The teenage girl-like hysteria and hyperbole on this board after a bad loss is pathetic and comical.
“FIRE FRANKLIN, ALLAR SUCKS, WE’LL NEVER COMPETE WITH MICHIGAN OR OHIO STATE!”
- Thread starter NittanyChris
- Start date
When you are 1-9, those are all legit issues.
I don't think Allar sucks (though he played horribly) and I don't think we should fire Franklin (yet anyway) but what happened yesterday to say we can compete with Ohio State and Michigan.
1-9 against Ohio State is what it is--a huge f-ing problem
Now do the records of every other Big 10 program in their last 10 against OSU. BTW we were the underdog in all 10 (underdog in something like 14 straight vs. them), and Franklin is 7-3 against the spread. Honestly curious what other teams have done ATS in the same time. I'd be shocked if anyone has 7 wins ATS except maybe Michigan who isn't an underdog against OSU anymore.
I don't bring it up for moral victory purposes. It's just that the sky is falling attitude when we are one of the 10 best programs in the college football is ridiculous.
I don't know. Comparing PSU's record vs. OSU to Indiana or Northwestern's isn't exactly flattering for lack of a better word.
didnt ohio state part ways with Cooper way back for exactly this kind of thing... having solid seasons but failing to almost ever beat one team (Mich.)?
You can also look at potentially replacing Franklin like the time Nebraska fired Frank Solich for not being Tom Osborne.
Franklin is John Cooper light. He isn't as good of a recruiter or a coach but shares most attributes.
You could but we gave Coach Hype ten years and he never got close to a championship game, Solich got five and played in one.
But that's being scared--you can't be scared if you want to be elite.
yeah and I do look at it that way. like what if Tressel had not been anything special at OSU? it would have turned out like when Michigan hired Brady Hoke or Rich Rodriguez.
there is no sure bet in making a change and I actually think Franklin has restored this program to something better than it has been for most of the 2000s. I don't understand why he can't beat Ohio State despite 80% of the games being very close, but I didn't understand why Paterno kept losing to Lloyd Carr either
You do realize the entire premise of your statement is based on “what if reality wasn’t reality”? Enough with the speculation. It leads to “what ifs” and a “fear based approach”. Neither of which are “reality”. Tressel was Tressel. He was a damn good coach at OSU. It’s not like that never happened….🤦♂️.
yeah i do, but, that's why i included the real examples of Rich Rodriguez and Brady Hoke at michigan. those really happened and took that program down several notches. where Franklin has PSU right now, there is only a little bit of room to move up and a lot of room to move down. so almost by definition changing coaches is going to be a massive risk
Maybe so. But 1 out of 16 third down is 6-4-esque. That was absolutely pitiful.
Last edited:
Without risk there is no reward.
If you want to be third forever then stick with Franklin.
I do not.
that's true but you are assuming there is no reward to be had in keeping Franklin, or that hiring him was a risk that didn't pay off. I don't think either one is the case. the chances of making a bad hire are extremely high and I think there are maybe fewer than 10 coaches (most of whom are unavailable) who could take this to the next level
I might also add…,where did Tressel come from? Youngstown State I believe? Further support for the argument that a coaching change with an unknown who is “hungry” to prove himself can be one heck of a good thing!! It’s not always about what/who you know….,the world is full of great candidates….do some vetting and hire a good “football” coach to be a “football” coach! Enough with Franklin’s charades….its all smoke and mirrors….kind of like “The Wizard of Oz”….little bitty guy behind the curtain of illusions……
This is a safe assumption. He has had like 10 years. Multiple coach changes at other schools and he has not improved.
LdN
yeah, but, what is the equivalent thing that PSU could do in 2023? Is there a guy at a school like Youngstown who could come to PSU and win a national title within two years? And did even OSU expect Tressel would do that so quickly? that was like a one in a million thing that is probably impossible to repeat
UM wouldn’t be where they are today without a reinvigerated fan base which was brought about by the RRod and Hoke years. Right now, we at PSU, are being lulled to sleep by the promises of 11-2 10-3 with zero chance of competing against OSU & UM let alone championships. Give me a few years of RRod & Hoke to reawaken a sleeping giant. I’m all in on that risk/reward.
You’re only bad until you’re not. You’re only good until you’re not. It’s life.
I don’t understand the desire for risk aversion to maintain “status quo”. Every ride needs turbulence to ensure gratitude and gratefulness. No risk = no reward. The desire to hold onto 11-2 or 10-3 which assures zero championships is mind boggling to me.
10 years is ample time to prove championship caliber coaching. It’s not in the cards with the current CEO. He has his good attributes. He belongs in a media marketing role for PSU athletics.
Dabo and Kirby weren't proven when they took programs to that level
I'm not saying fire Franklin but that day is coming soon if he can't beat top teams.
Or you could get the next Kirby Smart or Dabo or any number of coaches who a school took a chance on. Or you could stay put and be thrilled with 3rd. Cause that is the ceiling.
Oh, and don't forget we got 3 top 10ish teams joining soon in Oregon, USC, and Washington. So that third place might become as much of a pipe dream as winning the BIG.
Franklin did not inherit a great thing in 2014, but from 2014-19 he restored the program and had some real successes. it's not fair to just say all 10 years have been a disappointment, that's not true. since 2020 things have not been so great, although last year was decent. we will see how this year plays out
Can we wait for this season to play out before throwing in the towel? We just lost on the road by one score to the #3 team. If we beat Michigan at home and Michigan beats Ohio State at home, we can still win the conference and make the playoffs.
well that is what psu did with Paterno for like 50 years.
think there is a lot of value in stability. i don't think any of these coaches have a magic formula and you can easily hire a terrible one and be 4-8 before you know it
I never said all 10 years under Franklin were a disappointment. My argument is Franklin can’t coach. Franklin will not bring championships. Franklin will not beat OSU & UM in a fraction of the competitions. Franklin sells the world on the “PSU White Out” experience. Franklin is great at managing the brand and the media. Franklin is horrible as a “heavyweight” competition coach. I wish no ill will toward Franklin as a person. I find it egregious to reward a man for mediocre football coaching results.
Paterno earned that by winning National Championships. Until or if Franklin wins a NC the comparison between Franklin and Paterno is a moot point.
Moron....he cant compete with them ...1 and 9 proves the point its time to move on. Thanks for making it too easy
Or you can be satisfied with Troy Sunderland and miss out on Cael Sanderson. It's top 10 vs perennial champs.
yeah i don't disagree. should not be rewarded for mediocrity. i am just saying that if you had this conversation in 2019 or 2017, not a lot of people would be saying he had done a mediocre job (although maybe some were starting to say it). so to some extent his contract rewards him for past results. that's the way it goes. i do think he is soon getting into shaky territory if he keeps losing the big games every year. it will then take only one or two other losses to create a real possibility of a change being made. i would guess he is safe in 2023, though he may not be in 2024 or 2025 if he keeps doing this
we werent near OSUs level yesterday...there were only 2 games that mattered and he blew the big one yesterday
you pick the one example that worked, but what about all the coaching missteps that have taken programs down a notch or ruined them.
men's basketball was a comedy of errors for decades, and only in the last couple of years did it get out of laughingstock territory. that was due to bad coaching hires,, mostly. women's basketball went backwards, womens volleyball dropped in ranking after replacing Rose, etc. there are plenty of ways to miss on finding the right coaches and it can be a very expensive and lengthy process to fix it
I can agree with most of this. I personally think the expectations amongst the PSU fan base (the primary source of revenue for funding the football team) is to win National Championships. Franklin is being rewarded for the idea of “manufactured stability” in the wake of a BS scandal that was derived to remove one man (because he wasn’t a “yes sir” boy) to ultimately install a “yes sir” boy. Bob wasn’t a “yes sir” boy so he was shown the door (or he ran away from the political nonsense). Franklin is proven to be a “yes sir” boy and that’s why he’s rewarded. Nothing more and nothing less IMO.
