I thought Allar was just spectacular last night

[91Joe95]

Agreed.

Here's the other layer to this: the B1G was bad in 2013 and BOB was a legit good to great QB coach that year. Hack knew where to go with the ball based on scheme and playcall, and in hindsight much of it was due to good QB coaching. Hack had tremendous physical attributes and I'm forever grateful that he stuck with us through his commitment and career, but his feel for the game and ability to process reads as a QB proved a weakness that prevented him from reaching the ceiling his physical gifts provided him. His short lived NFL career bears this out. Great kid with tremendous physical talent, not NFL QB material as far as natural instincts, feel for the game, and ability to distribute the ball.

We shall see what Allar can become, but the way he commanded the game in terrible conditions last night leaves me optimistic.

As a freshman Hack had the benefit of throwing to Allen Robinson, who was able to go up and get the ball. He also had a decent line giving him protection. After that FLO's failure to recruit offensive linemen left Hack to the wolves. He developed bad habits, poor footwork, and became shell shocked, and was never able to recover. It's unfortunate, but FLO needed a mobile qb with his stubbornness to recruit oline recruits instead of receivers.

 

[91Joe95]

He’s not kidding. He is the most clueless poster we have

---

 

[blair10]

Morelli didn't live up to the hype either. Being sandwiched between MRob and Clark puts him in perspective a little better. Physical tools mean little if you are inaccurate, can't read a defense, and cost your team wins.

Morelli was a highly rated recruit, however he was not the top rated passing QB recruit pursued by Penn State in 2004. Chad Henne was the top target and a much higher rated recruit. After Henne committed to Michigan, Morelli de-committed from Pitt and signed with Penn State.

Hack was consensus 5 star by multiple services and ESPN rated the number one passing QB in the nation in 2012. I can’t think of a Penn State QB recruit who came in with Hack’s resume who failed to meet expectations at the college level.

 

[HeresCarterHesGoneGoodbye]

Morelli was a highly rated recruit, however he was not the top rated passing QB recruit pursued by Penn State in 2004. Chad Henne was the top target and a much higher rated recruit. After Henne committed to Michigan, Morelli de-committed from Pitt and signed with Penn State.

Hack was consensus 5 star by multiple services and ESPN rated the number one passing QB in the nation in 2012. I can’t think of a Penn State QB recruit who came in with Hack’s resume who failed to meet expectations at the college level.

I think you are misremembering how much fanfare Morelli arrived with. True, Henne was preferred by staff, but when Morelli, a 5 star and actually more highly rated recruit than Henne by several services, flipped to PSU it was seen as a coup.

Then he played.

And we wept.

 

[91Joe95]

I think you are misremembering how much fanfare Morelli arrived with. True, Henne was preferred by staff, but when Morelli, a 5 star and actually more highly rated recruit than Henne by several services, flipped to PSU it was seen as a coup.

Then he played.

And we wept.

It was maddening watching DWill, Norwood, and Butler constantly running around open and Morelli would never look their way. The fact the coaching staff was able to get a couple of 9 win seasons out of him was no minor miracle. He did throw a nice deep ball though.

 

[bdgan]

I think you are misremembering how much fanfare Morelli arrived with. True, Henne was preferred by staff, but when Morelli, a 5 star and actually more highly rated recruit than Henne by several services, flipped to PSU it was seen as a coup.

Then he played.

And we wept.

Morelli passed for over 5,000 yds during his two years as a starter. He completed 56% of his passes and had nearly a 2-1 TD vs INT ratio. He wasn't great but he wasn't horrible. He just didn't live up to his 5* billing. PSU finished 9-4 each of those two seasons.

 

[blair10]

I think you are misremembering how much fanfare Morelli arrived with. True, Henne was preferred by staff, but when Morelli, a 5 star and actually more highly rated recruit than Henne by several services, flipped to PSU it was seen as a coup.

Then he played.

And we wept.

Here is the 2003 Parade All-America Team. Chad Henne is listed. Also, he was the PA Gatorade Player of the year.

Alabama High School Football History

The History of high school football in Alabama

www.ahsfhs.org

 

[HeresCarterHesGoneGoodbye]

Morelli passed for over 5,000 yds during his two years as a starter. He completed 56% of his passes and had nearly a 2-1 TD vs INT ratio. He wasn't great but he wasn't horrible. He just didn't live up to his 5* billing. PSU finished 9-4 each of those two seasons.

Granted, some of it was bad offensive coaching, but Morelli was arguably a below average B1G QB by even the standards of the time. He had good WRs both years and PSU’s defense led by an elite LB corps is mostly why they finished 9-4 those years.

If you want to remember how bad Morelli could be on a given week, watch highlights of his performance in 2007 vs a Henneless Michigan. Bleak stuff.

 

[HeresCarterHesGoneGoodbye]

Here is the 2003 Parade All-America Team. Chad Henne is listed. Also, he was the PA Gatorade Player of the year.

Alabama High School Football History

The History of high school football in Alabama

www.ahsfhs.org

Those are media awards, not recruiting rankings.

Rivals ranking linked below. Morelli 5 star, #1 in PA above Henne, and #12 ranked recruit nationally. As I said, opinions were split but Morelli arrived with incredible fanfare.

 

[blair10]

Those are media awards, not recruiting rankings.

Rivals ranking linked below. Morelli 5 star, #1 in PA above Henne, and #12 ranked recruit nationally. As I said, opinions were split but Morelli arrived with incredible fanfare.

View embedded media

The PA Gatorade Player of the year award goes to the top ranked state player by that organization.

I am not disputing Morelli was a highly ranked recruit. I just think most sources during the 2003-2004 time frame viewed Henne as the better prospect just like the Penn State coaching staff did.

By the way, ESPN Tom Lemming reported rankings listing Henne at #7 and Morelli at #26.

Lemming's Top 100 for 2004

Tom Lemming ranks the Top 100 football prospects in the Class of 2004.

insider.espn.com

Again, this is not a slight to Morelli. Just saying most sources listed Henne much higher than Morelli.

 

[Obliviax]

I think the sanctions need to be factored in to Hacks assessment.

Agreed. Plus, a pronounced difference between O’Brien’s year and the CJF/Donaldson (sic,OC) year.

 

[HeresCarterHesGoneGoodbye]

The PA Gatorade Player of the year award goes to the top ranked state player by that organization.

I am not disputing Morelli was a highly ranked recruit. I just think most sources during the 2003-2004 time frame viewed Henne as the better prospect just like the Penn State coaching staff did.

By the way, ESPN Tom Lemming reported rankings listing Henne at #7 and Morelli at #26.

Lemming's Top 100 for 2004

Tom Lemming ranks the Top 100 football prospects in the Class of 2004.

insider.espn.com

Again, this is not a slight to Morelli. Just saying most sources listed Henne much higher than Morelli.

Fair assessment, and I agree with you. Essentially the consensus was PSU missed out on an elite in-State QB prospect in Henne but recovered by flipping another elite in-state QB prospect in Morelli.

Either way, Morelli underperformed significantly based on his recruiting pedigree, perceived physical traits, and the fanfare that arrived with an elite QB talent from Western PA.

Sadly, he never came close to realizing his lofty recruiting status for a combination of reasons including but not limited to bad offensive coaching.

 

[PSUMATT85]

He isn't better than Hackenberg during the second half of a his freshmen year. He probably will be next year but not right now and he isn't better than Clifford or Clark either.

And he’ll never be as good as Devlin🙄🙄

 

[ryoder1]

Granted, some of it was bad offensive coaching, but Morelli was arguably a below average B1G QB by even the standards of the time. He had good WRs both years and PSU’s defense led by an elite LB corps is mostly why they finished 9-4 those years.

If you want to remember how bad Morelli could be on a given week, watch highlights of his performance in 2007 vs a Henneless Michigan. Bleak stuff.

Remember our offensive coaching staff back then? Not hall of fame stuff.

 

[Obliviax]

Remember our offensive coaching staff back then? Not hall of fame stuff.

well, there are two OCs that come to mind when thinking about awful offenses at PSU and neither is named "jay".

don't forget that John Donovan was fired in the locker room after the last gave of the season in 2015. Wow, I've never seen that before. JoeMo, did a nice job but had a generational back in Saquon. BTW, JoeMo took Indiana to 4 overtimes with the Akron Zips.

Then we have Ciarrocca who had a rough ride during the COVID year and was replaced by CJF when Yercic became available. Ciarrocca then went back to Minny and is now OC with Rutgers under Schiano.

 

[bvillebaron]

I remember Kerry Collins in 92 and he struggled. We win at ND that year by 10 if he was more accurate.

Season ticket holder from 1978 until
we had to give them up last year for health reasons. Really excited about Allar and hope he turns out to be the best QB ever. I also realize Kerry Collins had a stacked offense in 1994. Having said that I have not seen a QB throw the ball better than Collins did in 1994 from my vantage point in row 57 of the north end zone. And that covers a lot of QBs including Marino and Brees.

 

[olelion]

I agree with everything except that fade pass to KLS. It worked but I hope to never see that again.

I'd really like to see our TEs use their height and high point the ball much like Gesicki. Our guy catches it or nobody catches it.

The fade is the most worthless pass in any game. It's guaranteed less than 50/50 unless you have a freak at receiver, in which case why bother to fade

 

[bcspsu]

Season ticket holder from 1978 until
we had to give them up last year for health reasons. Really excited about Allar and hope he turns out to be the best QB ever. I also realize Kerry Collins had a stacked offense in 1994. Having said that I have not seen a QB throw the ball better than Collins did in 1994 from my vantage point in row 57 of the north end zone. And that covers a lot of QBs including Marino and Brees.

Collins always will have a very high place on my list of favorite PSU players because of the great win at Michigan in 1994 and the fact that he led what I consider to be one of the best offenses in college football history that season. He also was a Heisman Trophy finalist along with Kijana Carter that season. It also should not be forgotten that he led the Giants to the Super Bowl in the 2000 season. With that said, I believe that Allar is a technically better qb than Collins with his throwing motion.

 

[voltz99]

He isn't better than Hackenberg during the second half of a his freshmen year. He probably will be next year but not right now and he isn't better than Clifford or Clark either.

Allar is better than hack at any point of hacks career.

Hack went 3-3 in that great second half with losses to Nebraska and Illinois. He had one td in the first quarter vs Nebraska and did nothing for three quarters. Hack hit uncovered jessee James and breneman vs Wisconsin.

Hack was overrated. Lousy accuracy, no pocket awareness and he was a statue. Hack was great for psu but don't pretend he was a great QB. He was not! If hack transferred he would not have started at a p5 school and would not have been drafted.

 

[olelion]

Allar is better than hack at any point of hacks career.

Hack went 3-3 in that great second half with losses to Nebraska and Illinois. He had one td in the first quarter vs Nebraska and did nothing for three quarters. Hack hit uncovered jessee James and breneman vs Wisconsin.

Hack was overrated. Lousy accuracy, no pocket awareness and he was a statue. Hack was great for psu but don't pretend he was a great QB. He was not! If hack transferred he would not have started at a p5 school and would not have been drafted.

I liked Hack. He was such an important recruit to help salvage the program going forward from those times . When he was on he was great but too many times I'd shake my head at his poor accuracy, and it was poor. But please don't forget how important he was to the program.

 

[Obliviax]

Allar is better than hack at any point of hacks career.

Hack went 3-3 in that great second half with losses to Nebraska and Illinois. He had one td in the first quarter vs Nebraska and did nothing for three quarters. Hack hit uncovered jessee James and breneman vs Wisconsin.

Hack was overrated. Lousy accuracy, no pocket awareness and he was a statue. Hack was great for psu but don't pretend he was a great QB. He was not! If hack transferred he would not have started at a p5 school and would not have been drafted.

I also think Hack was "ruined". I agree with just about everything you posted. However, I think Donovan was the worst OC PSU has ever had. Second, I think our OL was the worst we've ever had. There was a very popular blogger who posted post-game videos highlighting PSU. When Temple beat PSU in 2017, he stated that PSU's OL was not only the worst in the B1G, he said it was the worst in all of the Power5 and stated that it may be the worst in the history of the Power5. We had a Juco LT who's name I won't say (but his first name is the same as a large city in France) who was the worst OT I've ever seen in my life. He gave up a sack to Temple when they only rushed two players (the RT got looped causing Hack to step up and the LT let the DE slip under him to get a sack and they were the only two rushing the QB).

oy vey

 

[lazydave841]

I liked Hack. He was such an important recruit to help salvage the program going forward from those times When he was on he was great but too many times I'd shake my head at his poor accuracy, and it was poor. But please don't forget how important he was to the program.

I think there is a key difference in acquiring a 5* recruit in the midst of players transferring out and scholarship limitations vs how good/bad/ugly Hack was as a QB. You can appreciate the former while acknowledging the latter.

 

[voltz99]

I liked Hack. He was such an important recruit to help salvage the program going forward from those times . When he was on he was great but too many times I'd shake my head at his poor accuracy, and it was poor. But please don't forget how important he was to the program.

He was very important but his play on the field was not that great.

 

[OzLion]

Agreed. Plus, a pronounced difference between O’Brien’s year and the CJF/Donaldson (sic,OC) year.

Good points both, with the sanctions, being shorthanded on the OLine, and the change in coaches and staffs, Hack did about as well as could be expected.

I'm so excited about Drew having Yurcich for to coach him from start to finish, having a good OL and good players around him, and having Clifford as a mentor in Yr1, it's pretty much an ideal situation

BTW, Morelli's excuse is he had Paterno at the stubborn end of his career I remember one season UM being ripe for the plucking, having lost to App State and Colorado State, with both teams employing spread offenses similar to Jay's Spread HD. Does JoePa open it up against Michigan --- No. Paterno offenses near the end specialized in predictable runs and low percentage passes.

 

[Obliviax]

Good points both, with the sanctions, being shorthanded on the OLine, and the change in coaches and staffs, Hack did about as well as could be expected.

I'm so excited about Drew having Yurcich for to coach him from start to finish, having a good OL and good players around him, and having Clifford as a mentor in Yr1, it's pretty much an ideal situation

BTW, Morelli's excuse is he had Paterno at the stubborn end of his career I remember one season UM being ripe for the plucking, having lost to App State and Colorado State, with both teams employing spread offenses similar to Jay's Spread HD. Does JoePa open it up against Michigan --- No. Paterno offenses near the end specialized in predictable runs and low percentage passes.

Good points. You made me wonder, will Yurcich stay another year to coach Allar in his Junior third year? There are a lot of good coaches that languish. Finding the right player to make your coaching chops reputation can be valuable. (See Joe Morehead and Saquon Barkley). I am not sure Yurcich needs it but being hitched to that star ain't bad.

 

[voltz99]

I also think Hack was "ruined". I agree with just about everything you posted. However, I think Donovan was the worst OC PSU has ever had. Second, I think our OL was the worst we've ever had. There was a very popular blogger who posted post-game videos highlighting PSU. When Temple beat PSU in 2017, he stated that PSU's OL was not only the worst in the B1G, he said it was the worst in all of the Power5 and stated that it may be the worst in the history of the Power5. We had a Juco LT who's name I won't say (but his first name is the same as a large city in France) who was the worst OT I've ever seen in my life. He gave up a sack to Temple when they only rushed two players (the RT got looped causing Hack to step up and the LT let the DE slip under him to get a sack and they were the only two rushing the QB).

oy vey

You ignored some key points. The OL recruiting before sanctions was an issue. The two years before sanctions PSU only signed 16 and 18 players. After sanctions PSU was at or near the bottom of P5 teams in total OL on scholarship. I count 8 OL on scholarship that spring. 8????? That 8 included true freshman and injured players. They could not all play at this level either.

Palmer played out of desperation. He was not ready but there were not many options. There was no Drew Shelton or Jven Williams waiting their turn. The backup tackle was the starting CENTER. The starting guards were DTs who were moved to OL. One was a Marshall flip. The backup center had no other P5 offers.


Tell us who you would have started on the OL that would have been a good OL. The only other options were true freshman.

 

[Obliviax]

You ignored some key points. The OL recruiting before sanctions was an issue. The two years before sanctions PSU only signed 16 and 18 players. After sanctions PSU was at or near the bottom of P5 teams in total OL on scholarship. I count 8 OL on scholarship that spring. 8????? That 8 included true freshman and injured players. They could not all play at this level either.

Palmer played out of desperation. He was not ready but there were not many options. There was no Drew Shelton or Jven Williams waiting their turn. The backup tackle was the starting CENTER. The starting guards were DTs who were moved to OL. One was a Marshall flip. The backup center had no other P5 offers.


Tell us who you would have started on the OL that would have been a good OL. The only other options were true freshman.

yep. not ignoring at all I just didn't mention it. thank you for the additional color. Those are all great points and reasons why Hacks CJF year was a total mess. he appeared to be a different player that year. Like Steve Blass when he just couldn't find the plate after years of high-quality pitching. I have to believe he lost his confidence and never got it back. His game against UM, winning in 4 overtimes after staging a last-minute TD to tie it, is PSU legend.

 

[91Joe95]

You ignored some key points. The OL recruiting before sanctions was an issue. The two years before sanctions PSU only signed 16 and 18 players. After sanctions PSU was at or near the bottom of P5 teams in total OL on scholarship. I count 8 OL on scholarship that spring. 8????? That 8 included true freshman and injured players. They could not all play at this level either.

Palmer played out of desperation. He was not ready but there were not many options. There was no Drew Shelton or Jven Williams waiting their turn. The backup tackle was the starting CENTER. The starting guards were DTs who were moved to OL. One was a Marshall flip. The backup center had no other P5 offers.


Tell us who you would have started on the OL that would have been a good OL. The only other options were true freshman.

While FLO coached New England instead of focusing full time on PSU, Ohio State and everyone else was busy raiding PSU's recruiting class and laid waste to it. Then, FLO shit the bed when asked about sanctions and what was important for the program. To top it off he focused on recruiting 180 lb wr's instead of 300 lb offensive linemen. Hack never stood a chance once FLO ran out of Paterno recruits.

 

[lazydave841]

While FLO coached New England instead of focusing full time on PSU, Ohio State and everyone else was busy raiding PSU's recruiting class and laid waste to it. Then, FLO shit the bed when asked about sanctions and what was important for the program. To top it off he focused on recruiting 180 lb wr's instead of 300 lb offensive linemen. Hack never stood a chance once FLO ran out of Paterno recruits.

Bingo.

 

[LandoComando]

Allar is better than hack at any point of hacks career.

Hack went 3-3 in that great second half with losses to Nebraska and Illinois. He had one td in the first quarter vs Nebraska and did nothing for three quarters. Hack hit uncovered jessee James and breneman vs Wisconsin.

Hack was overrated. Lousy accuracy, no pocket awareness and he was a statue. Hack was great for psu but don't pretend he was a great QB. He was not! If hack transferred he would not have started at a p5 school and would not have been drafted.

Your last sentence is complete nonsense.

 

[voltz99]

Hack was not that great with O'Brien. He was ranked near the bottom of the b10. 59th in the country. Psu was 7-5 that year. Lost to cfu, Indiana, Nebraska, ot win vs illinois, ot win vs Michigan. Hacks claim to fame was a jump ball vs Michigan.

 

[AWS1022]

Hack was not that great with O'Brien. He was ranked near the bottom of the b10. 59th in the country. Psu was 7-5 that year. Lost to cfu, Indiana, Nebraska, ot win vs illinois, ot win vs Michigan. Hacks claim to fame was a jump ball vs Michigan.

Check out Hack vs Allar in terms of their high school stats. Hack wasn’t great in high school either.