Rutgers "decommit" visiting PSU this weekend.

GregInPitt

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Interesting, but with 2 interior OL players in the 2023 class now, would Trautwein and Franklin really want another interior OL player. The need for OT's seems glaring, and 3 OT's to go with the 2 interior players seems a more logical plan given the current roster, i.e. unless the staff is targeting a 6 OL class........
 
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ram2020

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Interesting, but with 2 interior OL players in the 2023 class now, would Trautwein and Franklin really want another interior OL player. The need for OT's seems glaring, and 3 OT's to go with the 2 interior players seems a more logical plan given the current roster, i.e. unless the staff is targeting a 6 OL class........
If there is one thing we should have learned its that one, two, or all of these guys are going to end up sucking at blocking. I think we should start recruiting 10 OL a year and then process 7 of them a year.
 

royboy

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If there is one thing we should have learned its that one, two, or all of these guys are going to end up sucking at blocking. I think we should start recruiting 10 OL a year and then process 7 of them a year.
I doubt the staff will do that, but numbers of OL seems to be important.

It's hard to tell just how they will develop, the rankings often prove wrong, and the positions seem injury-prone. So, the answer seems to be to bring in a high number of OL, work on development, make sure the position coaches are competent, and leave it to competition to get the best.

From 2020 and 2021, pretty much have to be on the upside. (you would think)
 

GregInPitt

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OLine is a significant area of need so you take as many quality OLinemen as you can. You never know if all OLinemen will stay committed and watch out for what could be a tough 2022 season and the transfer portal.
Yep but that's not what Franklin had done during his tenure at PSU
If there is one thing we should have learned its that one, two, or all of these guys are going to end up sucking at blocking. I think we should start recruiting 10 OL a year and then process 7 of them a year.
I believe what you wrote you wrote tongue in cheek, but Franklin has not recruited the number of olinemen on a yearly basis that some other programs have, and the results speak for themselves, unfortunately.

With recruiting classes averaging around 22 players or more in the Portal era with more players transferring than what was the norm previously, PSU is recruiting at least whole starting 22 player each year. So it would seem logical that almost a whole starting 5 oline would be recruited each year, especially since OL is a position where recruits seem harder to evaluate given how few are ready to play when they arrive on campus and how much development is necessary from the time they arrive until they are ready to play at a P5 level. But PSU has only recruited an average of 3.5 olinemen over that last 6 years. And that includes a couple of JC players with less eligibility.

2017 - 4
2018 - 4 (Asiedu out medically from the start)
2019 - 3, with 1 a JC player with less eligibility
2020 - 5
2021 - 2, plus 1 incoming transfer, with 1 of the H.S. recruits dropping out after less than 1 year in the program
2022 - 3, with 1 a JC player with less eligibility

The current PSU roster lists only 11 scholarship olinemen - Christ, Traore, Tengwall, Dawkins, Scruggs, Effner, Fashanu, Wormley, Achumba, Wallace and Nelson, with 2 more to enroll this summer, Shelton and McNeil. So that is only 13, just over a 2.5 deep if all were ready to play which we know is hardly the case. This is before any Portal additions, but there could also be Portal exits from the program as well.

With a limit of 85 scholarships a roster can not accommodate of full 4 deep at every position, and with the need for 4-5 deep at QB and RB, and a couple kickers as well as a few extra dlinemen to support the rotations used to keep players fresh in games, oline does get cut short of a full 4 deep. But a more realistic scholarship number of olinemen on a P5 roster would seem to be 15 to 17, which would likely have required an average of at least 4.5 olinemen per year in each recruiting class. Especially when JC olinemen with less eligibility are regularly part of recruiting classes.

Right now the numbers on the roster are just not there, and the only way to change that is for the staff to bring in a couple olinemen from the portal every year, or up the numbers every year in each recruiting class, which we have seen no evidence of occurring during Franklin's tenure........ And banking on Portal additions each year is a crap shoot, at the most important position on offense, and where the best teams insure success by recruiting the numbers and talent level out of high school.......

Watching the same teams in the playoff every year, and how dominant their OL and DL's are, shouldn't that lead Franklin to focus more on the OL numbers than he has done recently?
 
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bison13

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Dec 22, 2007
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I think it would be beneficial to take an extra offensive lineman if they can get one. Especially one who's ranked high like this young man. After a year or two some of these guys may be injured or leave in the portal or maybe they convert one of them to a defensive tackle if needed.
 

Cpeplion

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Feb 8, 2014
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Interesting, but with 2 interior OL players in the 2023 class now, would Trautwein and Franklin really want another interior OL player. The need for OT's seems glaring, and 3 OT's to go with the 2 interior players seems a more logical plan given the current roster, i.e. unless the staff is targeting a 6 OL class........
The need for OT’s has been glaring for 10 years. Best to just ignore it
 

Hugh Laurie

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Mar 26, 2017
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Wonder if Union City HS alum Steve Gonzalez played a role in having the kid decommit and take a look at PSU. I bumped into Steve at a local HS football game in the fall where his brother plays LB. He told me he was trying to catch on with a Canadian team after his release from the Bills. He looked in pretty good shape and chiseled.
 
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ryoder1

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I listened to a PSU podcast saying getting offensive tackles that meet the measureables which I guess is at least 6'5" if not 6'6" and long arms is very difficult. Nothing available in the portal. This podcast was saying just average players who meet the physical measurables get offers from everyone. We will most likely start Wallace and Fashanu at OT next season. What position is Wormley by the way? He was hurt last year but is supposed to be good, right?
 
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19333lion

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Jan 30, 2016
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I listened to a PSU podcast saying getting offensive tackles that meet the measureables which I guess is at least 6'5" if not 6'6" and long arms is very difficult. Nothing available in the portal. This podcast was saying just average players who meet the physical measurables get offers from everyone. We will most likely start Wallace and Fashanu at OT next season. What position is Wormley by the way? He was hurt last year but is supposed to be good, right?
Guard.
 

bvillebaron

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Feb 4, 2004
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Yep but that's not what Franklin had done during his tenure at PSU

I believe what you wrote you wrote tongue in cheek, but Franklin has not recruited the number of olinemen on a yearly basis that some other programs have, and the results speak for themselves, unfortunately.

With recruiting classes averaging around 22 players or more in the Portal era with more players transferring than what was the norm previously, PSU is recruiting at least whole starting 22 player each year. So it would seem logical that almost a whole starting 5 oline would be recruited each year, especially since OL is a position where recruits seem harder to evaluate given how few are ready to play when they arrive on campus and how much development is necessary from the time they arrive until they are ready to play at a P5 level. But PSU has only recruited an average of 3.5 olinemen over that last 6 years. And that includes a couple of JC players with less eligibility.

2017 - 4
2018 - 4 (Asiedu out medically from the start)
2019 - 3, with 1 a JC player with less eligibility
2020 - 5
2021 - 2, plus 1 incoming transfer, with 1 of the H.S. recruits dropping out after less than 1 year in the program
2022 - 3, with 1 a JC player with less eligibility

The current PSU roster lists only 11 scholarship olinemen - Christ, Traore, Tengwall, Dawkins, Scruggs, Effner, Fashanu, Wormley, Achumba, Wallace and Nelson, with 2 more to enroll this summer, Shelton and McNeil. So that is only 13, just over a 2.5 deep if all were ready to play which we know is hardly the case. This is before any Portal additions, but there could also be Portal exits from the program as well.

With a limit of 85 scholarships a roster can not accommodate of full 4 deep at every position, and with the need for 4-5 deep at QB and RB, and a couple kickers as well as a few extra dlinemen so support the rotations used to keep players fresh in games, oline does get cut short of a full 4 deep. But a more realistic scholarship number of olinemen on a P5 roster would seem to be 15 to 17, which would likely have required an average of at least 4.5 olinemen per year in each recruiting class. Especially when JC olinemen with less eligibility are regularly part of recruiting classes.

Right now the numbers on the roster are just not there, and the only way to change that is for the staff to bring in a couple olinemen from the portal every year, or up the numbers every year in each recruiting class, which we have seen no evidence of occurring during Franklin's tenure........ And banking on Portal additions each year is a crap shoot, at the most important position on offense, and where the best teams insure success by recruiting the numbers and talent level out of high school.......

Watching the same teams in the playoff every year, and how dominant their OL and DL's are, shouldn't that lead Franklin to focus more on the OL numbers than he has done recently?
Well taken points. I looked at the roster earlier and saw 20 OL listed, same number as Alabama but as you and others have pointed out too many of the OL on the roster are non-scholarship players. Given the uncertainty about OL panning out, I think your numbers are spot on and the number should be your high number—17. I think Franklin has over recruited WRs.
 

HartfordLlion

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Wonder if Union City HS alum Steve Gonzalez played a role in having the kid decommit and take a look at PSU. I bumped into Steve at a local HS football game in the fall where his brother plays LB. He told me he was trying to catch on with a Canadian team after his release from the Bills. He looked in pretty good shape and chiseled.

Gonzo, chiseled?? Those two words don't seem to go together.
 
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BBrown

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I doubt the staff will do that, but numbers of OL seems to be important.

It's hard to tell just how they will develop, the rankings often prove wrong, and the positions seem injury-prone. So, the answer seems to be to bring in a high number of OL, work on development, make sure the position coaches are competent, and leave it to competition to get the best.

From 2020 and 2021, pretty much have to be on the upside. (you would think)
+1. One of my criticisms of Franklin and the staff, with regards to recruiting, is the number of OL they sign. IMO they are on the low side. Once again we seem to have "holes" and depth issues on the OL and LB'rs.
 

GregInPitt

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We have over-recruited WR, IMO. Share the wealth with Trautwein this year. Bring in six offensive linemen.
Yes, over recruited WR, and that is with the fact that Franklin does not seem to be able to move WR's to DB when they don't work out at WR. The lack of WR's to DB is more than likely more so due to the attitudes of current young players who seem more set on finding success at their dream position than what Franklin and his staff may want to do. Forty years ago I believe players were more trusting of coaches to develop them where they felt that player fit best for the team and for their long term success. Not so much in today's world.

With the game having changing over the years to more of an emphasis on passing a team can't afford to not have 3 or 4 quality WR's ready to play. But WR's can usually play a lot more quickly after arriving on campus than olinemen can. Which leads to having a talented group of DB's that can cover....

But if you don't have a quality oline you aren't winning a lot of games, so something's gotta give........

Same with LB. Having only 5 scholarship LB's on the current roster (including Katshir who seems to have reached his potential level of play which is not that of a starter...) with only 2 true freshman to be added in the Fall, at this point, is also not a great plan for success.

This seems like a setup where Portal recruiting is more important than high school signing day recruiting.
 

bison13

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Dec 22, 2007
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Yes, over recruited WR, and that is with the fact that Franklin does not seem to be able to move WR's to DB when they don't work out at WR. The lack of WR's to DB is more than likely more so due to the attitudes of current young players who seem more set on finding success at their dream position than what Franklin and his staff may want to do. Forty years ago I believe players were more trusting of coaches to develop them where they felt that player fit best for the team and for their long term success. Not so much in today's world.

With the game having changing over the years to more of an emphasis on passing a team can't afford to not have 3 or 4 quality WR's ready to play. But WR's can usually play a lot more quickly after arriving on campus than olinemen can. Which leads to having a talented group of DB's that can cover....

But if you don't have a quality oline you aren't winning a lot of games, so something's gotta give........

Same with LB. Having only 5 scholarship LB's on the current roster (including Katshir who seems to have reached his potential level of play which is not that of a starter...) with only 2 true freshman to be added in the Fall, at this point, is also not a great plan for success.

This seems like a setup where Portal recruiting is more important than high school signing day recruiting.
Very much agree on the reluctancy of currents players and recruits who would rather portal then do a switch of positions. While I do think Saunders is a stud wr recruit, look at how osu recruited him as a db and he wanted nothing to do with it.
 
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