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FC: Princeton MLAX coach placed on leave

Tom McAndrew

Well-Known Member
May 29, 2001
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did any of you see this, or see a replay of it?

basically, in a game between Princeton and Brown, Princeton's head coach, Chris Bates, was on the field (not supposed to be across the boundary lines). then as a Brown player was running off the field for a substitution (in LAX, there is an area around the center of the midfield line, where all players being subbed must exit, and all players subbing must enter), Bates lowered his shoulder into the Brown LAX player that was exiting the field.

Brown had a 7-6 lead at the time, but ended up winning the game 19-8.

will be interesting to see how this plays out.

you can see video of the incident at THIS LINK.
 
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Very childish on his part, but I don't see a need for severe punishment. It was just a little tap. Now if someone did this to my kid... off with his head
 
Trying to claim it was an accident won't fly. Maybe he'll try to claim he was just being friendly, kind of like when an opponent walks and you give him a slap on the back. Judging by the player's reaction I'd guess that wasn't the case here.
 
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Trying to claim it was an accident won't fly. Maybe he'll try to claim he was just being friendly, kind of like when an opponent walks and you give him a slap on the back. Judging by the player's reaction I'd guess that wasn't the case here.
Agree, not an accident but not a clothesline either. If it were up to me I'd dock him a couple games and have him apologize.
 
What causes grown men to act like adolescents? As an attorney, I have been tempted to say "Objection your Honor. Opposing counsel is being a total asshole" but I know that is not appropriate conduct and so I do not. Whatever your chosen profession, you know there are certain boundaries that cannot be crossed. This should not be something you have to think about, you just know it instinctively. As a coach you have to understand you can never touch an opposing player except to assist them if they are injured or to congratulate or console them after a game. Unless there are circumstances we are unaware of (and there may be), I think the punishment should be severe. Not termination, but perhaps a fine and lengthy suspension.
 
It was an obvious attempt at giving the kid an elbow. The way the coach walks away, I think he knew as soon as he did it that he had done something real stupid. If I was the University President, I would sit down and see if his apology was geniune and the guy just made a heat of the moment screw up or if he was saying sorry just to get out from under this. Also, does the guy have any history of blowing his cool too much etc….the answers to those questions would make punishment go from a couple of games to being fired.
 
That's pretty absurd and unacceptable. Suspension for the rest of the year (Princeton lacrosse isn't exactly going places in 2016 anyway) should be on the table.
 
PSU Men's Lax #11 in the new poll with a HUGE match with MD looming...

Biggest PSU lacrosse match that I can remember.

7 PM on a Sunday is not an ideal time, however. Won't help the crowd. TV (BTN) makes the schedules though, not simply for football. Even for smaller-scale sports like lacrosse.

If we beat Maryland, the only undefeated teams in B1G conference play would be PSU and Rutgers! Rutgers had a 16-9 win over Hopkins this weekend, their team is actually looking pretty good.
 
did any of you see this, or see a replay of it?

basically, in a game between Princeton and Brown, Princeton's head coach, Chris Bates, was on the field (not supposed to be across the boundary lines). then as a Brown player was running off the field for a substitution (in LAX, there is an area around the center of the midfield line, where all players being subbed must exit, and all players subbing must enter), Bates lowered his shoulder into the Brown LAX player that was exiting the field.

Brown had a 7-6 lead at the time, but ended up winning the game 19-8.

will be interesting to see how this plays out.

you can see video of the incident at THIS LINK.


That attempt at a block actually makes our offensive line play look good!
 
you can see video of the incident at [URL='http://www.insidelacrosse.com/article/princeton-coach-bates-placed-on-adminstrative-leave-after-on-field-incident-with-brown-player/34615' said:
THIS LINK[/URL].


Watching that video .... seems like much ado about nothing to me. I did not see a lowered shoulder. More like a flying elbow that mostly missed the target.
 
Watching that video .... seems like much ado about nothing to me. I did not see a lowered shoulder. More like a flying elbow that mostly missed the target.

There are coaches that act like a$$ clowns on the sidelines, and they get away with it. There are a lot of coaches that are less than honorable in the way they manage their teams during practice, recruiting, etc., and they get away with it. They do so because they are not breaking a rule (or not doing so in a major way), and because they don't embarrass the institution that they are representing.

I don't think Princeton had a lot of options in this situation. As you noted, the elbow that Coach Bates threw at Brown University's John Yozzo-Scaperrotta wasn't a great shot. However, it was the head coach of Princeton striking a player of an opposing team. Princeton couldn't act as though that were acceptable, and allow Bates to continue as head coach. They could have suspended him for some interval. Or, they could have fired him. They probably worked through the pros and cons of each in their discussions, and in the end felt they could not allow him to continue as the head coach.

From the NCAA rule book:

Rule 2 Game Personnel

Coaches
Section 4
The head coach shall act in a courteous manner and also shall endeavor in every way to achieve the same from team members. The head coach also shall be in control of and be responsible for the actions of any and all people officially connected with his or her institution.

Coaches shall assist the officials in keeping the game under control. It shall be their duty, upon the request of an official, to control effectively actions of spectators not in conformity with standards of proper conduct.

Rule 5 Personal and Expulsion Fouls
Expulsion Fouls

Fighting and Flagrant Misconduct
Section 14
Fighting is defined as a player, substitute, nonplaying member of a squad, coach or anyone officially connected with a team deliberately striking or attempting to strike anyone in a malicious manner, or leaving the bench or coaches area during an altercation.
(I won't copy all the rules on the penalty, but basically you are booted from that game, can not be on the bench, on the sideline, or with the spectators, and you have to sit the following game as well.)

Rule 6 Technical Fouls

Conduct Foul
Section 7
A coach shall not enter the field of play without the permission of an official, except to attend to an injured player or to warm up a goalkeeper, or during halftime.


So, the head coach is responsible for the behavior of all players, support personnel, and fans of his institution. In addition, he's not allowed onto the field without the permission of the ref. And, it's a violation to deliberately strike anyone (even someone on your team). Coach Bates didn't just push things a bit, he violated two rules, and showed that he could not be responsible for his own actions, let alone his teams, and as such violated a third rule.

If video of the incident didn't exist, and a ref had not noticed it (which is quite possible, as it was away from the field of play, and where the ball was), it's quite possible that nothing would have happened to Bates. With the action being captured on video, Princeton only had a couple of options, and I think they went with the best option.
 
off the subject: What does a HC in LAX receive in salary? Ivy League?

A lot more than I thought...
Its not exactly current but here are a couple articles...

http://articles.baltimoresun.com/20...1_lacrosse-coach-dom-starsia-college-lacrosse

http://www.denverpost.com/colleges/ci_12565687

also found this...

>>In lacrosse, where Maryland is a traditional power, men’s coach John Tillman made $248,194 and women’s coach Cathy Reese, who just led her team to a national championship, made $177,503.<<
 
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A lot more than I thought...
Its not exactly current but here are a couple articles...

http://articles.baltimoresun.com/20...1_lacrosse-coach-dom-starsia-college-lacrosse

http://www.denverpost.com/colleges/ci_12565687

also found this...

>>In lacrosse, where Maryland is a traditional power, men’s coach John Tillman made $248,194 and women’s coach Cathy Reese, who just led her team to a national championship, made $177,503.<<
Thank you BBbrown, enjoyed the Denver article & the other. I definitely have to get to State College and watch a game, never seen one in person. My wife and d-in-law frequent State College for field hockey camps and tournaments. Midweek after the B/W game they'll be taking my HS junior granddaughter to PSU to a tournament.

Several years ago they went to see one of our friends daughter (Gabby) play against Penn State. Gabby played for Indiana. My wife told me the speed of the ball & play was so fast, they couldn't get over it. She said the ball flew across the turf as if it were ice. I imagine the same for lacrosse, watching on the screen vs. live action along the sidelines.
 
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Thank you BBbrown, enjoyed the Denver article & the other. I definitely have to get to State College and watch a game, never seen one in person. My wife and d-in-law frequent State College for field hockey camps and tournaments. Midweek after the B/W game they'll be taking my HS junior granddaughter to PSU to a tournament.

For PSU Women's LAX, they have a home game against Northwestern at noon on April 23rd. That might be at the tail-end of your granddaughter's schedule.

For PSU Mens' LAX, they have a home game against John Hopkins on Sunday at 7 pm of Blue-White weekend.

She said the ball flew across the turf [for field hockey] as if it were ice. I imagine the same for lacrosse, watching on the screen vs. live action along the sidelines.

College LAX is amazing. It bears no resemblance to high school LAX -- even to games played by elite high school teams. The players are so fast, and so skilled. You can have long stretches where the ball doesn't hit the ground, unless it's on a shot/block of a shot. Also, counters can make you dizzy. A turnover at one end of the field can be a shot on goal at the other end in just 5 seconds, with a few perfect passes.

The men's game is quite different than the women's game, but both are fun to watch.
 
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For PSU Women's LAX, they have a home game against Northwestern at noon on April 23rd. That might be at the tail-end of your granddaughter's schedule.

For PSU Mens' LAX, they have a home game against John Hopkins on Sunday at 7 pm of Blue-White weekend.



College LAX is amazing. It bears no resemblance to high school LAX -- even to games played by elite high school teams. The players are so fast, and so skilled. You can have long stretches where the ball doesn't hit the ground, unless it's on a shot/block of a shot. Also, counters can make you dizzy. A turnover at one end of the field can be a shot on goal at the other end in just 5 seconds, with a few perfect passes.

The men's game is quite different than the women's game, but both are fun to watch.
Thank you much for the heads Tom up on the lacrosse game. I'll check the official PSU site for scheduling.

Sun., Apr. 17 vs. Johns Hopkins *
media-icon-tv.gif
University Park, Pa. 7:00 p.m. ET, next is the following
Friday (Rutgers) & Saturday (home)
 
Yes hlstone, Gabby Olshemski. Her dad-my doctor-mention to me she is doing an internship with a notably law firm, but I forget the name. Gabby also helped one of my grandboys @ PSU with his law SAT's over the Christmas break.

My kid and her little sister play lax, soccer, and field hockey together. Her father, (your Dr) and I coached them in soccer together. The Dr. is quite intense on the sidelines. I really enjoy his families' company. Wonderful people.
 
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My kid and her little sister play lax, soccer, and field hockey together. Her father, (your Dr) and I coached them in soccer together. The Dr. is quite intense on the sidelines. I really enjoy his families' company. Wonderful people.
Cool, sometimes you have to settle Frank down a little. Give him a couple of blood pressure pills. I was involved with Frank, Gary Baker (Lisa's husband) and Dale Englehart since my grandson TJ was 7 years old. We were family for 15 years, now we separated somewhat since the boys are grown. We had some really terrific times together. little league, all star & legion teams. What a great ride and the kids gave us a lot of fun the kids gave us.
 
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Lmao, yep you know Frank, as intense as ever. My kid wants his kid to go to Lehman. His kid wants my kid to go to Redeemer. They are so good at sports, and have a lot of fun together.

If you want to see our girls play Lax, they will be playing a tourney at LLHS this Sunday. His kid is one of the superstars of the team (of course).
 
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Lmao, yep you know Frank, as intense as ever. My kid wants his kid to go to Lehman. His kid wants my kid to go to Redeemer. They are so good at sports, and have a lot of fun together.

If you want to see our girls play Lax, they will be playing a tourney at LLHS this Sunday. His kid is one of the superstars of the team (of course).
There may be 4 inches of new snow on the turf, thanks for the invitation. I may wonder over, I'm only a few miles distance.
 
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Hey gang,
An update on the tourney Step and I were discussing. My kids team went 2-1-1. It was a 7/8 th grade tourney, we were mostly 5/6 graders on our team and they played great. We tied Sem and lost to Danville 3-2.

During the Danville game, my kid drew 3 charging calls in the first 15 minutes(which is a caused turnover). On the last one she went out for the game and wanted to be done for the day, but coach said he needed her in there and she returned.

Cold day lots of fun.

PS Step, Gabby's parents say hi. They speak highly of you.
 
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