General White Rage Suggests Deployment of U.S. Troops to Ukraine

Jerry

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May 29, 2001
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Higher-tech weapons too. I guess it's all part of that $40 billion package designed to save Ukraine even as America sinks beneath the waves. You gotta love how the AP piece below just shrugs at the revelation. Hey, no big deal. It's only World War III after all.

Anyway, not to worry -- they're not combat troops you see. It's just that "adjustments" are necessary after gaining "a sharper, shared sense of Uraine's priority requirements and the situation on the battlefield."

Translation: The situation on the battlefield has taken a sharply negative turn for Ukraine with the fall of Mariupol, a Russian naval blockade strangling the country, and the Russians getting closer to gaining full control of both Donetsk and Luhansk regions while cutting off Ukrainian forces in the east. In fact, just a couple days ago Zelensky indicated that Ukraine was losing 100 troops a day on the eastern front, which means the number is probably higher. Of course our Regime's propaganda organs don't report stuff like that. It flies in the face of the Party Line.

I hate to sound like a broken record but the dynamic and upside-down logic of this insane conflict have always been toward escalation. And now...three months in...finally...inevitably...U.S. troops. Anyone who thinks Moscow won't see this latest bid and raise it is kidding themselves. We're heading at full speed toward a catastrophe brought to you by the arrogant madmen who run our government and media:

 

Jerry

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May 29, 2001
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Jerry: So, just to make sure I understand, you are predicting:

1. The introduction of U.S. troops into the Ukrainian combat; and
2. World War III.

Why not go for the Trifecta, and give us your prediction concerning The Rapture? :cool:

I think the chances of 1 and 2 are increasing.

Not to brag, but check the record of my comments on Ukraine here...going back a year or more. Pretty spooky how right I've been. But don't let that make you nervous.

As for The Rapture, that's not my thing. As an old-time Irish Catholic, I don't believe anybody is gonna escape by being lifted off the earth to the Glorious Kingdom. Waaaay too easy, baby.

Meanwhile, the Regime's cone of silence has descended over the comments of General White Rage. Seriously, you can't make this stuff up. But it'll make a great story over campfires a thousand years from now: how a great civilization rose in rebellion against God...and committed suicide.
 

Jerry

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May 29, 2001
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Higher-tech weapons too. I guess it's all part of that $40 billion package designed to save Ukraine even as America sinks beneath the waves. You gotta love how the AP piece below just shrugs at the revelation. Hey, no big deal. It's only World War III after all.

Anyway, not to worry -- they're not combat troops you see. It's just that "adjustments" are necessary after gaining "a sharper, shared sense of Uraine's priority requirements and the situation on the battlefield."

Translation: The situation on the battlefield has taken a sharply negative turn for Ukraine with the fall of Mariupol, a Russian naval blockade strangling the country, and the Russians getting closer to gaining full control of both Donetsk and Luhansk regions while cutting off Ukrainian forces in the east. In fact, just a couple days ago Zelensky indicated that Ukraine was losing 100 troops a day on the eastern front, which means the number is probably higher. Of course our Regime's propaganda organs don't report stuff like that. It flies in the face of the Party Line.

I hate to sound like a broken record but the dynamic and upside-down logic of this insane conflict have always been toward escalation. And now...three months in...finally...inevitably...U.S. troops. Anyone who thinks Moscow won't see this latest bid and raise it is kidding themselves. We're heading at full speed toward a catastrophe brought to you by the arrogant madmen who run our government and media:


Follow-on to the above thread with information...from the Washington Post no less...that reinforces my analysis of the situation.

Over the last two weeks, we've seen in a palpable shift in tone from the Regime's two main propaganda rags, WaPo and NYT.

Our fearless leaders are going to face a fateful decision soon: A) double down in an attempt to save Ukraine from the disaster that their own policy helped create; or B) pull back from the brink and try to somehow salvage something from the ruins.

General White Rage's comments, which were explosive but hardly noticed, unsurprisingly suggest that (A) is the preferred option....especially since they've painted themselves into a corner where (B) may no longer be tenable.

Meanwhile, $40 billion more down a rathole as we sleepwalk our way further toward global catastrophe:

 
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bdgan

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These are always difficult decisions. How can we allow this aggression to proceed unabated? On the other hand what are the ramifications if we get involved? How do you define victory? What is the exit strategy?

I don't have the answer but I feel strongly about one thing. Why should the U.S. always bear a disproportionate burden? $40 billion? IMO not until western Europe commits $40 billion.
 

jjw165

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Jan 18, 2005
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Higher-tech weapons too. I guess it's all part of that $40 billion package designed to save Ukraine even as America sinks beneath the waves. You gotta love how the AP piece below just shrugs at the revelation. Hey, no big deal. It's only World War III after all.

Anyway, not to worry -- they're not combat troops you see. It's just that "adjustments" are necessary after gaining "a sharper, shared sense of Uraine's priority requirements and the situation on the battlefield."

Translation: The situation on the battlefield has taken a sharply negative turn for Ukraine with the fall of Mariupol, a Russian naval blockade strangling the country, and the Russians getting closer to gaining full control of both Donetsk and Luhansk regions while cutting off Ukrainian forces in the east. In fact, just a couple days ago Zelensky indicated that Ukraine was losing 100 troops a day on the eastern front, which means the number is probably higher. Of course our Regime's propaganda organs don't report stuff like that. It flies in the face of the Party Line.

I hate to sound like a broken record but the dynamic and upside-down logic of this insane conflict have always been toward escalation. And now...three months in...finally...inevitably...U.S. troops. Anyone who thinks Moscow won't see this latest bid and raise it is kidding themselves. We're heading at full speed toward a catastrophe brought to you by the arrogant madmen who run our government and media:

Holy shit
 

LionDeNittany

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May 29, 2001
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These are always difficult decisions. How can we allow this aggression to proceed unabated? On the other hand what are the ramifications if we get involved? How do you define victory? What is the exit strategy?

I don't have the answer but I feel strongly about one thing. Why should the U.S. always bear a disproportionate burden? $40 billion? IMO not until western Europe commits $40 billion.

Here's the thing.
The US wanted this war.
It should he clear as day now.

We egged Russia on.

LdN
 

Ski

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May 29, 2001
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Follow-on to the above thread with information...from the Washington Post no less...that reinforces my analysis of the situation.

Over the last two weeks, we've seen in a palpable shift in tone from the Regime's two main propaganda rags, WaPo and NYT.

Our fearless leaders are going to face a fateful decision soon: A) double down in an attempt to save Ukraine from the disaster that their own policy helped create; or B) pull back from the brink and try to somehow salvage something from the ruins.

General White Rage's comments, which were explosive but hardly noticed, unsurprisingly suggest that (A) is the preferred option....especially since they've painted themselves into a corner where (B) may no longer be tenable.

Meanwhile, $40 billion more down a rathole as we sleepwalk our way further toward global catastrophe:


The US is doing Ukraine dirty. They are providing "defensive" weapons that will allow for a protracted bloody war, but they won't send the types of weapons that would allow Ukraine to win. It is easy to sit on the fence when it is other countries citizens doing the fighting and dying. Sh!t or get off the pot. Either send Ukraine the weapons that they need to tip the balance or find a peaceful resolution. Our current involvement makes the US and accessory to murder.
 

Jerry

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Here's the thing.
The US wanted this war.
It should he clear as day now.

We egged Russia on.

LdN

Dem-Media has a hard-on for Putin and has pursued a very aggressive policy toward Moscow since the 2014 coup in Kyiv, which was supported by Obama's government and lit the fuse for the current conflict.

The bitter reality is that all this could have been prevented, but Dem-Media chose to go down a different road. Now Ukraine pays the price. And not just Ukraine. There will be no winners. In fact, scholars will one day rank this war high on the list of the most stupendous follies in human history.

The real question at this point is how ugly things will get. A historic catastrophe is at the extreme end of the scale, but based on Milley's comments and related information in the link below, it would seem that our fatally arrogant leaders are flirting with exactly that scenario. No surprise there.

The bastards are not content to just wreck their own country. They want to work their magic on the entire globe. Because wrecking stuff is the only thing they do well.

Meanwhile, the Russians have captured a key railroad hub in the Donbas and are making significant progress toward encircling and cutting off the battered Ukrainian forces there. If Moscow succeeds in that objective, it's game over on the eastern front.

Ukraine will then be left with no good choices, while Washington will have exactly one: either blow up the world or find a way to end this friggin' madness short of that.

Nobody who has watched these people in action for as long as I have can possibly have a good feeling about which of the above options they will choose.

 
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LionDeNittany

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Dem-Media has a hard-on for Putin and has pursued a very aggressive policy toward Moscow since the 2014 coup in Kyiv, which was supported by Obama's government and lit the fuse for the current conflict.

The bitter reality is that all this could have been prevented, but Dem-Media chose to go down a different road. Now Ukraine pays the price. And not just Ukraine. There will be no winners. In fact, scholars will one day rank this war high on the list of the most stupendous follies in human history.

The real question at this point is how ugly things will get. A historic catastrophe is at the extreme end of the scale, but based on Milley's comments and related information in the link below, it would seem that our fatally arrogant leaders are flirting with exactly that scenario. No surprise there.

The bastards are not content to just wreck their own country. They want to work their magic on the entire globe. Because wrecking stuff is the only thing they do well.

Meanwhile, the Russians have captured a key railroad hub in the Donbas and are making significant progress toward encircling and cutting off the battered Ukrainian forces there. If Moscow succeeds in that objective, it's game over on the eastern front.

Ukraine will then be left with no good choices, while Washington will have exactly one: either blow up the world or find a way to end this friggin' madness short of that.

Nobody who has watched these people in action for as long as I have can possibly have a good feeling about which of the above options they will choose.


Washington already decided.

The left is the exact opposite of whst they claim to be.

They are pro billionaire
Anti little guy
Pro war

The left wants war.
 

ram2020

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Jul 29, 2013
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Dem-Media has a hard-on for Putin and has pursued a very aggressive policy toward Moscow since the 2014 coup in Kyiv, which was supported by Obama's government and lit the fuse for the current conflict.

The bitter reality is that all this could have been prevented, but Dem-Media chose to go down a different road. Now Ukraine pays the price. And not just Ukraine. There will be no winners. In fact, scholars will one day rank this war high on the list of the most stupendous follies in human history.

The real question at this point is how ugly things will get. A historic catastrophe is at the extreme end of the scale, but based on Milley's comments and related information in the link below, it would seem that our fatally arrogant leaders are flirting with exactly that scenario. No surprise there.

The bastards are not content to just wreck their own country. They want to work their magic on the entire globe. Because wrecking stuff is the only thing they do well.

Meanwhile, the Russians have captured a key railroad hub in the Donbas and are making significant progress toward encircling and cutting off the battered Ukrainian forces there. If Moscow succeeds in that objective, it's game over on the eastern front.

Ukraine will then be left with no good choices, while Washington will have exactly one: either blow up the world or find a way to end this friggin' madness short of that.

Nobody who has watched these people in action for as long as I have can possibly have a good feeling about which of the above options they will choose.

As I have said from the beginning, irrespective of whether it made policy sense to support Ukraine or not(or merely the moralizing and virtue signaling "we need to do something" from the mediacrats"), did anyone ever trust THIS administration to not totally fudge this up? When you are batting .000, I'm not sure a faux war with a nuclear power should be on the menu.
 

Jerry

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Washington already decided.

The left is the exact opposite of whst they claim to be.

They are pro billionaire
Anti little guy
Pro war

The left wants war.

Agreed.

But I wouldn't call them the "Left" anymore. Or liberals. Rather, they're a Frankenstein mutation of what leftism and liberalism used to be...just as Dem-Media is a Frankenstein mutation of what the old Democratic Party used to be.

The mutated versions are pro-Regime, pro-war, anti-life, and anti-liberty...a terminal cancer in the body of American democracy.

At the end of the day, they're a Death Cult, which is why in their sick little hearts, the idea of nuclear war is a turn-on.
 

Jerry

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Since Day One of this insane war, I've had a sort of predestined feeling about its ending.

The arrogant godless cretins who run our government are beyond hope.

They have no problem wrecking their own country but are willing to blow up the world to save...Ukraine. Except in the end, they'll take Ukraine...and everything else...down with them.

>>Whom the gods would destroy, they first make mad.<< -- ancient Greek writer.

 

KnightWhoSaysNit

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Lyndon Johnson is effectively back in the saddle.

I swear these people have never read a history book. Not important I guess when the critical element in education and throughout government is some kind of twisted idea that has been labeled "woke." Everything bows to that and some equally amorphous idea called the Green New Deal.
 
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Ski

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Since Day One of this insane war, I've had a sort of predestined feeling about its ending.

The arrogant godless cretins who run our government are beyond hope.

They have no problem wrecking their own country but are willing to blow up the world to save...Ukraine. Except in the end, they'll take Ukraine...and everything else...down with them.

>>Whom the gods would destroy, they first make mad.<< -- ancient Greek writer.


I have no sympathy for the Russians or their cities considering what they have done to Ukrainian cities. The US either needs to send these MLRS systems, along with anti-ship missiles and arrange for the transfer of MiGs from Western European countries to Ukraine to give them a chance to do more than extend a fight that they currently have no chance to win, or the US needs to encourage a peaceful solution. However, the current situation in Ukraine is not acceptable. Russia will pay attention when their pretty gold domes in Moscow start getting hit with long range missiles like they hit Kyiv. If they don't like it then they can pull their forces back to their own territory.

These weapons can tip the balance. Belgorod no longer becomes a safe jumping point and their safe logistical lines of communication which they are challenged with now trying to resupply through become even longer. Russia is yanking 55 year old T-62s out of mothballs to fight in Ukraine. Their Air Force does no strategic bombing except by long range guided missiles which they are running out of. They do not have the conventional military to challenge the US or NATO. Their bluster is simply the bluster of a poker player holding a pair of deuces and trying to bluff the table.

And no, they aren't nuking anyone.

Vladimir Putin will only use tactical nukes if 'Russia's existence in danger', envoy claims
 
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TN Lion

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Jerry: So, just to make sure I understand, you are predicting:

1. The introduction of U.S. troops into the Ukrainian combat; and
2. World War III.

Why not go for the Trifecta, and give us your prediction concerning The Rapture? :cool:
Just shut the fukk up. The board is as am I, tired of your lame attempts at humor. Add something of value for a change. Good grief.
 

Jerry

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I have no sympathy for the Russians or their cities considering what they have done to Ukrainian cities. The US either needs to send these MLRS systems, along with anti-ship missiles and arrange for the transfer of MiGs from Western European countries to Ukraine to give them a chance to do more than extend a fight that they currently have no chance to win, or the US needs to encourage a peaceful solution. However, the current situation in Ukraine is not acceptable. Russia will pay attention when their pretty gold domes in Moscow start getting hit with long range missiles like they hit Kyiv. If they don't like it then they can pull their forces back to their own territory.

These weapons can tip the balance. Belgorod no longer becomes a safe jumping point and their safe logistical lines of communication which they are challenged with now trying to resupply through become even longer. Russia is yanking 55 year old T-62s out of mothballs to fight in Ukraine. Their Air Force does no strategic bombing except by long range guided missiles which they are running out of. They do not have the conventional military to challenge the US or NATO. Their bluster is simply the bluster of a poker player holding a pair of deuces and trying to bluff the table.

And no, they aren't nuking anyone.

Vladimir Putin will only use tactical nukes if 'Russia's existence in danger', envoy claims

Ski, I give you credit for consistency, but I couldn't disagree more on the issue of supplying the weapons in question to Ukraine. I mean, we've been pouring in weapons and other kinds of support, most recently $40 billion worth, but as we approach Day 100, none of it has proven decisive. The momentum appears to have swung against Ukraine in fact.

As I've said before, I'm not pro-Russia or anti-Ukraine. Rather, my first priority is the interests of my own country, and in my view those interests argued strongly in favor of a deal that would have prevented all this...and now, having missed that chance, we need to find a way back from the brink before it's too late. This would also be in the interests of the suffering Ukrainian people, by the way. Unfortunately, our leaders have other priorities: bleeding Russia and regime change in Moscow. They've said it out loud. In other words, the Ukrainians are now pawns, nothing more.

About your images of the gold domes in Moscow on fire, I think you're letting your emotions get the better of your judgment. That's a recipe for catastrophe. In fact, if the Ukrainians use those weapons against targets in Russia, gold domes or not, the Russians are going to unleash hell...and nuclear weapons may well be on the table regardless of what some Ambassador in London might say now. He won't be the guy making the call. In the language of statecraft, the word "intolerable," as linked in a post above, is as clear a warning as a government can send.

Bottom line: as I've stated from Day One (and before), the Russians will do whatever is necessary to "win" this war. We can't out-escalate them and to attempt to do that for a country 5000 miles away where the United States has (or at least had) zero strategic interest at stake is utter madness. But madness seems very much in fashion in Washington these days. Oh well, I do hope I'm wrong...for all our sakes.
 

NJPSU

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Just shut the fukk up. The board is as am I, tired of your lame attempts at humor. Add something of value for a change. Good grief.
Sorry TN but Laffy is correct. Jerry is friggin gone. He’s a white Catholic version of the guys who flew airplanes into the WTC. He could be convinced to do something like that if he thought God was calling him to do it.
 
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Jerry

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Just shut the fukk up. The board is as am I, tired of your lame attempts at humor. Add something of value for a change. Good grief.

Problem is, when Laf attempts to engage on substance, as happened recently in the Pelosi-Cordileone thread, he gets demolished. So it's safer for him to retreat to sneers and smirks.

NJ. the pretend Wall Street guru, is an asshole, but I give him credit for at least recognizing his intellectual limitations and therefore confining himself to the kind of juvenile garbage you see in this and other threads. He never tries for more than that.
 
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NJPSU

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Problem is, when Laf attempts to engage on substance, as happened recently in the Pelosi-Cordileone thread, he gets demolished. So it's safer for him to retreat to sneers and smirks.

NJ. the pretend Wall Street guru, is an asshole, but I give him credit for at least recognizing his intellectual limitations and therefore confining himself to the kind of juvenile garbage you see in this and other threads. He never tries for more than that.
It’s not “juvenile” to call you what you are…a brainwashed dangerous ideologue.
 

Jerry

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It’s not “juvenile” to call you what you are…a brainwashed dangerous ideologue.

But it is juvenile to answer intelligent thoughts with moronic lies and taunts because you lack the knowledge and intellect to actually address, let alone rebut, the thoughts in question.

This thread is a great example. All the intelligent posts came from conservatives. The only contribution from the Dem-Mediacrats was idiotic blather about the Rapture and flying planes into buildings.

As for this "dangerous ideology" that frightens you so, it happens to be the very one that founded, built, and sustained Western civilization for thousands of years. Look it up.

Meanwhile, the corrupt ideology of nihilism now ascendant, mindlessly embraced by brainwashed tools like you, is wrecking that civilization...and our country with it. Open your friggin' eyes. Or ask the people of Uvalde.

At the end of the day, asshole, you've got nothing except the lies and hate at the heart of your would-be New Moral Order...plus an imaginary story about being a hot-shot Wall Street guru always one step ahead of the game.
 

Ski

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Ski, I give you credit for consistency, but I couldn't disagree more on the issue of supplying the weapons in question to Ukraine. I mean, we've been pouring in weapons and other kinds of support, most recently $40 billion worth, but as we approach Day 100, none of it has proven decisive. The momentum appears to have swung against Ukraine in fact.

As I've said before, I'm not pro-Russia or anti-Ukraine. Rather, my first priority is the interests of my own country, and in my view those interests argued strongly in favor of a deal that would have prevented all this...and now, having missed that chance, we need to find a way back from the brink before it's too late. This would also be in the interests of the suffering Ukrainian people, by the way. Unfortunately, our leaders have other priorities: bleeding Russia and regime change in Moscow. They've said it out loud. In other words, the Ukrainians are now pawns, nothing more.

About your images of the gold domes in Moscow on fire, I think you're letting your emotions get the better of your judgment. That's a recipe for catastrophe. In fact, if the Ukrainians use those weapons against targets in Russia, gold domes or not, the Russians are going to unleash hell...and nuclear weapons may well be on the table regardless of what some Ambassador in London might say now. He won't be the guy making the call. In the language of statecraft, the word "intolerable," as linked in a post above, is as clear a warning as a government can send.

Bottom line: as I've stated from Day One (and before), the Russians will do whatever is necessary to "win" this war. We can't out-escalate them and to attempt to do that for a country 5000 miles away where the United States has (or at least had) zero strategic interest at stake is utter madness. But madness seems very much in fashion in Washington these days. Oh well, I do hope I'm wrong...for all our sakes.

I guess we differ mostly in that I still believe that Ukraine can achieve victory, but it needs the proper weaponry to do it. Right now in the East it is artillery slugging it out where most Ukraine artillery can reach out 25 miles and the Russian artillery can reach out 40 miles.

While Russia is making gains the Ukrainians are not collapsing in mass. Russia has basically stopped advancing in most areas of Ukraine to concentrate its offensive operations around Severodonetsk and Lysychansk to complete their capture of Luhansk. That is the only value of these two cities to the Russians. Strategically, they are of little value and they have sacrificed strategic advances across the front for a tactical victory.

There is still time, but that window will close if Ukraine does not start receiving longer ranged weaponry now. To let them go on fighting receiving only weaponry that does not allow for significant offensive operations is to commit them to wasting lives for a cause they cannot win with only the weaponry that they have now. Our leadership needs to commit one way or another. Give Ukraine weaponry to turn the tide or get the hell out of it and stop encouraging Ukraine to bleed to death for a lost cause. The current course is inhumane.

I believe that long term, Russia cannot be allowed to keep Ukraine's Black Sea ports and the bulk of its natural gas reserves and that is not in our strategic interests going forward. Based on their performance in Ukraine, I don't fear the Russian military attacking the West. If they are having trouble advancing more than 70 miles across Ukraine from their own border, how are they going to mass enough force to cross Belarus and attack the West in the face of F-35s, F-22s, EuroFighters and even older F-15s and F16s? They will witness first hand what a real air force can do. They know it and so do we. Their bluster is bluster and should be treated as such.
 

LafayetteBear

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Dec 1, 2009
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But it is juvenile to answer intelligent thoughts with moronic lies and taunts because you lack the knowledge and intellect to actually address, let alone rebut, the thoughts in question.
Jerry: Your OP quite clearly expressed your opinion that U.S. troops were “finally … inevitably” going to be introduced in the Ukraine-Russia conflict. You followed up by opining that WW III would be close behind that.

Feel free to get all indignant at my asking you to confirm such wild predictions. Doesn’t bother me.

Also, if you hold yourself out as an authority on religion and engage in making apocalyptic predictions, you can hardly be surprised that someone else might respond with a request for your prediction about the Rapture. You think it’s coming soon?
 
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Jerry

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I guess we differ mostly in that I still believe that Ukraine can achieve victory, but it needs the proper weaponry to do it. Right now in the East it is artillery slugging it out where most Ukraine artillery can reach out 25 miles and the Russian artillery can reach out 40 miles.

While Russia is making gains the Ukrainians are not collapsing in mass. Russia has basically stopped advancing in most areas of Ukraine to concentrate its offensive operations around Severodonetsk and Lysychansk to complete their capture of Luhansk. That is the only value of these two cities to the Russians. Strategically, they are of little value and they have sacrificed strategic advances across the front for a tactical victory.

There is still time, but that window will close if Ukraine does not start receiving longer ranged weaponry now. To let them go on fighting receiving only weaponry that does not allow for significant offensive operations is to commit them to wasting lives for a cause they cannot win with only the weaponry that they have now. Our leadership needs to commit one way or another. Give Ukraine weaponry to turn the tide or get the hell out of it and stop encouraging Ukraine to bleed to death for a lost cause. The current course is inhumane.

I believe that long term, Russia cannot be allowed to keep Ukraine's Black Sea ports and the bulk of its natural gas reserves and that is not in our strategic interests going forward. Based on their performance in Ukraine, I don't fear the Russian military attacking the West. If they are having trouble advancing more than 70 miles across Ukraine from their own border, how are they going to mass enough force to cross Belarus and attack the West in the face of F-35s, F-22s, EuroFighters and even older F-15s and F16s? They will witness first hand what a real air force can do. They know it and so do we. Their bluster is bluster and should be treated as such.

Ski, I get where you're coming from, but we'll agree to disagree on a good portion of the above for reasons I've already stated here in this thread and previously.

But I give you a "like" for presenting your case respectfully and intelligently. :)
 
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Jerry

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Jerry: Your OP quite clearly expressed your opinion that U.S. troops were “finally … inevitably” going to be introduced in the Ukraine-Russia conflict. You followed up by opining that WW III would be close behind that.

Feel free to get all indignant at my asking you to confirm such wild predictions. Doesn’t bother me.

Also, if you hold yourself out as an authority on religion and engage in making apocalyptic predictions, you can hardly be surprised that someone else might respond with a request for your prediction about the Rapture. You think it’s coming soon?

Laf, in fairness to you, your post in this thread was not nearly as ludicrous and contemptible as NJ's so probably shouldn't be mentioned in the same breath.

On the other hand, you did recently state that I "hate gays," which, though not in the same ballpark as NJ's accusation that I'm a mass murderer, is still a pretty big-time lie. In fact, maybe you missed that I asked you to support the claim with anything that I've posted here. Still waiting on that.

As to the issue at hand, my opinion about the troops is based squarely on a clear statement on the part of General Milley. That statement is contained in the link at the OP.

On World War III, I took some poetic license in the phrasing in order to make an entirely valid point: the conflict is on an escalatory path while our leadership class and media stooges take a remarkably casual attitude toward the clearly increasing risk of a fatal incident, accident, or misjudgment. In fact, the situation is primed for exactly that.

You know, it's better to think about these things beforehand in order to head them off rather than afterward in the ruins when the only thing left to do will be wait for historians to explain the madness that caused rich, powerful nations to commit suicide. In such an event, the fact that our leadership class and its media stooges are composed of arrogant godless cretins will no doubt figure prominently on the list of historical reasons.

I don't know how many times you want me to answer your question about the Rapture. It's a comfortable little fairy tale believed by good and well-meaning people, and I don't begrudge them for it. But it's antithetical to Catholic teaching and flies in the face of a hard truth: Nobody gets out of here alive. Another hard truth taken directly from Scripture also applies, and as a self-described Christian you perhaps have heard of it: You know not the day or the hour.
 

WeR0206

Well-Known Member
Apr 9, 2014
19,370
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I guess we differ mostly in that I still believe that Ukraine can achieve victory, but it needs the proper weaponry to do it. Right now in the East it is artillery slugging it out where most Ukraine artillery can reach out 25 miles and the Russian artillery can reach out 40 miles.

While Russia is making gains the Ukrainians are not collapsing in mass. Russia has basically stopped advancing in most areas of Ukraine to concentrate its offensive operations around Severodonetsk and Lysychansk to complete their capture of Luhansk. That is the only value of these two cities to the Russians. Strategically, they are of little value and they have sacrificed strategic advances across the front for a tactical victory.

There is still time, but that window will close if Ukraine does not start receiving longer ranged weaponry now. To let them go on fighting receiving only weaponry that does not allow for significant offensive operations is to commit them to wasting lives for a cause they cannot win with only the weaponry that they have now. Our leadership needs to commit one way or another. Give Ukraine weaponry to turn the tide or get the hell out of it and stop encouraging Ukraine to bleed to death for a lost cause. The current course is inhumane.

I believe that long term, Russia cannot be allowed to keep Ukraine's Black Sea ports and the bulk of its natural gas reserves and that is not in our strategic interests going forward. Based on their performance in Ukraine, I don't fear the Russian military attacking the West. If they are having trouble advancing more than 70 miles across Ukraine from their own border, how are they going to mass enough force to cross Belarus and attack the West in the face of F-35s, F-22s, EuroFighters and even older F-15s and F16s? They will witness first hand what a real air force can do. They know it and so do we. Their bluster is bluster and should be treated as such.
We can throw all the weapons we want at Ukraine but it won’t make a difference and will only serve to inflame Russia even further. Most of them end up in the hands of the russians or sold on black markets (Ukraine is run by the mob with a coke head as the figurehead). Ukraine doesn’t have the ability to get the weapons to the front lines nor do they have the training and men to use them. They are dealing with a massive problem with deserters bc the military leadership is in shambles and no one wants to take orders from insane nazis (azov, right sector, etc.).

Nato had 8 yrs to train up and arm one of the largest standing armies in the EU and Russia came in and just decimated them in a few months. Nato is a joke and paper tiger. Which isn’t surprising since NATO has been taken over by the woke brigade.

You still have a misunderstanding of Russia’s motive. They don’t give a fuuck about taking over the EU/west. They are responding to continual provocation by the west and nato expansion. This is all well documented.

A path for peace was already established before this war started, it’s called the minsk agreement and nato/Ukraine shit all over it.

Here is just one person’s story from the Donbass which you will never hear in western msm:


Foreword by the Saker: today it is my great pleasure to introduce you all to Faina Savenkova, a young lady from Novorussia whose writings are steadily gaining recognition. I asked Faina to put in her own words how it feels to live under constant Ukronazi artillery strikes and sniper fire. The result is for you to discover below, along with a mini bio of Faina herself. But we had another idea we would like to submit to you: if, after reading Faina’s essay below, you want to ask her a question, please send it to me to my public address vineyardsaker@gmail.com. Please send your question(s) in English and please make sure to write “questions for Faina” as the subject of your email. I will then collect the questions, translate them into Russia and send them to Fania who will then send me her replies. I think that it is very important to be exposed to the hopes and fears of the regular people of Novorussia, and especially the young ones. I hope that many of you will use this opportunity to not only ask a question, but also maybe convey something to Faina and her family and friends. Finally, I gratefully welcome Fania to our international community – Faina, we are glad and honored to have you with us!

The Saker
——-
To Believe and to Hope
by Faina Savenkova for the Saker blog
Translated by Scott Humor


Whenever someone asks me to describe life under Ukrainian shelling, I feel lost. Not only because I am still a child, and not simply because I have nothing to say. I just don’t know what they want me to say. Dry and indifferent reports of casualties and destruction? Certainly not. There is news for that. Personal feelings and experiences? That’s more difficult. What is a life during the war? Ordinary, if you don’t remember your peaceful life.

Many people may be horrified to realize that in the twenty-first century in the geographical center of Europe, there are children who don’t remember passenger jets flying high in the sky, walking across an evening city with their parents, or some other cute nonsense that other children don’t even notice.

The no-fly zone and the curfews adjust our lives. That’s why when we read about the riots in some European cities after an introduction of coronavirus curfew, it is puzzling: what is wrong? It’s just a curfew, nothing terrible, why does it bother them that much? The reason for our calmness is actually very simple: everything is known in comparison, and we have nothing to compare.

We are a generation that doesn’t remember a peaceful life. We are a generation that lives by strict rules, the failure of which might result in death. We learned how to determine the direction of the projectiles by ear, so that we know when to worry and when to continue going about our business. We have learned not to ignore the lectures of the Ministry of Emergency Situations on the rules of conduct during attacks, in case of detection of suspicious objects or other recommendations in various situations. And still, no one can guarantee that you won’t accidentally get hit by a shard because you’re just unlucky. Strange? Scared? Everyday life, with a small degree of difference depending on the intensity of the shelling of the territory.

What is life under Ukrainian shelling? It is the evening of June 1st, Children’s Day, when hundreds of paper lanterns soared into the sky at the memorials to commemorate the fallen children of Donbass and light the way for the angels. After all, it is difficult to explain to kids why these angels were robbed of their short lives, deprived of the opportunity to grow up and see the world in our homeland. Now they can only watch from the sky and cry while the adults comfort them.

Almost all of my life and memories are connected to the war, which is why I have no regrets and sadness about the past. I live in the present and occasionally think about the future, in which there is a place for a naive and stupid dream that causes a smile. Quite real, warming and almost tangible, it allows you not to despair even in the most difficult times. I want passenger planes to fly in the skies of Donbass, not paper lanterns. Any dream can turn into a reality. It must be so, and I believe it will be so.”

r0wLXo1.jpg
 
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NJPSU

Well-Known Member
May 29, 2001
44,101
15,481
1
Laf, in fairness to you, your post in this thread was not nearly as ludicrous and contemptible as NJ's so probably shouldn't be mentioned in the same breath.

On the other hand, you did recently state that I "hate gays," which, though not in the same ballpark as NJ's accusation that I'm a mass murderer, is still a pretty big-time lie. In fact, maybe you missed that I asked you to support the claim with anything that I've posted here. Still waiting on that.

As to the issue at hand, my opinion about the troops is based squarely on a clear statement on the part of General Milley. That statement is contained in the link at the OP.

On World War III, I took some poetic license in the phrasing in order to make an entirely valid point: the conflict is on an escalatory path while our leadership class and media stooges take a remarkably casual attitude toward the clearly increasing risk of a fatal incident, accident, or misjudgment. In fact, the situation is primed for exactly that.

You know, it's better to think about these things beforehand in order to head them off rather than afterward in the ruins when the only thing left to do will be wait for historians to explain the madness that caused rich, powerful nations to commit suicide. In such an event, the fact that our leadership class and its media stooges are composed of arrogant godless cretins will no doubt figure prominently on the list of historical reasons.

I don't know how many times you want me to answer your question about the Rapture. It's a comfortable little fairy tale believed by good and well-meaning people, and I don't begrudge them for it. But it's antithetical to Catholic teaching and flies in the face of a hard truth: Nobody gets out of here alive. Another hard truth taken directly from Scripture also applies, and as a self-described Christian you perhaps have heard of it: You know not the day or the hour.
I didn’t say you are a mass murderer.

You do however seem like the type who could be convinced to commit mass murder if someone was able to get you to think it was somehow supporting your obsessive religious and political ideology.

Your writing style makes me feel like I’m reading the Unabomber‘s manifesto.
 

Jerry

Well-Known Member
May 29, 2001
4,874
10,317
1
I didn’t say you are a mass murderer.

You do however seem like the type who could be convinced to commit mass murder if someone was able to get you to think it was somehow supporting your obsessive religious and political ideology.

Your writing style makes me feel like I’m reading the Unabomber‘s manifesto.

Yes, you did say I was a mass murderer or the equivalent thereof and repeated it above. But fact is, my "obsessive religious and political ideology" happens to look askance at mass murder...or any kind of murder. The Fifth Commandment and all. Look it up.

You, on the other hand, have actually voted for a nihilist ideology that is addicted to Death and has devastated an entire generation of kids while leaving a trail of misery and destruction across the land. This makes you an actual enabler of murder...mass or otherwise...and a participant in the destruction of your own children.

So troll your little heart out...wash your hands as much as you want...you ain't gonna get the blood off them, asshole.
 
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Ski

Well-Known Member
May 29, 2001
9,579
11,354
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We can throw all the weapons we want at Ukraine but it won’t make a difference and will only serve to inflame Russia even further. Most of them end up in the hands of the russians or sold on black markets (Ukraine is run by the mob with a coke head as the figurehead). Ukraine doesn’t have the ability to get the weapons to the front lines nor do they have the training and men to use them. They are dealing with a massive problem with deserters bc the military leadership is in shambles and no one wants to take orders from insane nazis (azov, right sector, etc.).

Nato had 8 yrs to train up and arm one of the largest standing armies in the EU and Russia came in and just decimated them in a few months. Nato is a joke and paper tiger. Which isn’t surprising since NATO has been taken over by the woke brigade.

You still have a misunderstanding of Russia’s motive. They don’t give a fuuck about taking over the EU/west. They are responding to continual provocation by the west and nato expansion. This is all well documented.

A path for peace was already established before this war started, it’s called the minsk agreement and nato/Ukraine shit all over it.

Here is just one person’s story from the Donbass which you will never hear in western msm:


Foreword by the Saker: today it is my great pleasure to introduce you all to Faina Savenkova, a young lady from Novorussia whose writings are steadily gaining recognition. I asked Faina to put in her own words how it feels to live under constant Ukronazi artillery strikes and sniper fire. The result is for you to discover below, along with a mini bio of Faina herself. But we had another idea we would like to submit to you: if, after reading Faina’s essay below, you want to ask her a question, please send it to me to my public address vineyardsaker@gmail.com. Please send your question(s) in English and please make sure to write “questions for Faina” as the subject of your email. I will then collect the questions, translate them into Russia and send them to Fania who will then send me her replies. I think that it is very important to be exposed to the hopes and fears of the regular people of Novorussia, and especially the young ones. I hope that many of you will use this opportunity to not only ask a question, but also maybe convey something to Faina and her family and friends. Finally, I gratefully welcome Fania to our international community – Faina, we are glad and honored to have you with us!

The Saker
——-
To Believe and to Hope
by Faina Savenkova for the Saker blog
Translated by Scott Humor


Whenever someone asks me to describe life under Ukrainian shelling, I feel lost. Not only because I am still a child, and not simply because I have nothing to say. I just don’t know what they want me to say. Dry and indifferent reports of casualties and destruction? Certainly not. There is news for that. Personal feelings and experiences? That’s more difficult. What is a life during the war? Ordinary, if you don’t remember your peaceful life.

Many people may be horrified to realize that in the twenty-first century in the geographical center of Europe, there are children who don’t remember passenger jets flying high in the sky, walking across an evening city with their parents, or some other cute nonsense that other children don’t even notice.

The no-fly zone and the curfews adjust our lives. That’s why when we read about the riots in some European cities after an introduction of coronavirus curfew, it is puzzling: what is wrong? It’s just a curfew, nothing terrible, why does it bother them that much? The reason for our calmness is actually very simple: everything is known in comparison, and we have nothing to compare.

We are a generation that doesn’t remember a peaceful life. We are a generation that lives by strict rules, the failure of which might result in death. We learned how to determine the direction of the projectiles by ear, so that we know when to worry and when to continue going about our business. We have learned not to ignore the lectures of the Ministry of Emergency Situations on the rules of conduct during attacks, in case of detection of suspicious objects or other recommendations in various situations. And still, no one can guarantee that you won’t accidentally get hit by a shard because you’re just unlucky. Strange? Scared? Everyday life, with a small degree of difference depending on the intensity of the shelling of the territory.

What is life under Ukrainian shelling? It is the evening of June 1st, Children’s Day, when hundreds of paper lanterns soared into the sky at the memorials to commemorate the fallen children of Donbass and light the way for the angels. After all, it is difficult to explain to kids why these angels were robbed of their short lives, deprived of the opportunity to grow up and see the world in our homeland. Now they can only watch from the sky and cry while the adults comfort them.

Almost all of my life and memories are connected to the war, which is why I have no regrets and sadness about the past. I live in the present and occasionally think about the future, in which there is a place for a naive and stupid dream that causes a smile. Quite real, warming and almost tangible, it allows you not to despair even in the most difficult times. I want passenger planes to fly in the skies of Donbass, not paper lanterns. Any dream can turn into a reality. It must be so, and I believe it will be so.”

r0wLXo1.jpg

I thought the Russians were clearing out Nazis? And they have indicated that there are Nazis in Poland, Nazis in Finland, and that the Israelis are Nazi sympathizers. I can't keep up with the reason of the week for the Russian invasion of a sovereign nation. Russia has kept Ukraine out of NATO by forcing Sweden and Finland to ask for membership thereby doubling Russia's border with NATO. Very effective strategy. Brilliant. You must be very proud of Pooty Poot.

The path for peace was the Budapest Memorandum that the Russians sh!t all over. The world has an obligation to defend the sovereignty of a nation that gave up a huge nuclear arsenal in exchange for guarantees of its borders if it ever wants to have another country give up nuclear arms again.
 
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WeR0206

Well-Known Member
Apr 9, 2014
19,370
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2020evidence.org
I thought the Russians were clearing out Nazis? And they have indicated that there are Nazis in Poland, Nazis in Finland, and that the Israelis are Nazi sympathizers. I can't keep up with the reason of the week for the Russian invasion of a sovereign nation. Russia has kept Ukraine out of NATO by forcing Sweden and Finland to ask for membership thereby doubling Russia's border with NATO. Very effective strategy. Brilliant. You must be very proud of Pooty Poot.

The path for peace was the Budapest Memorandum that the Russians sh!t all over. The world has an obligation to defend the sovereignty of a nation that gave up a huge nuclear arsenal in exchange for guarantees of its borders if it ever wants to have another country give up nuclear arms again.
Who said they weren’t clearing out nazis? Nazis + biolabs + Ukraine’s refusal to acknowledge the independence of Crimea/Donabass + committing ethnic cleansing in Donbass + nato pumping tons of weapons right along russias border is why they got invaded.

How can anyone in their right mind not think Ukraine has a nazi problem when their leaders bestow hero of Ukrainian status to prominent Ukrainian nazis (stepan bandera), have nazis on postage stamps, have streets named after them, and have political parties that follow their ideology (svoboda, etc)??

Nothing to see here…
https://rumble.com/vzieml-deleted-f...and-president-zelensky-interview-about-a.html (DELETED Fox News Video: Brett Baier and President Zelensky Interview about Azov Nazi Battalion)


(Watch the BBC debunk its own denial of nazis in Ukraine. Backup link:
https://rumble.com/vyczkz-watch-the-bbc-debunk-its-own-denial-of-nazis-in-ukraine.html)
 
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Ten Thousan Marbles

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Feb 6, 2014
106,135
18,604
1
Higher-tech weapons too. I guess it's all part of that $40 billion package designed to save Ukraine even as America sinks beneath the waves. You gotta love how the AP piece below just shrugs at the revelation. Hey, no big deal. It's only World War III after all.

Anyway, not to worry -- they're not combat troops you see. It's just that "adjustments" are necessary after gaining "a sharper, shared sense of Uraine's priority requirements and the situation on the battlefield."

Translation: The situation on the battlefield has taken a sharply negative turn for Ukraine with the fall of Mariupol, a Russian naval blockade strangling the country, and the Russians getting closer to gaining full control of both Donetsk and Luhansk regions while cutting off Ukrainian forces in the east. In fact, just a couple days ago Zelensky indicated that Ukraine was losing 100 troops a day on the eastern front, which means the number is probably higher. Of course our Regime's propaganda organs don't report stuff like that. It flies in the face of the Party Line.

I hate to sound like a broken record but the dynamic and upside-down logic of this insane conflict have always been toward escalation. And now...three months in...finally...inevitably...U.S. troops. Anyone who thinks Moscow won't see this latest bid and raise it is kidding themselves. We're heading at full speed toward a catastrophe brought to you by the arrogant madmen who run our government and media:

LULZ

I do not expect you to fully grasp this effect. There is no way that you are able to do that.

Nevertheless, I am here to try to help you......

 

LafayetteBear

Well-Known Member
Dec 1, 2009
47,541
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Laf, in fairness to you, your post in this thread was not nearly as ludicrous and contemptible as NJ's so probably shouldn't be mentioned in the same breath.

On the other hand, you did recently state that I "hate gays," which, though not in the same ballpark as NJ's accusation that I'm a mass murderer, is still a pretty big-time lie. In fact, maybe you missed that I asked you to support the claim with anything that I've posted here. Still waiting on that.

As to the issue at hand, my opinion about the troops is based squarely on a clear statement on the part of General Milley. That statement is contained in the link at the OP.

On World War III, I took some poetic license in the phrasing in order to make an entirely valid point: the conflict is on an escalatory path while our leadership class and media stooges take a remarkably casual attitude toward the clearly increasing risk of a fatal incident, accident, or misjudgment. In fact, the situation is primed for exactly that.

You know, it's better to think about these things beforehand in order to head them off rather than afterward in the ruins when the only thing left to do will be wait for historians to explain the madness that caused rich, powerful nations to commit suicide. In such an event, the fact that our leadership class and its media stooges are composed of arrogant godless cretins will no doubt figure prominently on the list of historical reasons.

I don't know how many times you want me to answer your question about the Rapture. It's a comfortable little fairy tale believed by good and well-meaning people, and I don't begrudge them for it. But it's antithetical to Catholic teaching and flies in the face of a hard truth: Nobody gets out of here alive. Another hard truth taken directly from Scripture also applies, and as a self-described Christian you perhaps have heard of it: You know not the day or the hour.
Wait, wut?! Where did I state that you "hate gays?!" I don't think that. Rather, my guess is that your sentiment is similar to that of a lot of evangelicals (including some who are related to me), whose attitude is summed up by the phrase "Hate the sin, love the sinner." My only issue with that statement is that I don't believe they really love the sinner.

Lemme be clear. Being gay was not my choice, and I am glad to report that it is not the choice of any of my three sons. I say that for effect, because I do not believe homosexuality is a choice. I think people either are or are not born with that trait. I know far too many gay people whose siblings are straight, or straight people who have a gay sibling. Nurture does not have a part to play in it, IMHO. People who are gay have enough difficulties of their own without having to deal with judgement, hatred, and discrimination from others. If their defense mechanism is to have "pride" regarding who they are, how difficult is it to simply say "Good for you" and move on with your own business? You do not have to agree with their orientation, lifestyle, or political viewpoint.

As for the last paragraph of your post above, I fully agree with it. I may have other issues with your philosophy, but they will not revolve around the Rapture.
 
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Jerry

Well-Known Member
May 29, 2001
4,874
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LULZ

I do not expect you to fully grasp this effect. There is no way that you are able to do that.

Nevertheless, I am here to try to help you......


Thank you, Marbles. I immediately recognized myself in the second sentence of your link: Some researchers also include in their definition the opposite effect for high performers: their tendency to underestimate their skills.

As a high performer myself, a sense of Christian humility has often tempted me to underestimate my considerable skills, and I have worked hard to overcome this personality quirk. But I'm glad to know the experts recognize it as an issue for some high performers like me. ;)
 

Jerry

Well-Known Member
May 29, 2001
4,874
10,317
1

This guy at least tries to present his analysis, which appears knowledgeable and well-informed, straight up...without the propaganda infusion that has turned most U.S. media reporting on the war into a joke. We'll give him a pass on his butchery of the pronunciation of the placenames.

I've been wondering about that Kherson counter-offensive by the Ukies. It was reportedly commenced a few days ago, but I've seen no progress reports. If they were to achieve success against the southern anchor of Moscow's line, it would be pretty huge.

Late word this morning is that the Russians have made additional progress in their attack on Severodonetsk, but I can't see where they can afford another Mariupol-type slog there. Then again, everything about the Russian invasion has been a slog...even on its "good" days. A blitzkrieg this has not been.

Also, it's being reported that our government will NOT give Ukraine the long-range MLRS that Russia warned against, as posted above, but might send the Ukies a shorter-range version of the weapon system.

Meanwhile, I read another good piece by William Arkin at Newsweek. His analysis has been pretty much objective, and he appears to have good contacts at the Pentagon. Here he reports on the failure of Russia's air war, such as its been, against Ukraine:

 

Jerry

Well-Known Member
May 29, 2001
4,874
10,317
1
Wait, wut?! Where did I state that you "hate gays?!" I don't think that. Rather, my guess is that your sentiment is similar to that of a lot of evangelicals (including some who are related to me), whose attitude is summed up by the phrase "Hate the sin, love the sinner." My only issue with that statement is that I don't believe they really love the sinner.

Lemme be clear. Being gay was not my choice, and I am glad to report that it is not the choice of any of my three sons. I say that for effect, because I do not believe homosexuality is a choice. I think people either are or are not born with that trait. I know far too many gay people whose siblings are straight, or straight people who have a gay sibling. Nurture does not have a part to play in it, IMHO. People who are gay have enough difficulties of their own without having to deal with judgement, hatred, and discrimination from others. If their defense mechanism is to have "pride" regarding who they are, how difficult is it to simply say "Good for you" and move on with your own business? You do not have to agree with their orientation, lifestyle, or political viewpoint.

As for the last paragraph of your post above, I fully agree with it. I may have other issues with your philosophy, but they will not revolve around the Rapture.

You're kidding, right? I mean your above question "where did I state that you hate gays."

How about five days ago in the monkeypox thread. Your quote: It's sad that we have to call Jerry out for his hatred of LGBTQ folks.

So I take it you're retracting that claim. Thank you.

Look, Laf, I've had this conversation before, in detail, with you and others here, making clear that my only emotion toward "LGBTQ folks" is compassion.

I can't say "good for you" to them because I don't believe it is "good for them." But more and more our culture and government are demanding that I say this...and punishing or censoring those of us who decline. It's nothing less than an attack on religious liberty, and it's being led by your Party.

At the end of the day, this is not complicated: I hold to the traditional Christian teaching, still on the books in the Catholic Church, that our sexuality is a gift from God and should be in harmony with the natural order that He ordained...oriented toward the Good, toward Life, toward God. This is the Ideal. We all fall short of it at times, but the answer is not to overturn the Ideal.

At any rate, it's not "LGBTQ folks" being targeted these days but rather a relatively small minority still holding to the age-old Judeo-Christian moral code. This is because your Party and the Powers ruling the land equate that code to "hatred." That's a vicious lie.
 
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ram2020

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You're kidding, right? I mean your above question "where did I state that you hate gays."

How about five days ago in the monkeypox thread. Your quote: It's sad that we have to call Jerry out for his hatred of LGBTQ folks.

So I take it you're retracting that claim. Thank you.

Look, Laf, I've had this conversation before, in detail, with you and others here, making clear that my only emotion toward "LGBTQ folks" is compassion.

I can't say "good for you" to them because I don't believe it is "good for them." But more and more our culture and government are demanding that I say this...and punishing or censoring those of us who decline. It's nothing less than an attack on religious liberty, and it's being led by your Party.

At the end of the day, this is not complicated: I hold to the traditional Christian teaching, still on the books in the Catholic Church, that our sexuality is a gift from God and should be in harmony with the natural order that He ordained...oriented toward the Good, toward Life, toward God. This is the Ideal. We all fall short of it at times, but the answer is not to overturn the Ideal.

At any rate, it's not "LGBTQ folks" being targeted these days but rather a relatively small minority still holding to the age-old Judeo-Christian moral code. This is because your Party and the Powers ruling the land equate that code to "hatred." That's a vicious lie.
Unbridled and public support, total affirmation of all life choices........or, you are a hateful racist bigot. That is the game now and it is pernicious, it will divide us to ruin.
 
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NJPSU

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May 29, 2001
44,101
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.

At the end of the day, this is not complicated: I hold to the traditional Christian teaching, still on the books in the Catholic Church, that our sexuality is a gift from God and should be in harmony with the natural order that He ordained...oriented toward the Good, toward Life, toward God. This is the Ideal. We all fall short of it at times, but the answer is not to overturn the Ideal.
If you believe sexuality is a gift from God then you believe:

1. God made gay people gay.

or

2. Being gay is a choice
 
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