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Adam Breneman chimes in

I guess it depends on how we see an OC. If the new hire brings a system that we're not staffed for then we wait the two or three years while he recruits people to fit his system. On the other hand if an OC is an offensive coach he adjusts his plays - not necessarily his philosophy - to fit the players that he has,

You can go online and buy or steal offensive plays that fit both prebula and allar. The key is then to put them in a position to use their skills in offensive plays that work with those skills. I might be wrong, but I doubt if MY came to PSU with a playbook that included that last two point conversion. He could have just looked up "dumbass two point conversion plays for your 8th grade team" and gotten it from there.

We need someone who understands offensive football and can coach kids how to execute. Remember, he has subordinate position coaches to teach running routes, blocking etc


I turned around failing distribution operations. I did not replace anyone
1. I assessed the team members.
2. I assessed what they did.
3. We found better things to do and better ways to do them
4. We taught everyone how do do their job better.
5. I managed by walking around, assessing, encouraging, and coaching.
6. I involved each team member and the team in the first 4.
Coaching is the same. You adapt what you teach to the skills of the team. You find plays that Dante Cephus knows by spending time with him. You never give a team or team members too much. KISS. Joe Paterno was good at this.

Nobody cares how much you know. They will always know how much you care.
 
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Coach BOB did a great job of instilling confidence and swagger. His OL helped a not so fast or quick Zwinak run for a lot of yards. His kids played mean.
Zwinak did that before the apparent rule change that makes it illegal to run the ball with the quarterback taking the snap from under center. Man, it was easier to run the ball in those days!
 
Bill O’Brien would be a better fit! Belichick may be leaving NE, so Bill may be available.

Looking back is always dangerous and complicated. Maybe Moorhead would be interested, but his offense is not new anymore, and I don’t see Allar benefitting. Just kidding on Bill, I think…
Looking back is always dangerous so you suggest O’Brien?
 
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His points are valid, but for those who are romanticizing the Moorhead era please keep in mind:

1) His team averaged 36 PPG. Current team averages 35 PPG
2) He had Saquon Barkley (no offense to our current RBs who I love but they are not Saquon)
3) In 2016, they only scored 10 points against Michigan and 14 points against OSU (other TD coming on special teams).

I'm not sure he's the answer.
I agree with your overall sentiment. I don’t know if JoMo is the answer. Second acts often don’t work in football, and I believe there could very well be somebody younger who can do a better job.

However, I’m going to disagree with some of your points.

1) Your averages are correct for JoMo’s 2016 team and this year’s team. But 2016 was Moorhead’s first year. This is Yurcich’s third year. JoMo’s 2017 PPG were a tad higher than 2016.

But averages are deceiving because they can be skewed. This year’s team dropped 63 on an FCS school (Delaware) and 63 on arguably the worst FBS program (UMASS). Moorhead didn’t face an FCS school or an FBS school as bad as UMASS. Add that to the B1G being abysmal top to bottom and it really skews this year’s numbers.

2) I see the argument being made that JoMo had Barkley as if that’s a strike against him. Yes, he had Barkley, who is better than either running back this year. Moorhead also had more talent at receiver.

The question should be “how did he use Barkley?” Moorhead schemed really well to get Barkley his touches. He was ultra creative in that way because he realized PSU’s OLine wouldn’t be able to line up and run at people.

Compare that to this year. Has PSU done anything creative to accentuate their strengths offensively? I can’t think of many.

There are many, and I’m not accusing you of being in this camp, who seem to think because PSU didn’t line up under center, with a fullback, and hand it to Barkley 25 times a game from the I formation that he was somehow misused. That wouldn’t have worked with that OLine. It also wouldn’t have properly utilized some of the other talent on the team.

All that being said, Barkley was a running back. Offenses run through the qb, and JoMo had McSorley, who has nowhere near the potential of Allar. Please don’t misunderstand, Trace McSorley is one of my favorite Penn Staters ever. He was a 3 star recruit that more than maximized his potential, but he was limited. The optimism for this year was in Allar’s potential, something PSU hasn’t had in a qb in a few years. That potential was nowhere near realized and why PSU is now looking for their 6th OC in 10 years.

3) Moorhead’s offense scored 17 on OSU in 2016. I’m not sure why you didn’t count the fg. If we aren’t counting field goals then the PPG in point 1 are off. And if we aren’t counting field goals then I don’t know why we would count extra points. I digress.

I’m not sure if you realize, but JoMo was the OC in 2017 as well. His offense scored 41 on Michigan and 31 on OSU that year. His average over two years (4 games) against OSU and Michigan was just about 25 and trending up.

Plenty of criticisms of JoMo’s offense. At points it seemed to score too quickly and didn’t manage the overall game well. The offense was often times, especially in 2016, MIA in the first half and required offensive explosions in the second half to win. PSU seemed to lack a short yardage package. Franklin and JoMo almost seemed stubborn and out to prove a point by not having one.
 
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Franklin and Moorehead lost three games in 2016 with Barkley, Gesicki, Hamilton, Goodwin and McSorley and a couple of offensive linemen that started in the NFL (Bates,Mcgovern) what do think they will do with set of offensive weapons they have now?
2016 was the beginning of Moorhead putting that offense together. Those players were young and didn’t “come alive” in Mooreheads system until after the UM game. Context is always appreciated in posts but seldom used.
 
BlackShoeDiaries has a nice write-up on Joe Brady who is QBs coach with the Buffalo Bills and former grad assistant with PSU in '15 and '16. He was also WR coach and passing game coordinator wth LSU natty with Joe Burrow.

A long shot but what is intriguing is that he works with pocket passers like Burrow and Buffalos Josh Allen. Allen often being the NFL QB most commonly used as an Allar comparison (now that Hackenberg is no longer in the league! ). After last nights debacle, and the idea that Buffalo will probably not even make the playoffs, he may be looking for a new home.
 
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BlackShoeDiaries has a nice write-up on Joe Brady who is QBs coach with the Buffalo Bills and former grad assistant with PSU in '15 and '16. He was also WR coach and passing game coordinator wth LSU natty with Joe Burrow.

A long shot but what is intriguing is that he works with pocket passers like Borrow and Buffalos Josh Allen. Allen often being the NFL QB most commonly used as an Allar comparison (now that Hackenberg is no longer in the league! ).
I'm just concerned that Franklin isn't necessarily keen on a full fledged pocket passer in "his" offense. He always talked about having a mobile QB as an extra running threat to keep defenses off balance... I guess you have to adapt an offense to the players you do have.

I love Allar and it would be great if we could run a more Pro style offense, but I'll take anything that produces at this point.
 
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I'm just concerned that Franklin isn't necessarily keen on a full fledged pocket passer in "his" offense. He always talked about having a mobile QB as an extra running threat to keep defenses off balance... I guess you have to adapt an offense to the players you do have.

I love Allar and it would be great if we could run a more Pro style offense, but I'll take anything that produces at this point.
yep. But Allar isn't a surprise. This is what CJF recruited. Allar can run, he did so on Saturday effectively. But he isn't going to be counted on for that.
 
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yep. But Allar isn't a surprise. This is what CJF recruited. Allar can run, he did so on Saturday effectively. But he isn't going to be counted on for that.
I didn't mean to make it sound like he is a statue. But yeah you're right, you wouldn't want to count on him taking over a game with his feet. He can and hopefully will be taking over games with his arm in the near future.
 
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I am full of responding to you this afternoon!!

Do you think Cephus and McClain are products of the scheme or why haven't they made a difference at all? Hell, Cephus barley knows where to line up. I wonder if MY tried to be too smart and ended up confusing his players.

I saw no rub routes for Saunders or Clifford.

The crazy thing was he used his TE's really well and coming in that wasn't a strength of his.
Cephus still looks lost. McClain had one good game, then dropped a couple of balls and got benched. Getting some run now but hasn't been the same. Maybe Drew lost confidence in him?

They ran some nice rub routes against Maryland. Not sure what happened to that this past week.

I have a two (very generalized) theories about the modern OC (again, doesn't apply to everyone):

1) They would much rather call passing plays because running plays aren't "sexy" (i.e. it's tougher to show "what a genius you are" on a stretch zone).

2) Related, they like to show off their various passing plays. Rather than finding 10 plays that work, they keep calling new and different stuff. By week 3, you should know a dozen or so plays that your team runs really well and those should be >50% of your offense.

I think QB trust in the WRs is maybe not talked about enough. If you just trust your guy to "go get it" (see: Godwin, Hamilton, Dotson, maybe Washington), you feel better as a QB about throwing it into a less than perfect window. I think Allar feels that with the TEs but not the WR. That lack of confidence (deserved or not) hurts the WR production.
 
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Really comes down to being a head coach Vs wanting a ton more money for guys like him.

He took a huge paycut (and is still making more than 99.9% of people) to take the job. He’d take a similar raise coming back.

But we’d be lucky to get him. If he’s looking to be a P5 OC again, he’d have no shortage of suitors.
I think the former head coach at Duke (whose name presently escapes me) would be a good choice especially since he has been something of a QB guru.
 
I'm just concerned that Franklin isn't necessarily keen on a full fledged pocket passer in "his" offense. He always talked about having a mobile QB as an extra running threat to keep defenses off balance... I guess you have to adapt an offense to the players you do have.

I love Allar and it would be great if we could run a more Pro style offense, but I'll take anything that produces at this point.
Then why in the heck is he recruiting them? Grunkenmeyer looks like a pocket passer as well, he should only recruit dual threat Qb's then if that is the case.
 
Then why in the heck is he recruiting them? Grunkenmeyer looks like a pocket passer as well, he should only recruit dual threat Qb's then if that is the case.
I have the same question. It makes me think that this was mostly Yurich? Can't think of any other reason. If that is the case, it may not be good. We may never know for sure.
 
BlackShoeDiaries has a nice write-up on Joe Brady who is QBs coach with the Buffalo Bills and former grad assistant with PSU in '15 and '16. He was also WR coach and passing game coordinator wth LSU natty with Joe Burrow.

A long shot but what is intriguing is that he works with pocket passers like Burrow and Buffalos Josh Allen. Allen often being the NFL QB most commonly used as an Allar comparison (now that Hackenberg is no longer in the league! ). After last nights debacle, and the idea that Buffalo will probably not even make the playoffs, he may be looking for a new home.
Joe Burrow had two phenoms at WR.

Drew is nowhere near as fast a runner as Josh Allen.
 
Joe Burrow had two phenoms at WR.

Drew is nowhere near as fast a runner as Josh Allen.
Agreed on the WRs but the QB has done ok there and after. Drew Allar will get faster. He's only 19 and still struggling with a growing body.
 
Looking back is always dangerous so you suggest O’Brien?
I try to comment with a little humor while making my point. O’Brien would be better than Morehead for a drop back qb like Allar, but I don’t think either is realistic or advisable. I just hope the eventual choice works.
 
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His points are valid, but for those who are romanticizing the Moorhead era please keep in mind:

1) His team averaged 36 PPG. Current team averages 35 PPG
2) He had Saquon Barkley (no offense to our current RBs who I love but they are not Saquon)
3) In 2016, they only scored 10 points against Michigan and 14 points against OSU (other TD coming on special teams).

I'm not sure he's the answer.
We scored 42 against Michigan in 2017 and 38 against Ohio State (ok 31, maybe? - I remember that Saquon housed the opening kickoff).
 
Then why in the heck is he recruiting them? Grunkenmeyer looks like a pocket passer as well, he should only recruit dual threat Qb's then if that is the case.
If you're going to recruit true dropback passers who can't run that well, then you have to compliment them by also recruiting top, and I mean top, wide receivers. Otherwise, it just won't work.
 
What has been frustrating with our offense is that it seems to have lacked progression in our big games. For example, we threw the 5 yard out to KLS early in both games vs OSU and Michigan. Both times, the corners were camped and waiting on it. Why did we not run and out and up with the next closest receiver running a seam or in breaking route to cloud any safety help? Then you at least make the corners think twice about jumping the out.

What happened to the Pistol? What happened to under center? Allar seemed to have better footwork out of those and they give our RBs better running options.
 
What has been frustrating with our offense is that it seems to have lacked progression in our big games. For example, we threw the 5 yard out to KLS early in both games vs OSU and Michigan. Both times, the corners were camped and waiting on it. Why did we not run and out and up with the next closest receiver running a seam or in breaking route to cloud any safety help? Then you at least make the corners think twice about jumping the out.

What happened to the Pistol? What happened to under center? Allar seemed to have better footwork out of those and they give our RBs better running options.
Your guess is as good as mine. A kid using madden plays could have called a better couple of games against OSU and Michigan... this is a HUGE decision for Franklin to say the least.
 
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What has been frustrating with our offense is that it seems to have lacked progression in our big games. For example, we threw the 5 yard out to KLS early in both games vs OSU and Michigan. Both times, the corners were camped and waiting on it. Why did we not run and out and up with the next closest receiver running a seam or in breaking route to cloud any safety help? Then you at least make the corners think twice about jumping the out.

What happened to the Pistol? What happened to under center? Allar seemed to have better footwork out of those and they give our RBs better running options.
the creativity from 2022 is simply gone in 2023. Why? It has to be one of two things: MY doesn't trust the guys in the game.
 
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the creativity from 2022 is simply gone in 2023. Why? It has to be one of two things: MY doesn't trust the guys in the game.

Like our Power T. We didn't have an eligible jersey to put on Shelton and put him at TE for the goal line package? We don't have a Belly play to Allen that looks like the Sweep to Singleton?

These adjustments aren't hard. We just watched Michigan make them.
 
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Like our Power T. We didn't have an eligible jersey to put on Shelton and put him at TE for the goal line package? We don't have a Belly play to Allen that looks like the Sweep to Singleton?

These adjustments aren't hard. We just watched Michigan make them.
I recall the days of USC's heyday running game. it was a simple plan; let each OL go man on man, pitch it back to the RB seven yards deep, and let him pick a hole. The OL simply pushed the DL/LB whichever way he wanted to go. There had to be a gap someplace and there typically was. The zone/read has dominated college football for several years and defenses have adjusted just like they did to the spread, vear, and I formation. with the fast flowing defenses we now see it may be too slow but it isn't any slower than the zone-read. It is easy to throw from because it is a one-back set. And, it is good in short yardage because the back has a head of steam and picks his hole.
 
no. Ive not seen JoeMo successful with a pocket QB. I am not sure where AB gets this from. I think he liked JoeMo and he's a good OC but he isn't ideal for what we have today.
Moorhead knows how to create mismatches on O, the main job of an OC. Hes smart enough to make it work. Will probably mix in Pribula more.
 
We scored 42 against Michigan in 2017 and 38 against Ohio State (ok 31, maybe? - I remember that Saquon housed the opening kickoff).
Do you think Michigan's current defense is comparable to their defense in 2017?
 
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Agreed on the WRs but the QB has done ok there and after. Drew Allar will get faster. He's only 19 and still struggling with a growing body.
Oh for Christ sake can we stop with the "19 years old" crap? Next year he will be 20, do we still get to use the "he's only 20" excuse?

Personally I want him to redshirt and then we can go with the "he's only 22 years old" excuse.
 
I think the former head coach at Duke (whose name presently escapes me) would be a good choice especially since he has been something of a QB guru.
Cutcliffe? I think the team can do a lot worse.

I really have a LOW bar to clear for this hire. As in, it won't take a whole lot to feel like it was a good hire.

I think the next OC is presently on staff, and I think it's Seider if he wants the job. (This is obviously no insider info, just feels like it makes sense if we're putting the puzzle together). But I could be wrong, certainly have been plenty times.
 
Moorhead knows how to create mismatches on O, the main job of an OC. Hes smart enough to make it work. Will probably mix in Pribula more.
Who is this "Pribula" fellow? The only QB I ever seen is that big kid who gets nervous and craps the bed against Ohio State and Michigan
 
This WR room talent wise, is the worst in Penn State Football history. Not a single difference maker.

This is 100% the fault of coach Franklin whose strength is supposedly recruiting.
Visions of Kinta Palmer and company come to mind...........................................
 
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Franklin and Moorehead lost three games in 2016 with Barkley, Gesicki, Hamilton, Goodwin and McSorley and a couple of offensive linemen that started in the NFL (Bates,Mcgovern) what do think they will do with set of offensive weapons they have now?
True about Context. So then the 3rd game was the last game, the bowl game in what would become a hallmark of Franklin…..giving up leads to lose.
 
Franklin and Moorehead lost three games in 2016 with Barkley, Gesicki, Hamilton, Goodwin and McSorley and a couple of offensive linemen that started in the NFL (Bates,Mcgovern) what do think they will do with set of offensive weapons they have now?
With the right OC anything is possible. I’m not a speculator so I couldn’t offer any speculative ideas. You do realize that was Mooreheads first year with those players and his playbook, right? It was PSU’s 3rd HC in 4 years and 4th OC in 4 years. There was a lot of turbulence to iron out at that point in time. It takes a little time to adapt and grow within a new system. The mere fact there were only 3 losses that year is a good thing. It was projected to be much different than that.
 
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