Let the poaching begin
- Thread starter ChiTownLion
- Start date
You mean UMD and RU? Desperate coaches do desperate things. This puts him closer to those two, not tOSU. I don't like it at all, legal or not. JH is desperate and his actions speak loudly as to how desperate he is.
I mean compete success wise, not tactics wise. His measure is tOSU and he ain't stackin' up so well so far. Hence the desperation.
It is remarkable that it's come to this so soon. UM fans were pretty confident when they hired him. No wonder. Heck, I thought that they'd have much more success with him than they have - especially if you consider that Hoke left the cupboard full of talent. Last season should have been their season. A mediocre QB and lack of offensive imagination doomed them to disappointment.
I generally try to stay out of it with this level of vitriol toward my dear alma mater. And I’m not interested in arguing whether Harbaugh is a dbag or an ahole, whether he’s being unfair to current kids in the roster, or his inability to develop talent (you guys have fun with that)....but is it really “poaching” to recruit kids who have requested and received their releases from a program which was just heavily sanctioned by the NCAA?
I’ll sit back and watch the hate spew at me. Hoping one or more will actually respond to the question though.
I’ll sit back and watch the hate spew at me. Hoping one or more will actually respond to the question though.
Admit. A decade ago, you'd never have guessed that Michigan would have come to this point. You guys go out and recruit players out of high school, tell them that they are "Michigan Men", and then blithely recruit over them when it suits you. Seems fair to me that if this QB comes, then Michigan should release Peters and McCaffrey and let them go wherever they want, without penalty, and allow them to play next year. In fact, if Harbaugh is going to do this, then every Michigan player should be accorded the same privilege. It's only fair.
Of course, the NCAA would never allow it, hypocritical bastards that they are. But don't give me any more drivel about being Leaders and Best. Nothing matters but winning anymore, no matter how, no matter where.
Of course, the NCAA would never allow it, hypocritical bastards that they are. But don't give me any more drivel about being Leaders and Best. Nothing matters but winning anymore, no matter how, no matter where.
There are plenty of things I never could’ve guessed about the developments at both Michigan and Penn State over the past decade. You got me there.
That said, I haven’t seen where anyone associated with UM has restricted Peters or McCaffrey from transferring (nor where they’ve requested to do so). I did see where Harbaugh didn’t want Speight to go but granted him his request for a release anyway.
On a technical note, I don’t believe Peters would be eligible to play next year at another FBS school because of NCAA transfer rules - that’s not anything UM can control. Same thing is true of two of the three Ole Miss players visiting UM this weekend - they played this season and aren’t rising seniors, therefore they can’t play next season without an NCAA-granted waiver.
To my earlier question...how is this “poaching”?
Obviously, those kids can't transfer without penalty. That's the whole point of the hypocrisy. Harbaugh commits himself to those kids, and before they even get a chance to play, a situation like this comes up and they are potentially behind a multiple-year starter. That, to me, is a slap in the face to those kids. I'm quite sure that they take it that way, as well.
The upshot is, you're a Michigan Man, until Harbaugh decides you're not. And there's nothing you can do about it.
If Harbaugh keeps doing things like this, it will hurt his recruiting eventually. Why would anybody with an ounce of self-esteem believe a single word he says?
The upshot is, you're a Michigan Man, until Harbaugh decides you're not. And there's nothing you can do about it.
If Harbaugh keeps doing things like this, it will hurt his recruiting eventually. Why would anybody with an ounce of self-esteem believe a single word he says?
He is a total fraud. When he was at Stanford he slammed Michigan for losing their academic values etc but then he tries to recruit kids from a scandal ridden SEC program. Can't understand why anyone would want to play for the goof.
Sitting on the other side of that fence before for completely different reasons not related to the NCAA but still sanctioned....I can tell you it is chickensh!t and usually done by desperate coaches. And I don't feel sorry for the kids at Ole Miss being stuck there as half of them had their GD hands out as that school was trying to play catch up with the rest of the cheating SEC West.
I'm sure you really think no feelers were put out by the UM staff at all....it was all just those kids reaching out one way. Unlike the PSU sanctions, the kids at Ole Miss were a part of the problem as that school was making the deal with the devil. The kids at PSU were kids themselves and had jack crap to do with what Jerry did, but that didn't matter to Emmert and company. Nor the disgusting coaches acting like ambulance chasing lawyers.
Oh well....you're usually a good poster, but to not see how wrong this is on pretty much every level starting at the NCAA on down...well that is your bad. Sorry but the a-hole coaches that did this in the past all ate some really bad karma later on......so please spare me the kids made Jimmy do it and hopefully his desperate moves will be justified by you next year. If not the smell of kerosene in AA will grow thicker and thicker with each passing year and nothing to show for it...yet.
Ignoring the ~80% of this post which I promised I’m not here to argue...
“The kids made Jimmy do it” is most certainly not something I’m arguing. I’m sorry if that’s what you took away. To be perfectly clear, even if they reached out first, that doesn’t mean UM had to reciprocate the interest. My question though...is it “poaching” if you recruit kids who requested and received their release from another program? For example, is whichever program signs Speight “poaching” given Harbaugh didn’t want him to leave but granted the release anyway?
On another note - and I’m not trying to get into the weeds on this part i promise...
With respect to the three kids in question, I certainly don’t know whether they took money too. I do know they weren’t cited in the NCAA investigation or findings. And one of them (Deontay Anderson) sat out the season voluntarily and retained counsel to potentially sue Ole Miss for misleading him about it when they recruited him. It certainly *seems* to me a kid who had taken improper benefits wouldn’t do that. But yes, that only speaks to one of the three - and I agree that Patterson’s brother getting a job at Ole Miss after he committed was clearly no coincidence.
So basically you felt some guilt felt some sort of guilt or shame? Don't sweat it, he's a nut.
That's college sports....my son went through it in baseball. It's not high school where you get your shot just because you're an upperclassman....the coaches are always trying to recruit someone better.
Oh it's poaching and he is desperate. Thought you could put 2 and 2 together, guess not. Defend away.
I think we're just sensitive to this because of how Illinois handled things when our guys were set free.
I understand why current players and recruits won't like this. That may hurt him long term but if these guys wanted to come here I'd hope Franklin would talk to them if they fit scheme
I understand why current players and recruits won't like this. That may hurt him long term but if these guys wanted to come here I'd hope Franklin would talk to them if they fit scheme
I would like to think he wouldn't knowing the history, but nothing would surprise me anymore. NCAA let the sharks run the show while they collect the dough.
IMO, Its fine if the player visit another school in this situation, but to have opposing coaches on the campus of another team trying to recruit players off said team just doesn't sit right with me and I would not be happy if Franklin did that either. NCAA grants the kids right to transfer, fine let them go take visits and make a decision, but the coaches need to stay on their own campus.
Appreciate that response and totally respect your view on it. Seems like a perfectly reasonable place to draw the line.
Question for clarification: When you say “trying to recruit players off said team,” I assume you’re saying it doesn’t matter that they had already requested to be released from “said team,” right?
Thanks.
Sounds to me like you know this isn't a good look, and you're looking for reasons to justify and feel better about it.
Chasing transfer is not a good look for UM and JH. What other Power 5 conference school is doing this? Does AL do this? tOSU? ....
Also historically, I do not recall UM chasing transfers. And he is chasing them.
PSU has had some transfers over the years but I do not recall JoePa or others actively going after players announcing they were leaving their schools.
Given the state of college sports .... could this become more commonplace in the future?
Also historically, I do not recall UM chasing transfers. And he is chasing them.
PSU has had some transfers over the years but I do not recall JoePa or others actively going after players announcing they were leaving their schools.
Given the state of college sports .... could this become more commonplace in the future?
How is brining in a kid who has requested a release from a sanctioned school any different than bringing in a JUCO?
If I was looking to feel better about it, I’d just stick on the UM boards. Grateful to @harjeff for cutting through the noise to engage in an honest conversation.
Definitely agree with this. I think it’s interesting that when Patterson’s family started making noise about UM before the season ended (which I mentioned here), UM shut it down and told them they wouldn’t talk until after he got his release. I don’t know the story with Jefferson and Anderson, but Patterson’s story seems to fit with what you (and I) find acceptable.
Of course he is chasing them. He has a QB problem apparently....just don't tell me he isn't an ambulance chaser at this moment. It is poaching and he is desperate to win as it is expected for his salary. He knows it and I'm not sure why anyone would get so offended by it. He had a young team this year that returns a ton and he is looking to fill some pieces of that puzzle. I didn't expect to see him go full Beckman, but he did. Maybe we can start to call him Jimmy Beckman?
You don't see a difference here? I find that hard to believe.
Having NCAA coaches show up at the Ole Miss campus, to me, is unseemly. If I'm wrong, then we'll see all kinds of NCAA coaches crawling all over the place. I'm sure some will. Let's see who Harbaugh is joined by. The company he keeps will tell you all you need to know.
You should ask McCaffrey and Peters what they think of this. As I said earlier in the thread, they should be permitted to leave via special dispensation if the QB kid is coming in via special dispensation. That's only fair. Seems to me that they are the ones being unfairly punished here. After all, they played by the rules.
I meant back when they were recruited. I mean, otherwise, why would Patterson's family pull UM out of a hat? Unless there was some kind of prior relationship, I find the newfound interest "hinkey".
I think the most glaring issue is that Harbaugh has yet to be able to identify a good high school qb and develop him into a good college qb. His best season at Mich came with a qb transfer Rudock. None of the qb’s he recruited to date have developed well
“Harbaugh commits himself to those kids, and before they even get a chance to play, a situation like this comes up and they are potentially behind a multiple-year starter. “
I’m speaking specifically to this point. You seem very concerned about the kids who JH recruited out of high school. Do you feel the same way about the kids who committed to PSU out of high school but are now potentially losing their jobs to JUCOs?
I’m speaking specifically to this point. You seem very concerned about the kids who JH recruited out of high school. Do you feel the same way about the kids who committed to PSU out of high school but are now potentially losing their jobs to JUCOs?
