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A parchment copy of Declaration of Independence found in England

Tom McAndrew

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May 29, 2001
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two Harvard researchers, that were conducting research for other purposes, have found and verified a parchment copy of the Declaration of Independence, in the records office in Chichester, England.

It appears to be a copy of the Declaration that was made around 1780. Excluding the original, which resides at the National Archives, all copies of the Declaration from the 1770s and 1780s were published on broadsides, books, newspapers, and manuscripts. (I'm excluding from this the two copies on parchment made by the anastatic process, which is believed to have caused the fading on the original Declaration.) This parchment copy reportedly is in better condition than is the original Declaration.

You can read more about the discovery at THIS LINK.

It's been a big topic of discussion in Rev War circles today.
 
I wonder how it ended up in England... if the copy was made in 1780, the revolutionary war was still going on. Since it wasn't an original copy, it wasn't like the new American government would have sent this copy to England as a way to let them know their full intentions.
 
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Too funny.

I know that the Harrison's show is more BS than not but it's compelling TV. I watched a lot of that before I gave up reality TV this past New Years.

It's amazing when you read about all the TV shows. I was reading how even Survivor is put together and that it's not close to what is shown.
 
It's amazing when you read about all the TV shows. I was reading how even Survivor is put together and that it's not close to what is shown.

Have you/anybody seen 'Naked and Afraid'? I'd like to think that's pretty authentic. There's no reward/contest and a few have come back with some scary stuff.
 
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Have you/anybody seen 'Naked and Afraid'? I'd like to think that's pretty authentic. There's no reward/contest and a few have come back with some scary stuff.

I've seen it advertised but never saw it. The other one I watched once or twice was where people get put in a life raft with nothing and have to make it to land. That seemed pretty intense.
 
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two Harvard researchers, that were conducting research for other purposes, have found and verified a parchment copy of the Declaration of Independence, in the records office in Chichester, England....

You can read more about the discovery at THIS LINK.

It's been a big topic of discussion in Rev War circles today.

Thanks, Tom, and interesting development.

Can't help noticing that you apparently travel in Rev. War circles and Attractive Female Celebrity circles. What versatility. ;)
 
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I wonder how it ended up in England... if the copy was made in 1780, the revolutionary war was still going on. Since it wasn't an original copy, it wasn't like the new American government would have sent this copy to England as a way to let them know their full intentions.

In time, historians will likely figure out the answer to your question. The article I linked does offer a pretty good indication of who owned the document, which would also answer why it was in in England.
 
Thanks, Tom, and interesting development.

Can't help noticing that you apparently travel in Rev. War circles and Attractive Female Celebrity circles. What versatility. ;)

Why can't Tom ever combine the two?
 
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I wonder how it ended up in England... if the copy was made in 1780, the revolutionary war was still going on. Since it wasn't an original copy, it wasn't like the new American government would have sent this copy to England as a way to let them know their full intentions.

I think we can safely conclude it means the revolution was faked. First we find out man didn't walk on the Moon, then that 9/11 didn't really happen and now that the US never declared independence from Britain.
 
Rick from the Pawn Shop will offer 2 grand saying he's going to spend a lot to frame it. Frank Fritz would bundle it with a toy dog or something.
Brilliant!
1Ze80_s-200x150.gif
 
Have you/anybody seen 'Naked and Afraid'? I'd like to think that's pretty authentic. There's no reward/contest and a few have come back with some scary stuff.
It's only a matter of time before human sacrifice becomes the subject of one of these shows.
 
In time, historians will likely figure out the answer to your question. The article I linked does offer a pretty good indication of who owned the document, which would also answer why it was in in England.

Yes, from the article it may have been the property of Charles Lennox, the 3rd Duke of Richmond. I found him to be just as interesting as the discovery of the document. He apparently was a very progressive Brit who was not only in favor of American independence but also supported home rule in Ireland and manhood suffrage. Radical indeed.
 
It seems to me that if you are going to declare independence from the mother country you should let them know in writing! Maybe we sent an original to King George just to make it official.

Just guessing.
 
two Harvard researchers, that were conducting research for other purposes, have found and verified a parchment copy of the Declaration of Independence, in the records office in Chichester, England.

It appears to be a copy of the Declaration that was made around 1780. Excluding the original, which resides at the National Archives, all copies of the Declaration from the 1770s and 1780s were published on broadsides, books, newspapers, and manuscripts. (I'm excluding from this the two copies on parchment made by the anastatic process, which is believed to have caused the fading on the original Declaration.) This parchment copy reportedly is in better condition than is the original Declaration.

You can read more about the discovery at THIS LINK.

It's been a big topic of discussion in Rev War circles today.
I don't know where/when I learned this, but since we have a signer in the family (signed as "Step Hopkins") I thought I would add what these Harvardians seem not to know: The original documents were NOT signed in state order. The Congress traveled back and forth to their Colonies and homes all throughout the Congress and were not all there at the same time. The signing did not take place all on one day, either.

This tends to confirm the authenticity of the document. Tres interessant!
 
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It seems to me that if you are going to declare independence from the mother country you should let them know in writing! Maybe we sent an original to King George just to make it official.

Just guessing.

You send a former assistant with a note late at night, say 11 p.m.
 
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Didn't they find a real one taped to the back of a picture frame on Storage Wars? I believe they also found one in a suitcase on Airport Auctions.;)
 
They found one in a picture that someone bought at an antique mall in Adamstown not far up the road from me. He liked the frame. I forget what they said it was worth. Something like $2mil.
 
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I don't know where/when I learned this, but since we have a signer in the family (signed as "Step Hopkins") I thought I would add what these Harvardians seem not to know: The original documents were NOT signed in state order. The Congress traveled back and forth to their Colonies and homes all throughout the Congress and were not all there at the same time. The signing did not take place all on one day, either.

you're mostly correct, but I don't think you're addressing the point that the Harvard researchers were making.

On the original Declaration of Independence, the signers added their names in six columns. For the most part, they were grouped by the Colonies that they represented in the Second Continental Congress. Column 1 has the 3 signers from Georgia. Column 2 starts with the 3 signers from North Carolina. Lower in the same column are the 4 signatures from the South Carolina representatives. If we go over to the 6th column, about half-way down are the 2 signatures from the Rhode Island representatives, including your ancestor.

On the parchment copy that was recently found and authenticated by the Harvard researchers, the signatures are not in columns. They are written in 6 rows, at the bottom of the copy. I can't make out all of the signatures on the copy to determine if the signatures are grouped for each of the colonies, but it appears that the signatures of the New Jersey representatives are on the same row.

As for the signing of the original Declaration, it did, for the most part, take place on one day -- August 2, 1776. The draft copy, which the Second Continental Congress adopted on July 4, 1776, was signed by John Hancock, the President of the Congress, and Charles Thompson, the secretary of the Congress (though not a representative of his state, Pennsylvania). On July 19, 1776, Congress decided a more formal version of the document was needed. Timothy Matlack, who was Secretary Thompson's assistant, took 2 weeks to pen on parchment what we now call the original Declaration of Independence. Elbridge Gerry, Oliver Wolcott, Lewis Morris, Thomas McKean, and Matthew Thornton were not in attendance at Congress on August 2nd, so they added their signatures at later dates. Two representatives, John Dickinson and Robert Livingston, never signed the Declaration.

It seems to me that if you are going to declare independence from the mother country you should let them know in writing! Maybe we sent an original to King George just to make it official.

The 1st part of your post is accurate, and is in fact what the Declaration of Independence is. The 2nd part of your post is incorrect.

The reason the draft was signed on July 4th by President Hancock and Secretary Thompson was so that it could be rushed to printers, so that the information could be widely disseminated. The broadside versions were sent to each colony, and published in newspapers throughout the colonies.

If you read the Declaration, you'll find that beyond "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness." and a few other sentences, pretty much the entire Declaration lays out the case against King George III, and explains why the colonies are declaring independence from Great Britain.

Reports about the Declaration of Independence, and the text of it, reached London by boat on August 10, 1776. The Second Continental Congress did not send an official version of the document to the King to inform him of what they had adopted.
 
you're mostly correct, but I don't think you're addressing the point that the Harvard researchers were making.

On the original Declaration of Independence, the signers added their names in six columns. For the most part, they were grouped by the Colonies that they represented in the Second Continental Congress. Column 1 has the 3 signers from Georgia. Column 2 starts with the 3 signers from North Carolina. Lower in the same column are the 4 signatures from the South Carolina representatives. If we go over to the 6th column, about half-way down are the 2 signatures from the Rhode Island representatives, including your ancestor.

On the parchment copy that was recently found and authenticated by the Harvard researchers, the signatures are not in columns. They are written in 6 rows, at the bottom of the copy. I can't make out all of the signatures on the copy to determine if the signatures are grouped for each of the colonies, but it appears that the signatures of the New Jersey representatives are on the same row.

As for the signing of the original Declaration, it did, for the most part, take place on one day -- August 2, 1776. The draft copy, which the Second Continental Congress adopted on July 4, 1776, was signed by John Hancock, the President of the Congress, and Charles Thompson, the secretary of the Congress (though not a representative of his state, Pennsylvania). On July 19, 1776, Congress decided a more formal version of the document was needed. Timothy Matlack, who was Secretary Thompson's assistant, took 2 weeks to pen on parchment what we now call the original Declaration of Independence. Elbridge Gerry, Oliver Wolcott, Lewis Morris, Thomas McKean, and Matthew Thornton were not in attendance at Congress on August 2nd, so they added their signatures at later dates. Two representatives, John Dickinson and Robert Livingston, never signed the Declaration.



The 1st part of your post is accurate, and is in fact what the Declaration of Independence is. The 2nd part of your post is incorrect.

The reason the draft was signed on July 4th by President Hancock and Secretary Thompson was so that it could be rushed to printers, so that the information could be widely disseminated. The broadside versions were sent to each colony, and published in newspapers throughout the colonies.

If you read the Declaration, you'll find that beyond "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness." and a few other sentences, pretty much the entire Declaration lays out the case against King George III, and explains why the colonies are declaring independence from Great Britain.

Reports about the Declaration of Independence, and the text of it, reached London by boat on August 10, 1776. The Second Continental Congress did not send an official version of the document to the King to inform him of what they had adopted.

Thank you for the correction and additional information. I certainly don't have the depth of knowledge on this as you. A very interesting topic.
 
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