Thread on testing & treatment research for COVID-19

[dailybuck777]

[h]ttps://twitter.com/RiganoESQ/status/1239780304082124800

Coauthor of study explains good signs that a cheap well-known anti-malarial drug, chloroquine, is effective against virus. See also https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/03...as-been-found-in-a-common-anti-malarial-drug/

 

[interrobang]

Fortunately not a "new" drug but a repurposed one. That should speed up timelines a ton.

 

[dailybuck777]

Fortunately not a "new" drug but a repurposed one. That should speed up timelines a ton.

You are right. My title was wrong and has been changed.

 

[sluggo72]

[h]ttps://twitter.com/RiganoESQ/status/1239780304082124800

Coauthor of study explains good signs that a cheap well-know anti-malarial drug, chloroquine, is effective against virus. See also [h]ttps://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/03/17/an-effective-treatment-for-coronavirus-covid-19-has-been-found-in-a-common-anti-malarial-drug/

are your links hot? asking for a friend

 

[rigi11]

It only treats the symptoms

 

[interrobang]

It only treats the symptoms

If it lets people breath again and avoid going on a ventilator, that's a major win.

 

[mrmk5110]

Any kind of treatments that mitigate the symptoms would be a huge improvement over what we have simply to ease the strain on our healthcare network right now. That being said, I did see some mixed reviews from initial trials of hydroxychloroquine regarding its actual effectiveness. I think there has been enough effort put into researching existing drugs that something positive will come out of this within the next month.

 

[Pardlion]

[h]ttps://twitter.com/RiganoESQ/status/1239780304082124800

Coauthor of study explains good signs that a cheap well-know anti-malarial drug, chloroquine, is effective against virus. See also https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/03...as-been-found-in-a-common-anti-malarial-drug/

I guess I’ll be breaking out the gin & tonics early this year.

 

[PennStateNate]

it will take 18 months for us to get this going..

 

[interrobang]

it will take 18 months for us to get this going..

 

[PennStateNate]

View embedded media

That is good, but Prez saying it and it actually happening are two different things.

In terms of game changer, I vote maybe not.

 

[SLUPSU]

it will take 18 months for us to get this going..

No it won't, using existing drugs for off-label uses is done all the time.

 

[CoastGuard2018]

That is good, but Prez saying it and it actually happening are two different things.

In terms of game changer, I vote maybe not.

We shall see

 

[PennStateNate]

It is head way, but I cringe at the fact they are just going to start using it on all different folks with different underlying conditions after a small sample size test.

Seems like desperation and I hope the end results isn't fatal.

 

[GreggK]

If it lets people breath again and avoid going on a ventilator, that's a major win.

Exactly! That is where the achilles heal is for this entire crisis. Ventilators. If we had millions of them and millions of people manning them, this wouldn't be a crisis. Not saying we should have had that of course.

Getting people off of ventilators could literally save millions of lives.

 

[dailybuck777]

Seems like desperation and I hope the end results isn't fatal.

"Chloroquine was discovered in 1934 by Hans Andersag.[4][5] It is on the World Health Organization's List of Essential Medicines, the safest and most effective medicines needed in a health system." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chloroquine

Seems like the risk/reward ratio is good. Also, the wattsup article linked in original post says that it has been used in China and South Korea successfully.

 

[dailybuck777]

Getting people off of ventilators could literally save millions of lives.

Symptoms, not the virus itself cause the deaths. 95% of virus carriers are fine. It is only the small percentage who have strong negative symptoms that make the virus truly dangerous.

 

[Richard the LIONhearted]

Gupta on CNN basically stated this is only a clinical trial, that we simply don't know if these drugs are helpful for this or not, and that putting it over like he did to the media is dangerous in creating false hope.

 

[dailybuck777]

Gupta on CNN basically stated this is only a clinical trial, that we simply don't know if these drugs are helpful for this or not, and that putting it over like he did to the media is dangerous in creating false hope.

I agree that the studies are not as extensive as would be ideal and false hopes could be created. On the other hand, this is an old drug, and there is very little downside in my mind to trying it. It has also been used in China and S. Korea.

 

[GreggK]

Gupta on CNN basically stated this is only a clinical trial, that we simply don't know if these drugs are helpful for this or not, and that putting it over like he did to the media is dangerous in creating false hope.

I also agree with this. Remdesivir is another one that has been promising.

 

[PennStateNate]

Didn't Japan find a flu drug that has also been effective? I think FujiFilm had something to do with it or something.

One great thing is we are getting closer to finding something to stop this.

 

[Pardlion]

It is head way, but I cringe at the fact they are just going to start using it on all different folks with different underlying conditions after a small sample size test.

Seems like desperation and I hope the end results isn't fatal.

Already tested. Here's a picture of the first test:

 

[sluggo72]

Didn't Japan find a flu drug that has also been effective? I think FujiFilm had something to do with it or something.

One great thing is we are getting closer to finding something to stop this.

Posted elsewhere yesterday

TOKYO/BEIJING (Reuters) - Shares in Japan’s Fujifilm Holdings Corp (4901.T) surged 15% on Wednesday after a Chinese official said an active ingredient of the company’s Avigan anti-flu drug appeared to help coronavirus patients recover.

Avigan, also known as Favipiravir, is manufactured by a subsidiary of Fujifilm, which has a healthcare arm although it is better known for its cameras. The drug was approved for use in Japan in 2014.

Favipiravir has been effective, with no obvious side-effects, in helping coronavirus patients recover, Zhang Xinmin, an official at China’s Science and Technology Ministry, told reporters at a news conference on Tuesday.


But a Fujifilm spokesman said the company expects no direct earnings impact from potential sales growth of Favipiravir in China, at least for now, as its license for the key ingredient in the country already expired last year.

In Japan, Fujifilm manufactures Avigan only on receiving orders from the government and has no sales target for the drug, she said.

 

[psufan1999797]

I normally don't watch Hannity and the like, but lately I've been tuning in for small, 5 minute snippets to see what they are saying to their viewership. During my 5 minutes of watching Laura Ingraham last night, they were propping up these drugs pretty aggressively. Wonder if that's what led to DT touting it today?

 

[Langmuir]

I trust a wattsup article about as much as I would if I found the article in the National Enquirer.

 

[interrobang]

I normally don't watch Hannity and the like, but lately I've been tuning in for small, 5 minute snippets to see what they are saying to their viewership. During my 5 minutes of watching Laura Ingraham last night, they were propping up these drugs pretty aggressively. Wonder if that's what led to DT touting it today?

My uneducated guess is that behind closed doors, they're confident these drugs will work. But publicly they can't say that until they go through a few more trials.

 

[mjh218]

There is a big difference between new drugs and drugs currently on the market. For drugs currently on the market, they have already been extensively tested for safety. for instance, the anti-malaria drug has decades of data and can even be taken by pregnant women. For the old drugs the question is - do they help with COVID-19?

The new drugs/treatments are different. The FDA will need to determine what safety risks they pose. That takes time, even with a sped up time table.

The hope is that one of the old drugs provides some help. Most of these drugs are readily available and could be disseminated pretty quickly. Does it cure COVID-19, no....but if it reduces the severity of the symptoms, you can keep more people out of hospital beds and ease the strain on the healthcare system.

Off-label use is done all the time as stated above. It was how Viagra came to be used for erectile dysfunction. There are countless other examples of off-label use. Doctors have the ability to prescribe any drug they want for any use. The drug companies on the other hand cannot market their drugs for off-label use. That means that Pfizer needed to get FDA clearance to market Viagra for erectile dysfunction. Before they got this clearance doctors could prescribe it for erectile dysfunction, but Pfizer could not market it for that use. No commercials, brochures etc.

 

[Pardlion]

I normally don't watch Hannity and the like, but lately I've been tuning in for small, 5 minute snippets to see what they are saying to their viewership. During my 5 minutes of watching Laura Ingraham last night, they were propping up these drugs pretty aggressively. Wonder if that's what led to DT touting it today?

LOL

 

[Langmuir]

My uneducated guess is that behind closed doors, they're confident these drugs will work. But publicly they can't say that until they go through a few more trials.

My wife works on clinical trials. There are many drugs that researchers are confident will work, until they don't. About six months ago, they shut down a drug that they spent about a billion dollars on. Somebody thought it would work. And it was not side effects that shut it down, it was totally ineffective. I am hopeful they work but we don't know until we try.

 

[MacNit07]

Gupta on CNN basically stated this is only a clinical trial, that we simply don't know if these drugs are helpful for this or not, and that putting it over like he did to the media is dangerous in creating false hope.

Dude, The head of the FDA provided the details and was both hopeful and realistic.

 

[Pardlion]

Dude, The head of the FDA provided the details and was both hopeful and realistic.

Stop. It's important that no one can feel a ray of hope.

 

[I am Ironman]

More hope in the link below.

We'll be talking football soon boys.

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/heal...g-holds-promise-treating-coronavirus-n1158316

 

[blion72]

If it lets people breath again and avoid going on a ventilator, that's a major win.

agree as that is the progression that keeps them on ventilator in IUC and overloads the system. also so far on avg 4% need hospital and most of those wind up on ventilator with half of them dying. if we stop that, then you can forget about the rest of the people as they get better anyhow - even if they have severe symptoms.

 

[PennStateNate]

More hope in the link below.

We'll be talking football soon boys.

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/heal...g-holds-promise-treating-coronavirus-n1158316

Two people felt better and that gives us hope? LOL

 

[katchthis]

Exactly! That is where the achilles heal is for this entire crisis. Ventilators. If we had millions of them and millions of people manning them, this wouldn't be a crisis. Not saying we should have had that of course.

Getting people off of ventilators could literally save millions of lives.

Having a vent is one thing. Having a team trained to operate and manage the increased number is not possible in the short run.

 

[I am Ironman]

Two people felt better and that gives us hope? LOL

It's better than nothing.

Go stock up on more toilet paper.

 

[The Spin Meister]

[h]ttps://twitter.com/RiganoESQ/status/1239780304082124800

Coauthor of study explains good signs that a cheap well-know anti-malarial drug, chloroquine, is effective against virus. See also https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/03...as-been-found-in-a-common-anti-malarial-drug/

If you hang out at the crazy Test Board, you knew this two days ago.. I talked to my pharmacist this morning. Said they just put in a big order to have it ready when approved. Half hr later Trump made his announcement.

Pharmacist said this is 'hard on the body' without going into specifics. But its normal approved uses are for malaria, severe arthritis, and lupus so that would all be long term and presumably at high doses.

Studies on Covid 19 were for six days and then patients were cleared so short term use may minimize side effects. I don't know dosage rates as compared to labelled treatments but I guess the doses would be lower which would also help.

I also don't know what conditions it would contraindicated for. Heart disease? Kidney, liver, diabetics? Need to do more research. Also it appears to help prophlacticly meaning it can be given to high risk people before infection.

If it works it is very common and every pharmacy has it in stock which is good. Maybe start giving to high risk plus health care workers first to help those at highest risk.

 

[psunovaluvr]

I’m

I also agree with this. Remdesivir is another one that has been promising.

I’ve been following Remdesivir for several weeks, also the other antiviral out of Japan(by Fujifilm of all companies). Praying and crossing my fingers for good clinical data soon.

 

[The Spin Meister]

My wife works on clinical trials. There are many drugs that researchers are confident will work, until they don't. About six months ago, they shut down a drug that they spent about a billion dollars on. Somebody thought it would work. And it was not side effects that shut it down, it was totally ineffective. I am hopeful they work but we don't know until we try.

Big difference in brand new drugs and new uses for established drugs. And a couple of different small tests got great results. Even if it is only 50% effective that would still be a huge benefit.

Two people felt better and that gives us hope? LOL

Saw one run of 40 patients, another with 10.

 

[LafayetteBear]

Exactly! That is where the achilles heal is for this entire crisis. Ventilators. If we had millions of them and millions of people manning them, this wouldn't be a crisis. Not saying we should have had that of course..

I was listening to Bay Area talk radio yesterday morning while in my car, and a doctor called in to talk about the shortage of ventilators. I was surprised to learn that the military apparently has 10,000 of them squirreled away in case of emergency, and they are bringing them out for current use. I was also surprised to hear this doctor say that a particular brand of ventilator (he called it the "Mark IV" and said it is in wide use) can with minor modifications be converted to provide ventilation for up to four people at the same time.