ISU vs. Iowa (what do you think?)

[Aardvark86]

If I were an Iowa fan, I'd be at a complete loss for what they do, or don't, have for a team this year.

 

[GOLDBANGER]

Regardless of the emphasis we as fans put on dual meets, I don't believe Cael and the coaching staff have the same zeal for them.

 

[AgSurfer]

Oh no worries at all my friend.

FWIW - I don't have any issues with Turk's posts. He strikes me as a pretty down to earth kind of guy. Probably someone you would want to have at a family BBQ. If someone makes a dig at Iowa wrestling, he's going to react to it. The good part about that is we know there is always someone out there who will take the bait when one of us tosses out a good slur towards the Iowa program. 😁

 

[hlstone]

Might not like Arnold's dad, or his wrestling style but the kid has won at an elite level growing up and has had an impressive start to his college career. Sometimes you have to give credit where it is due. I will hope he becomes more offensive over the years from a pure fan of the sport standpoint and from a PSU fan standpoint, I will root for a very Bull/Kem like career for him, filled with lots of AAs but no titles. However, 174 clears out next year and I assume Keegan will not go up to 174 b/c of Olympic Trials, so next year could be Gabe's best shot if Carter doesn't come back.

Well written.

 

[mcpat]

so we worked out a plan the have a match that would look real to them, have a lot of scoring and action and end in a tie.

I bet $$$ on that match; you’re telling me it was fixed?!?!

 

[FatWoodchuck]

Didnt he apologize years later and admitted he didnt handle things properly at PSU. Maybe Im misremembering.

IIRC. He did admit that, but was still happier after he left.

 

[STAND with PRIDE]

I agree. Such poor taste.

If a parent politely asked ESPN to NOT film them, would they oblidge?

Some of this has gotta fall on the parents/wrestler… surely ESPN gets their identity/seat number from their son and or them personally,right?

 

[RandyL]

Arnold kinda reminds me of Steve Shields.
Those builds can be awful frustrating.
Just ask Andy Matter.

 

[a_mshaffer]

If I were a person not familiar with college wrestling but wanted to see what it was like and tuned into yesterday's match on ESPN, I'd probably write it off as a sport to watch in my leisure time. As pointed out, Iowa, the winner of the match, had more stalling warnings than takedowns. There was only one bonus point out of the ten matches. It was boring, even for someone who has been involved with the sport for over 50 years. It was basically Rutgers v. VT from a couple weeks ago with different teams. It's not an attractive product.

When I was in high school, our wrestling team was a very new program with little fan support. Our coach, in his third year and my third year, convinced the school to have an assembly to introduce the sport to the students. I was one of the wrestlers picked to wrestle an exhibition match. I was paired with a wrestler whom I had wrestled with and against for 3 years. We realized if we wrestled a "real" match, it was not going to be very exciting for fans being introduced to the sport, so we worked out a plan the have a match that would look real to them, have a lot of scoring and action and end in a tie. It went over very well and I don't think anyone knew what we had done. Yesterday looked like the match we could have wrestled if we weren't concerned with making the sport fun to watch - especially for new fans.

Almost every time I watch a D1 college wrestling dual meet, I fight a strong urge to turn it off because nothing is happening other than thinly veiled stalling for most of the matches. I do think we are spoiled and blessed by Penn State's style.a But I, for one, am very appreciative of it - especially when watching something like yesterday's match.

but the new rules always makes things better!

 

[mcpat]

I’m just glad the scoring changes resulted in so much more action from the most storied school and it’s arch rival in the country’s best wrestling state.

 

[El-Jefe]

If I were a person not familiar with college wrestling but wanted to see what it was like and tuned into yesterday's match on ESPN, I'd probably write it off as a sport to watch in my leisure time. As pointed out, Iowa, the winner of the match, had more stalling warnings than takedowns. There was only one bonus point out of the ten matches. It was boring, even for someone who has been involved with the sport for over 50 years. It was basically Rutgers v. VT from a couple weeks ago with different teams. It's not an attractive product.

When I was in high school, our wrestling team was a very new program with little fan support. Our coach, in his third year and my third year, convinced the school to have an assembly to introduce the sport to the students. I was one of the wrestlers picked to wrestle an exhibition match. I was paired with a wrestler whom I had wrestled with and against for 3 years. We realized if we wrestled a "real" match, it was not going to be very exciting for fans being introduced to the sport, so we worked out a plan the have a match that would look real to them, have a lot of scoring and action and end in a tie. It went over very well and I don't think anyone knew what we had done. Yesterday looked like the match we could have wrestled if we weren't concerned with making the sport fun to watch - especially for new fans.

Almost every time I watch a D1 college wrestling dual meet, I fight a strong urge to turn it off because nothing is happening other than thinly veiled stalling for most of the matches. I do think we are spoiled and blessed by Penn State's style.a But I, for one, am very appreciative of it - especially when watching something like yesterday's match.

2 bonus points -- Carr and Bastida borh won by major. And the 174 match was exciting.

But otherwise, point taken. There was a lot of wrestling to not lose, instead of wrestling to win.

 

[Random4598375]

2 bonus points -- Carr and Bastida borh won by major. And the 174 match was exciting.

But otherwise, point taken. There was a lot of wrestling to not lose, instead of wrestling to win.

I enjoyed a lot of it, though. I thought Echemendia vastly improved his defense since the OSU days and could be a contender. The end of the Chittum match was great, too, except for him not getting the call.

Frost wasn't bashful about getting to his offense, either.

 

[Aardvark86]

2 bonus points -- Carr and Bastida borh won by major. And the 174 match was exciting.

But otherwise, point taken. There was a lot of wrestling to not lose, instead of wrestling to win.

Yep, it's sort of analogous to Newton's third law of motion: for every so-called incentive to offense by playing with scoring values, there is an equal and opposite defensive incentive to avoiding such scoring.

But of course nobody really thinks in terms of behavioral incentives any more.

 

[Bosox2004]

If I were a person not familiar with college wrestling but wanted to see what it was like and tuned into yesterday's match on ESPN, I'd probably write it off as a sport to watch in my leisure time. As pointed out, Iowa, the winner of the match, had more stalling warnings than takedowns. There was only one bonus point out of the ten matches. It was boring, even for someone who has been involved with the sport for over 50 years. It was basically Rutgers v. VT from a couple weeks ago with different teams. It's not an attractive product.

When I was in high school, our wrestling team was a very new program with little fan support. Our coach, in his third year and my third year, convinced the school to have an assembly to introduce the sport to the students. I was one of the wrestlers picked to wrestle an exhibition match. I was paired with a wrestler whom I had wrestled with and against for 3 years. We realized if we wrestled a "real" match, it was not going to be very exciting for fans being introduced to the sport, so we worked out a plan the have a match that would look real to them, have a lot of scoring and action and end in a tie. It went over very well and I don't think anyone knew what we had done. Yesterday looked like the match we could have wrestled if we weren't concerned with making the sport fun to watch - especially for new fans.

Almost every time I watch a D1 college wrestling dual meet, I fight a strong urge to turn it off because nothing is happening other than thinly veiled stalling for most of the matches. I do think we are spoiled and blessed by Penn State's style.a But I, for one, am very appreciative of it - especially when watching something like yesterday's match.

I watched the match with friends. None of which are wrestling fans. my takeaway is slightly different.

I was genuinely excited to watch Gabe so I might have led to skewing what otherwise would be unbiased results .

The Gabe match , the Pk match , David Carr and real woods matches were all well received at my house. By far the Gabe match was the most entertaining to my friends as well as for me.

In order to attract more people into the sport

1. Embrace and promote woman’s wrestling
2. Rules changes will definitely be needed.
Truax stretching and putting his foot out of bounds that type of stuff especially down repeatedly is a turn off. As is either running out or being pushed out of bounds intentionally .
3 the match would have been much better received if heavy weight preceded the 197 bout. Made me think the coaches should get to alternative what weight class goes next . Home team picks first.

And a totally unpopular opinion but the average person isn’t going to want to watch a PSU match that ends 45-3 .

 

[raslen007]

I defended the guy without knowing the backstory there. My apologies.

Yes and I need to chill the F out. An apology was in order but it didn't happen. JS has made his peace with this and I'll drop it. Better days ahead.

 

[Chickenman Testa]

I watched the match with friends. None of which are wrestling fans. my takeaway is slightly different.

I was genuinely excited to watch Gabe so I might have led to skewing what otherwise would be unbiased results .

The Gabe match , the Pk match , David Carr and real woods matches were all well received at my house. By far the Gabe match was the most entertaining to my friends as well as for me.

In order to attract more people into the sport

1. Embrace and promote woman’s wrestling
2. Rules changes will definitely be needed.
Truax stretching and putting his foot out of bounds that type of stuff especially down repeatedly is a turn off. As is either running out or being pushed out of bounds intentionally .
3 the match would have been much better received if heavy weight preceded the 197 bout. Made me think the coaches should get to alternative what weight class goes next . Home team picks first.

And a totally unpopular opinion but the average person isn’t going to want to watch a PSU match that ends 45-3 .

Make sure you invite your friends over to watch Mesenbrink or AB. The increased activity might blow their minds

 

[Brian LB-U]

I don't disagree. However, they've been throwing accolades at him for years. I think I heard too many excuses for his big loss as well

The accolades are richly deserved, I don’t have a problem with this. He’s still the GOAT. All I’m saying is the man loves to talk about himself and his greatness. He has an ego the size of Texas.

Another example: Did you ever watch the documentary on Lee Kemp? If not, I highly recommend checking it out on YouTube. Anyways, as told by the Wisconsin coach, after Kemp beat Iowa’s Chuck Yagla, Gable approached the coach and said “it looks like perhaps the only way we (meaning Iowa) are going to be able to beat Kemp going forward is if I come out of retirement.” Seriously, who talks like this? He paid the kid a compliment while talking about his own greatness. Of course, shortly after this conversation took place he wasn’t able to beat 18-year-old Kemp when it mattered at the Northern Open. Lee beat his idol straight up. Gable then hints that he hunted Kemp down a month or so later and “regained some pride” by beating him in a meaningless 1:1 private practice session.🤦‍♂️

 

[Chickenman Testa]

The accolades are richly deserved, I don’t have a problem with this. He’s still the GOAT. All I’m saying is the man loves to talk about himself and his greatness. He has an ego the size of Texas.

Another example: Did you ever watch the documentary on Lee Kemp? If not, I highly recommend checking it out on YouTube. Anyways, as told by the Wisconsin coach, after Kemp beat Iowa’s Chuck Yagla, Gable approached the coach and said “it looks like perhaps the only way we (meaning Iowa) are going to be able to beat Kemp going forward is if I come out of retirement.” Seriously, who talks like this? He paid the kid a compliment while talking about his own greatness. Of course, shortly after this conversation took place he wasn’t able to beat 18-year-old Kemp when it mattered at the Northern Open. Lee beat his idol straight up. Gable then hints that he hunted Kemp down a month or so later and “regained some pride” by beating him in a meaningless 1:1 private practice session.🤦‍♂️

Think about it, a guy who’d be a high school junior these days (I.e. 18) beat adult Dan Gable.

 

[Bosox2004]

Make sure you invite your friends over to watch Mesenbrink or AB. The increased activity might blow their minds

Agreed. I think someone unfamiliar with the sport will enjoy watching SVN, Levi and Mitch but the average person will get bored by the time AB goes if the team score is way out of whack .

 

[El-Jefe]

Yep, it's sort of analogous to Newton's third law of motion: for every so-called incentive to offense by playing with scoring values, there is an equal and opposite defensive incentive to avoiding such scoring.

But of course nobody really thinks in terms of behavioral incentives any more.

The worst offender was Woods, and T2 vs T3 wasn't going to alter his strategy of taking the match to OT.

 

[js8793]

How do you see it going? Can Arnold keep it close. His defense is pretty damn impressive

I see it going very similarly to the Brands match. Close on the scoreboard, but Starocci in control and never threatened. I could see him getting a takedown or two, but would be surprised if he blew it open. Arnold defensive fundamentals are already elite at the college level.

Starocci wins 10/10 times, but it might be 2-1 6 or 7 of those times. My thoughts could change if we see him continue to score the way he did against Mekhi.

 

[zzs006]

I see it going very similarly to the Brands match. Close on the scoreboard, but Starocci in control and never threatened. I could see him getting a takedown or two, but would be surprised if he blew it open. Arnold defensive fundamentals are already elite at the college level.

Starocci wins 10/10 times, but it might be 2-1 6 or 7 of those times. My thoughts could change if we see him continue to score the way he did against Mekhi.

Thanks for the response. I see it the same. Gabe is better than a lot on here are giving him credit for. Still, Carter is a different beast altogether. I hope it happens but I kind of doubt now with how the Iowa lineup is shaking out

 

[js8793]

Thanks for the response. I see it the same. Gabe is better than a lot on here are giving him credit for. Still, Carter is a different beast altogether. I hope it happens but I kind of doubt now with how the Iowa lineup is shaking out

He kind of reminds me of Suriano his freshman year. Very uncommon defensive fundamentals combined with good physical attributes. Plenty strong enough to maintain those fundamentals against a higher level of competition. Tons of experience closing tight matches throughout high school. Isn't rattled in big moments.

I'm excited to see him develop offensively. He's already moving in a direction I was hoping to see. Head outside attacks to lifts. Minimizing troubles with length and using his horsepower. Think Molinaro. In both his big wins, we've seen him get to the hips and pick guys up. Very encouraging.

 

[Pitchfork Rebel]

I agree. Such poor taste.

Big1-

I watched the match with friends. None of which are wrestling fans. my takeaway is slightly different.

I was genuinely excited to watch Gabe so I might have led to skewing what otherwise would be unbiased results .

The Gabe match , the Pk match , David Carr and real woods matches were all well received at my house. By far the Gabe match was the most entertaining to my friends as well as for me.

In order to attract more people into the sport

1. Embrace and promote woman’s wrestling
2. Rules changes will definitely be needed.
Truax stretching and putting his foot out of bounds that type of stuff especially down repeatedly is a turn off. As is either running out or being pushed out of bounds intentionally .
3 the match would have been much better received if heavy weight preceded the 197 bout. Made me think the coaches should get to alternative what weight class goes next . Home team picks first.

And a totally unpopular opinion but the average person isn’t going to want to watch a PSU match that ends 45-3

When do we get men's field hockey?

 

[a_mshaffer]

He kind of reminds me of Suriano his freshman year. Very uncommon defensive fundamentals combined with good physical attributes. Plenty strong enough to maintain those fundamentals against a higher level of competition. Tons of experience closing tight matches throughout high school. Isn't rattled in big moments.

I'm excited to see him develop offensively. He's already moving in a direction I was hoping to see. Head outside attacks to lifts. Minimizing troubles with length and using his horsepower. Think Molinaro. In both his big wins, we've seen him get to the hips and pick guys up. Very encouraging.

too early to tell. he's on tape now. wrestled up and 'legs' were wide open any time he wanted to shoot. Don't see the Suriano comparison except Suriano had good D. We'll see... Good wrestler

 

[GOLDBANGER]

He kind of reminds me of Suriano his freshman year. Very uncommon defensive fundamentals combined with good physical attributes. Plenty strong enough to maintain those fundamentals against a higher level of competition. Tons of experience closing tight matches throughout high school. Isn't rattled in big moments.

I'm excited to see him develop offensively. He's already moving in a direction I was hoping to see. Head outside attacks to lifts. Minimizing troubles with length and using his horsepower. Think Molinaro. In both his big wins, we've seen him get to the hips and pick guys up. Very encouraging.

On the other hand, Feldkamp looked AWFUL!!

 

[Cali_Nittany]

And a totally unpopular opinion but the average person isn’t going to want to watch a PSU match that ends 45-3 .

I'd wager that a Penn State blowout at Carver with their style of wrestling would be more watchable to an average person than what we saw with Iowa-ISU.

 

[Cstroke]

Iowa Vs. Iowa St. was not a good product..
Doubt Mike Evans was impressed.

 

[Bosox2004]

I'd wager that a Penn State blowout at Carver with their style of wrestling would be more watchable to an average person than what we saw with Iowa-ISU.

Well I’d invite the same people over and let you know but since I’m most likely going that’s not an option .

 

[Bosox2004]

Big1-


When do we get men's field hockey?

funny thing is it’s basically a man’s sport outside the USA or atleast used to be.

 

[82bordeaux]

Starocci wins 10/10 times, but it might be 2-1 6 or 7 of those times

How do you see Gabe scoring a point 6 or 7 times against Starocci? An escape, or are those matches all at Carver and those are stalling points? I don't think Gabe could score period, but in 2/10 matches.

 

[johnstownsteel]

How do you see Gabe scoring a point 6 or 7 times against Starocci? An escape, or are those matches all at Carver and those are stalling points? I don't think Gabe could score period, but in 2/10 matches.

I'm more interested to know how he thinks Carter gets 2 points in 6 or 7 matches. Escape and a stall point? 2 stall points? An escape and penalty point? Escape and Rt? A reversal?

 

[El-Jefe]

How do you see Gabe scoring a point 6 or 7 times against Starocci? An escape, or are those matches all at Carver and those are stalling points? I don't think Gabe could score period, but in 2/10 matches.

Carter cuts him to mess with his head.

 

[Foreverinbluejeans57]

The accolades are richly deserved, I don’t have a problem with this. He’s still the GOAT. All I’m saying is the man loves to talk about himself and his greatness. He has an ego the size of Texas.

Another example: Did you ever watch the documentary on Lee Kemp? If not, I highly recommend checking it out on YouTube. Anyways, as told by the Wisconsin coach, after Kemp beat Iowa’s Chuck Yagla, Gable approached the coach and said “it looks like perhaps the only way we (meaning Iowa) are going to be able to beat Kemp going forward is if I come out of retirement.” Seriously, who talks like this? He paid the kid a compliment while talking about his own greatness. Of course, shortly after this conversation took place he wasn’t able to beat 18-year-old Kemp when it mattered at the Northern Open. Lee beat his idol straight up. Gable then hints that he hunted Kemp down a month or so later and “regained some pride” by beating him in a meaningless 1:1 private practice session.🤦‍♂️

You can tell when Gable is forced to talk about Cael every positive word is like pulling teeth

 

[Chickenman Testa]

You can tell when Gable is forced to talk about Cael every positive word is like pulling teeth

Exactly - all the more reason I want Cael to win 16+ NCs while Gable is still kicking. 15 in 21 years or less would be nice too - that would cut down on a line of excuses. Absent Iowa mortgaging everything with NIL, we are on track for another long run.

If all this happened, Iowa fans would turn their sights to banging Cael about not winning enough Big 10 titles

 

[JWil23]

Not me. When his Dad tried to run his mouth on HR and incinuate that PSU has a racist culture, I pretty much knew Gabe would be one that I will enjoy watching him lose. If thats petty of me then so be it. In Phils defense tho, at least hes not using our deceased relatives to take pot shots at us...

Gabe seems like a good kid to me, the dad obviously a different story. The funny thing is some people inside the buildings who matter actually read these boards. I know a few of those who saw his racial comments. They weren’t impressed at all.

I think he has some hard feelings because of Gabe not really being recruited by Cael.

 

[Chickenman Testa]

Gabe seems like a good kid to me, the dad obviously a different story. The funny thing is some people inside the buildings who matter actually read these boards. I know a few of those who saw his racial comments. They weren’t impressed at all.

I think he has some hard feelings because of Gabe not really being recruited by Cael.

Cael - if you’re reading this, a few things:

1. @johnstownsteel has been critical of your long-term recruiting plans. The rest of us believe you’re doing a bang up job in that regard
2. Make sure Willie Saylor doesn’t rest on his laurels. We haven’t landed a Top 10 guy in several weeks - what’s up with that?

 

[Ski]

Agreed. I think someone unfamiliar with the sport will enjoy watching SVN, Levi and Mitch but the average person will get bored by the time AB goes if the team score is way out of whack .

If the individual matches are action packed the casual fan won't care about the team score. Entertaining is entertaining any time, boring is boring any time.

 

[ss7]

Gabe seems like a good kid to me, the dad obviously a different story. The funny thing is some people inside the buildings who matter actually read these boards. I know a few of those who saw his racial comments. They weren’t impressed at all.

I think he has some hard feelings because of Gabe not really being recruited by Cael.

I don't think his dad is that bad...maybe a bit of a "try hard".

As for the "culture" comment, who knows what he experienced. Maybe that's what he felt or heard from someone else. I think the important part is that based on who is and has been on PSUs team, those feelings are not widely held.

 

[Chickenman Testa]

I don't think his dad is that bad...maybe a bit of a "try hard".

As for the "culture" comment, who knows what he experienced. Maybe that's what he felt or heard from someone else. I think the important part is that based on who is and has been on PSUs team, those feelings are not widely held.

We got a new poster on here who’s a bit of a “try hard”