Aaron Fisher Offers to Meet Ziegler in Sunday Inky, But Backs Out In Epic Facebook Conversation

[JohnZiegler]

Sunday's Philadelphia Inquirer has a long puff piece on Sandusky "Victim #1" Aaron Fisher. I am mentioned and quoted quite a bit (in a very biased/inaccurate fashion, of course). In the article, Aaron offers to meet with me. When I read this I immediately reached out to him via Facebook. You can read the remarkable exchange we had at this link.

http://framingpaterno.com/aaron-fis...me-then-backs-down-during-epic-facebook-conve

If you care at all about the real truth of this case please read and share. On Tuesday or Wednesday of this week I will be out with a HUGE release of new information on how this entire story REALLY began. I believe that, if you are open-minded, you will see that it is a FAR different narrative from what you have been told. Thank you to those who still care about the truth, which is what Joe Paterno said on his deathbed that he wanted.

Thanks,

John Ziegler

 

[LaJolla Lion]

Awful. Simply awful.

 

[71camaro]

You are a freaking nut, Ziegler. What a total jackass move how you handled that.

 

[71camaro]

Then post it online like you're a hero. Unreal.

 

[PSU-Knocker]

That is truly funny. Keep us informed if you send this to the Inquirer. Their response would be very interesting.

 

[psuguy04]

Well, PSU-Knocker is here. The Free Jerry sickos are coming out.

It's amazing/sad that this garbage is allowed and tacitly encouraged to be posted here.

 

[Raffycorn]

Good lord.

 

[TheWitchDoctor]

Sunday's Philadelphia Inquirer has a long puff piece on Sandusky "Victim #1" Aaron Fisher. I am mentioned and quoted quite a bit (in a very biased/inaccurate fashion, of course). In the article, Aaron offers to meet with me. When I read this I immediately reached out to him via Facebook. You can read the remarkable exchange we had at this link.

http://framingpaterno.com/aaron-fis...me-then-backs-down-during-epic-facebook-conve

If you care at all about the real truth of this case please read and share. On Tuesday or Wednesday of this week I will be out with a HUGE release of new information on how this entire story REALLY began. I believe that, if you are open-minded, you will see that it is a FAR different narrative from what you have been told. Thank you to those who still care about the truth, which is what Joe Paterno said on his deathbed that he wanted.

Thanks,

John Ziegler

I wish this guy would finally be picked up by the aliens that dropped him here about 3 years ago.

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

I don't follow this too regularly but I read most of the FB exchange posted in the link. What am I missing? JZ repeatedly says he's willing to meet in person and that hes never contacted AF previously. He says both of these things a number of times. AF dances around meeting in person and doesn't seem to address JZ's claims he's never contacted him. AF then goes into 'getting a lawyer' mode. Is it just that no one believes JZ?

 

[Ten Thousan Marbles]

Sunday's Philadelphia Inquirer has a long puff piece on Sandusky "Victim #1" Aaron Fisher. I am mentioned and quoted quite a bit (in a very biased/inaccurate fashion, of course). In the article, Aaron offers to meet with me. When I read this I immediately reached out to him via Facebook. You can read the remarkable exchange we had at this link.

http://framingpaterno.com/aaron-fis...me-then-backs-down-during-epic-facebook-conve

If you care at all about the real truth of this case please read and share. On Tuesday or Wednesday of this week I will be out with a HUGE release of new information on how this entire story REALLY began. I believe that, if you are open-minded, you will see that it is a FAR different narrative from what you have been told. Thank you to those who still care about the truth, which is what Joe Paterno said on his deathbed that he wanted.

Thanks,

John Ziegler

Please just stop.

 

[MtNittany]

AF is a congenital liar.

 

[LaJolla Lion]

AF is a congenital liar.

You mean Sandusky.

 

[psuguy04]

I don't follow this too regularly but I read most of the FB exchange posted in the link. What am I missing? JZ repeatedly says he's willing to meet in person and that hes never contacted AF previously. He says both of these things a number of times. AF dances around meeting in person and doesn't seem to address JZ's claims he's never contacted him. AF then goes into 'getting a lawyer' mode. Is it just that no one believes JZ?

It might have something to do with the fact that JZ feels the need to contact Fisher and shame other victims as part of his Free Jerry project.

 

[Raffycorn]

I don't follow this too regularly but I read most of the FB exchange posted in the link. What am I missing? JZ repeatedly says he's willing to meet in person and that hes never contacted AF previously. He says both of these things a number of times. AF dances around meeting in person and doesn't seem to address JZ's claims he's never contacted him. AF then goes into 'getting a lawyer' mode. Is it just that no one believes JZ?

My problem with it is this: we have JZ unsolicitedly messaging Fisher, which goes for a while without incident - albeit with JZ being a bit aggressive and Fisher being a bit defensive. Fisher seems willing, as it seems that he said in the article, to meet in person with JZ rather than over the phone where he seems to be concerned over JZ selectively editing telephone conversations. There seems to be some suspicion from Fisher that people who contact him on Facebook (presumably harassing him) are either actually JZ or acting on JZ's direction. Then, JZ brings up Fisher's car accident out of nowhere - it was uncalled for and pretty clearly causes Fisher to want to end the conversation, but Ziggy doesn't stop there. He keeps pushing and pushing and pushing and sending message after message calling Fisher a liar, just to harass and bully him. It's disgusting.

 

[nits74]

My problem with it is this: we have JZ unsolicitedly messaging Fisher, which goes for a while without incident - albeit with JZ being a bit aggressive and Fisher being a bit defensive. Fisher seems willing, as it seems that he said in the article, to meet in person with JZ rather than over the phone where he seems to be concerned over JZ selectively editing telephone conversations. There seems to be some suspicion from Fisher that people who contact him on Facebook (presumably harassing him) are either actually JZ or acting on JZ's direction. Then, JZ brings up Fisher's car accident out of nowhere - it was uncalled for and pretty clearly causes Fisher to want to end the conversation, but Ziggy doesn't stop there. He keeps pushing and pushing and pushing and sending message after message calling Fisher a liar, just to harass and bully him. It's disgusting.

Hear you, but why does AF feel he has to say in a major newspaper he's willing to meet with JZ in the first place? And to be honest, he did dance around and ultimately back out. With you on Jerry, but this is not the most credible guy in the world, not to mention sickeningly flaunting his monetary gains. In other words, he invites this sort of stuff, so I really am in no hurry to take up the mantle for him.

 

[PSU-Knocker]

Well, PSU-Knocker is here. The Free Jerry sickos are coming out.

It's amazing/sad that this garbage is allowed and tacitly encouraged to be posted here.

Ah, once again you have misrepresented me, being the nice gentleman you are. I have never stated to "free Jerry". I've come to expect that kind of misrepresentation from you, nice gentleman.

While I have never said "free Jerry" or Jerry is innocent, I do have an open mind. I can see from your multiple posts about me, you don't.

It is a known fact that multiple people have been released from prison (sometimes after decades of imprisonment). It is more likely that one is imprisoned where children are the "victims". Juries often come to emotional decisions and even more so where children are the "victims".

Now I'm certain that that enlightenment will be lost on you, but maybe the other readers will understand.

 

[psuguy04]

Ah, once again you have misrepresented me, being the nice gentleman you are. I have never stated to "free Jerry". I've come to expect that kind of misrepresentation from you, nice gentleman.

While I have never said "free Jerry" or Jerry is innocent, I do have an open mind. I can see from your multiple posts about me, you don't.

It is a known fact that multiple people have been released from prison (sometimes after decades of imprisonment). It is more likely that one is imprisoned where children are the "victims". Juries often come to emotional decisions and even more so where children are the "victims".

Now I'm certain that that enlightenment will be lost on you, but maybe the other readers will understand.

Jerry at a minimum showered with children. If you think that's okay or doesn't deserve a jail sentence, you are an extremely deranged individual.

 

[nits74]

Jerry at a minimum showered with children. If you think that's okay or doesn't deserve a jail sentence, you are an extremely deranged individual.

Now that is a ridiculous statement. Not even sure it is a crime.

 

[PSU-Knocker]

Jerry at a minimum showered with children. If you think that's okay or doesn't deserve a jail sentence, you are an extremely deranged individual.

Bullshit, showering with children was not a crime in the recent past. Coaches used to do it regularly after practices with their team. Now as I understand the situation with Sandusky, he and the boy (who defended Sandusky in the papers and to Sandusky's lawyer stated nothing nefarious occurred) worked out in PSU facility. The two showered together after working out. Now, Sandusky had to drive the kid to the workout because he was 14. It is certain that Sandusky had to drive him home. So the two would have had to shower together or One would have had to shower alone while the other waited and then the second would shower while the first showered had to wait. This happened at night and I doubt that either wanted to wait to get home.

Now I'm certain that all of this will be lost on you, but there are open minds out there and this my help them.

 

[71camaro]

Hear you, but why does AF feel he has to say in a major newspaper he's willing to meet with JZ in the first place? And to be honest, he did dance around and ultimately back out. With you on Jerry, but this is not the most credible guy in the world, not to mention sickeningly flaunting his monetary gains. In other words, he invites this sort of stuff, so I really am in no hurry to take up the mantle for him.

I don't know that I've ever seen him "flaunting" his monetary gains- he certainly isn't on some VH1 reality show doing it, and a photo in bad taste on a personal Facebook page doesn't mean much other than he's still a kid who took a stupid picture. As to saying that to the Inquy, he was asked specifically about Zeigler, it wasn't unsolicited.

 

[JoeBatters1]

Jerry at a minimum showered with children. If you think that's okay or doesn't deserve a jail sentence, you are an extremely deranged individual.

I'm not here to defend sandusky, but I'm guessing that you are fairly young and of a different generational understanding than some others on this board or least me, becaue I don't think you realize that is was not uncommon at all for young boys and grown men to use showering facilities together. When I was in high school in the 80's the coaches and players used the same shower in the lockerroom and would use it at the same time after practice - it was just part of the locker room culture if you will and no one thought it was weird or strange (btw, it was the same locker room Cappelletti had used in HS). Also, when I was kid (around 10 or so), my family belonged to a local swim club outside Philly and there was only one locker room area at the club. When I would go to put my personal stuff in a locker (because having a locker made me feel like a grown up) inside the lockeroom there were men and boys of all ages using the locker rooms to dress, along with the showers and toilet facilities. Additionally, in the early 80's when I was a young teenager I went up to visit Cape Cod and there was a public lockerroom by the beach where the men and boys were packed like sardines in varying stages of dress. My point is that societal norms and mores may change (they do), but at one time in this society people did not find it odd nor did they freak out if grown men and boys were sharing locker room/shower facilities together. I often thought that part of sandusky's grooming methods of the adults around him may have been to have the kids work out and then use the shower "like grown ups" do and other adults may not have thought anything of it since they may have been part of a generation that did not see it as unusual. They may actually have thought that the kids sandusky was bringing to the locker room where getting the chance to feel like a football player or a grown up. If I remember correctly, the police report from the 1998 showering episode even indicates there was another adult in the shower with sandusky and the kid he lifted up and bear hugged. To be honest, not suspecting sandusky to be a pedophile at the time, if I was in the shower in 1998 there is a good chance that I probably would not have even thought twice about what sandusky was doing because i had seen it throughout my life.

 

[psuguy04]

So helping a kid lather up in the shower is OK and shouldn't result in a jail sentence?

Christ, you guys need a lot of help.

 

[Raffycorn]

I'm not here to defend sandusky, but I'm guessing that you are fairly young and of a different generational understanding than some others on this board or least me, becaue I don't think you realize that is was not uncommon at all for young boys and grown men to use showering facilities together. When I was in high school in the 80's the coaches and players used the same shower in the locker and would use it at the same time after practice - it was just part of the locker room culture if you will and no one thought it was weird or strange (btw, it was the same locker room Cappelletti had used in HS). Also, when I was kid (around 10 or so), my family belonged to the local swim club outside Philly and there was only one locker room area at the club. When I went inside there were men and boys of all ages using the locker rooms to dress, along with the showers and toilet facilities. Additionally, in the early 80's when I was a young teenager I went up to visit to Cape Cod there was a public lock room by the beach where there men and boys were packed like sardines in varying stages of dress. My point is that societal norms and mores may change (they do), but at one time in this society people did not find it odd nor did they freak out if grown men and boys were sharing locker room/shower facilities together. I often thought that part of sandusky's grooming methods of the adults around him may have been to have the kids work out and then use the shower "like grown ups" do and other adults may not have thought anything of it since they may have been part of a generation that did not see it as unusual. They may have thought that the kids sandusky was bringing to the locker room where getting the chance to fell like a football player or a grown up. If I remember correctly, the police report from the 1998 showering episode even indicates there was another adult in the shower with sandusky and the kid he lifted up and bear hugged. To be honest, not suspecting sandusky to be a pedophile at the time, if I was in the shower in 1998 there is a good chance that I probably would not have even thought twice about what sandusky was doing because i had seen it throughout my life.

To my knowledge there was no other man in the shower with Jerry and the boy in 1998; it was just Jerry and the boy alone. To the rest of your point, though - surely you can see that there's a pretty large distinction between a shower in a semi-public swim club during the daytime with multiple adults and children around and what Jerry was doing, right? There's a big difference between your common shower at the YMCA and taking a boy alone at night, going through a 10-15 minute "workout", and showering with him (even though the boy tells you he doesn't need or want a shower), intentionally turning on showers so you're right next to the boy, and making physical contact with the boy so that (at a minimum) your genitals make contact with the boy's backside. And then, even when you're told not to do it again, you take another boy alone late at night to a private building and do the same thing? There's an enormous gulf in the innocence of the situation you're describing and the situation with Jerry's showers - particularly when Jerry had already been instructed not to put himself in that situation any longer.

 

[Westcoast24]

I'm not here to defend sandusky, but I'm guessing that you are fairly young and of a different generational understanding than some others on this board or least me, becaue I don't think you realize that is was not uncommon at all for young boys and grown men to use showering facilities together. When I was in high school in the 80's the coaches and players used the same shower in the lockerroom and would use it at the same time after practice - it was just part of the locker room culture if you will and no one thought it was weird or strange (btw, it was the same locker room Cappelletti had used in HS). Also, when I was kid (around 10 or so), my family belonged to a local swim club outside Philly and there was only one locker room area at the club. When I would go to put my personal stuff in a locker (because having a locker made me feel like a grown up) inside the lockeroom there were men and boys of all ages using the locker rooms to dress, along with the showers and toilet facilities. Additionally, in the early 80's when I was a young teenager I went up to visit Cape Cod and there was a public lockerroom by the beach where the men and boys were packed like sardines in varying stages of dress. My point is that societal norms and mores may change (they do), but at one time in this society people did not find it odd nor did they freak out if grown men and boys were sharing locker room/shower facilities together. I often thought that part of sandusky's grooming methods of the adults around him may have been to have the kids work out and then use the shower "like grown ups" do and other adults may not have thought anything of it since they may have been part of a generation that did not see it as unusual. They may actually have thought that the kids sandusky was bringing to the locker room where getting the chance to feel like a football player or a grown up. If I remember correctly, the police report from the 1998 showering episode even indicates there was another adult in the shower with sandusky and the kid he lifted up and bear hugged. To be honest, not suspecting sandusky to be a pedophile at the time, if I was in the shower in 1998 there is a good chance that I probably would not have even thought twice about what sandusky was doing because i had seen it throughout my life.

OMG. I'm sorry but if a older gentlemen bear hugged a young boy in a shower and I saw it I would find that very sick.

 

[Westcoast24]

Sunday's Philadelphia Inquirer has a long puff piece on Sandusky "Victim #1" Aaron Fisher. I am mentioned and quoted quite a bit (in a very biased/inaccurate fashion, of course). In the article, Aaron offers to meet with me. When I read this I immediately reached out to him via Facebook. You can read the remarkable exchange we had at this link.

http://framingpaterno.com/aaron-fis...me-then-backs-down-during-epic-facebook-conve

If you care at all about the real truth of this case please read and share. On Tuesday or Wednesday of this week I will be out with a HUGE release of new information on how this entire story REALLY began. I believe that, if you are open-minded, you will see that it is a FAR different narrative from what you have been told. Thank you to those who still care about the truth, which is what Joe Paterno said on his deathbed that he wanted.

Thanks,

John Ziegler

Wow. It's like your proud of that exchange. Wtf.

 

[Westcoast24]

I'm not here to defend sandusky, but I'm guessing that you are fairly young and of a different generational understanding than some others on this board or least me, becaue I don't think you realize that is was not uncommon at all for young boys and grown men to use showering facilities together. When I was in high school in the 80's the coaches and players used the same shower in the lockerroom and would use it at the same time after practice - it was just part of the locker room culture if you will and no one thought it was weird or strange (btw, it was the same locker room Cappelletti had used in HS). Also, when I was kid (around 10 or so), my family belonged to a local swim club outside Philly and there was only one locker room area at the club. When I would go to put my personal stuff in a locker (because having a locker made me feel like a grown up) inside the lockeroom there were men and boys of all ages using the locker rooms to dress, along with the showers and toilet facilities. Additionally, in the early 80's when I was a young teenager I went up to visit Cape Cod and there was a public lockerroom by the beach where the men and boys were packed like sardines in varying stages of dress. My point is that societal norms and mores may change (they do), but at one time in this society people did not find it odd nor did they freak out if grown men and boys were sharing locker room/shower facilities together. I often thought that part of sandusky's grooming methods of the adults around him may have been to have the kids work out and then use the shower "like grown ups" do and other adults may not have thought anything of it since they may have been part of a generation that did not see it as unusual. They may actually have thought that the kids sandusky was bringing to the locker room where getting the chance to feel like a football player or a grown up. If I remember correctly, the police report from the 1998 showering episode even indicates there was another adult in the shower with sandusky and the kid he lifted up and bear hugged. To be honest, not suspecting sandusky to be a pedophile at the time, if I was in the shower in 1998 there is a good chance that I probably would not have even thought twice about what sandusky was doing because i had seen it throughout my life.

Is this real or are you just effin with people

 

[JoeBatters1]

So helping a kid lather up in the shower is OK and shouldn't result in a jail sentence?

Christ, you guys need a lot of help.

So helping a kid lather up in the shower is OK and shouldn't result in a jail sentence?

Christ, you guys need a lot of help.

What is the old line - better to be thought a fool then to open your mouth and remove all doubt. Good day.

 

[nits74]

So helping a kid lather up in the shower is OK and shouldn't result in a jail sentence?

Christ, you guys need a lot of help.

I noticed you added the "lather up" part to your earlier post to make your point. To say we need help for just pointing out your error in calling merely taking a shower with a child a crime says something about you. It says you are an a-hole. Not that any more evidence was needed.

 

[LaJolla Lion]

Wow. It's like your proud of that exchange. Wtf.

Sadly he is proud about this. All you can do is shake your head at this point in time. Yet some still keep encouraging him somehow. It sounded like 2 HS girls fighting to be honest....horrible.

 

[JoeBatters1]

To my knowledge there was no other man in the shower with Jerry and the boy in 1998; it was just Jerry and the boy alone. To the rest of your point, though - surely you can see that there's a pretty large distinction between a shower in a semi-public swim club during the daytime with multiple adults and children around and what Jerry was doing, right? There's a big difference between your common shower at the YMCA and taking a boy alone at night, going through a 10-15 minute "workout", and showering with him (even though the boy tells you he doesn't need or want a shower), intentionally turning on showers so you're right next to the boy, and making physical contact with the boy so that (at a minimum) your genitals make contact with the boy's backside. And then, even when you're told not to do it again, you take another boy alone late at night to a private building and do the same thing? There's an enormous gulf in the innocence of the situation you're describing and the situation with Jerry's showers - particularly when Jerry had already been instructed not to put himself in that situation any longer.

You may be right about the 1998 incident - I need to go back and re-review the report, but I thought it had made mention of another adult. Regarding the rest of your post - I was commenting on the general statement made by the other poster about men and boys showering with each other and the general perception of society at a different point and time in the past. Too many in today's society are apt to get on their moral high horse and make blanket moral judgements on certain things without understanding history and context. As I stated, i'm not defending sandusky, but I can see where people from certain generation (s) may not have seen signals in sandusky's behavior and their critical instincts never triggered. That was what I was trying to convey with the notion that sandusky groomed the adults around him as well as the children because I was alwasy under the impression that 1998 and 2001 were probably not the first time people may have seen him showering with kids. I don't know that McQueary has ever indicated that he was specifically upset about the fact that sandusky was in a shower area with a kid? Only that he thought something more than showering may have been going on.

 

[CDW3333]

To my knowledge there was no other man in the shower with Jerry and the boy in 1998; it was just Jerry and the boy alone. To the rest of your point, though - surely you can see that there's a pretty large distinction between a shower in a semi-public swim club during the daytime with multiple adults and children around and what Jerry was doing, right? There's a big difference between your common shower at the YMCA and taking a boy alone at night, going through a 10-15 minute "workout", and showering with him (even though the boy tells you he doesn't need or want a shower), intentionally turning on showers so you're right next to the boy, and making physical contact with the boy so that (at a minimum) your genitals make contact with the boy's backside. And then, even when you're told not to do it again, you take another boy alone late at night to a private building and do the same thing? There's an enormous gulf in the innocence of the situation you're describing and the situation with Jerry's showers - particularly when Jerry had already been instructed not to put himself in that situation any longer.

There were two boys in the shower with Jerry in '98. Soapy gave them both naked bear hugs.

 

[JoeBatters1]

Is this real or are you just effin with people

Is this real or are you just effin with people?

 

[PSU-Knocker]

Damn folks, Fisher threw out the challenge, even claiming to be a man while doing such. Zeigler accepted and Fisher renege. What can't you see?

 

[LaJolla Lion]

Damn folks, Fisher threw out the challenge, even claiming to be a man while doing such. Zeigler accepted and Fisher renege. What can't you see?

Well a ton of good is coming of this crap. I mean going after his family and calling each other out is looking totally sane to you which is fine. Quite a few of cringe when we see trainwrecks, but some keep applauding this guy on this site. Any other PSU site and he gets run out of town IMO.

 

[PSU-Knocker]

Well a ton of good is coming of this crap. I mean going after his family and calling each other out is looking totally sane to you which is fine. Quite a few of cringe when we see trainwrecks, but some keep applauding this guy on this site. Any other PSU site and he gets run out of town IMO.

I wonder what LaJolla Lion would do if he was challenged in the Inquirer. I'm certain he would let it go; do nothing. I and others have enough pride to take the challenge. If you are serious, make the challenge, but don't run from it like a little girl when the challenge is answered.

 

[getmyjive11]

I noticed you added the "lather up" part to your earlier post to make your point. To say we need help for just pointing out your error in calling merely taking a shower with a child a crime says something about you. It says you are an a-hole. Not that any more evidence was needed.

Forget "lather up", do you think it's normal for old men to bear huge boys in a shower?

 

[getmyjive11]

I wonder what LaJolla Lion would do if he was challenged in the Inquirer. I'm certain he would let it go; do nothing. I and others have enough pride to take the challenge. If you are serious, make the challenge, but don't run from it like a little girl when the challenge is answered.

I'm fairly certain he wouldn't go on Facebook and make an ass out of himself.

 

[getmyjive11]

Ah, once again you have misrepresented me, being the nice gentleman you are. I have never stated to "free Jerry". I've come to expect that kind of misrepresentation from you, nice gentleman.

While I have never said "free Jerry" or Jerry is innocent, I do have an open mind. I can see from your multiple posts about me, you don't.

It is a known fact that multiple people have been released from prison (sometimes after decades of imprisonment). It is more likely that one is imprisoned where children are the "victims". Juries often come to emotional decisions and even more so where children are the "victims".

Now I'm certain that that enlightenment will be lost on you, but maybe the other readers will understand.

How many of them were convicted on forty-seven counts?

 

[Raffycorn]

Damn folks, Fisher threw out the challenge, even claiming to be a man while doing such. Zeigler accepted and Fisher renege. What can't you see?

Where do you see Fisher renege? I see Fisher saying he's happy to meet JZ in the Lock Haven area, and that JZ should pick the time. JZ proceeds to call Fisher a liar, claiming that he's doubtful Fisher will show up, that the Facebook poster in question has nothing to do with him, and the low blow about Fisher's car accident. It's then - and only then - that Fisher tells JZ not to contact him anymore, which JZ ignores. Where do you see a reneging by Fisher that isn't brought on directly by JZ's harassment and attacks?

 

[PSU-Knocker]

I'm fairly certain he wouldn't go on Facebook and make an ass out of himself.

Amazing; it wasn't the guy who threw out the challenge and then ran away when it was answered, it was the guy who answered the challenge who is the "ass".