Haven't posted in years - due to the McAndrew Board going away. Fire Franklin. This weekend.

[shak66_psu]

The dude is a fraud. He is a bully. Look no further than his mafia stare down of Jones after getting asked some hard questions about his nonsensical decisions to go for 2 - not just the Michigan game - it's been happening for years. He talks 'analytics'. Ok pal.
After his stare down, he pulled out his sheet of paper and wrote down 9 - 1 = 8 Oh crap
Time for him to move on.
I can't take his schtick any more. Not even sure what it is? When was the last time he laughed at a press conference?! He puts this tough guy persona on. And he ain't that. Let him go coach Syracuse and then call it a career.
Ok hornets. Have at it.

 

[Vic Vaselino]

Nobody missed you.

 

[Erial_Lion]

The dude is a fraud. He is a bully. Look no further than his mafia stare down of Jones after getting asked some hard questions about his nonsensical decisions to go for 2 - not just the Michigan game - it's been happening for years.

Going for 2 after the last TD made a lot of sense, so certainly not "nonsensical".

 

[WPTLION]

The dude is a fraud. He is a bully. Look no further than his mafia stare down of Jones after getting asked some hard questions about his nonsensical decisions to go for 2 - not just the Michigan game - it's been happening for years. He talks 'analytics'. Ok pal.
After his stare down, he pulled out his sheet of paper and wrote down 9 - 1 = 8 Oh crap
Time for him to move on.
I can't take his schtick any more. Not even sure what it is? When was the last time he laughed at a press conference?! He puts this tough guy persona on. And he ain't that. Let him go coach Syracuse and then call it a career.
Ok hornets. Have at it.

The Board never went away--just changed names. It was all fear tactics by Tom!

 

[LeatherHelmets]

Go back to Tom the dictator.

 

[heckmans]

The dude is a fraud. He is a bully. Look no further than his mafia stare down of Jones after getting asked some hard questions about his nonsensical decisions to go for 2 - not just the Michigan game - it's been happening for years. He talks 'analytics'. Ok pal.
After his stare down, he pulled out his sheet of paper and wrote down 9 - 1 = 8 Oh crap
Time for him to move on.
I can't take his schtick any more. Not even sure what it is? When was the last time he laughed at a press conference?! He puts this tough guy persona on. And he ain't that. Let him go coach Syracuse and then call it a career.
Ok hornets. Have at it.

Did you not get the response you wanted to this on the current McAndrew board so you came here to try it out?

 

[Obliviax]

A flippen skit!
It is a lyger, kind of a cross between a tiger and a lion. It's some of my best work.

 

[Chickenman Testa]

The Board never went away--just changed names. It was all fear tactics by Tom!

Yeah, that was pretty sleazy

 

[lazydave841]

Yeah, that was pretty sleazy

On3 wanted the board activity I'm sure. I didn't think anything about it was sleezy personally, but this could have been transitioned better. Regardless, I kind of went with them to start and over time I've found that I post/respond here more.

 

[Crusher1950]

It couldn’t happen fast enough to dump him

 

[19333lion]

I have lost faith in Franklin to put us over the top. Nonetheless, getting rid of him right now would be stupid. Let him hire a(nother) OC and let him know that his own future is tied to the decision. If it works, great. If it doesn't, he needs to see that he isn't the guy.

 

[Wallace Breen]

Going for 2 after the last TD made a lot of sense, so certainly not "nonsensical".

Please explain how it made a lot of sense because on it's face, it was the worst in game decision any Big Ten coach has ever made.

 

[Crusher1950]

When down 15 and score you go for the point after than IF you can get the onside kick and score again you go for 2 to tie it nothing hard about this ec

 

[Erial_Lion]

Please explain how it made a lot of sense because on it's face, it was the worst in game decision any Big Ten coach has ever made.

Because if you're going to miss the two point conversion, it's better to know that information earlier than later (and there is no reason to think that your odds of making the conversion will increase as the game moves along).

When down 15 and then scoring a TD, you should always go for two. Coaches are finally coming around on it slowly but surely, but many fans/announcers still don't see it.

 

[fkkkjm]

Welcome back. This board is still packed with nasty inbred dorks from coudersport as you can see by the warm welcome you received. Yes Franklin can recruit like hell, but he’s too arrogant to admit to his faults and say he sucks at scheme and gameday execution.

 

[voltz99]

The dude is a fraud. He is a bully. Look no further than his mafia stare down of Jones after getting asked some hard questions about his nonsensical decisions to go for 2 - not just the Michigan game - it's been happening for years. He talks 'analytics'. Ok pal.
After his stare down, he pulled out his sheet of paper and wrote down 9 - 1 = 8 Oh crap
Time for him to move on.
I can't take his schtick any more. Not even sure what it is? When was the last time he laughed at a press conference?! He puts this tough guy persona on. And he ain't that. Let him go coach Syracuse and then call it a career.
Ok hornets. Have at it.

Ohhh, he stared at Jones. Fire him. Did you care when Joe gave a reporter the business after the Toledo loss?

 

[Indian rocks rich]

The dude is a fraud. He is a bully. Look no further than his mafia stare down of Jones after getting asked some hard questions about his nonsensical decisions to go for 2 - not just the Michigan game - it's been happening for years. He talks 'analytics'. Ok pal.
After his stare down, he pulled out his sheet of paper and wrote down 9 - 1 = 8 Oh crap
Time for him to move on.
I can't take his schtick any more. Not even sure what it is? When was the last time he laughed at a press conference?! He puts this tough guy persona on. And he ain't that. Let him go coach Syracuse and then call it a career.
Ok hornets. Have at it.

Hopefully it’s a couple more years when you post again

 

[Bondist]

Wow, everyone of James’ most avid fans posting here, agreed or not honestly nothing changes. But with respect to everyone, please give a realistic replacement? FYI hot rumor here in South Carolina is certain coach 10years/130 million to A$M

 

[lazydave841]

Wow, everyone of James’ most avid fans posting here, agreed or not honestly nothing changes. But with respect to everyone, please give a realistic replacement? FYI hot rumor here in South Carolina is certain coach 10years/130 million to A$M

Huh? Who is rumored?

 

[bvillebaron]

Please explain how it made a lot of sense because on it's face, it was the worst in game decision any Big Ten coach has ever made.

Disagreed with the decision to go for 2 but claiming that it was the worst in game decision any Big Ten coach “has ever made” is your most idiotic post yet and that covers a lot of territory.

 

[shak66_psu]

So you’re saying Franklin is way ahead of the times when it comes to game day decisioning and analytics. Got it. That perfectly coincides with reality.

 

[bvillebaron]

Please explain how it made a lot of sense because on it's face, it was the worst in game decision any Big Ten coach has ever made.

Disagreed with the decision to go for 2 but claiming that it was the worst in game decision any Big Ten coach “has ever made” is your most idiotic post yet and that covers a lot of territory.

 

[Bondist]

Dabo

 

[lazydave841]

Dabo

Interesting. Isn't that the same play they made prior? Overpaying a guy after his big success thinking he can duplicate it...

 

[IANit]

Going for 2 after the last TD made a lot of sense, so certainly not "nonsensical".

How did it make sense? Kick the PAT and it's a single-score game. By the way, our kickers have made 100 percent of their PAT tries this year. You still have to make a 2-pointer to tie it up if you score 6 again, but that only requires one more possession. Miss it (probably at minimum a 50 percent chance of doing so) and you have to have two more possessions with less than 4 minutes left against a running team.

 

[IANit]

Interesting. Isn't that the same play they made prior? Overpaying a guy after his big success thinking he can duplicate it...

I think Dabo is a better coach than Jimbo. But he did benefit from having two really good QBs and long-term assistants. Also, his stubbornness wrt to NIL is going to have to change, not that it did much for Jimbo.

 

[Erial_Lion]

How did it make sense? Kick the PAT and it's a single-score game. By the way, our kickers have made 100 percent of their PAT tries this year. You still have to make a 2-pointer to tie it up if you score 6 again, but that only requires one more possession. Miss it (probably at minimum a 50 percent chance of doing so) and you have to have two more possessions with less than 4 minutes left against a running team.

Your post pretty much sums up the reason you go for two in that situation. If you go for two and miss with 4 minutes left, you know that you need 2 more possessions (so if you get the ball back, you know that you can settle for a long FG and try another onsides kick). If you wait until late to go for 2 and miss, the game could be over at that point without enough time left to onsides kick and go for the FG. My strategy will change if I know I need one more score vs. two more scores, so it's helpful to know how aggressive I am with my play calling (and how aggressively I need to conserve time).

There is no reason to believe that going for 2 after a second TD is more likely to succeed than going for two after the first TD...so the question becomes, is it better to know how many scores you still need now, or later. The old school reasoning is "make it a one score game", but there is a big difference between a 7 and 8 point game. I'd rather enhance my chances to win the game, rather than "extend the game".

As I mentioned, you see more and more coaches realizing this is the way to go (just as you are with the coaches beginning to go for 2 when they are down 14 and score, since it increases your chances of winning).

Here is a pretty old article about it as the analytics community was starting to realize that it's the right strategy (it's the first one I found when googling, but I'm sure there are others that go into more details that I can get into in a post)...

Trailing by 15 in the middle of the 4th quarter, teams are foolish to not go for 2 after touchdowns

Let’s start with the obvious: your odds of winning when trailing by 15 in the 4th quarter are really, really low. From 1994, the first season the two-point attempt was introduced to the NFL, to 2011, 68 teams have entered the 4th quarter trailing by exactly 15 points. Only one of those teams...

www.footballperspective.com

 

[jbenedict]

The dude is a fraud. He is a bully. Look no further than his mafia stare down of Jones after getting asked some hard questions about his nonsensical decisions to go for 2 - not just the Michigan game - it's been happening for years. He talks 'analytics'. Ok pal.
After his stare down, he pulled out his sheet of paper and wrote down 9 - 1 = 8 Oh crap
Time for him to move on.
I can't take his schtick any more. Not even sure what it is? When was the last time he laughed at a press conference?! He puts this tough guy persona on. And he ain't that. Let him go coach Syracuse and then call it a career.
Ok hornets. Have at it.

Shak yes this is what he does when the propaganda machine pushes back. Unfortunately Jones is the only one with some nuts. The others just fall in line and don't rock the boat. The heat needs to be placed upon him and question him. He makes 7 million a year and he is unable to see that Allar is not the most suited to run this O. We all have seen it and Prib only gets a shot because Allar got hurt. C'mon!

 

[m.knox]

So you’re saying Franklin is way ahead of the times when it comes to game day decisioning and analytics. Got it. That perfectly coincides with reality.

Klatt said it best. Know the analytics, but know your team. There is no way in hell he should have gone for the first two point conversion at the end of the first half. Almost like putting a nail in the coffin lid. Live to fight another day. They were getting the ball back to start the second half.

Franklin disenfranchised me a bit many years ago when he proclaimed proudly that the plays work better with better players. What a kick in the ass to his current team at the time. Sometime around there he goes on a silly rant about fullbacks doing "only one thing." Tell that to UM....

Now he has the players.............. And he has a drop back passer running QB draws getting his bell rung....

Then in 2018, I got to watch OSU come back from a two score lead only to have Franklin rant about going from good to great. This was to be the year, and it was the same old same old.

I'm not going to discredit his results these last two years. They are good. But man, when the big ones came, PSU was a no show. An absolute no show. Had PSU been competitive in those two contests and lost, it would be a totally different story.

 

[Rip_E_2_Joe_PA]

The dude is a fraud. He is a bully. Look no further than his mafia stare down of Jones after getting asked some hard questions about his nonsensical decisions to go for 2 - not just the Michigan game - it's been happening for years. He talks 'analytics'. Ok pal.
After his stare down, he pulled out his sheet of paper and wrote down 9 - 1 = 8 Oh crap
Time for him to move on.
I can't take his schtick any more. Not even sure what it is? When was the last time he laughed at a press conference?! He puts this tough guy persona on. And he ain't that. Let him go coach Syracuse and then call it a career.
Ok hornets. Have at it.

You weren't missed! What a childish post. Now you're out of here!

 

[lazydave841]

I think Dabo is a better coach than Jimbo. But he did benefit from having two really good QBs and long-term assistants. Also, his stubbornness wrt to NIL is going to have to change, not that it did much for Jimbo.

Dabo is stubborn over the portal, not necessarily NIL, right?

The entire SEC has had a Saban problem for 14 years. Now they have a Smart problem. 5 years running. I don't think overpaying for a guy like Dabo makes sense. Buyout Smart or Saban or hire someone who can be the next one of them 2. Otherwise, they are going to repeat the process all over again.

Whoever they hire, they better not get stuck in another longterm big $$ buyout. Unless they just like making headlines for spending money.

 

[MacNit2.0]

Ohhh, he stared at Jones. Fire him. Did you care when Joe gave a reporter the business after the Toledo loss?

Joe earned the right for that and more.

 

[The Spin Meister]

Your post pretty much sums up the reason you go for two in that situation. If you go for two and miss with 4 minutes left, you know that you need 2 more possessions (so if you get the ball back, you know that you can settle for a long FG and try another onsides kick). If you wait until late to go for 2 and miss, the game could be over at that point without enough time left to onsides kick and go for the FG. My strategy will change if I know I need one more score vs. two more scores, so it's helpful to know how aggressive I am with my play calling (and how aggressively I need to conserve time).

There is no reason to believe that going for 2 after a second TD is more likely to succeed than going for two after the first TD...so the question becomes, is it better to know how many scores you still need now, or later. The old school reasoning is "make it a one score game", but there is a big difference between a 7 and 8 point game. I'd rather enhance my chances to win the game, rather than "extend the game".

As I mentioned, you see more and more coaches realizing this is the way to go (just as you are with the coaches beginning to go for 2 when they are down 14 and score, since it increases your chances of winning).

Here is a pretty old article about it as the analytics community was starting to realize that it's the right strategy (it's the first one I found when googling, but I'm sure there are others that go into more details that I can get into in a post)...

Trailing by 15 in the middle of the 4th quarter, teams are foolish to not go for 2 after touchdowns

Let’s start with the obvious: your odds of winning when trailing by 15 in the 4th quarter are really, really low. From 1994, the first season the two-point attempt was introduced to the NFL, to 2011, 68 teams have entered the 4th quarter trailing by exactly 15 points. Only one of those teams...

www.footballperspective.com

The TD was scored with only 1:59 left in game. Going for two that late was terrible.

A) It made the onsides kick almost worthless as we would have to score quickly and get a second onsides kick….or a miracle.

B) Once they got the ball all they needed was one first down….if we had timeouts left. Not sure we did.

C) Making the point guys would have had hope with one onsides kick. The game was over when the two point failed….

 

[Erial_Lion]

The TD was scored with only 1:59 left in game. Going for two that late was terrible.

A) It made the onsides kick almost worthless as we would have to score quickly and get a second onsides kick….or a miracle.

B) Once they got the ball all they needed was one first down….if we had timeouts left. Not sure we did.

C) Making the point guys would have had hope with one onsides kick. The game was over when the two point failed….

My response would be...
a) sure, it would take a near miracle...but it would have taken a bigger miracle had we scored another TD and missed the 2 point conversion at that point, since we wouldn't have known that we need a FG. At least this gives us the very remote chance of getting the onsides kick, kicking a long FG if we get into position, and then trying to get another onsides kick.

b) We had timeouts...but again, whether we got the two point conversion or not, we really needed to hit on any onsides kicks we had left at that point. Franklin still made the right call here, but it's not quite as big of a deal when the game gets this late. Going for two early or in the middle of the 4th quarter is a hugely obvious move that's also still blasted because people are so focused on the "one score game".

c) And don't we even have more hope if we hit that two pointer and we know all we need is a TD to tie it...without it, we still need to get the TD, and then hit the two point conversion, and still survive an Overtime. At least getting that earlier two, we need to just score the TD to force overtime. And when you say "the game was over when the two point failed"...there was still a very remote chance of winning, but the game would have truly been over if we wait to go for two on the last play of the game and miss it. Again, I'm all about maximizing the chances of winning, and this gives that narrow window of one other way to win the game.

 

[royboy]

No doubt Franklin has his shortcomings, in-game management probably at the top of the list

But double digit wins , Top Ten finishes or near, a clean program, great attendance -- highly unlikely he is on some sort of Hot Seat.

 

[Ward Hog]

We can do much worse than Franklin. Tennessee got rid of Fat Phil and spent 15 years wishing they had not. A&M continues to buy players and win the recruiting war but cannot learn that you cannot win with "me" players no matter how many stars they have. Ask Miami and Florida and Florida State and USC. You need a real special coach to get Me First players to buy in and win. They are very rare.

I like Franklin as an organizer, recruiter and person, but like many others disagree with some gameday decisions. The offense this year in those games was really bad. Why throw fades at the goal line when we have two 6'6" athletic tight ends. I still cannot understand how we allow OSU to run screen plays one after the other for 3 straight TD drives in 2017 when up big, while we run 3 dive plays and punt it right back to them again and again.

Franklin has now gotten to the point that he plays too conservative against the big two and hopes to win a close one. It was actually more enjoyable when we were physically outmatched and played OSU tough. Against Michigan we should have just gone jumbo like they did and pound them. We actually ran more consistently than they did, but they got the big ones due to about 4 or 5 terribly missed gap assignments. Some by guys trying to do too much and some by just bad football.

Franklin needs to hire an offensive coordinator who is creative. I don't think Yurcich knew how to use Allar as a nonrunner and still have an effective running game. This hurt our passing game as did an inability to separate by the WR room. Allar cannot run an option when he is always going to hand it off to the back. He ran more as the season went on but no matter how much he works at it he's never going to be a real threat. We need the I formation with a pro style passing game. Hopefully, we get someone who is creative and Franklin unleashes them.

 

[The Spin Meister]

My response would be...
a) sure, it would take a near miracle...but it would have taken a bigger miracle had we scored another TD and missed the 2 point conversion at that point, since we wouldn't have known that we need a FG. At least this gives us the very remote chance of getting the onsides kick, kicking a long FG if we get into position, and then trying to get another onsides kick.

b) We had timeouts...but again, whether we got the two point conversion or not, we really needed to hit on any onsides kicks we had left at that point. Franklin still made the right call here, but it's not quite as big of a deal when the game gets this late. Going for two early or in the middle of the 4th quarter is a hugely obvious move that's also still blasted because people are so focused on the "one score game".

c) And don't we even have more hope if we hit that two pointer and we know all we need is a TD to tie it...without it, we still need to get the TD, and then hit the two point conversion, and still survive an Overtime. At least getting that earlier two, we need to just score the TD to force overtime. And when you say "the game was over when the two point failed"...there was still a very remote chance of winning, but the game would have truly been over if we wait to go for two on the last play of the game and miss it. Again, I'm all about maximizing the chances of winning, and this gives that narrow window of one other way to win the game.

So very wrong. Just kick the point. Then you need an onside kick followed a TD and a two point which would have been two miracles.

Missing the two point you then needed about four miracles. An onside kick…. Then a TD….then another onside kick….. then a last second field goal ….. all in a minute fifty nine.

2<4

 

[Jerry]

So very wrong. Just kick the point. Then you need an onside kick followed a TD and a two point which would have been two miracles.

Missing the two point you then needed about four miracles. An onside kick…. Then a TD….then another onside kick….. then a last second field goal ….. all in a minute fifty nine.

2<4

Gotta agree with you, Spin, and I think most coaches would as well. Klatt certainly did, and he's a pretty sharp observer.

Keep in mind, this wouldn't even be an issue if not for the crazy decision to go for 2 near the end of the first half.

 

[bison13]

So very wrong. Just kick the point. Then you need an onside kick followed a TD and a two point which would have been two miracles.

Missing the two point you then needed about four miracles. An onside kick…. Then a TD….then another onside kick….. then a last second field goal ….. all in a minute fifty nine.

2<4

I am an analytics person and this is correct. If there would have been more than five minutes left on the clock yes you go for two but with under two minutes left and knowing that Michigan would run the ball three times your game plan is to keep it at one score game to ride the momentum that you have, and attempt to get the two as the last option. Analytics never account for momentum, and in this case, cut it to a one possession game maintains momentum and put more pressure on Michigan.

 

[Thomas1945]

This probably isn’t a popular take with some posters. But every time I see what I perceive to be a boneheaded decision by Franklin, I want him fired. Then faced with the frightening reality of who could be next (some posters suggestions are mind numbing, and I don’t perceive them as more stupid than the people actually making the decision) I figure I can live with him a little longer.