I haven't researched this but I will if it comes up. If Zahid moves up to 184 and Bo beats him in the finals Bo will have won 3 NCAA titles, beating a previous NCAA champ in all three finals, Dean, Martin, and Valencia. Not sure that has ever been done before.
Talk of Valencia moving up and Bo making history
- Thread starter NoVa Lion
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And if you are ZV and you can win 3 titles and you go through Hall, Bo, and RS Senior Martin to get them you have cemented your place as an all time great. We live in a great era of wrestling!
imagine MyMar snake bitten once again by the finals and hearing this news. Im not saying MyMar cant beat him, he can, but it just complicates things I feel.
Im torn if this news would make you want to RS or give it a go. Probably short sighted because ZV moving up was probably always in the cards all a long.
the RS is probably a holistic world view decision and not a wrestling one.
Im torn if this news would make you want to RS or give it a go. Probably short sighted because ZV moving up was probably always in the cards all a long.
the RS is probably a holistic world view decision and not a wrestling one.
It would be one of the best weight classes I can remember if Bo, Miles, and ZV all compete there next year. 3 National champions and the worst (lol) of the 3 won it as a true freshman. I figured Miles might redshirt from a team perspective for tOSU somewhat like Nico did when Cael wanted to be able to put the super team out there. tOSU could be top 3 next year if they choose, but becomes pretty hard to beat in 2020 if they shirt 133,141, and 184 next year.
yeah, that's good stuff
it's hard to bet against Bo, and I would certainly root for him, but would he be the favorite in a matchup with Zahid? I'm thinking probably not...
Zahid is HUGE and very explosive. Bo is still the favorite but Zahid causes big matchup problems with his insane length and explosiveness.
Bo has shown he can handle strong guys (Gabe Dean) but his kryptonite would be athletic/explosive guys like Myles and Zahid.
Bo has shown he can handle strong guys (Gabe Dean) but his kryptonite would be athletic/explosive guys like Myles and Zahid.
A lot has changed since 2015, and this is freestyle, but found this vid where ZV beat MyMar 7-0 a couple years ago.
And according to this article, ZV beat Bo in 2016 to make the Junior World Team:
https://www.associatedwrestlingpress.com/news_article/show/651369?referrer_id=1023868
And according to this article, ZV beat Bo in 2016 to make the Junior World Team:
https://www.associatedwrestlingpress.com/news_article/show/651369?referrer_id=1023868
Zahid is the real deal as a wrestler. Still, in folkstyle, I don't know that I can ever think of Bo as an underdog again. I'll admit that I definitely had him as the underdog against Dean. I'm not saying he couldn't lose to Zahid, but the underdog. . .I can't go there anymore.
...just joking here, but my first thought is I can't wait to hear Bo's speech, post championship.
I'll believe it when I see it. There was talk of that last year, and his coaches insisted that Zahid really isn't big for the weight, and isn't cutting much. Maybe he also wants to stay at that weight for freestyle reasons, who knows? Either way, it presents the possibility of an awesome NCAA final. I don't think an 8-2 loss sits too well with Mark, and will fester for 12 months until he can reverse it.
7-2 vs Myles "Kryptonite" Martin so far. Perhaps its a bad batch...?
That Gabe Dean guy was pretty good and that worked OK.
Valencia isn't going to have s size advantage on Bo and he is going to wrestle Bo thinking he can win. That generally speaking works in Bo's favor. Valencia runs his offense off of a short step back, position and as the opponent reaches/steps into contact he sags backward just a hair more which gets his opponent leaning forward just enough to allow Valencia to attack with a very proficient shot.
My guess is after watching Mark 3 times step/reach in and react to the slight sag Bo will have a plan.
I have no idea how the coaches poll will rate the two or how Flo will rate them, but Bo wins his third title.
The very first thing I thought about was the All Star match. How does everyone feel about it? Should Cael put Bo out there against Zahid in the all star meet? Remember, while "technically" we have heard it should not matter, it certainly did matter this year. As it turned out in the end, it didn't effect anything, but make no mistake, the all star match cost Mark the 1 seed at Nationals. Other coaches have now pulled their guys from this meet for that reason, to protect their seeds. At 184 with Zahid now in the mix, I think that seeding really, really does matter. You don't want the 2 seed here, and if they don't meet at All Stars, I believe Bo gets the 1, Zahid gets the 2, and Myles gets the 3. Again, perhaps it turns out to be of no consequence, but in this case, do you risk that 2 seed on a match that can do you no good, only harm? Putting aside the fact that we are PSU, and we fear nobody, and we always go after it, and we never duck anyone etc...
Thoughts? Not thoughts on the if's or the then's, but simply thoughts about the All Star thing and how it will affect 184 with Zahid coming up.
Thoughts? Not thoughts on the if's or the then's, but simply thoughts about the All Star thing and how it will affect 184 with Zahid coming up.
just my opinion, but I don't think you should expect to see any psu kids in the all star match any time soon.
Myles hasn’t shown me anything dating back to HS competing against Zahid that says he can beat him. Zahid beat Nickal in freestyle twice but it was freestyle and it was some time ago. Regarding the move up like funkisfun said I’ll believe it when I see it.
I'll believe Bo Nickal loses another NCAA Final when I actually see it happen. Valencia is great, but until he beats Bo on a Saturday Night in Pittsburgh March 2019 he won't be the man.
My thoughts: MyMar has no chance against Zahid. I think if Mark sees him again he will be on the attack and much more offensive, and ultimately will win, but we will probably never see that again in folk.
Same for Bo, he wins plus he delivers in big matches. I don't see Bo entering the all star classic, and I do think Zahid moves up next year. The 184 final will be one of the top matches everyone waits for all year, like Bo vs Dean for the NC next year. I think noone will stop Bo's Swan song. Zahid is extremely good but before you anoint him the second coming go watch his semi match again. If you take the match to him he is mortal, if you allow him to dictate the pace, he can take control or counter.
Nolf cruises as well, likely to the hodge on top of a 3rd NC. Another good one although not ours is Suriano - Fix which will put an exclamation point on his bad decision... It will be another exciting year that mich is guaranteed
Same for Bo, he wins plus he delivers in big matches. I don't see Bo entering the all star classic, and I do think Zahid moves up next year. The 184 final will be one of the top matches everyone waits for all year, like Bo vs Dean for the NC next year. I think noone will stop Bo's Swan song. Zahid is extremely good but before you anoint him the second coming go watch his semi match again. If you take the match to him he is mortal, if you allow him to dictate the pace, he can take control or counter.
Nolf cruises as well, likely to the hodge on top of a 3rd NC. Another good one although not ours is Suriano - Fix which will put an exclamation point on his bad decision... It will be another exciting year that mich is guaranteed
Bad to boycott wrt growing the sport. Send the best wrestlers and deal with any aftermath. PSU has the wrestlers fans will pay to see and taking their ball and going home isn't the way I think it should be done.
on a serious note, I dont know where he would see ZV before the ncaa finals. so this isnt that far fetched.Especially if he has to listen to the media, all season long, talking about how he doesn’t stand a chance.
The argument is, and mind you this is not necessarily my argument, but the argument is that the all star meet should not technically affect seeding, but one of the posts I saw about the comparative matches for Mark and Zahid, indicated and proved that the only distinguishing factor was head to head in the all star match. Cael is about doing what is best for his team. In my mind, what is best for your team, isn't always an easy answer or some kind of philosophy. I think it changes for every situation.
This situation does not show me any real cognitive positive reason for sending Bo out for an all star match. Cael's man got screwed over an all star match on seeding, and it went against what the rule technically says. Is the rule enforced? Obviously not, but if you have a rule and you don't enforce it, then you cannot expect coaches to send their wrestlers into no-win situations.
This situation does not show me any real cognitive positive reason for sending Bo out for an all star match. Cael's man got screwed over an all star match on seeding, and it went against what the rule technically says. Is the rule enforced? Obviously not, but if you have a rule and you don't enforce it, then you cannot expect coaches to send their wrestlers into no-win situations.
More athletic than Bo? He's not more athletic. Bo Nickal is off the charts athletic. I don't think ZV is quicker or more explosive than Bo, either. You really underestimate how athletic Bo Nickal is.
Agree, considering Bo beat two time champ Gabe Dean who is also the only guy to beat Ed Ruth his last 3 years of college. Doubt Bo at your own peril.
Send the best wrestlers? Here are the matchups from last year -- you think these were the best wrestlers in the country?
125: Darian Cruz, Sr. (Lehigh) vs. Nick Piccininni, So. (Oklahoma State)
133: Seth Gross, Jr. (South Dakota State) vs. Stevan Micic, So. (Michigan)
141: Kevin Jack, Sr. (NC State) vs. Bryce Meredith, Sr. (Wyoming)
149: Matt Kolodzik, So. (Princeton) vs. Max Thomsen, So. (Northern Iowa)
157: B.J. Clagon, Sr. (Rider) vs. Alec Pantaleo, Jr. (Michigan)
165: Chad Walsh, Sr. (Rider) vs. Jonathan Schleifer, Sr. (Princeton)
174: Mark Hall, So. (Penn State) vs. Zahid Valencia, So. (Arizona State)
184: Drew Foster, Jr. (Northern Iowa) vs Pete Renda, Sr. (NC State)
197: Frank Mattiace, Sr. (Penn) vs. Michael Macchiavello, Sr. (NC State)
285: Tanner Hall, Jr. (Arizona State) vs. Nick Nevills, So. (Penn State)
I don't see how PSU gains anything by sending wrestlers or loses anything by not sending wrestlers.
Our coaches generally let it up to the wrestlers, but surely offer advice. Our guys are competitors, so it wouldn't surprise me if one or more go next year. Wouldn't surprise me if none go either. Sad in a way, as we've managed to see several of the All-Star Classics, and they were enjoyable events.
Wait....if ZV moves up and beats Bo, should he move up again to claim 3 championships in three different weight classes?
Just coming from a fan perspective. All Star classic. Sometimes the bigger picture should be viewed because without wrestlers, well...
They made their own bed when they began to break their own rule about the results not affecting the seeds. Now they will lie in it, that's how this works. Cael gave them every chance and their broken deal with the seeding committee and the service rankings turned on one of ours. Cael's history shows that when something like this happens, he fixes the problem.
I think Cael is going to fix the problem. Right now. Zahid can go against Martin, well, no, Tan man also has shunned them. Zahid can go against, hey, Gravina? A good Jersey test for Zahid and he can experience head butts, arm pulls, ankle twists, and eye pokes, good ole Jersey style.
I think Cael is going to fix the problem. Right now. Zahid can go against Martin, well, no, Tan man also has shunned them. Zahid can go against, hey, Gravina? A good Jersey test for Zahid and he can experience head butts, arm pulls, ankle twists, and eye pokes, good ole Jersey style.
Benefit to all-star participation are data points received. It could help a kid / coaches with strategy for round #2 (could hurt you too, by giving your opponent the insight)
Do seeds truly matter if you’re top 4 in the weight class? As a whole, there has been significant hand-wringing every year by us PSU fans (myself included) over PSU’s seeds and tough draws for NCAAs. While a tough draw has hurt a few PSU guys, most have turned lemons into lemonade. No one gets trophies for seeds achieved before the tourney begins... just my 2 cents
Do seeds truly matter if you’re top 4 in the weight class? As a whole, there has been significant hand-wringing every year by us PSU fans (myself included) over PSU’s seeds and tough draws for NCAAs. While a tough draw has hurt a few PSU guys, most have turned lemons into lemonade. No one gets trophies for seeds achieved before the tourney begins... just my 2 cents
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