Stall calls on RBY

[jbkeller72]

If I remember correctly, Cael did not have a big reaction to the third stall call. Most coaches would have been over the top.

Not Cael, he keep his Cool and I believe that his emotions helped keep RBY in a great mindset to continue how he wrestled for the previous 7 minutes.

Cael knew who had the better of the situation at that moment and let his athlete perform as he ultimately did.

I thought Cael was about as animated as he gets after the 3rd stall call sans infamous chair toss. He seemed pretty fired up all tourney relative to his normal disposition.

 

[GOLDBANGER]

Does anyone recall who the official was in the Reenan/Warner match?

 

[nitlion6]

Tom I pretty much agree on everything you post and again agree with you on Angel's proclivity to call stalls. I also had to rewatch it today and again found his calls to be ridicules. He should not have been assigned a finals match. Too much at stake.

While discussing stalling, I also found it interesting how people in the arena were booing Aaron Brooks during the last 14 seconds of his match.

While in neutral the whole match, Aaron hand fought and shot moving forward until Hidlay had his ass outside the circle repeatedly. Aaron was not pushing him, he was wrestling to score. If he wasn't doing that, Aaron held center.

Yet Hidlay down by a point, with 14 seconds to go decides to attack Aaron, as Aaron wisely backed up and circled. Had Hidlay decided to engage Aaron the other 6 minutes 46 seconds like he did for the last 14 seconds he might have been more happy with his Wrestling. To his credit he did have that nice shot in the third where Aaron's hands came off the mat but Aaron's shots were 3 or 4 to 1 from Hidlay. Yet the crowd foolishly booed Aaron at the end.

I'm glad Aaron, Roman, Nick and Carter achieved their goals. What a great night to be a Penn State wrestling fan.

In reality, if Hidley had engaged Aaron more he (Hidley) most likely would not have been pleased with results.
Kinda like Sammy Brooks wrestling Bo. Entertaining as hell, but not results oriented.

 

[nitlion6]

If I remember correctly, Cael did not have a big reaction to the third stall call. Most coaches would have been over the top.

Not Cael, he keep his Cool and I believe that his emotions helped keep RBY in a great mindset to continue how he wrestled for the previous 7 minutes.

Cael knew who had the better of the situation at that moment and let his athlete perform as he ultimately did.

You don't not recall correctly. He was out of the chair with mask pulled down to be heard clearly. Not Brands or Manning level animated, but pretty dramatic for Cael.
Terrible call by a very below average official. I am left wondering if the NCAA made Rivera take a long bus ride prior to the finals.

 

[Hotshoe]

You don't not recall correctly. He was out of the chair with mask pulled down to heard clearly. Not Brands or Manning level animated, but pretty dramatic for Cael.
Terrible call by a very below average official. I am left wondering if the NCAA made Rivera take a long bus ride prior to the finals.

Yes, Cael was pissed and was making comments. He pulled his mask down to do so. About as animated as he gets.

 

[Petch]

So Willie tweeted out a still showing Fix on RBY’s leg and the ref blowing OOB while they are both clearly in. He was laughing at the call, but failed to realize that they actually were OOB before Fix had RBY’s leg, but the main ref didn’t see the secondary ref indicate it. So the sequence went on and the main ref finally saw the other ref and rightly blew it dead.

C’mom Willie. You’re better than that.

 

[matter7172]

I'm personally not a fan of any of the attempts to make stalling less subjective. They don't seem to have improved anything.

The automatic backing out stall call doesn't seem to have reduced people wrestling at the edge. The guys that do it just know they need to circle in at the last second. And now there seems to be more guys wrestling/pushing their opponents to the edge hoping for a chance to push them OOB (Fix's neutral "offense" vs RBY). Instead of encouraging wrestling in the center of the mat, it seems to have had the opposite effect.

I think an automatic stall call at the end of a 0-0 first period would be similar. It would become just another within-the-match game some guys would play to try to eek out a point without **actually wrestling**.

I wish the refs would seize upon the obvious solution. When the two wrestlers are wrestling the edge in a "gamesmanship" manner, blow the whistle and restart them in the center.

 

[liex26]

Thought all three seemed kinda warranted. Now it’d be nice if that’s how they always called it tho. Pretty tough for RBY for the rules to change and him not know it lol. Watching the rest of the matches it obviously wasn’t called this way. Hidlay was about to immediately back up to being completely oob.

I'm sure I'll regret asking, but I'd love to hear your guesses on why Eirman didn't receive similar calls in his B1G finals. Were they warranted?

 

[District four]

I agree that this match was a definite outlier in how stall calls are made in Division 1 wrestling and thus, the calls were horrible given the precedent that has been set. However, I do not believe stalling is called enough in Division 1 wrestling and therefore I hope there is no consequence to the referee. After all, IMO there are many more instances where stalling should have been called but wasn't and there is rarely any consequence for failure to make the call. The result is the boring wrestling that many of us on this board complain about. If there is consequence to the Ref in the RBY match, the message the NCAA will be sending to refs will be "when in doubt, do not call stalling" which I believe is the wrong message and the wrong direction for the sport.

Stepping away from the RBY match, I would much rather see wrestlers being penalized more for stalling and the second stall call made in quicker succession after the first call when the wrestler does not pick up his game. The last 30 seconds of close Division 1 wrestling matches commonly become a joke because the wrestler that is leading runs away from the wrestler that is losing in a blatant display of stalling. The wrestlers know that the refs rarely call stalling twice within the last 30 seconds of a match. I would much rather this change so we see aggression from both wrestlers until the buzzer.

Put a smaller circle between out of bounds and the inner circle. If stalling is called you can't go outside the middle line lol. Keep moving them towards the center or they get dinged lol

 

[nerfstate]

I'm personally not a fan of any of the attempts to make stalling less subjective.

I'm so glad I'm not alone in favoring subjectivity for the refs. I feel like stalling mitigation was better when it was less prescribed.

 

[PSUcup1]

The timing between the two doesn't matter because the third was on an out of bounds situation. While RBY did back up a bit to the edge, Fix did ultimately push him out so I agree with those saying that one probably should've been on Fix.

First one when RBY was on top was definitely deserved. Second one wasn't horrible. But yes third one was bad.

this. 1st call was warranted. 2nd call was horrible. 3rd was a mis-application of the rule.

 

[El-Jefe]

So Willie tweeted out a still showing Fix on RBY’s leg and the ref blowing OOB while they are both clearly in. He was laughing at the call, but failed to realize that they actually were OOB before Fix had RBY’s leg, but the main ref didn’t see the secondary ref indicate it. So the sequence went on and the main ref finally saw the other ref and rightly blew it dead.

C’mom Willie. You’re better than that.

Tan Tom hacked Willie's account.

 

[El-Jefe]

Put a smaller circle between out of bounds and the inner circle. If stalling is called you can't go outside the middle line lol. Keep moving them towards the center or they get dinged lol

Funnier if about HR instead of mat action.

 

[nerfstate]

maybe BWI is the medium circle. Then again, apparently we are out of bounds.

 

[El-Jefe]

I'm personally not a fan of any of the attempts to make stalling less subjective. They don't seem to have improved anything.

I hear you but wrestling fans have been complaining about lack of stall calls for decades. The refs weren't changing on their own. So this is what we have.

I was only half joking in the other thread about Special Guest Referee Willie Saylor. I'd also hire Special Guest Referees David Taylor, Quentin Wright, Ed Ruth, Frank Molinaro, Jason Nolf, Zain Retherford, Cenzo Joseph, Mark Hall, and Ant the Special Guest Ref Champ. (But not Bo yet after his comments about one-direction calls.)

We could probably find some Special Guest Referees from other schools, say Gilman and Snyder. OK, Burroughs too.

Action would intensify and some of the coaches would chirp less.

 

[1032004]

this. 1st call was warranted. 2nd call was horrible. 3rd was a mis-application of the rule.

Well I said I thought the 2nd one was not horrible

 

[SRATH]

You don't not recall correctly. He was out of the chair with mask pulled down to heard clearly. Not Brands or Manning level animated, but pretty dramatic for Cael.
Terrible call by a very below average official. I am left wondering if the NCAA made Rivera take a long bus ride prior to the finals.

Cael being out of his chair might be code for "the chair is coming.....".

I thought Roman and Carter wrestled the way they needed to wrestle to win. Engage a little, move a lot and keep them at greater than arms length, wear the other guy out until you choose to attack. If both decided to go toe to toe, they would have had a more difficult time winning.

While we all remember the huge finals moments, Cenzo vs Imar, Bo getting the chin, Zain giving up the first takedown than almost breaking that poor kid in half, generally the finals are very cat and mouse.

I thought the third call against Roman was really poor, but that is only my opinion.

 

[NoVaLion2]

Put a smaller circle between out of bounds and the inner circle. If stalling is called you can't go outside the middle line lol. Keep moving them towards the center or they get dinged lol

I kind of like this idea. But I think they should make the inner circle a little larger. Then, if you're outside that circle for 30s you're stalling. You come wrestle this other guy or else.

 

[PSUcup1]

Just watching it again now. The 2nd call is one of the worst you will ever see. It came after Fix made one attempt a free a stoppage in which RBY was in on the leg.

atrocious

 

[okinburg1]

So Willie tweeted out a still showing Fix on RBY’s leg and the ref blowing OOB while they are both clearly in. He was laughing at the call, but failed to realize that they actually were OOB before Fix had RBY’s leg, but the main ref didn’t see the secondary ref indicate it. So the sequence went on and the main ref finally saw the other ref and rightly blew it dead.

C’mom Willie. You’re better than that.

Is he though???

 

[Pitchfork Rebel]

if these guys are supposed to be the best officials in college wrestling, then collegiate wrestling is in deep s&$%, and rivera should never call a championship math again. he should be totally embarrassed by that performance.

Absolutely. In general, its seemed a lot of the officiating needs an after action review.

I can't remember what match, but the announcer actually attempted to excuse a call because the ref was out of position.