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Takedown Wrestling slams Cael "should wrestling pander to Cael?"

IMO, this is what happens when you are successful. One can call Cael (or Brands) selfish but they have the largest fan bases and recent success...why kowtow to the NWCA unless it favors them? Sounds like somebody just wants to wet their beak.

Agree 100% with this assessment. Sanderson and Brands are paid by their respective universities to do what is best for THEIR programs first. Both of these guys do some things which may not be in their own self-interest to help expand the reach of wrestling in general. Our west coast trip this year, Utah Valley a couple of years ago are just examples. Now the NWCA, not sure there is a lot of love in either camp for them.
 
I don't care what Mr. Casbar, or anyone else says, frankly, including JRob. It's not worth a rise of even one point in my blood pressure...so my advice is just roll with it. I do listen, and search for nuggets of valuable info among the rhetoric. I also think the Casbar/Robinson comments became an anti-PSU feeding frenzy, but that won't affect Cael's thoughts one iota.

Here's something FDR said once upon a time. Cael has a vision, and he won't sway.


"It is not the critic who counts: not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself for a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat."

-- Teddy Roosevelt
 
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I don't care what Mr. Casbar, or anyone else says, frankly, including JRob. It's not worth a rise of even one point in my blood pressure...so my advice is just roll with it. I do listen, and search for nuggets of valuable info among the rhetoric. I also think the Casbar/Robinson comments became an anti-PSU feeding frenzy, but that won't affect Cael's thoughts one iota.

Here's something FDR said once upon a time. Cael has a vision, and he won't sway.


"It is not the critic who counts: not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself for a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat."

-- F. D. Roosevelt

Actually, it was the other Roosevelt Pres....Teddy. Often called the "Man in the Arena Speech" (although the real title Teddy Roosevelt gave it was "Citizenship in a Republic"). Was delivered at Sorbonne in Paris, France, I believe in 1910. The "Man in the Arena" portion was but one excerpt, albeit the most famous, from a much longer speech.
 
I don't care what Mr. Casbar, or anyone else says, frankly, including JRob. It's not worth a rise of even one point in my blood pressure...so my advice is just roll with it. I do listen, and search for nuggets of valuable info among the rhetoric. I also think the Casbar/Robinson comments became an anti-PSU feeding frenzy, but that won't affect Cael's thoughts one iota.

Here's something FDR said once upon a time. Cael has a vision, and he won't sway.


"It is not the critic who counts: not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself for a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat."

-- F. D. Roosevelt

I thought that was Teddy? Point taken none the less.
 
Yeah, Teddy. Doesn't change my intent.

Here's another...who said it (or something very close)...

"Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocre minds”
 
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Yeah, Teddy. Doesn't change my intent.

Here's another...who said it (or something very close)...

"Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocre minds”

Got me stumped on that one Roar, if I had to guess I would say Einstein??
 
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I apologize for not having the link available on TakedownWrestle.com, but for any wanting to go back and listen I will post the link below and you can fast forward to the 32 minute mark which is when J Rob joined Tom Ryan on the show.


I would appreciate the link, because I am shocked. I have always felt that Casber is the classiest wrestling talk show host out there (apologies to Seton et al). He always was dignified and fair. I am stunned. Please provide the link. Thanks. @HawkTalk3
 
jammenz, I was feeling sorry for you for the state of the Gopher program, but now you have gone to just flat out posting LIES, which makes you someone no longer worth wasting sympathy on, or for that matter wasting anything so you go where I should have put you a long time ago, on ignore. I suggest all PSU posters do the same. Then jammenz can do what he does best, post and responds to his own posts himself, while the rest of life on in bliss at not haven't to know he exists.

I expect a certain amount of homerism form outside fans. I am OK with it. But, when I feel that the flames/homerism exceed an acceptable level, it's not worth the aggravation. I am putting him on ignore too.
 
I would appreciate the link, because I am shocked. I have always felt that Casber is the classiest wrestling talk show host out there (apologies to Seton et al). He always was dignified and fair. I am stunned. Please provide the link. Thanks. @HawkTalk3

When did I become a wrestling talk show host? I mean, I only have the perfect voice for a silent movie!

In all seriousness, no apologies needed. There have been times I have occasionally gone off the rails, and I'll happily acknowledge that. I've just never had my own show/podcast/etc., and if I did, I'm fairly certain nobody would listen.
 
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I would appreciate the link, because I am shocked. I have always felt that Casber is the classiest wrestling talk show host out there (apologies to Seton et al). He always was dignified and fair. I am stunned. Please provide the link. Thanks. @HawkTalk3

Here is the show link. If you go to it I have all the guests broken out by time. The commercial breaks were included with this podcast on accident, so you will have to actually fast-forward between guest unlink normal.

http://takedownwrestle.com/radio/dresser-ryan-robinson-popolizio-smith-bentley-on-takedown-radio/
 
When did I become a wrestling talk show host? I mean, I only have the perfect voice for a silent movie!

In all seriousness, no apologies needed. There have been times I have occasionally gone off the rails, and I'll happily acknowledge that. I've just never had my own show/podcast/etc., and if I did, I'm fairly certain nobody would listen.
I have a name for your podcast:

"The Pirate's Booty"

Then again, you might attract an unintended audience. Back to the drawing board I go
 
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Here is the show link. If you go to it I have all the guests broken out by time. The commercial breaks were included with this podcast on accident, so you will have to actually fast-forward between guest unlink normal.

http://takedownwrestle.com/radio/dresser-ryan-robinson-popolizio-smith-bentley-on-takedown-radio/
Thank you very much for the link.

My take is:

Casber: Was trying to pander to his online guests and flame a little. He came after Cael hard more than once. But, most talk hosts do the same thing to create interest (BWI fans: A David Jones writing approach). Bottom line is that his stock went down a little with me.

Ryan: His stock went up a lot with me. He supported Cael when he could have easily went with the negative narrative Casber was fishing for.

JRob: His stock hasn't changed with me. he's a self serving douche. He was very anti-Cael/PSU. But, if his comment about Cael wanting to keep all the money is accurate (And Ryan didn't dispute it), that doesn't speak well of Cael to me. But, I don't know the back story. It just sounded bad as they all laughed at Cael's "greediness."
 
Thank you very much for the link.

My take is:

Casber: Was trying to pander to his online guests and flame a little. He came after Cael hard more than once. But, most talk hosts do the same thing to create interest (BWI fans: A David Jones writing approach). Bottom line is that his stock went down a little with me.

Ryan: His stock went up a lot with me. He supported Cael when he could have easily went with the negative narrative Casber was fishing for.

JRob: His stock hasn't changed with me. he's a self serving douche. He was very anti-Cael/PSU. But, if his comment about Cael wanting to keep all the money is accurate (And Ryan didn't dispute it), that doesn't speak well of Cael to me. But, I don't know the back story. It just sounded bad as they all laughed at Cael's "greediness."

Cael wanted to keep all of WHAT money. The receipts from a PSU home dual? Wasn't this all setup by NWCA? Sounds like sour grapes from JRob because they have lower attendance than we do and hence less receipts.
 
That may be true, but Scott Casber was very anti-Cael, in this episode. He started the show off calling Cael a prima dona. He said Cael didn't have wrestling's best interest at heart. When Coach Ryan differed, Scott said he'd like to see it. These were Scott's views and not his guests.
There was discussion on sharing revenue. It wasn't clear. JRob seemed to be talking about sharing amongst all the teams involved. Ryan was talking about growing the Duals and then sharing amongst all DI teams, I believe, like football does with bowl money. Casber didn't clear it up, so I don't know. He did react negatively when JRob said Call wanted it all. What did that mean? I don't know. It wasn't cleared up. Did JRob want PSU and Iowa to share their gate with the visiting teams? Was there any travel aid? Did he want some of that money going to Minnesota?
I just got a bad vibe from Casber. Maybe it was my pro PSU bias tainting my view.

I just listened and it was definitely a hatchet job by Casber et al. JRob made a comment about money that "Cael wanted it all" and the hosts took it as fact! They never questioned it and encouraged their listeners to tweet it to the world. In fact Casber later said, "Cael Sanderson stated that he wanted the money." A quote for which he had no credible source!

They certainly didn't let Popolizio's positive comments about this year's format affect their bias.

I came away with a very different impression of Scott Casber than I previously had based on his TV show. As a journalist he fell a long way in my estimation.
 
Cael wanted to keep all of WHAT money. The receipts from a PSU home dual? Wasn't this all setup by NWCA? Sounds like sour grapes from JRob because they have lower attendance than we do and hence less receipts.

Say what
I just listened and it was definitely a hatchet job by Casber et al. JRob made a comment about money that "Cael wanted it all" and the hosts took it as fact! They never questioned it and encouraged their listeners to tweet it to the world. In fact Casber later said, "Cael Sanderson stated that he wanted the money." A quote for which he had no credible source!

They certainly didn't let Popolizio's positive comments about this year's format affect their bias.

I came away with a very different impression of Scott Casber than I previously had based on his TV show. As a journalist he fell a long way in my estimation.

If you listened, then you have to agree that Ryan defended Cael earlier, right? When the comment was made about Cael wanting all of the money, Ryan didn't say a word. So, absent proof/direct quotes, etc, I did lend some validity to the comment.
 
Thank you very much for the link.

JRob: His stock hasn't changed with me. he's a self serving douche. He was very anti-Cael/PSU. But, if his comment about Cael wanting to keep all the money is accurate (And Ryan didn't dispute it), that doesn't speak well of Cael to me. But, I don't know the back story. It just sounded bad as they all laughed at Cael's "greediness."

You assume that Cael is the sole decision maker in regards to revenue sharing. Cael is answerable to the Penn State administration and there is only JRob's accusation. Maybe Ryan didn't dispute it because, as a host school, tOSU didn't share either.
 
Say what


If you listened, then you have to agree that Ryan defended Cael earlier, right? When the comment was made about Cael wanting all of the money, Ryan didn't say a word. So, absent proof/direct quotes, etc, I did lend some validity to the comment.

I don't lend any credit to a random comment made by JRob with NO evidence to back it up whatsoever.
 
I did find that the moderator took ample opportunity to take shots at Cael and PennState. The program could have discussed the opposite view a bit more. If you listened to this and didn't know better you would run off and think that things are screwed up and PennState is a villain. Ryan did a commendable job.
Most of JRob's arguments of using big time sports is directionally correct but not absolute. Football and the like do not have the individual tournament, they only have the bowls. So you are not comparing apples to apples. In effect, it is better than the 68 team NCAA basketball tourney as all teams can compete and when their team slips, individuals can move on. Also, it is a different environment based on the demand and $$ involved. If there were a lot of $$ in wrestling, then the AD would tell the coaches what to do!
Ryan did mention about the NCAA only recognizing one champion. Thus the real debate. Cael thinks that should be the natl tourney not the duals. I agree with that.
Revenue sharing - good idea but even baseball has the minimums - as in all teams should be held accountable for some level of attendance. That also poses the argument on why wouldn't you want the dual at PSU or Iowa every year? They'll bring in the most at the gate compared to other non-big10 teams...
 
I expect a certain amount of homerism form outside fans. I am OK with it. But, when I feel that the flames/homerism exceed an acceptable level, it's not worth the aggravation. I am putting him on ignore too.
Lionlover and Novalion discover that everything I posted was quotes from the podcast.

Your diligent reporter
 
this was the best attended duals concept in years and to acknowledge it a success would do a disservice to the NWCA/JRob narrative. They want the NCAA tournament to change. they want the NWCA to be a bigger piece of the college scene and thus push their agenda. These are my opinions.

People are complaining about the loss of funds but why dont we ever see a balance sheet from the NWCA? Im betting they could save money by not having a cocktail hour and serving fillets from the convention to help out Appalachian state. But what do I know.

Duals matter, the NWCA duals could be a big deal but I applaud Cael and PSU for standing their ground against the noise.
 
9 out of 10 threads you start on this board have something negative about Penn State's team, individual wrestlers or Cael. I guess this is the response to having nothing positive to say about your own team.
Don't feel bad he pulls the same crap on Hawkeyereport.Just a poor little rodent with no where to go.
 
Just think about what they'll be saying next year when PSU is going in with our 5th National Championship under Cael and working on the 6th!
 
I guess I don't have a strong position to defend Scott in this. I listened and he absolutely called Cael out for what is at worst a debatable situation. I have never seen this from Scott in the past, and I will directly ask him what that noise was all about when I talk to him. I can't really blame anybody on here for thinking negative things about Scott Casber after hearing what I heard. I know him to be a great guy and a true wrestling fan. Strange.
 
;)
Goldbanger and Roar forget his name but I'm sure it was a Irishman ;). Maybe look it up and can tell Roar at big tens this week end..
It would be a pleasure to meet a fellow wrestling fan!! Team preference aside, I have met some really incredible "wrestling fans", from EVERY team, over the years.
 
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Wow, I think everyone is being pretty harsh after listening to this. While some of the statements made were clearly more opinion than facts, nothing during this broadcast struck me as being any more egregious than the sports talk radio I listen to every day. Cael declined to be on this broadcast and when you do that, your side of the story is not heard. Not saying he was obligated to be involved but I don't know what you would expect otherwise. I thought both Ryan and JRob stated their positions well even if you don't agree with them.

I thought it was a pretty thought provoking discuss on a very tricky subject. The reality is that as long as the NCAA wrestling tournament crowns the NCAA team champions, this is going to be an on-going issue. Likening the NCAA tournament to an "all-star" event is actually pretty accurate, and I get why some people have the view that the team championship should be decided by a dual tournament. Traditionalists don't want to hear that (I like the NCAA tournament too!) but the question remains whether the current approach is the best way to grow the sport.
 
To me, JRob whining about revenue sharing illustrates how far his once mighty program has fallen. The all time low will come next year when he's begging teams from the ACC or EIWA for NWCA gate receipts. Pathetic.
 
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You don't seem to understand that Minny would also be sharing revenue with the have-nots in the B1G. Revenue sharing is a proven success that leads to better more successful sports.
 
You don't seem to understand that Minny would also be sharing revenue with the have-nots in the B1G. Revenue sharing is a proven success that leads to better more successful sports.

2000>6000 in the great white north interesting. You must be a bernie sanders fan.

To that point, I would venture a guess cael/PSu would be ok with revenue sharing if it went to the bottom tier teams in equal portion. But sharing our revenue with the likes of just the final 16 or in our case Minny/Iowa/OSU/etc makes no sense when these same teams for the most part could care less about the 15-20k travel expense.

Dont let a flawed argument get in the way of a good trash cael thread.
 
You don't seem to understand that Minny would also be sharing revenue with the have-nots in the B1G. Revenue sharing is a proven success that leads to better more successful sports.
What's stopping J Rob from sharing his revenue anyway, if that's what he really wants?
 
To me, JRob whining about revenue sharing illustrates how far his once mighty program has fallen. The all time low will come next year when he's begging teams from the ACC or EIWA for NWCA gate receipts. Pathetic.

So why wasn't J-Rob whining about Iowa keeping all their gate revenue or, better yet, the Goofs themselves keeping 100% of their dual's revenue? I'm confused, why is CS being singled out by "has been" J-Rob.
 
You don't seem to understand that Minny would also be sharing revenue with the have-nots in the B1G. Revenue sharing is a proven success that leads to better more successful sports.

"Have-nots" in the BIG?? Last I heard the fully vested member schools were each pulling down something on the order of $35MM per year off the television contract alone. If there are "have-nots" in this conference, it's self-imposed.
 
I suppose I do not understand the revenue sharing flap. If this tournament is to grow the wrestling sport, how is that different than what Penn State does yearly by going to distant outposts to wrestle out-of-the-normal teams. It seems to me that every time Penn State does this, the host team gets a significant boost in attendance. To the best of my knowledge, Penn State's expenses are not defrayed by the host. Penn State does this to grow the sport just like this tournament.
 
I could care less what others think about Carl or Penn State. No one does more to promote wrestling than Cael. OP get over yourself. To come here once again to spout your crap is embarrassing. Worry about your own team. I don't go on other boards and post inflammatory crap or lies for that matter. Jealousy is really ugly.
 
You don't seem to understand that Minny would also be sharing revenue with the have-nots in the B1G. Revenue sharing is a proven success that leads to better more successful sports.
you need a minimum about of 'revenue' before any revenue sharing plan is feasible. Gate receipts isn't worth the time to calculate... at this time...
 
I thought it was a very interesting show and I give Casber credit for taking a position (although I'm not sure he has all the details of the issues to work with.) I quit listening to him a long time ago when all he did was praised his guests and offered nothing interesting or controversial. Thanks for bringing it here Jammenz. I would like to see a good national duals tournament going forward, and I hope the Sandersons hear this show and respond to their critics.
 
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