OT: Poor Restaurant Service

[MJG-90]

I want to talk positively about service. We can walk to about 20 restaurants in our neighborhood, and there are two that are wonderful every single time. (And by the way, if table service is good, food is usually good. If a restaurant is committed in the dining room, chances are there's that same commitment in the kitchen). To be good at restaurants you have to care a LOT about a lot of things.

Service is not determined by the person who comes to the table. It's who owns the restaurant and who runs the restaurant. That's why you often have such crappy experience in the suburbs -- it tends to be chains, and chain restaurant owners, whether they be investors or franchisees, are never on site. Nobody with a long term stake is in the dining room or kitchen. An owner operated place that is more than a few years old -- odds are good that you'll have a good experience. In a competitive place like Philly, if you're not really, good you don't survive beyond 2 years.

Here are the places:

Bar Hygge has owners who have been running bars for 20 years and they are really good at it, and really care. They can do every job in the kitchen and dining room and they know how difficult the work is. They are really picky about who they hire, and they don't hesitate to fire when people don't meet the standard. But when they get a good one, they take REALLY good care of them. So they hold on to good staff for years. They attract people who actually want to make a career waiting tables or tending bar.

Zorba's is a traditional Greek-American restaurant run by the same family since the 1980s. Might be the best Greek in Philly. We go for the food, which is simple and unpretentious -- always great ingredients and incredibly consistent. Anyway after about a year of eating at Zorba's, I realized that the service was also invariably spot on. This is all about experience and continuity. The kitchen is the same people who've been cooking the same recipes for 25 years. And the waitstaff, I don't know how long they've been there but some go back as long as we've been in Philly -- 8 years.

Boiling Springs Tavern, for those in south central PA, is one of my favorites. The bartender has been there for years, knows what we like to eat and drink, and almost never lets my glass empty before he's on it. I'm not sure I can recall a time when I didn't see the owner hanging out in the corner chatting with other regulars.

Apparently new owners have taken over, so it will be interesting to see if anything changes. If they do make changes, hopefully they are improvements to the dining room, which I always felt was oddly laid out and didn't have near the atmosphere as the bar area.

 

[CoastFan]

The automatic 20% service charge is becoming more and more common in the Seattle area. The bills still have a line for a tip though in many cases, basically saying that if you thought you had really good service to remember to tip your server. Imagine that.

https://wahospitality.org/blog/hero_service-charges/

 

[Langmuir]

I was only giving you a hard time. Takes one to know one?

But everybody should still remember, if you have a problem everywhere you go, maybe it's not where you're going that's the problem.

My family eats out a lot. My wife's best recipe is reservations. So it is not everywhere we go, I just have been noticing this more and more over the past several months. Many of these places, I have been to multiple times and have not had any issues in the past. I am kind and polite to the servers and generally tip 20% or more. I don't think it is too much to ask to get a draft beer in less than 30 minutes before my meal arrives. I generally don't say anything except in the most extreme cases, I just leave the restaurant disappointed.

 

[sluggo72]

To your first point, you have that one right.

As for the second--Bonfatto's would be wise to go back to what they used to be: A takeout hoagie joint. Their menu got too big and management was poorly suited to keep things consistent. Most of the time you get a baseball bat for a hoagie bun, re-heated mush for eggplant parm, and burnt jerky for a steak. The last time I ate there, I got a roast beef sub....that literally had two thinly-sliced pieces of meat on it. Swore I'd never go back, and haven't.

FWIW, Mama Lucrezia's is another great downtown Bellefonte restaurant. Garlic bread is awesome and I haven't found better pizza in the area--including Hofbrau.

 

[ThePennsyOracle]

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Yeah, pretty much. Not even sure if what Bonfatto's serves would qualify as egg noodles & ketchup.

 

[PSUQBKeeper]

Waffle shop in Bellefonte is great. Can't impress everyone everywhere I guess.

Bonfattos from what I hear is going to be out here soon. I'm pretty sure they bought a small building by tally rand and will just do take out...

Try the Redhorse in pleasant gap or the Hofbrau in Bellefonte as well. Great places.

And also. Michaels tavern in Zion will be back and running in October.

Brown's Hill Tavern down near the I-80 interchange is very good also

 

[Global Fan]

Guess I didn’t explain myself well. It just seems (at least to me) to be an overused catch phrase for almost everything these days.

For example, if a waiter/waitress took good care of me, I don’t just sign the credit card receipt and leave. I always like to say “good night”, “I enjoyed the meal” or “thanks for taking care of me tonight, you did a great job”. Nice to hear a “you’re welcome” or “please come back soon” or “thanks for coming in tonight” instead of a “no problem”.

understood Lion, no problem

 

[BBrown]

Not really a commentary on poor restaurant service, but was in Myrtle Beach last week and was disappointed in nearly every restaurant experience my family had. Went as a rather large group (11 us, including six children under seven), and service was mostly fine, but a traditional meal at one of the hibachi restaurants fell flat (absolutely nothing in their hibachi fried rice save soy sauce...), Joe's Crab Shack was meh, American Tap House was awful, and Nacho Hippo had the most watered down margarita's I've ever had. I don't have super high expectations for vacation restaurants, especially ones able to accommodate such a large group, but for all the places they have down there nothing stands out. Also saw The Kitchen Table (owned by someone here, right?) was closed (maybe they're seasonal?). I guess the fact that the Duplin Winery is constantly packed should be a harbinger of MB cuisine....

LOL, yea Joe's Crab Shack lasted about 1.5 years in Abingdon, MD. Waayyyy too much competition for good seafood for them to survive around here.

 

[cntblvitsbutter]

Funny timing of this post. Was just lamenting with the wife how bad service has gotten recently. Not even bad, but increasingly just aggressively rude service. I was in line waiting for a bacon burger wo/ sauce at the Adventure Aquarium in Camden, NJ. The grill person seemed to have forgotten about my order, so I asked him if he had another bacon burger coming out. He walked over to a heat lamp and just grabbed a burger and gave it to me. When I asked him if he could make a fresh one without sauce, he raised his voice and berated me for just standing there as he's passing out food! Then there's all the times the entrees come out 5 minutes or 30 minutes after the appetizers. And the constant filling of the water glass or the total ignoring of the water glass. And the constant asking if there's anything else we need or the total ignoring of our table.

 

[manatree]

The tipping culture is one of the most counter productive ways to encourage and maintain good customer service.

 

[Aardvark86]

Maybe it is just me with a string of bad luck but I have had incident after incident of poor service at restaurants over the past several months. This has happened in the Philly suburbs, in Centre County and Delaware beaches. I gotta think something is going on in the industry. A common theme is that on Friday or Saturday night, the place will not be packed but the wait staff complains that they are very busy and shorthanded.

An all to common occurrence is an issue of getting drinks. One place we ordered our drinks as soon as we were seated. We got our appetizers, no drinks. Our dinner came, no drinks. It was over 30 minutes and the drinks never came but the waitress apologized about every 10 minutes saying the bar was very busy. I eventually asked to see the manager. Within two minutes the drinks came, but never did see the manager. The waitress offered free dessert, I said no give me the drinks for free which we got after she talked to the manager.

Another place which called itself a restaurant and bourbon bar also had an issue with the bar. After dinner, I ordered a shot of some fancy bourbon. Waited about 10 minutes and the waitress said the "system" at the bar was down and they should be able to get it back up soon and get me my drink. I told her to forget and just get me the check. WTF, when did a "system" become more important than serving customers? Poor me the damn drink and figure out your system later.

I do have to compliment Mad Mex in Willow Grove who gave us poor service by nobody coming to take our drink order for 15 minutes and our appetizer order never came. They recognized the poor service and without even asking comped the drinks and gave us 50% off on the food.

Anybody else notice a serious decline in restaurant/bar service lately?

Hell, I’ve even had this at a private club.

I can only chalk it up to summer help, being charitable.

 

[Op2]

Funny timing of this post. Was just lamenting with the wife how bad service has gotten recently. Not even bad, but increasingly just aggressively rude service. I was in line waiting for a bacon burger wo/ sauce at the Adventure Aquarium in Camden, NJ. The grill person seemed to have forgotten about my order, so I asked him if he had another bacon burger coming out. He walked over to a heat lamp and just grabbed a burger and gave it to me. When I asked him if he could make a fresh one without sauce, he raised his voice and berated me for just standing there as he's passing out food! Then there's all the times the entrees come out 5 minutes or 30 minutes after the appetizers. And the constant filling of the water glass or the total ignoring of the water glass. And the constant asking if there's anything else we need or the total ignoring of our table.

Re. the water glass, that's one more reason we need an Ipad-device instead of a waiter. When you want more water you press a button and they bring it. No more of them interrupting your conversation to ask you if you want water (or want anything).

And plus, if they're only out on the floor to fulfill a request someone has made on the Ipad that's less people pointlessly walking around, which makes for a better dining experience.

 

[pandaczar12]

My family eats out a lot. My wife's best recipe is reservations. So it is not everywhere we go, I just have been noticing this more and more over the past several months. Many of these places, I have been to multiple times and have not had any issues in the past. I am kind and polite to the servers and generally tip 20% or more. I don't think it is too much to ask to get a draft beer in less than 30 minutes before my meal arrives. I generally don't say anything except in the most extreme cases, I just leave the restaurant disappointed.

Do you happen to live near Pittsburgh? The high number of Pitt grads working in restaurants could be the problem.

Funny timing of this post. Was just lamenting with the wife how bad service has gotten recently. Not even bad, but increasingly just aggressively rude service. I was in line waiting for a bacon burger wo/ sauce at the Adventure Aquarium in Camden, NJ. The grill person seemed to have forgotten about my order, so I asked him if he had another bacon burger coming out. He walked over to a heat lamp and just grabbed a burger and gave it to me. When I asked him if he could make a fresh one without sauce, he raised his voice and berated me for just standing there as he's passing out food! Then there's all the times the entrees come out 5 minutes or 30 minutes after the appetizers. And the constant filling of the water glass or the total ignoring of the water glass. And the constant asking if there's anything else we need or the total ignoring of our table.

It's like they wait for you to take a big bite and your mouth is full, before they stop over to ask how everything is.

 

[jrd23psu]

My family eats out a lot. My wife's best recipe is reservations. So it is not everywhere we go, I just have been noticing this more and more over the past several months. Many of these places, I have been to multiple times and have not had any issues in the past. I am kind and polite to the servers and generally tip 20% or more. I don't think it is too much to ask to get a draft beer in less than 30 minutes before my meal arrives. I generally don't say anything except in the most extreme cases, I just leave the restaurant disappointed.

I agree. I'm really just ball busting. I imagine like most people you're a regular easy going customer. Hopefully it's just a run of bad service. I've had them before.

 

[Cletus11]

The tipping culture is one of the most counter productive ways to encourage and maintain good customer service.

one thing i like about european restaurants. servers are hourly/salary. tipping is only done if the food or service was exceptional, sort of like it should be. i am at the point i won't tip 20% if the food is bad or service is bad. i work too hard for my money to give it away. if i do a crappy job at work, i hear about it.

 

[nits74]

I blame management for the poor service at restaurants/retail. They are the ones running the show, hiring the staff, providing the training, evaluating and "correcting" if things go wrong. I'm a believer in the "When the cat's away the mice will play" motto and if there is poor service that's a reflection on the type of supervision that is taking place. This usually occurs due to the Peter principle whereby people are promoted to their level of incompetence - leading to many people in management positions without the skills necessary to lead properly.

Interesting conversation with a couple who are in the restaurant management business. They were telling me that they were actually required to attend a two day seminar in how to deal with millennials in the work place. This says a lot.

 

[Cosmos]

+1.
and since we are all venting or ranting, allow me to rant on about "self checkout" lines.
Fine, you want me to do "self chekout" then take 10% off my bill, seeing as how I'm saving you thousands in salary and health care by doing it myself.

So true. How about offers to go paperless. I refuse. You give me a price break. Until then it aint happening. I recently changed my electric service plan. Now TXU is sending two identical paper invoices. I'll get around to telling them when I get around to it.

 

[jrd23psu]

So true. How about offers to go paperless. I refuse. You give me a price break. Until then it aint happening. I recently changed my electric service plan. Now TXU is sending two identical paper invoices. I'll get around to telling them when I get around to it.

I always go paperless and use self checkout. Self checkout is way faster. It's a time savings for me. I'm like a pro. I'm in and out.

I hate paper bills. It's a waste. Again I have to open them up and look at them or just toss them when I see them. No need.

 

[jrd23psu]

Interesting conversation with a couple who are in the restaurant management business. They were telling me that they were actually required to attend a two day seminar in how to deal with millennials in the work place. This says a lot.

Ah, the old "shit on Millennials" strategy when things aren't going right.

Let me go ahead and take a wild guess here. This couple are baby boomers, right? Probably complain about "the participation trophy generation" right? Forget to mention boomers invented participation trophies?

 

[Cosmos]

Interesting conversation with a couple who are in the restaurant management business. They were telling me that they were actually required to attend a two day seminar in how to deal with millennials in the work place. This says a lot.

Oh yeah. We actually had training session on it. Brought in outside consultants to inform us as to what motivates a millennial. The thing I remember is the millennials in the training class were falling asleep!

 

[Cosmos]

I always go paperless and use self checkout. Self checkout is way faster. It's a time savings for me. I'm like a pro. I'm in and out.

I hate paper bills. It's a waste. Again I have to open them up and look at them or just toss them when I see them. No need.

I reconcile the checkbook in my household, so I need the papers. It's the accountant in me.
The one recurring bill that is paperless is my Consumer Cellular because it comes that way. No choice.

 

[jrd23psu]

I reconcile the checkbook in my household, so I need the papers. It's the accountant in me.
The one recurring bill that is paperless is my Consumer Cellular because it comes that way. No choice.

That's another thing I streamline. My bank has online banking. I check my bank account frequently and make sure there are no withdrawals that I don't recognize. So long as I can account for everything that posts by checking it every 2-3 days I don't have to keep a hard copy of my checkbook. It's redundant when my bank already balances it for me.

The whole point of a balancing a checkbook is to make sure you know how much is in your account. When you have to write checks and you don't know when they will be cashed/withdrawn from your account that's important. However, I can count how many checks I write in a year on one hand at this point. I can also check to see how much is in my account by unlocking my iPhone and tapping my banking app. I get an immediate breakdown of my account. I find balancing a hard copy of a check book to be redundant and unnecessary.

 

[razpsu]

Not really a commentary on poor restaurant service, but was in Myrtle Beach last week and was disappointed in nearly every restaurant experience my family had. Went as a rather large group (11 us, including six children under seven), and service was mostly fine, but a traditional meal at one of the hibachi restaurants fell flat (absolutely nothing in their hibachi fried rice save soy sauce...), Joe's Crab Shack was meh, American Tap House was awful, and Nacho Hippo had the most watered down margarita's I've ever had. I don't have super high expectations for vacation restaurants, especially ones able to accommodate such a large group, but for all the places they have down there nothing stands out. Also saw The Kitchen Table (owned by someone here, right?) was closed (maybe they're seasonal?). I guess the fact that the Duplin Winery is constantly packed should be a harbinger of MB cuisine....

We close at 2pm. Open for breakfast and lunch. You should have come to barefoot resort. Sunset bistro for dinner and drinks on the marina.

 

[Cosmos]

Troegs in Hershey has a line for ordering. You go through the line, order your food and pay. They give you a buzzer that lets you know when to go up for your food. Works great in my opinion. The only downside is that you have to decide your tip before you get your food. I'm not sure why you would even tip since no one is actually serving you anything. But I'm always afraid if I don't tip, someone will treat my food with less care than they should.

Fuzzy's Tacos works that way. But no tip required. You're also expected to buss your own table. The only problem is, a lot of customers don't. So you have a hard time finding a clean one.

 

[Cosmos]

That's another thing I streamline. My bank has online banking. I check my bank account frequently and make sure there are no withdrawals that I don't recognize. So long as I can account for everything that posts by checking it every 2-3 days I don't have to keep a hard copy of my checkbook. It's redundant when my bank already balances it for me.

The whole point of a balancing a checkbook is to make sure you know how much is in your account. When you have to write checks and you don't know when they will be cashed/withdrawn from your account that's important. However, I can count how many checks I write in a year on one hand at this point. I can also check to see how much is in my account by unlocking my iPhone and tapping my banking app. I get an immediate breakdown of my account. I find balancing a hard copy of a check book to be redundant and unnecessary.

I feel ya. I don't reconcile in the traditional sense (i.e., balance check register and statement to the penny). I only make sure there's nothing on the statement that's not on my check register. In other words, the bank's always right. Besides, it helps me keep tabs on the wife's spending as she's in possession of the check book.

I use online banking, too. I've spending alerts, transfers limits and ATM withdrawal notifications setup. I've got Chase's mobile ap on my phone and use it to deposit checks. Piece of cake.

 

[Cosmos]

The part that cracks me up is the; if you have a rotary phone, please stay on the line and someone will answer your call shortly. Who the hell still has a rotary phone?

Believe it or not portions of NW PA are still on a rotary system.

 

[psuro]

Believe it or not portions of NW PA are still on a rotary system.

Oh. I believe it.

 

[nits74]

Ah, the old "shit on Millennials" strategy when things aren't going right.

Let me go ahead and take a wild guess here. This couple are baby boomers, right? Probably complain about "the participation trophy generation" right? Forget to mention boomers invented participation trophies?

Actually I would put them as Generation X'ers. But, I hear you on the participation trophy and other ancillary things. Much of this stuff is no doubt due to the boomer generation's parenting. Not all bad or all good. Just the way society evolves over time.

 

[Cosmos]

Amen to the Ipad-like ordering device. They oughta have someone seating you and thus note that that table is in usage and then let you take it from there. Have one of the Ipad buttons be "Send a human over" when you need a human. In addition to ordering the food itself you could have a "Bring water" button or "More Silverware" or whatever. And an urgency button too so you could either summon it immediately or instead have it be a "when you get a chance" thing.

Show me to my table and clear the table after I leave but other than that I don't need the human, unless I have a special request. And yeah, get rid of the tipping in the process.

Don't forget the disinfectant wipes to wipe down the Ipad-like ordering device. Or when I go to a smorgasbord, which isn't very often, wear surgical gloves when handling the serving utensils: Luby's, Ci Ci's Pizza or any salad bar.

 

[nits74]

Believe it or not portions of NW PA are still on a rotary system.

I have one as conversation piece (no pun intended).

 

[Op2]

Don't forget the disinfectant wipes to wipe down the Ipad-like ordering device. Or when I go to a smorgasbord, which isn't very often, wear surgical gloves when handling the serving utensils: Luby's, Ci Ci's Pizza or any salad bar.

Good point, that could be part of the standard routine of bussing the table after the people leave, in addition to taking the dishes away and wiping down the table, wipe down the Ipad-like ordering device at the same time.

 

[jrd23psu]

I feel ya. I don't reconcile in the traditional sense (i.e., balance check register and statement to the penny). I only make sure there's nothing on the statement that's not on my check register. In other words, the bank's always right. Besides, it helps me keep tabs on the wife's spending as she's in possession of the check book.

I use online banking, too. I've spending alerts, transfers limits and ATM withdrawal notifications setup. I've got Chase's mobile ap on my phone and use it to deposit checks. Piece of cake.

Mobile check deposit is amazing. I don't have to deposit a lot of checks but when I do it's great because I never remember to take checks with me to stop at the bank to deposit them.

 

[jrd23psu]

Actually I would put them as Generation X'ers. But, I hear you on the participation trophy and other ancillary things. Much of this stuff is no doubt due to the boomer generation's parenting. Not all bad or all good. Just the way society evolves over time.

One of the things that drives me nuts is when older generations blame the younger generation for things. I think Millennials get a disproportionate amount of criticism, though. Every generation thinks the younger generation is lazy, entitled, and has crappy music. It's been this way since the beginning of time. I'm sure Millennials will say the same about Gen Z and whatever generation is after them.

 

[Bloomnit]

LOL, yea Joe's Crab Shack lasted about 1.5 years in Abingdon, MD. Waayyyy too much competition for good seafood for them to survive around here.

The one in Cockeysville was a disaster. They didn't have any clean tables the one time we were there, so instead of cleaning one, they made a makeshift table out of a two-person table for a party of four. Never in my life had a wackier experience at a restaurant.

I do find myself eating out less and less these days. Tougher with young kids, but I think the bigger reason is the experience is becoming less and less worth it. Went to Las Cazuelas Restaurant in Fishtown neighborhood of Philly and everything about the experience was mediocre. The service, the food, the ambiance... Everything except the bill. $180 for four people, no drinks (just water). Charged 15 dollars for four ounce sides of guacamole and salsa each. The next week, ate at El Salto near Baltimore and had vastly better Mexican food and service for literally 1/6th of the price.

Everything is a crapshoot with restaurants now and days. Sometimes you can go to a chain and have a great experience and have a crappy one with a hip, highly recommended one. I am at a point now where I would rather just learn to cook really well myself and save the hassle.

 

[CentrevilleLion]

Have you ever thought about the common denominator in all these scenarios?

There is a saying. "If you meet an asshole in the morning, you met an asshole. If you meet assholes all day long..."

...you're a proctologist.

 

[nits74]

One of the things that drives me nuts is when older generations blame the younger generation for things. I think Millennials get a disproportionate amount of criticism, though. Every generation thinks the younger generation is lazy, entitled, and has crappy music. It's been this way since the beginning of time. I'm sure Millennials will say the same about Gen Z and whatever generation is after them.

You nail it. I'm a Boomer, but I always try to keep in mind what my parents' generation (not so much my own parents) would say about us. Personally, there are many things (not everything) which I very much like what I see from the Millennials. But, I won't elaborate on some of those for fear of the thread being dispatched by our mods.

 

[Nittany Ziggy]

We have a restaurant in rural America. We kicked out the meth heads and decided to hire clean people, some young, mostly retired and pay them respectable wages with a percent of the net added on as bonus. We (my wife and I) figured that the employees were just like us and wanted reward for their effort. We are also on premise (not a franchise that has brought back feudalism to the work force) with arms length ownership.

Another policy that helps us keep good employees in our business is that "The customer is not always right." Customers that are assholes, rude, abusive in any way of any employee, spouse, other customer or onlooker is summarily identified and walked to the Exit sign after being informed they are never to enter our premises again. Too many customer butt kissing lackeys with negative outlooks toward their employees own and run restaurants. The result is they get bad employees... go figure!

God bless you. Showing narcissistic customers the door and profit sharing is a great way to attract good employees.

 

[Nittany Ziggy]

I went to Otto's once. They overcooked my burger (why can't any restaurants make a medium rare burger?). They wanted to make me another, but I was on my way to a hockey game and didn't have the time to wait. They comped my beer instead, which was a pleasant surprise. I'm used to getting a discount on my food. The two beers were as much or more than the burger if I recall correctly.

I'll go back to a place that treats me right. Unfortunately, the wife isn't a fan of places like Otto's, so I haven't had the opportunity to return.

I like Otto’s and have had mostly good experiences there (over a LARGE sample size ). Perhaps it was less expensive to the house to comp your beer rather than the meal since Otto’s brews their own?

 

[MJG-90]

I like Otto’s and have had mostly good experiences there (over a LARGE sample size ). Perhaps it was less expensive to the house to comp your beer rather than the meal since Otto’s brews their own?

Cost doesn’t matter at that point. The cost was already sunk. By comping the beer instead of the burger, they reduced their revenue. Not by much. I just found it interesting.

 

[Nittany Ziggy]

Yea they should know their "product". Whats an Onion Bun?

I just had an “onion bun” cut off of the bottom of my foot. In hindsight, the shot to numb the region hurt worse than the actual onionbunnectomy!