Poll: The Future of Penn State Football (If you actually had a say)
- Thread starter Waste Management Consultant
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Let those grumbling start drinking heavily to kill the bug up their a..es!
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anon_xdc8rmuek44eq
Guest
Give Franklin 10 years - if no CFB Playoff appearance we find someone new. How long should he get?
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anon_xdc8rmuek44eq
Guest
I was being rhetorical but my guess is most top tier programs wouldn’t keep a coach that long without at least one playoff appearance. I do not think we’ll see another B1G championship in the next three years either.
While I don't disagree with your approach, I think the administration is locked in on something like the fourth choice on the list. Good, not great is acceptable on the field.
I think PSU is different. A range of 8-4 to 10-2 is acceptable.
Interesting observation. Not sure that all of the excuse-making continues ad-infinitum.
We have never been elite with the likes of Alabama, Clemson and Ohio State's of today. These teams have all finished in the top five in at least 8 of the last ten seasons. We've never done that consistently over a decade.
I've enjoyed being a PSU fan for 60 years. The coach, the players and the results will be just fine. I think things would be more enjoyable if a few "loyal fans" here would take up the sport of Russian Roulette.
I feel that the BOT/people in charge of PSU had a 10 year span after the sanctions where the University as a whole had to improve it's image by running a completely clean football program. Just being competitive is a more than acceptable result during this time period. Making the playoffs would be well beyond their expectations. Franklin fit the mold to be the type of coach to run a clean program and keep us competitive. He brings in good kids and there hasn't been any major problems.
As fans, we want more production on the field because we have short memories of how desperate a situation the University was in only 8 years ago.
As fans, we want more production on the field because we have short memories of how desperate a situation the University was in only 8 years ago.
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anon_xdc8rmuek44eq
Guest
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anon_xdc8rmuek44eq
Guest
I wanted to vote for 1) Bagmen are okay AND 2) Fire Franklin, but could only choose one.
I went with the Bagmen, figuring Franklin will take care of himself
I went with the Bagmen, figuring Franklin will take care of himself
Franklin is in a good spot. I don't see his job in jeopardy unless he consistently finishes in the lower half of the B10 East. So as long as he can win about 8-9 games a year, go to a middling to above average bowl and once every 3-5 years hit the lottery with NY6 birth then he is set with his $6.5 mil a year.
I don't think going to the playoff, winning a natty or even a B10 championship are seriously in his job performance requirements. Or said another way, none of those metrics have a bearing on whether he keeps his job. I lump the B10 championship into that metric group because of the O$U obstacle and I don't believe he will ever be fired for not beating O$U.
I don't think going to the playoff, winning a natty or even a B10 championship are seriously in his job performance requirements. Or said another way, none of those metrics have a bearing on whether he keeps his job. I lump the B10 championship into that metric group because of the O$U obstacle and I don't believe he will ever be fired for not beating O$U.
I would say playing for 4 National Titles from ‘78-‘87 would be considered elite by anyone’s standards.
not 10 years, imo. The huge mistakes in coaching are glaring... he had his shot(s). That said, this is the year of the covid so i'll give him a mulligan. But the on field product is not appealing... then again, the absence of serious players (parsons, cain, etc) is equally glaring... so yeah, one more year is fair. He doesn't get it done in 21, time to fire up the barbie.
imo.
Whether it’s due to Covid related news constant political nonsense or just general malaise - I never thought I would be this “detached“ from witnessing PSU get off to an 0-2 start.
Let me humbly take the privilege to edit your response...
"Good, not great is acceptable on the field..... as long as the program turns out a huge revenue"
IMO, as long as Penn State football is generating $40-50-60 million ... (or whatever the actual number is) in revenue & profits then being "good, not great is acceptable"
That was arguably our stretch of "elitism". Now, one could counter and say from '78-'87 we did definitely play for 4 National Titles, winning 2.... but we also experienced a few down years in that decade as well. Right now, Bama, Clemson & Ohio St are not experiencing any 7 or 8 win "down" years. Their idea of "down" is 10-2 or 11-1, like Bama had last year.
But if you take out your decade, take out '78-'87, the Penn St program was actually more defined as a "cycle". We'd have a great year, an undefeated year, followed up by a down year, then a rebuilding would start, we'd be very good again in year 3, and then great again in year 4. It was never really year after year after year of 10+ win seasons.
There are fans and fan bases that somehow believe that they are entitled to winning virtually every game. Some feel this way only on game day(fueled by alcohol) and others (those that need help) find kinship in places like right here.
Nebraska is one such fanbase. 59-19 was not good enough under Frank Solich. After the Bill Callahan experiment they tolerated 66-28 under Bo Pelini......they deserved better and they've gotten it. Yep, 28-35 since they upgraded their coaching.
While some puff out their meaty chests and point to two NC's in the 80's, some near misses in the 70's and 90's.....all under a different system for qualifying.....the very same "loyal" fans damn Joe for "staying too long..." LOL Joe had the audacity to recover from the unforgivable "dark years" to finish his last 7 years at 66-20....with "only" 3 top ten finishes. Its funny about BWI keyboard warriors...."we" always deserve better.....and its always the coaching. LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL
Nebraska is one such fanbase. 59-19 was not good enough under Frank Solich. After the Bill Callahan experiment they tolerated 66-28 under Bo Pelini......they deserved better and they've gotten it. Yep, 28-35 since they upgraded their coaching.
While some puff out their meaty chests and point to two NC's in the 80's, some near misses in the 70's and 90's.....all under a different system for qualifying.....the very same "loyal" fans damn Joe for "staying too long..." LOL Joe had the audacity to recover from the unforgivable "dark years" to finish his last 7 years at 66-20....with "only" 3 top ten finishes. Its funny about BWI keyboard warriors...."we" always deserve better.....and its always the coaching. LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL
I’m with you. I really just don’t care that much. I got all ready to watch I the game Saturday, put it on, then heard no noise and saw no fans. Then I heard stupid piped in noise. Then after the first two Ohio State drives I turned it off, checking back in periodically. It all just seems ridiculous.
So, would you rather get 10-11 wins every year over the next decade never make CFP OR make the CFP & play for 4National Titles with a clunker or two 7-5/8-4 seasons thrown in?
Fair enough and i would agree.
Raises some interesting questions. By how much would the surplus have to drop for any action to be undertake? After all, no HFC is responsible for the $$bottom line $$ (so much for the CEO analogy). And what does the administration say during interviews for a new guy, charged with elevating the program to elite status,, lays on the table, "Well, if you want to get there we're going to have to change how we do bidness?"
We are trying to compare ourselves to todays elite ... and they have BOTH ... they win 12-13 games every year AND they make the CFP every year.
With Bama, Clemson & Ohio State it is not an either or question.
You raise a good question, and it's something I have actually discussed/debated with friends the last few years. IMO, people tend to have revisionist memories and they believe during the Paterno Era we were great "every' year. The fact of our records does not bear that out. Joe himself used to talk about a "cycle" type of approach to building the program, in which you'd be good and compete for a national title every 3-4 years. The other years were building up towards the great years..... The question is.... Looking at the dynamics of the Penn State program : With what Penn State is willing to invest into the program, with the geographic location, with the academic requirements .... Is Penn St capable of being a "Bama type" of elite program winning 12-13 games EVERY year and competing for the CFP EVERY year.... Or, with all of those dynamics, is Penn St more of an "every 3-4 year cycle" program??????
And everybody knows it’s not legit. So the question becomes whether or not you are willing to cheat your balls off to win a couple more games a year.
Yep. The chances of us going backwards by replacing Franklin are much greater than the chances of us finding someone who will take us to a higher level than where we are and have been since 2016. The college football system is broken. This CFP set up with only 4 teams is ruining the game. It has allowed the talent and success to be concentrated in the same 4-5 teams and nobody else has a chance once they lose 1 game.
It can be so much better if they go to 8 teams. All 5 conference champions, one from G5, and 2 at large. This would result in a greater importance in every regular season game, allowing more teams to have a reasonable shot. It would also spread the 4 and 5 star talent around, rather than most of them choosing the same schools every year (AL, Clemson, OSU, UGA).
I am all in on CJF even if he does have a brain fart or two each year.
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We can debate all day about whether or not they "cheat". I know enough about college football to know it's not "apples to apples" when comparing programs. It's idiotic in a sense to compare a "Stanford" with an "LSU" and expect Stanford to produce the same on field successes as an LSU. Schools have different academic entrance requirements, different admission standards,.... heck even different drug testing policies. About 15-20 years ago I shared a few beers with a guy who was a long time assistant coach at a southern school. He told me that they'd often lose recruits because recruits would actually ask them about the drug testing policy and theirs was a bit more strict than some others (IE - fail once nothing, fail twice suspended, fail three times.....). So I 100% agree in the notion that there is not a 100% fair & balanced system. Like Lou Holtz said on national TV one time "The fact is that half the players on the LSU roster would not even be admitted into Notre Dame". And Lou was absolutely correct.
As far as "bag men" and outright cheating. I will have to say that unless we have a smoking gun, I will not just believe it. It's like the defense against the conspiracy theorists who say we did not land on the Moon.... the best defense is ... "NASA had hundreds of scientists in the room that day, and hundreds working on the Moon landing, it would be virtually impossible to guarantee life-long silence from hundreds and hundreds of scientists about NOT landing on the Moon... eventually someone would talk"............ same principal. If Clemson, Ohio St, Bama had "bag men" handing out thousands of dollars to 17-yera old guys to persuade them to pick their school. We are talking 17-year old guys.... Eventually some of them would talk. Does Bama pay all 85 guys??? Assume Bama pays just their 5* guys... Wouldn't the 4* guys get jealous and talk?? Players talk amongst themselves. So if Bama is say paying the 5* guys, they mention it to their team mate a 4* guy.... wouldn't eventually at least one of those jilted 4* guys get mad and squeal???
Apparently you forgot about the Troy Smith $500 handshake and the huge pile of cash stolen from Hawk’s apartment. I lived in Columbus at the time and the people there treat this stuff like business as usual, and just laugh it off. When Troy got caught, he clammed up because many thought that was the tip of the iceberg, but he fell on his sword to protect the others. The O$U faithful told me this was being a good teammate, and that everybody does it, meaning all the top football programs.
Columbus is a financial capital with lots of corporate money floating around, and I am sure there are back door ways that some of this finds itself into the hands of the football players. I am sure all of us can buy a two week old barely “used” car for half price, because the NCAA with the help of the connected O$U AD determined that to be true and therefore no violation occurred.
As a big fan of NASA & Astronauts I agree with your premise. I think what gets lost is the very definition of “bagman”. Are there boosters making large direct cash payments to players or their families? (Cam Newton, Reggie Bush, OBJ on-field cash handouts to LSU players on live tv) can probably answer that honestly. Does this happen with entire rosters? Probably not. It is even unlikely that anyone (wink,wink) associated directly with any program has any knowledge of anything of that nature. I believe that they believe that. I would say that the $100 handshakes, “borrowing”the sports car, mom getting a kitchen remodel, a new SUV or Trans-Am - (Eric Dickerson) randomly showing up in the driveway. I have 2 recent examples from the mouth of a highly rated recruit.
1. On a recruiting trip to Georgia, the recruits are told to go into the student bookstore and buy a t-shirt and hand the cashier some ticket/slip of paper ( in essence a coupon) They pay, the shirt goes into a much larger- bag that had been “prepared”, there is a ton of sweats, t-shirts, and other “gifts” in the bag.
2. From a Michigan assistant, The player was asked directly “How much was the SUV your dad just bought for you?” Maybe small talk in the recruiting world, but why does a football coach need to know how much dad spent on the SUV?
