NY looking to end youth football

[Online Persona]

Democratic New York lawmakers are introducing a bill to ban children from playing tackle football.

The John Mackey Youth Football Protection Act, named after an NFL player from New York who died from chronic traumatic encephalopathy (CTE) in 2011, would ban tackle football for kids 12 years old and younger.

Assemblyman Michael Benedetto, a Democrat who represents the Bronx in New York City, has been trying to get the bill passed for more than 10 years, but he finally has a sponsor in the state Senate, Democrat Luis Sepulveda.

 

[bcspsu]

Democratic New York lawmakers are introducing a bill to ban children from playing tackle football.

The John Mackey Youth Football Protection Act, named after an NFL player from New York who died from chronic traumatic encephalopathy (CTE) in 2011, would ban tackle football for kids 12 years old and younger.

Assemblyman Michael Benedetto, a Democrat who represents the Bronx in New York City, has been trying to get the bill passed for more than 10 years, but he finally has a sponsor in the state Senate, Democrat Luis Sepulveda.

What’s ironic is that youth tackle football probably is the safest form of tackle football because kids that age don’t run fast enough and aren’t big enough to create the impact that would cause concussions. This is another example of cultural busy bodies demasculating this country.

Why stop at youth football; youth hockey, soccer and lacrosse will be next. A lot of these asses won’t be satisfied until our boys are playing with dolls and becoming drag queens.

 

[katchthis]

Better cancel women's soccer and cheerleading too, it is right up there for concussions.

 

[PSUWrestlingFanSince2011]

Gross

 

[GregInPitt]

Put all the kids in rubber rooms. That's where the so called adults that make up stupid law after stupid law belong. Misery likes company.

 

[Obliviax]

You don’t see it around here. Flag football into jr high. I am not sure it’s of benefit at that young age.

 

[PSU_Nut]

They want to make youth football safer get better coaches. It sad there are still meat head coaches who still think drills m like bull in the ring which have no football value will toughen up kids.

 

[LeatherHelmets]

OK, probably so colleges don't even recruit NY football players going forward.

 

[LandoComando]

Predictable

 

[PSUPride1]

Democratic New York lawmakers are introducing a bill to ban children from playing tackle football.

The John Mackey Youth Football Protection Act, named after an NFL player from New York who died from chronic traumatic encephalopathy (CTE) in 2011, would ban tackle football for kids 12 years old and younger.

Assemblyman Michael Benedetto, a Democrat who represents the Bronx in New York City, has been trying to get the bill passed for more than 10 years, but he finally has a sponsor in the state Senate, Democrat Luis Sepulveda.

As I've said many times progressive Democrats destroy everything they touch. Some of you people better wake up.

 

[bdgan]

They want to make youth football safer get better coaches. It sad there are still meat head coaches who still think drills m like bull in the ring which have no football value will toughen up kids.

Nobody gets hurt in bull in the ring. It's pretty much a blocking drill.

I agree that some coaches are over the top. The problem is they're mostly volunteers that have gone through minimal training.

 

[LMTLION]

Are youth in NY more likely to develop cte from football or from assaults in under-policed areas of NYC?

 

[heckmans]

As I've said many times progressive Democrats destroy everything they touch. Some of you people better wake up.

Too late. They're already woke...I'll show myself out

 

[joeaubie21]

Let's buy them dresses and teach them to suck.....

 

[marshall23]

I don't think this is an example of something government should be spending their time on.
As a guy who played and coached, I chose to keep my sons away from football until 7th grade.
The community I coached in didn't have a program and every boy I ever coached had no experience until he played in our junior high program.
I don't believe a lot of experiences as a 6 or 7 year old transfer to high school stardom.
The biggest and quickest boy at 9 isn't a real indicator of what that child might be at 14.
Coaching and maturation process are huge variables with "midget" football. In the final analysis, if the program is available and the child wishes to participate it should be a parental decision.
My final comment is a concern that some of the tikes I've seen running around are smaller than their helmets.

 

[PSU_Nut]

Nobody gets hurt in bull in the ring. It's pretty much a blocking drill.

I agree that some coaches are over the top. The problem is they're mostly volunteers that have gone through minimal training.

Not according to research. A study at VT bio medical found the drill had the highest and most frequent head impacts of any drill in practice. How is a guy running into a circle of teammates a blocking drill?

Study: High-impact drills cause more concussions at youth football level

Eliminating particular high-impact drills in youth football practices significantly reduces the risk of head injuries, according to a study published in theJournal of Neurosurgery on Tuesday. Resea…

usatodayhss.com

 

[Online Persona]

Anyone ever seen 5-year-olds wrestling in PA? My cousin had his kid wrestling at 5 and I went to his match one time. The only thing that I could guarantee is that at least one and maybe both of the kids would be coming off the mat crying. That was every match. This is an example IMO of too early for a sport. It's probably doing more damage than the very few who take to it so early and love the sport through college.

Tackle football on the other hand, well, kids are going to play it. I was one of those kids whose mom wouldn't let me play until junior high. So we played tackle with no pads and no supervision up by the elementary school and in our friends' yards. I knocked one of my buddies out cold in his back yard one time covering a kickoff when he fell forward into my knee as it was coming up. Fortunately his mom was home at the time. I broke my wrist in one of those games and never said anything. Learned that it was broken when I had an xray in college for another injury and the calcification of the bone dated to about that timeframe.

BTW, when I was finally allowed to play for my JR High, I scored on my 1st touch. Middle KO return, through the first wave and broke it to the outside for the score to open the first game.

 

[lowhandicapper]

Watching the same people get triggered over and over by every social item that doesn't fit into their historical life narrative is a sport unto itself. Such sentiment is clearly a sign of some sort of unresolved life trauma.

 

[Online Persona]

Watching the same people get triggered over and over by every social item that doesn't fit into their historical life narrative is a sport unto itself. Such sentiment is clearly a sign of some sort of unresolved life trauma.

Probably the same for anyone making excuses for it. I get your point but you are essentially saying to never stand up for anything, no matter how wrong it may be. If you voice an opinion, you must have been triggered, and it likely applies to everything that you experience in your life, therefore you clearly have unresolved life trauma?

 

[bcspsu]

Anyone ever seen 5-year-olds wrestling in PA? My cousin had his kid wrestling at 5 and I went to his match one time. The only thing that I could guarantee is that at least one and maybe both of the kids would be coming off the mat crying. That was every match. This is an example IMO of too early for a sport. It's probably doing more damage than the very few who take to it so early and love the sport through college.

Tackle football on the other hand, well, kids are going to play it. I was one of those kids whose mom wouldn't let me play until junior high. So we played tackle with no pads and no supervision up by the elementary school and in our friends' yards. I knocked one of my buddies out cold in his back yard one time covering a kickoff when he fell forward into my knee as it was coming up. Fortunately his mom was home at the time. I broke my wrist in one of those games and never said anything. Learned that it was broken when I had an xray in college for another injury and the calcification of the bone dated to about that timeframe.

BTW, when I was finally allowed to play for my JR High, I scored on my 1st touch. Middle KO return, through the first wave and broke it to the outside for the score to open the first game.

I played 6 years of youth football and then high school in the Pittsburgh area. I never was injured while doing that. However, stupidly, the day after Thanksgiving in 1983, I participated in a pick up tackle football game with no equipment and ended up breaking my right ankle.

 

[lowhandicapper]

Probably the same for anyone making excuses for it. I get your point but you are essentially saying to never stand up for anything, no matter how wrong it may be. If you voice an opinion, you must have been triggered, and it likely applies to everything that you experience in your life, therefore you clearly have unresolved life trauma?

Faulty comprehension.
Flawed logic.

 

[Texas Lion]

The Government, both sides, are a complete joke. I still can't believe there isnt a legitimate third party...call it the "common sense" party.

 

[bcspsu]

The Government, both sides, are a complete joke. I still can't believe there isnt a legitimate third party...call it the "common sense" party.

Regardless of party, a lot of this country, including the federal government, many states, and most large cities are being poorly led. However, the voters largely have nobody to blame but themselves. Just look at PA for example; the voters just elected somebody for Senate who obviously is not physically fit to serve after having a stroke, and anybody with a brain knew it, and now he's been hospitalized again.

 

[bdgan]

Not according to research. A study at VT bio medical found the drill had the highest and most frequent head impacts of any drill in practice. How is a guy running into a circle of teammates a blocking drill?

Study: High-impact drills cause more concussions at youth football level

Eliminating particular high-impact drills in youth football practices significantly reduces the risk of head injuries, according to a study published in theJournal of Neurosurgery on Tuesday. Resea…

usatodayhss.com

That's not the drill I know. The article says King of the Circle. I'm familiar with a drill we called Bull in the ring. The players would stand in a circle and coaches would call on two players of comparable size to go into the middle of the ring. When he blew the whistle they went at it as hard as they could trying to push each other back. The drill probably lasted for 30 seconds unless someone got knocked to the ground. The players were in full gear but I never saw a head collision.

 

[Texas Lion]

Regardless of party, a lot of this country, including the federal government, many states, and most large cities are being poorly led. However, the voters largely have nobody to blame but themselves. Just look at PA for example; the voters just elected somebody for Senate who obviously is not physically fit to serve after having a stroke, and anybody with a brain knew it, and now he's been hospitalized again.

agreed, but doesn't it go to show you how bad the other sides choice was? Running Dr. Oz was a horrible choice.

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

 

[bcspsu]

agreed, but doesn't it go to show you how bad the other sides choice was? Running Dr. Oz was a horrible choice.

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

Yes. I didn't vote for him in the primary. However, the other choices were rather uninspired too.

The frustrating thing is that I really don't know if it even matters anymore in several parts of this country about the quality of a candidate because this country is so divided, which is promoted by our so-called leaders, and a lot of voters obviously now are mindless zombies and vote without thinking.

 

[PSU_Nut]

That's not the drill I know. The article says King of the Circle. I'm familiar with a drill we called Bull in the ring. The players would stand in a circle and coaches would call on two players of comparable size to go into the middle of the ring. When he blew the whistle they went at it as hard as they could trying to push each other back. The drill probably lasted for 30 seconds unless someone got knocked to the ground. The players were in full gear but I never saw a head collision.

King of the circle is the same drill we called bull in the ring. So we were talking about different drills.

 

[IANit]

What’s ironic is that youth tackle football probably is the safest form of tackle football because kids that age don’t run fast enough and aren’t big enough to create the impact that would cause concussions. This is another example of cultural busy bodies demasculating this country.

Why stop at youth football; youth hockey, soccer and lacrosse will be next. A lot of these asses won’t be satisfied until our boys are playing with dolls and becoming drag queens.

I've had a couple sons in youth football - more my wife's doing than mine, even though I'm a huge football fan. I don't think kids should play until 14 or so. Don't kid yourself - kids get concussions and other injuries even in the 4th and 5th grade version. A kid on my son's 6th-grade team last year was basically my size (6'0 200+) already. They have weight limits on who can be a ball carrier, but not on defense or offensive line. Some of the middle school coaches I talked to when my oldest was in 5th grade a few years back were drooling over a 4th-grader who was about the same size or bigger already. I'm sure there are exceptions, but IMO at the lower ages it's basically just a lot of kids running into each other. Most of the kids don't really understand what they're trying to do.

 

[IANit]

Anyone ever seen 5-year-olds wrestling in PA? My cousin had his kid wrestling at 5 and I went to his match one time. The only thing that I could guarantee is that at least one and maybe both of the kids would be coming off the mat crying. That was every match. This is an example IMO of too early for a sport. It's probably doing more damage than the very few who take to it so early and love the sport through college.

Tackle football on the other hand, well, kids are going to play it. I was one of those kids whose mom wouldn't let me play until junior high. So we played tackle with no pads and no supervision up by the elementary school and in our friends' yards. I knocked one of my buddies out cold in his back yard one time covering a kickoff when he fell forward into my knee as it was coming up. Fortunately his mom was home at the time. I broke my wrist in one of those games and never said anything. Learned that it was broken when I had an xray in college for another injury and the calcification of the bone dated to about that timeframe.

BTW, when I was finally allowed to play for my JR High, I scored on my 1st touch. Middle KO return, through the first wave and broke it to the outside for the score to open the first game.

With wrestling you almost have to start in elementary school to be really good unless you're an amazing athlete. Many of our best wrestlers in high school were youth state champs or close to it. I think you can pick up football later because at the lower levels for the most part it doesn't really resemble what you get even in high school.

 

[Thomas1945]

We used to occasionally do that drill, and the results were often hilarious. One coach who ran it, was with me being kind, not a Mensa candidate. Frankly neither were most of us players. After every player being assigned a number the drill began with one player in the middle.
He would call out a number, and that player would attack the one in the ring. Being a sadist he often called two numbers which became interesting. Sometimes he called out the number of the guy in the middle, and I guess he expected the player to either block or tackle himself, which we found unusual. Sometimes ( because 30 seconds or so had elapsed since being given a number ) players forgot their number which slowed the action somewhat.

 

[sss]

Anyone ever seen 5-year-olds wrestling in PA? My cousin had his kid wrestling at 5 and I went to his match one time. The only thing that I could guarantee is that at least one and maybe both of the kids would be coming off the mat crying. That was every match. This is an example IMO of too early for a sport. It's probably doing more damage than the very few who take to it so early and love the sport through college.

Tackle football on the other hand, well, kids are going to play it. I was one of those kids whose mom wouldn't let me play until junior high. So we played tackle with no pads and no supervision up by the elementary school and in our friends' yards. I knocked one of my buddies out cold in his back yard one time covering a kickoff when he fell forward into my knee as it was coming up. Fortunately his mom was home at the time. I broke my wrist in one of those games and never said anything. Learned that it was broken when I had an xray in college for another injury and the calcification of the bone dated to about that timeframe.

BTW, when I was finally allowed to play for my JR High, I scored on my 1st touch. Middle KO return, through the first wave and broke it to the outside for the score to open the first game.

Yeah, well I can still throw a football over that their mountain.

 

[bdgan]

I've had a couple sons in youth football - more my wife's doing than mine, even though I'm a huge football fan. I don't think kids should play until 14 or so. Don't kid yourself - kids get concussions and other injuries even in the 4th and 5th grade version. A kid on my son's 6th-grade team last year was basically my size (6'0 200+) already. They have weight limits on who can be a ball carrier, but not on defense or offensive line. Some of the middle school coaches I talked to when my oldest was in 5th grade a few years back were drooling over a 4th-grader who was about the same size or bigger already. I'm sure there are exceptions, but IMO at the lower ages it's basically just a lot of kids running into each other. Most of the kids don't really understand what they're trying to do.

We had A, B, and C leagues that were based on age but with weight limits.

 

[bcspsu]

We had A, B, and C leagues that were based on age but with weight limits.

Our youth football league had weight limits for each age group too.

 

[bison13]

We had A, B, and C leagues that were based on age but with weight limits.

We do a lot of things now to keep the bigger kids from hurting smaller kids, evern in the same weight divisions. Wearing a stripe or cover on the helmet to make sure those kids play on the OL/DL only and are not allowed to run with the ball even on fumbles. They cant play on KO team or punt unless they are the punter or kicker. Basically anytime they touch the ball its dead. Defenses can not stack the line as at least five kids must be at least 5 yards off the ball, no rush on punt/kick.

Plus all coaches must take the heads up tackling class before they coach a single practice and one of our first practices is a league wide tackling practice. If kids/parents dont like what we do they can go play in the unlimited league where it is just by age.

 

[Texas Lion]

Could it be that, although all levels have some risk, that the NFL numbers are more inflated because they are bigger and faster? what do the CTE #'s say about those that ended after D1, D-2, D-3, High School, Jr. High?

 

[McCloudersportLion]

People mock and complain about Dabo being The Lawd first but the other side of that coin is corny reddit atheists that think they can make the world safeproof.

 

[bdgan]

We do a lot of things now to keep the bigger kids from hurting smaller kids, evern in the same weight divisions. Wearing a stripe or cover on the helmet to make sure those kids play on the OL/DL only and are not allowed to run with the ball even on fumbles. They cant play on KO team or punt unless they are the punter or kicker. Basically anytime they touch the ball its dead. Defenses can not stack the line as at least five kids must be at least 5 yards off the ball, no rush on punt/kick.

Plus all coaches must take the heads up tackling class before they coach a single practice and one of our first practices is a league wide tackling practice. If kids/parents dont like what we do they can go play in the unlimited league where it is just by age.

Side story about youth football. We had a mercy rule that prevented teams from running up the score. Win by more than 42 pts and you forfeit. We had a really good team that was 1 win away from the championship. We were winning 35-0 at half and playing with all subs. The coaches told the backup players to run 10 yards and fall down. we scored once to make the score 41-0 so we took a knee on the XP. The opposing team had the ball at midfield and their coach called a TO with seconds remaining. For their last play their QB took the snap and ran backwards through the end zone for a safety. We won 43-0, had to forfeit, and missed the championship game. Our fans booed and so did their fans who were ashamed by the poor sportsmanship. The rule was changed the next year.

 

[joeaubie21]

It's their way out! Do not cheat them.

 

[Online Persona]

Could it be that, although all levels have some risk, that the NFL numbers are more inflated because they are bigger and faster? what do the CTE #'s say about those that ended after D1, D-2, D-3, High School, Jr. High?

CTE is the result of repeated TBI. TBI becomes easier and easier with each iteration of it. TBI is the result of the brain moving through the cerebral fluid (the breaks) with enough speed that brain matter impacts the cranium and then swells or bleeds. The way that the brain matter achieves enough speed to overcome the cerebral fluid is through large accelerations as the cerebral fluid (a viscous fluid) acts to decelerate the brain matter.

Large accelerations are achieved by having large impulses (a large force as a function of time times (really the dot product) the differential element of time of impact). There are two ways to analyze the impulse of a collision.

1) Maximizing the force experienced due to impact which then maximizes the acceleration of the brain matter (F=ma), can be achieved when the time of the collision is reduced. This is done when you have a) a fast, violent hit and b) the collision occurs over a smaller surface area that is harder and therefore less compression and envelopment occurs on the impact surfaces (think of dropping an egg on the floor versus if it were to be dropped into a net that envelopes it and slows the collision down or in the practical sense of this discussion, a helmet to helmet hit).

2) Maximizing the acceleration can be achieved by maximizing the rate of momentum change with respect to time (F = dP/dt, or the original way Newton's 2nd law was written dP/dt = ma). To maximize the rate of change of momentum with respect to time, you would need to decrease the time of collision (we already covered this) or maximize the change in momentum (p = mv) by either increasing the masses or the velocity of the masses in the collision.

The point of the above analysis is that the larger and faster the players in the collisions as well as helmet to helmet collisions maximize the acceleration of the brain matter causing a higher likelihood of that brain matter impacting the skull (and with greater force) of the players. The force of the impact of the brain matter with the skull usually results in more trauma to the brain matter.

This is why we have helmets in the first place btw. They cause a slower head-to-head collision over a greater surface area with more deformation than if it were skull to skull. The unfortunate thing is that additional protection can be viewed as a weapon. I have some concepts for improved helmet design based on physics (a mix of similar concepts used in auto safety design and hydraulic breaks). But the crux of the problem is always going to be bigger players, moving faster, and hitting helmet to helmet.

 

[Obliviax]

CTE is the result of repeated TBI. TBI becomes easier and easier with each iteration of it. TBI is the result of the brain moving through the cerebral fluid (the breaks) with enough speed that brain matter impacts the cranium and then swells or bleeds. The way that the brain matter achieves enough speed to overcome the cerebral fluid is through large accelerations as the cerebral fluid (a viscous fluid) acts to decelerate the brain matter.

Large accelerations are achieved by having large impulses (a large force as a function of time times (really the dot product) the differential element of time of impact). There are two ways to analyze the impulse of a collision.

1) Maximizing the force experienced due to impact which then maximizes the acceleration of the brain matter (F=ma), can be achieved when the time of the collision is reduced. This is done when you have a) a fast, violent hit and b) the collision occurs over a smaller surface area that is harder and therefore less compression and envelopment occurs on the impact surfaces (think of dropping an egg on the floor versus if it were to be dropped into a net that envelopes it and slows the collision down or in the practical sense of this discussion, a helmet to helmet hit).

2) Maximizing the acceleration can be achieved by maximizing the rate of momentum change with respect to time (F = dP/dt, or the original way Newton's 2nd law was written dP/dt = ma). To maximize the rate of change of momentum with respect to time, you would need to decrease the time of collision (we already covered this) or maximize the change in momentum (p = mv) by either increasing the masses or the velocity of the masses in the collision.

The point of the above analysis is that the larger and faster the players in the collisions as well as helmet to helmet collisions maximize the acceleration of the brain matter causing a higher likelihood of that brain matter impacting the skull (and with greater force) of the players. The force of the impact of the brain matter with the skull usually results in more trauma to the brain matter.

This is why we have helmets in the first place btw. They cause a slower head-to-head collision over a greater surface area with more deformation than if it were skull to skull. The unfortunate thing is that additional protection can be viewed as a weapon. I have some concepts for improved helmet design based on physics (a mix of similar concepts used in auto safety design and hydraulic breaks). But the crux of the problem is always going to be bigger players, moving faster, and hitting helmet to helmet.

I have a pet peeve with this and have for quite some time. If football powers really wanted to do something, they'd pad the outside of the helmets. Teams have been doing this for decades. There is simply no reason to make football helmets as hard as rocks other than teams like to use them as weapons.