Interesting stats. Thanks for posting. This indicates that the 4 on Mount Rushmore should be Ruth, Young, Mays, and Aaron. Bonds is tossed because of steroids and Cobb is tossed because he was a rabid racist and half nuts to boot.
Sort of OT: Mount Rushmore of Baseball
- Thread starter BrucePa
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The latest research on Cobb is that his racism is at least somewhat overstated. I’ll try to find an article. Half-nuts still works.
Well if you are going to have a DH, then Ruth should be the DH and Aaron should be playing RF.
Sorry but Clemente instead of Aaron is ridiculous and I was a big Clemente fan.
By today's standards everyone living before about 1970 was a racist. Perhaps Abraham Lincoln wasn't a racist but I'm not sure about him.
I was at a little staff lunch yesterday when one co-worker accused the other of benefitting from white privilege because she was allowed to take a nap in class when she was in middle school.
At age 41 Williams hit 29 HRs and had a 1.096 OPS. That is insane
That's a great point. Unfortunately we are creatures of our up bringing. Its sad but true that people thought differently back then. The problem was bad in the north and south, but especially for cobb he grew up in the rural south and was probably not a deep thinker about these things. He was pretty crazy when it came to fighting and such. I think i've read that he expressed some respect for some negro league players. He was far from a saint but i think his reputation was damaged by a book written in the 1960s that was more sensational than actually true.
I smell a Yankee fan.
So you have Ruth as one of your four faces on Mt. Rushmore. Who does Gehrig replace? Mays? No. Aaron? No. Williams? No. When you have a list as select as that, even an immortal like Gehrig doesn't get in.
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So there is a bit of a groundswell in Atlanta (or call it some noise being made, if you prefer) to rename the Braves the Hammers in honor of Hammerin' Hank. It follows the trend of eliminating native american team monikers, but does so in a way in which they can at least say it is primarily in honor of Aaron. (Everyone can and will draw his or her own conclusion as to which motive predominates, but it is hard to argue that they both are not in play.)
As much as I virtually genuflect at the thought of a guy like Henry Aaron, I am not sure how I feel about this. Your thoughts?
I read in the paper this morning that there is another story of Aaron giving his nickname to someone else. A young black kid from the East Bay was once a clubhouse worker for the Oakland A's. Name of Stanley Burrell. He met Hank Aaron at an A's-Brewers game in 1976 (Aaron played his last two years for the Brewers), and was so impressed by him that he adopted the name "MC Hammer" when he began his rap career.
As much as I virtually genuflect at the thought of a guy like Henry Aaron, I am not sure how I feel about this. Your thoughts?
I read in the paper this morning that there is another story of Aaron giving his nickname to someone else. A young black kid from the East Bay was once a clubhouse worker for the Oakland A's. Name of Stanley Burrell. He met Hank Aaron at an A's-Brewers game in 1976 (Aaron played his last two years for the Brewers), and was so impressed by him that he adopted the name "MC Hammer" when he began his rap career.
Bonds is still the scariest hitter I've ever seen, guy got one or two pitches to hit a game, intentionally walked with the bases loaded, unreal. Let's not forget he was a 2 time MVP in Pittsburgh as a stick figure, say what you want about steriods, but guy was incredible and his accomplishments can't be discounted.
I agree that Bonds is a super talent. I saw him play dozens of times in Pittsburgh. A great athlete. He is in the top 20 all time for sure. If he stayed away from steriods he would be in the Hall of Fame. However, without steriods I doubt that his stats would get him in the top 4. We will never know.
They have his number up in every stadium. Not putting him on it would be like not including Lincoln on the real Mt. Rushmore.
Ty Cobb was not the racists, crazy man as portrayed in the popular media, the attached links provide a different perspective.
Amazon product ASIN 1451645767
Was Baseball Great Ty Cobb Really A Racist? New Biography Says No
A new biography of baseball legend Ty Cobb disputes the long-held beliefs that Cobb was a racist and a dirty player. Author Charles Leerhsen joins Bill Littlefield to explain how his research exposed earlier stories of Cobb as lies.
www.wbur.org
Ty Cobb - Wikipedia
30s and 40s. It created a bit of an awkward lull. Nobody really knows what to say when something like is thrown out.
I'm so glad I'm as old as I am (late 50s) and spend most of my time around people my age. These SJWs are insufferable.
It didn’t even fit the conversation. We were talking about kids falling asleep on these Zoom sessions, then turned into a conversation about us falling asleep in school and then the white privilege comment. Weird.
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Kenesaw Mountain Landis, Babe Ruth, Jackie Robinson, Cy Young
A Mount Rushmore needs to be people who changed the game.....I would be fine switching Cy Young for Satchel Paige.
A Mount Rushmore needs to be people who changed the game.....I would be fine switching Cy Young for Satchel Paige.
No, unfortunately the Buccos are my teamI smell a Yankee fan.
I think that is automatic. Whatever the criteria, a list that doesn’t include him wouldn’t be worth paying attention to.
Well there isn’t an official or accepted list for the need of anyone necessarily to be replaced.
Based on on-field results, I could make my case for Gehrig over other HOFs that other people deem more worthy. I think Gehrig gets overlooked because of Ruth.
It pretty much goes to the point LE made earlier in this thread. If you go on talent and production alone, NO WAY he gets there. Not even close. If you take into account his being the first black player in MLB, then you have a decent case to make for him, which is what you appear to be doing. Nothing wrong with that. But Aaron was important for sociological reasons, too.
The entire first page I believe fails to mention Roberto Clemente......the Man that died helping other people after his 3000th hit. You should all be ashamed of yourselves.
I have Aaron in my choices. And I think for a Mt. Rushmore choice you have to go beyond statistics....who knows what Robinson’s stats would have looked like if he didn’t fear for his life and safety every game.
Maybe try it this way: who were the most important and influential players in history? Short list has to include both Ruth and Robinson.
What infielder should be ahead of those guys? Pitchers play every 5 days, just not as valuable..
For some reason the best hitters usually play in the outfield. Fielding prowess doesn't seem to matter. Just hitting. No votes for Brooks Robinson or Ozzie Smith.
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