Haven't seen comments here but I'm curious as to opinions now that Hinkie is gone. Strange to say but as not much of a fan, for me losing was like winning. The more losses the more ping pong balls. I think the new regime will waste the "assets", strive to make the team an 8th seed out in the first round and that creates no rooting interest. Record losing created interest, not fans in the seats but who are the top college players and whom can they get in the draft. Regularly surfed for mock drafts, anyone else?
76'ers - The Process
- Thread starter psulongago
- Start date
The diehard fans had been wanting a complete teardown for a long time. The only way to win championships in the nba is to get 3 or 4 all stars. The only way a team like the Sixers was going to get 3 or 4 all stars is at the top of the draft. Of course, there are no guarantees that Hinkie's plan was going to work, just like there are no guarantees for any of the other 30 teams in the league. But this is a team that has gotten out of the first round of the playoffs, what, a handful of times in the past 30 years? Hinkie won every trade he made, and with a 50/50 chance at the Lakers pick at 4 or 5 this year along with their own Top 4 pick, with Embiid and Saric playing for them in the fall as well, this is when it was all going to come together. Was a body blow to have him quit after he was kneecapped by Colangelo, the old b@stard.
Cut my interest in the team by 80%. Not sure how much I'll be following in the future.
Cut my interest in the team by 80%. Not sure how much I'll be following in the future.
Don't forget they have picks 23 and 27. There is a 50/50 chance they could walk out of the draft with 2 of the 3 of Simmons, Hield, and Dunn... Even if not 3 first round picks and 2 next year that shouldn't be bad and a crap ton of assets and cap room. This is what he was losing for, this offseason and now he's gone.
my thoughts, which is why I posted. Will watch the ping pong balls, the draft and follow trades but when they create a mediocre team I will have lost any interest.
I'm rooting for Brandon Ingram and Jamal Murray. I'm not taking a chance with Simmons never figuring out how to shoot. Dun didn't have a very good season. Murray really came on for the 2nd half of the year, and I think he can do more than Hield.
The most amusing thing, in a sick way, was Josh Harris and Baby Colangelo constantly talking in that press conference about how well the Sixers are set up going into the future, with all these assets. Well then why the hell did you screw over Hinkie, you moron?
bwifan
Well-Known Member
I was in favor of letting Sam stay and finish it out and finally start rebuilding. But I also saw how other owners were getting ticked off and the pressure was growing on ownership to start reversing the trend and start building and spending money. So I didn't have a big problem getting rid of Sam. My big problem is they should of gotten rid of Sam back when they brought Colangelo on board and not left Sam flapping in the wind. We all saw the writing on the wall he was gone. And it really bothers me that Colangelo brought his son on to run the team. Colangelo has won nothing when running a team and his son's draft picks are a horrible to say the least. Neither has been that successful in the NBA. If Harris had brought in a good GM with a proven record I would be totally on board. Right now this smells of nepotism at its finest and the father and son are milking Harris for all he has.... My fear is they burn through the draft picks and we get no usable players and they over pay free agents and we end up having to tear it all down again. I am actually hoping with the new practice facility Harris and his ego of making money are looking to sell the team quickly. We get an owner who really cares about the franchise...
Not sure Hinkie was the guy they wanted to be making the picks or trades. He was successfully acquiring "assets" but who knows what he was going to do with them. He has alienated the other GMs in the league and was ineffective as a communicator. I'm ok with having someone who knows basketball be in charge of the draft, not just a statistical analyst. It's a team sport.
Who the f would you rather be making trades than Hinkie? The trade he made with Sacramento has the potential to be one of the biggest robberies of all time. If the Lakers pick conveys at #4 this year, that is also a highway robbery for MCW who is garbage.
We get to flip picks with a perennial loser like Sacramento 2 times. That is unbelievable deal
Plus get their 2019 unprotected 1st round pick, the year after Cousins' deal expires. And got Stauskas. All for taking on cap garbage, that we had to spend the money any way.
I was in favor of the plan but Hinkie had to go. He had 5 1st rd picks so far and he produced a 10 win team. That is a disgrace.
Colangelo is a loser too.
They had to finish below the Lakers, to give themselves a better chance at that pick conveying. They won 10 wins by design. They weren't trying to win. He had two #1 picks playing, Noel and Okafor. Okafor just had a season where he was the youngest player to average over 15 ppg at better than 50% shooting. His other 3 picks Embiid, Saric, and the Lakers pick for MCW, will probably be playing next year.
I understand the casual fan doesn't have the patience for "The Process", but it was the right thing to do.
http://www.sactownroyalty.com/2015/10/16/9553765/what-happens-to-the-kings-first-round-pick
This break down every scenario. What is incredible is that Scremento could win the lottery next year and we could flip picks to be number 1 from wherever in the draft and then they could win the lottery again in 2019 and we get that pick too. Unbelievable.
Not really. They did not plan on MCW not fitting and trading him. The design was AFTER the fact that most of their picks did not fit. Hinkie did not plan on getting pushed out the door.
The process is the right thing to do if it results in getting better which Hinkie did not do. In three years Hinkie put together a team that competed for the worst record ALL time. No excuse for that.
They were $20 to $30 million below the cap. If they wanted to win, don't you think they would have signed free agents so they could win 30 games and accomplish NOTHING?
Yes, boo hoo, they won 10 games. And if they land Simmons or Ingram and they turn out to be the next Durant and Lebron, it will be forgotten quickly.
Lots of ifs in the process. Sorry, not a fan of intentionally losing for 5 years for the possibility you might win big.
Were you a fan of UNintentionally losing for 5 straight years? Other than 2001 which 76ers team from 1990-2013 had a good game plan? The 2001 team was built around a #1 pick.
The Hinkie plan was fine. His execution of the plan was the problem.
PS. Can you Tell us YOUR plan that guarantees the team will win big?
I think they really were going to keep Hinkie around to handle the analytics and cap side, but they needed someone who could communicate and evaluate some talent. Hinkie didn't like that arrangement, so Hinkie then quit. At this point I would have liked to see how the final chapter played out.
Its not true that Colengelo has done nothing ever. He's been executive of the year a couple times, and left Toronto in pretty good shape..... currently the second seed in the East. Has he won a title? No.....
The whole plan was to get cap space and draft picks. They need some luck to make them all good draft picks. And some dang good talent evaluation. You draft a couple guys with bad attitudes or bad knees (or feet) and you are screwed.
I didn't love the plan. Who likes to suck and be historically for three years. Teams of all young guys don't win much in the NBA. A lot of lottery picks and nothing to really show for it yet. If this were Penn State football, we would be screaming for everyone's head.
Its not true that Colengelo has done nothing ever. He's been executive of the year a couple times, and left Toronto in pretty good shape..... currently the second seed in the East. Has he won a title? No.....
The whole plan was to get cap space and draft picks. They need some luck to make them all good draft picks. And some dang good talent evaluation. You draft a couple guys with bad attitudes or bad knees (or feet) and you are screwed.
I didn't love the plan. Who likes to suck and be historically for three years. Teams of all young guys don't win much in the NBA. A lot of lottery picks and nothing to really show for it yet. If this were Penn State football, we would be screaming for everyone's head.
It was going to be a young team, but with Embiid, Okafor, Noel, Saric, maybe Ingram and/or Murray, two other first round picks, and $30 mil in cap space....and the possibility of trading Okafor or Noel for a big time guard....this was always going to be a 20 to 30 win team in 2016-17.
They got a little unlucky. They had two high picks in years when there was hardly any talent.
It was well known that Embiid was a gamble -- big guys with injured feet usually never play much -- ask Sam Bowie or Bill Walton. If the docs can fix Embiid's foot it will be something close to a miracle.
But they didn't have much alternative -- if they didn't pick Embiid there wasn't anyone on the board with all star potential.
I think they have two more years of high picks plus some other 1st and 2nd round picks, plus they can hopefully get Saric to come play in the NBA.
But right now Okafor is probably their only player who is better than NBA average at his position.
It was well known that Embiid was a gamble -- big guys with injured feet usually never play much -- ask Sam Bowie or Bill Walton. If the docs can fix Embiid's foot it will be something close to a miracle.
But they didn't have much alternative -- if they didn't pick Embiid there wasn't anyone on the board with all star potential.
I think they have two more years of high picks plus some other 1st and 2nd round picks, plus they can hopefully get Saric to come play in the NBA.
But right now Okafor is probably their only player who is better than NBA average at his position.
The 5 previous first round picks and quality free agents should have added up to more than nothing.
If the 76ers won 30 games they would still be in the lottery. Winning 10 does not guarantee Simmons and getting Simmons does not guarantee anything. Simmons could not even make his college team good. Hinkie also turned off a lot of free agents. Players do not want to come here. It was over the top.
Bryan Colangelo had 7 years in Toronto, and his last 5 were all losing seasons.
Reading your BOT/Sandusky hot takes, obvious your terrible judgment bleeds over into all areas of your life.
They have a 63% chance to get a Top 3 pick. If they had won 30 games, they would have a 21.5% chance at a Top 3 pick. Both those spots finish out of the playoffs. If you don't understand probability and outcome, go take a stats class. It's better to be in the Sixers spot now, than the #6 team.
There are no guarantees in life, other than your posts are dumb.
The team that wins the championship has the lowest odds.
The goal is to draft LAST.
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bwifan
Well-Known Member
E
Exactly... and look at his choices as coach as well.... abysmal...I fear for the sixers now.
Exactly... and look at his choices as coach as well.... abysmal...I fear for the sixers now.
Well I guess you prefer being mediocre for decades instead.
I'm not sure what you are talking about. They weren't supposed to be good yet by design. Ideally, it wouldn't have lasted this long, but Embid set them back a year.
Even if the tanking plan was more successful earlier, it was still going to take a few years until the draft picks matured and the team got good. Expect the next few years to still be rough until those kids get some experience.
Hinkie had 5 first round picks and the team got worse. Nobody expected a championship in year three but there is NO excuse for the team to get WORSE.
The process also included some bad luck in the last two drafts. Two years ago they draft Embid (the #1 player until his injury), last year they draft Okafor (should have been taken by the Lakers). So the 76ers have 3 starting centers !!!!
If they are super lucky Embid will be able to play and they can trade Okafor for a forward or guard. Keep Noel as a rotating center. If Embid is done (most likely) they should still trade Okafor for a forward or guard and keep Noel in the middle. They should be pretty good next year if they make some moves. They should get a top forward in the draft and the kid from Turkey arrives, add that to the player they get for Okafor and they will have a decent "young" lineup.
If they are super lucky Embid will be able to play and they can trade Okafor for a forward or guard. Keep Noel as a rotating center. If Embid is done (most likely) they should still trade Okafor for a forward or guard and keep Noel in the middle. They should be pretty good next year if they make some moves. They should get a top forward in the draft and the kid from Turkey arrives, add that to the player they get for Okafor and they will have a decent "young" lineup.
What team has proven that tanking wins you NBA Championships? The Spurs and Heat never have. Warriors were a mid-lottery team and not a bottom feeder like the Sixers. Minnesota have been perennial bottom feeders and haven't made the playoffs in 12 Years. The closest would be OKC who drafted Kevin Durant, Westbrook, and James Hardin. But they haven't won anything.
Not really. He really only has 2 1st round picks. MCW was traded for a pick they will get this year or next. Saric is set to play next year and Embid has been hurt. Hinkie was there for 3 years. It was a 2 year tank, that turned into 3 because of Embid. Even 2 or 3 years ago, anyone who knew anything about basketball was saying that they still weren't going to be good for several years to come.
Look at the Spurs record before they got Robinson, and then Duncan. They may not have intentionally tanked, but they sucked enough to get 2 number 1 picks. And one number 1 pick wasn't enough to do it for them - they needed both guys eventually. That is how they got good and then they have sustained. I think that is the Sixers model. Suck. Get picks. Get good. and then sustain it.
Living in Lexington, KY, I've seen a ton of Jamal Murray along with Ben Simmons. Murray is either 3 or 4 years younger than Hield, plus can play either point or 2 guard. I'd much rather the Sixers select him if available. Also, I think Simmons is going to be a head case, similar to Michael Beasley from a few years back. All the talent in the world, just won't have the mental makeup to consistently produce and make others/the team any better.
Noel has the potential to be a defensive player of the year type in the future. Guys like Okafor are a dime a dozen.
Noel has the potential to be a defensive player of the year type in the future. Guys like Okafor are a dime a dozen.
