light on the death being a cover death is the only thing that would cause it to be removed. This is an example of good investigative reporting by the folks at FOX 35. I am sure these types of things happen all the time.
I put in bold that part because I thought you would obviously realize that whomever discovered the error certainly had the ability to find out if it was removed. The fact that they deliberately posted that it was unclear if it was removed should tell you that it was removed.....they knew it was removed....but didn't want to report that it was removed and didn't want a lawsuit by saying it wasn't removed......so they want you to believe it wasn't. Not exactly lying but pretty obvious deliberate attempt to deceive anyone who doesn't bother to analyze to any depth.
 
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I’m at the orthodontist’s office with my daughter. The technician here says she’s noticed more chipped teeth lately [among all the patients] than she’s ever seen. I suggested it might be due to people’s poor home cooking skills. She thinks it’s due to teeth grinding from home-bound stress.

[My kid’s teeth are still not chipped, BTW.]
 
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I’m at the orthodontist’s office with my daughter. The technician here says she’s noticed more chipped teeth lately than she’s ever seen. I suggested it might be due to people’s poor home cooking skills. She thinks it’s due to teeth grinding from home-bound stress.
DW please clear-up my confusion on this posting as I'm interpreting it as a confession regarding your cooking skills.
Please confirm or deny (Although I probably won't accept either)!🤔
 
DW please clear-up my confusion on this posting as I'm interpreting it as a confession regarding your cooking skills.
Please confirm or deny (Although I probably won't accept either)!🤔
Ha ha. I was not clear. My kid’s teeth are fine. But in the dental office, noticeably many more of their patients have chipped teeth than ever before, says the technician.

As far as my cooking skills, ... they’re still not too good. :)
 
Did you actually READ this? ..... I took the time to expand on this example in hopes that you will read it....process it....and look for future attempts to guide your/our beliefs with False Information, Diversion, Tunnel Vision etc...........Best Wishes

Sports fan is correct neither this article not any other that I have searched provides any indication there is a 'direct or overt' payment I premium tied to the classification of a death as CV-19.

That said there is these three pieces of circumstancial evidence:

1) As stated previously, and documented in oodles of articles, Medicare patients absolutely trigger a 20% payment coverage premium boost for patients diagnosed with CV.

2) More than 8 of 10 of CV deaths are for patients older than 65, this presumably on Medicare.

3) Hospitals are absolutely able to, and do list the presumed cause of death as CV-19 without a positive CV test as a requirement (this includes deaths 'with' CV, seat he s 'from' CV and deaths presumed to be from CV).

The CDC's guidance adds: “Ideally, testing for COVID-19 should be conducted, but it is acceptable to report COVID-19 on a death certificate without this confirmation if the circumstances are compelling within a reasonable degree of certainty.”

It is very clear that patients with comorbities are at most risk, and if you have diabetes, heart disease and 'presumed' but unconfirmed CV due to say pneumonia, and then die of a heart attack while in a ventilator you will be classified as a CV death.

In this situation the hospital can reclassify the entirety of the treatment billings to medicare as CV, and indeed the hospital will receive more money (indirectly) due to that classification of CV on the death certificate without ever having received a positive test, not to mention the 'direct cause' of death being a heart attack to a high risk patient.

Most deaths have co morbidities, and most deaths are on Medicare, so yes hospitals receive more money putting CV on the death certificate, especially after the fact. I have a family member in Sr. Management that works for one of the mammoth health care providers, and she has told us that they are absolutely classifying as many patients as possible as CV due to government guidance and they are also financially incented to do so.
 
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Buckle up, folks. Another spike in cases and deaths is on the way. We've been at a plateau of roughly 40,000 new cases daily for about 3 months and it's shooting up rapidly. It would be nice if the federal government had a plan.
 
Buckle up, folks. Another spike in cases and deaths is on the way. We've been at a plateau of roughly 40,000 new cases daily for about 3 months and it's shooting up rapidly. It would be nice if the federal government had a plan.

From https://www.usa.gov/coronavirus. Sorry for the long post, I didn't know exactly which portion you were looking for. :rolleyes:

(Perhaps I shouldn't apologize...it is supposed to be a dumpster fire after all, right? ;))


Government Response to Coronavirus, COVID-19
Top U.S. Government Websites for COVID-19 Information
Visit these federal government websites for current information about the coronavirus (COVID-19).

What is the Federal Government Doing in Response to COVID-19?
Get information from federal agencies on how they're responding to the coronavirus pandemic.

Health and Safety
Travel, Immigration, and Transportation
Money and Taxes
Education
Scams and Fraud
Benefits and Grants
Housing
Federal Building Status Updates and National Parks
Voting and Elections
Courts
Communications
Businesses
International Cooperation
Cybersecurity
Federal Workforce
Get a list of the federal agencies responding to coronavirus (COVID-19).

How Are States Responding to COVID-19?
Each state manages its own response to the coronavirus pandemic. Visit your state health department website for the latest coronavirus information, resources, and guidance.
 
From https://www.usa.gov/coronavirus. Sorry for the long post, I didn't know exactly which portion you were looking for. :rolleyes:

(Perhaps I shouldn't apologize...it is supposed to be a dumpster fire after all, right? ;))


Government Response to Coronavirus, COVID-19
Top U.S. Government Websites for COVID-19 Information
Visit these federal government websites for current information about the coronavirus (COVID-19).

What is the Federal Government Doing in Response to COVID-19?
Get information from federal agencies on how they're responding to the coronavirus pandemic.

Health and Safety
Travel, Immigration, and Transportation
Money and Taxes
Education
Scams and Fraud
Benefits and Grants
Housing
Federal Building Status Updates and National Parks
Voting and Elections
Courts
Communications
Businesses
International Cooperation
Cybersecurity
Federal Workforce
Get a list of the federal agencies responding to coronavirus (COVID-19).

How Are States Responding to COVID-19?
Each state manages its own response to the coronavirus pandemic. Visit your state health department website for the latest coronavirus information, resources, and guidance.

After reading down through....I'm left thinking.....if only we could do more?×?*<>$%/÷#^
 
Buckle up, folks. Another spike in cases and deaths is on the way. We've been at a plateau of roughly 40,000 new cases daily for about 3 months and it's shooting up rapidly. It would be nice if the federal government had a plan.
European countries should have a plan, too. They topped out around 40,000 cases per day during the first wave. Now, they're hitting 100,000 per day.

 
matter7172

It's so funny when people write something like this:

"It would be nice if the federal government had a plan. "

1.) Health matters are principally state issues, and given the chance; the Governors, including the bespeckled imbecile from York, with the contrived nasality and laborious cadence put active cases in nursing homes, you know where there's elderly with things like diabetes, hypertension, pulmonary issues, dementia and various causes of immunodeficiency-the truly vulnerable. You really can't do that unless you are stupid or criminal. Wolf is both. (My little perch in life lets me see him up close and personal) All you get from Cuomo, DeWine, Whitmer and Wolf are power grabs.

2.) You don't want a "plan", you want magic fairy dust. When the hell are people going to figure politicians aren't going to save us from anything and most, if not the vast majority of them care only about getting elected again, and again, and again, and again. I'm sorry but that's a fact. I have some 30 something twit running for State Rep and everyday, my mailbox is stuffed with her 11X14's. I love it when she says she's "fighting" for healthcare for Veterans, like she's never heard of the VA, which she'll have no influence over if elected. She also makes promises about fair wages. I'd like to tell her I never made a damn dime because of a politician, they only take what I earn. Just like a crackpot disheveled career politician from Vermont wasn't going to get every little girl a pony, either.

I note now the WHO and over 20,000 medical professionals have noted that lockdowns are a bad idea, with hidden costs and little benefit. If this was a decent world, Wolf and his fellow morons would be hiding in a hole like Saddam Hussein did.

I'm so sick of this COVID thing, I'd cheer for Iowa if they wrestled. Since I have a cousin that shot me pictures from C-H scoreboard after the last dual meet to gloat, you figure out how much I'd hate that.
 
matter7172
... 2.) You don't want a "plan", you want magic fairy dust. When the hell are people going to figure politicians aren't going to save us from anything.
Yeah! Politicians could never create a Department of Defense to save us from Nazis. They could never create fire departments to save us from fire. They could never create court systems to save us from contract breakers. Politicians could never devise plans to save us from uniquely high [rather, remarkably high] per-capita COVID deaths. Only the non-politician fairy godmothers of S. Korea and Taiwan and Germany and most other non-U.S. countries could keep per-capita deaths down.

matter7172
1.) Health matters are principally state issues, ...
Yes. That’s why the U.S. has *never, ever* had an FDA, USDA, CDC, HHS, EPA, ...

matter7172

It's so funny when people write something like this ...
Yeah. Funny! :rolleyes:
 
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uniquely high per-capita COVID deaths? We are supposedly number 9, with the UK right behind us, and Italy not too far after that. What is your definition of unique?
 
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uniquely high per-capita COVID deaths? We are supposedly number 9, with the UK right behind us, and Italy not to far after that. What is your definition of unique?
Good gotcha! How was my grammar, though? Pretty good, right? ;)
 
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Buckle up, folks. Another spike in cases and deaths is on the way. We've been at a plateau of roughly 40,000 new cases daily for about 3 months and it's shooting up rapidly. It would be nice if the federal government had a plan.

There was a "spike" in cases over the summer, but not really deaths. Despite the average daily cases being about 2x of what it was in April, average daily deaths were about 1/2.
 
There was a "spike" in cases over the summer, but not really deaths. Despite the average daily cases being about 2x of what it was in April, average daily deaths were about 1/2.
That better survival rate is good news. Some hypothesized factors behind the better survival rate include better treatment protocols and younger, stronger people getting sick.
 
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uniquely high per-capita COVID deaths? We are supposedly number 9, with the UK right behind us, and Italy not to far after that. What is your definition of unique?
By the way, is 9th worst in the world something to brag about? Just wondering. :)

Hmm. I should teach my debater son this trick that we just accidentally discovered: a way to make the other guy (“Christopher Darden”) draw attention to something that is embarrassing to his own side. :) [That was a joke. I actually teach my son to avoid cheap tricks and to focus on substance.]
 
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Lol, I truly do not know if you are messing with me, agree with me, or are pissed off at me....
Ha ha. I agree with you.

I never did scholastic debate. When I “debate” as a layperson, via keyboard, I frequently annoy people because I try so hard to make a strong argument that I go too hard. Or I sound like I’m mansplaining. It’s hard for me to debate via keyboard without seeming condescending or anger-filled. In fact, I think everyone on this list seems pretty nice and I don’t have bad thoughts about you or anyone else. :)
 
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matter7172

It's so funny when people write something like this:

"It would be nice if the federal government had a plan. "

1.) Health matters are principally state issues

I stopped reading here. Yes, by all means lets have states compete against each other for scarce resources, to fight a virus that doesn't recognize state boundaries. Let's not use the vast resources of the Federal government to mobilize industries to provide those resources. Let's not use the Federal government to organize the use of those resources when and where they are most needed.

You Trump apologists are nuts.
 
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