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Question for Misder2

LundyPSU

Well-Known Member
Gold Member
Jan 5, 2002
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Since you seem to be in the know on a few things related to the JS saga, what is going on with this tape of the janitor (Calhoun) saying it was not JS who he saw in the shower (2000 incident, V8)?
 
follow John Ziegler on twitter...

....apparently the janitor with "dementia" is on a prosecution tape saying Sandusky is NOT who he saw in the shower. Zig hasn't heard the tape but is confident he knows what's on it. Bottom line - the most "horrific" incident (per Louis the Liar) to occur on campus never happened...
 
i am not on twitter either....

....but if you just google "john ziegler twitter" you can read everything
 
Re: follow John Ziegler on twitter...

Well, with all respect, it's Zeigler so I take it with a grain of salt. If the prosecution had that on tape and did not turn it over to the defense that's a serious charge to make. If the defense had it and didn't bring it up, (which I find very hard to believe), then that's beyond malpractice on their end. Right now though, I need more proof than a tweet from Zeigler to get all worked up over it. JMO.

This post was edited on 3/12 10:02 PM by psu00
 
Re: follow John Ziegler on twitter...

So if this tape exists, and you believe the guy, does it make you feel better that two guys who had access to FB showers were showering with kids?
 
Re: follow John Ziegler on twitter...

Well, as someone who is not a 'dedicated Zeigler fan or follower' I will only add the following. First, if true, this undermines the entire case that people were afraid to turn in the all powerful football coach. Remember, this was the entire basis for that claim (used by the ncaa) with the janitor and his manager fearing to report it out of fear of reprisal. Second, if true, it totally puts the prosecution case (about PSU) into complete doubt in terms of their honesty and integrity. Finally, and most importantly, it would mean that there may be another abuser out there that needs to be caught and is right now getting away with it because the AG blamed it on JS when they (supposedly) know it was not JS.
 
Re: follow John Ziegler on twitter...

Originally posted by PSU Mike:
So if this tape exists, and you believe the guy, does it make you feel better that two guys who had access to FB showers were showering with kids?
WTF are you talking about??? That's the conclusion you come to if this tape actually does exist??? If I recall correctly, Sandusky was convicted of charges associated this unknown victim based at least partially on second hand testimony from the now demented janitor.

This post was edited on 3/12 10:15 PM by Mixolydian
 
I'm not sure what this is about, my first inclination is that this is just another case of Ziegler being Ziegler. I am not familiar with and have not heard rumor of any sort of recording involving any of the janitors. There are parts of that story that don't fit but a recording is not one of them. My feelings on Ziegler is that he is an a@@hat of the n'th degree, but I can't refute this particular claim of his.

All that said, I only know what I know, I don't know what others may or may not know.

Ziegler is an interesting character to watch in all of this, he will twist and turn anything and everything in order to meet his desired outcome. Interesting, dangerous and oftentimes comical to watch.

It's difficult for me to keep track of him because he has me blocked but then again so does Scott Paterno.
 
Re: follow John Ziegler on twitter...

My question was simple, and not loaded in any way. JS was still convicted in connection with the McQueary incident. If you believe the janitor witnessed somebody else showering with a boy, wouldn't make the number that did so two?

Hey, the notion of a network of pervs has been out there for years...
 
Re: follow John Ziegler on twitter...

Well, there's no mention of who this other perv is, so I wouldn't go that far. Didn't it allegedly happen in the Lasch?
 
Re: follow John Ziegler on twitter...

Where is the link to the audio of the tape? More importantly, if the tape exists and he did really say that, did he have dementia at the time he made that statement? If so, it's moot.
 
One would think that Amendola was aware. As for Zieglar, I am not a fan of his style. I am not in a position to dispute his opinions. Whether is right or wrong, most people won't or don't take him seriously
 
it sure would be interesting. I've said all along, the lynchpin of this entire thing is McQuery. Without his testimony, it is very likely JS is a free man. He is really the only witness that didn't have a financial gain. And it certainly looks like he emboldened his testimony from the GJ/trial versus what he told his father, Dranov, Joe, Curley & Schultz. And, with what we know about what the detectives did to get favorable testimonies, nothing would surprise me.

Do I think JS is guilty? yes, but there's the whole burden of proof thing in a criminal trial.

Wouldn't it be something to see his conviction overturned at some point? Man, the roof would come off.
 
Well, if Amendola had this tape and Rominger leaked the MS tape to the media, then JS sure as hell has a great case for an appeal. And yes, the roof would come off...
 
That will never happen. Even if the trial were a sham and the means of acquiring evidence was shady, I doubt anyone would overturn this case. Way too emotional/political.
 
Given the insular way that SC is obviously run,

and given that powerful people are pulling the strings, I've wondered whether Amendola was compromised.
 
Re: Given the insular way that SC is obviously run,

Didn't he knock up his 16 year old assistant or something?
 
Who has the audio tape? If the tape exists, was the janitor suffering from dementia at the time of the statement? If so, it's not relevant. I never thought that the hearsay ruling was correct either though.
 
no clue. and was the dementia diagnosis verified? the whole case (as presented) re: V8 was BS. Given that, it really makes you wonder why the OAG included it, when they supposedly had more accusers lined up

This post was edited on 3/13 9:44 AM by LundyPSU
 
agree, for JS...but for Penn State

all of this would have been for naught...the Freeh Report, the NCAA, the BOT's actions/inactions, perhaps the victim payouts.....that would be a monumental mess of epic proportions.
 
The PA OAG is obviously a criminal enterprise...

...this has been exhibited from the day of the GJP leak. All I'll say about the alleged tape recording is that it wouldn't surprise me in the least. Anyone that would be surprised by it hasn't been paying attention.

Nothing will ever come of it because the courts and the judges protect their own (in this case the OAG) in PA.

The PA OAG remains (in my eyes) the biggest culprit in this entire saga. There isn't even a close second.
 
Re: agree, for JS...but for Penn State


Obliviax posted on 3/13/2015...
all of this would have been for naught...the Freeh Report, the NCAA, the BOT's actions/inactions, perhaps the victim payouts.....that would be a monumental mess of epic proportions.



This should be worded in the past tense.
 
Re: follow John Ziegler on twitter...


Originally posted by psu00:
Well, with all respect, it's Zeigler so I take it with a grain of salt. If the prosecution had that on tape and did not turn it over to the defense that's a serious charge to make. If the defense had it and didn't bring it up, (which I find very hard to believe), then that's beyond malpractice on their end. Right now though, I need more proof than a tweet from Zeigler to get all worked up over it. JMO.

This post was edited on 3/12 10:02 PM by psu00
I follow Zig because he has information but I do not agree with all, or even most of his conclusions on the scandal. However, there are a few things to note here. Whatever you might think of his take on the subject, I've never known John to simply make up evidence. There are a number of reasons why the defense team would not have used this info at the trial. For one, as part of the discovery process, the prosecution dumped millions of documents and other evidence on the defense team about three weeks prior to the trial. It would have been impossible for the defense team to go through it all in time. It's a common strategy used by prosecution teams to deny the defense team an opportunity to find holes in the prosecution's arguments. It's also a common practice for the defense to team to respond with a request for a continuance in order to have more time to go through the discovery documentation and those requests are nearly always granted. However, every request for continuance made by the defense team in the JS trial was denied. That's a big part of why the trial happened so quickly and it's also very unusual.

Another point is that the tape could only have been used by the defense team to refute prosecution testimony of James Calhoun. However, Calhoun never testified since the prosecution team declared him to be unfit to testify due to his dementia. Since Calhoun would have been the prosecution's witness, the defense team could not have used the tape to refute testimony since that testimony never happened. Furthermore, the defense team could not call Calhoun to testify as a defense witness since he was declared unfit to testify in any event. Even if they tried to used the tape to refute Ron Petrosky's testimony, the prosecution would have objected and had the judge rule the tape off limits since Calhoun was already declared incompetent and anything he might say either before or during the trial declared unreliable. Assuming the tape exists, and assuming the defense team knew about it, the prosecution fixed it so the tape was useless to them.
 
Question - the twitter thread where Ziegler mentions the janitor


indicating he did not see Sandusky you seem to ask twice whether Ziegler ever spoke to any janitors - are you implying something there?
 
Re: Question - the twitter thread where Ziegler mentions the janitor

Not at all, I was just trying to determine whether he had or not. Nothing more than that.
 
Re: agree, for JS...but for Penn State


Originally posted by Obliviax:
all of this would have been for naught...the Freeh Report, the NCAA, the BOT's actions/inactions, perhaps the victim payouts.....that would be a monumental mess of epic proportions.
Yep, and that's exactly why the BOT cabal/Pepper Hamilton/FSS are fighting so hard against providing the unredacted source docs for the bullshit freeh report.

So many actions/punishments/settlements took place based on that bullshit report and A LOT of people (PA OAG, PH/FSS, BOT cabal, NCAA, etc.) will be made to look really stupid if it comes out the Freeh report isn't worth the paper it was printed on.
 
Originally posted by mn78psu83:
Who has the audio tape? If the tape exists, was the janitor suffering from dementia at the time of the statement? If so, it's not relevant. I never thought that the hearsay ruling was correct either though.
John says the "lawyer" has the "audio". And that as he understands it (or I understand him), the "lawyer" implies that the janitor was declared "demented" AFTER he made the statement that it wasn't Sandusky. I assume the "lawyer" he is talking about is Amendola, but he didn't make that clear.
 
Originally posted by BUFFALO LION:

Originally posted by mn78psu83:
Who has the audio tape? If the tape exists, was the janitor suffering from dementia at the time of the statement? If so, it's not relevant. I never thought that the hearsay ruling was correct either though.
John says the "lawyer" has the "audio". And that as he understands it (or I understand him), the "lawyer" implies that the janitor was declared "demented" AFTER he made the statement that it wasn't Sandusky. I assume the "lawyer" he is talking about is Amendola, but he didn't make that clear.
OK. Apparently at least two of Sandusky's lawyers have the audio. Amendola and the appeals attorney.
 
I always figured they included it because it was the only other "victim" other than the McQueary victim that involved an eye witness. And of course we all know that neither of those victims came forward for the trial.

I too believe Sandusky was guilty of something illegal, but I often wonder what exactly it was that he did.
 
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