ADVERTISEMENT

Perspective on UM, OSU, PSU

PSU2UNC

Well-Known Member
Feb 9, 2016
7,000
7,317
1
Michigan has certainly looked very impressive this year and a lot is being made of their two straight wins over OSU.

There are articles about how PSU is now "chasing" Michigan rather than chasing OSU.

PSU is 2-2 vs Michigan over the last four years, including a very close loss (that probably should have been a win) in 2021. PSU has also played very close games against OSU over the past 6 years. My assessment is that PSU is not very far behind either program.

However, I would make three points about Michigan's recent success as they relate to PSU.

1) In the four years prior to Michigan's first playoff appearance, their records were: 8-5, 10-3, 9-4, 2-4 (all under Harbaugh). That's mediocre (ish) and not dissimilar from where PSU is.

2) While Michigan was (mostly) impressive this year, their 2021 results included a loss to MSU and squeaking by (1 score games) against Rutgers, Nebraska and PSU.

There is zero reason PSU can't also break through. Recruiting is similar, coaching is similar, facilities are similar, NIL is similar. Just a matter of time.
 
Michigan has certainly looked very impressive this year and a lot is being made of their two straight wins over OSU.

There are articles about how PSU is now "chasing" Michigan rather than chasing OSU.

PSU is 2-2 vs Michigan over the last four years, including a very close loss (that probably should have been a win) in 2021. PSU has also played very close games against OSU over the past 6 years. My assessment is that PSU is not very far behind either program.

However, I would make three points about Michigan's recent success as they relate to PSU.

1) In the four years prior to Michigan's first playoff appearance, their records were: 8-5, 10-3, 9-4, 2-4 (all under Harbaugh). That's mediocre (ish) and not dissimilar from where PSU is.

2) While Michigan was (mostly) impressive this year, their 2021 results included a loss to MSU and squeaking by (1 score games) against Rutgers, Nebraska and PSU.

There is zero reason PSU can't also break through. Recruiting is similar, coaching is similar, facilities are similar, NIL is similar. Just a matter of time.
Not sure including the COVID year has any value -- from the games we won or lost. That wasn't a "Real" football season. As far as I'm concerned...JF has yet to win in AA, sans Covid year. But, overall agreed with your post.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mcpat
Michigan has certainly looked very impressive this year and a lot is being made of their two straight wins over OSU.

There are articles about how PSU is now "chasing" Michigan rather than chasing OSU.

PSU is 2-2 vs Michigan over the last four years, including a very close loss (that probably should have been a win) in 2021. PSU has also played very close games against OSU over the past 6 years. My assessment is that PSU is not very far behind either program.

However, I would make three points about Michigan's recent success as they relate to PSU.

1) In the four years prior to Michigan's first playoff appearance, their records were: 8-5, 10-3, 9-4, 2-4 (all under Harbaugh). That's mediocre (ish) and not dissimilar from where PSU is.

2) While Michigan was (mostly) impressive this year, their 2021 results included a loss to MSU and squeaking by (1 score games) against Rutgers, Nebraska and PSU.

There is zero reason PSU can't also break through. Recruiting is similar, coaching is similar, facilities are similar, NIL is similar. Just a matter of time.
Good Stuff, although I ask you this......are we not in the same place we were after 2016? The 2 Ohio State choke jobs killed the momentum.

I am hoping we grab a little momentum and that the QB is it and we make a serious run.
 
Not sure including the COVID year has any value -- from the games we won or lost. That wasn't a "Real" football season. As far as I'm concerned...JF has yet to win in AA, sans Covid year. But, overall agreed with your post.
For the same people that point to PSU's bad 2020, you have to include those results.

If you want to exclude 2020 (I am OK with that), then PSU has had one "down year" (in which they still went to a major bowl game) since the 2016 championship.

But people (not necessarily you) can't have it both ways.
 
Michigan has certainly looked very impressive this year and a lot is being made of their two straight wins over OSU.

There are articles about how PSU is now "chasing" Michigan rather than chasing OSU.

PSU is 2-2 vs Michigan over the last four years, including a very close loss (that probably should have been a win) in 2021. PSU has also played very close games against OSU over the past 6 years. My assessment is that PSU is not very far behind either program.

However, I would make three points about Michigan's recent success as they relate to PSU.

1) In the four years prior to Michigan's first playoff appearance, their records were: 8-5, 10-3, 9-4, 2-4 (all under Harbaugh). That's mediocre (ish) and not dissimilar from where PSU is.

2) While Michigan was (mostly) impressive this year, their 2021 results included a loss to MSU and squeaking by (1 score games) against Rutgers, Nebraska and PSU.

There is zero reason PSU can't also break through. Recruiting is similar, coaching is similar, facilities are similar, NIL is similar. Just a matter of time.
not that it's germane, but we played michigan too early in the season this year. The defense was still learning Diaz system and players were out of position on some of the michigan runs. Not saying we would have won, but later in the year it might have been closer
 
A number of very valid points in this thread. I will add though that we have been just a touch behind Michigan on average in team talent composite but Ohio State is on another level from the rest of the conference and on par with only Alabama and Georgia.
 
not that it's germane, but we played michigan too early in the season this year. The defense was still learning Diaz system and players were out of position on some of the michigan runs. Not saying we would have won, but later in the year it might have been closer
Certainly didn't help to play them that early. Somewhat reminiscent of 2016 and the O still learning Morehead's system (although that day, the LB injuries were too much to overcome).

I also think that the gameplan (not selling out to stop the run) was because Diaz thought that McCarthy could beat them deep. Interesting that is exactly how Michigan beat OSU.
 
Just my two cents. Michigan is simply hot at the moment. As you stated prior to last years run they where Mediocre imho and psu has beaten them. No I don’t think there head and shoulders above psu. I look for payback next year at beaver. They have automatically been anointed as the second coming of Alabama and I hope that ends FAST
 
One of the biggest changes for UM was their S&C coach from Arkansas who's philosophy was to build big body OL's which seemed to work for Bret Bielema at Arkansas. They seemed to handle most Big 10 opponents in that area.
 
Michigan has certainly looked very impressive this year and a lot is being made of their two straight wins over OSU.

There are articles about how PSU is now "chasing" Michigan rather than chasing OSU.

PSU is 2-2 vs Michigan over the last four years, including a very close loss (that probably should have been a win) in 2021. PSU has also played very close games against OSU over the past 6 years. My assessment is that PSU is not very far behind either program.

However, I would make three points about Michigan's recent success as they relate to PSU.

1) In the four years prior to Michigan's first playoff appearance, their records were: 8-5, 10-3, 9-4, 2-4 (all under Harbaugh). That's mediocre (ish) and not dissimilar from where PSU is.

2) While Michigan was (mostly) impressive this year, their 2021 results included a loss to MSU and squeaking by (1 score games) against Rutgers, Nebraska and PSU.

There is zero reason PSU can't also break through. Recruiting is similar, coaching is similar, facilities are similar, NIL is similar. Just a matter of time.
So I spoke to a person inside the tOSU program yesterday who told me this. tOSU couldn't handle UM's long passing game when they bunched up 3 or 4 receivers on one side of the field. To counter that, they had to take their entire defensive backfield over to cover them because the DC wanted to blitz the QB to keep him from being comfortable. UM countered with running plays to the weak side (plays on the side away from the bunched-up WRs) using a RB with world-class speed (for a RB). That kid kept breaking the runs for long gainers. tOSU simply could not stop both the WRs and the RB in that formation and that was the key to several long gainers for TDs that UM had. They didn't see this in film and feel UM put it in for the tOSU game.

Interestingly, UM also broke long runs for TDs to break the game open against us.


Regardless, my contact told me that had they prepared for that O, they would have won the game but that UM scored 5 TDs off that formation either running or passing.
 
So I spoke to a person inside the tOSU program yesterday who told me this. tOSU couldn't handle UM's long passing game when they bunched up 3 or 4 receivers on one side of the field. To counter that, they had to take their entire defensive backfield over to cover them because the DC wanted to blitz the QB to keep him from being comfortable. UM countered with running plays to the weak side (plays on the side away from the bunched-up WRs) using a RB with world-class speed (for a RB). That kid kept breaking the runs for long gainers. tOSU simply could not stop both the WRs and the RB in that formation and that was the key to several long gainers for TDs that UM had. They didn't see this in film and feel UM put it in for the tOSU game.

Interestingly, UM also broke long runs for TDs to break the game open against us.


Regardless, my contact told me that had they prepared for that O, they would have won the game but that UM scored 5 TDs off that formation either running or passing.
Interesting. But UM won because of the long passing game, not the long runs (I mean the runs helped, but the three long TD passes were daggers). UM hadn't really done that against a team with a pulse all year (which is maybe why OSU wasn't ready for that). I frankly didn't think they could do it.
 
Interesting. But UM won because of the long passing game, not the long runs (I mean the runs helped, but the three long TD passes were daggers). UM hadn't really done that against a team with a pulse all year (which is maybe why OSU wasn't ready for that). I frankly didn't think they could do it.
The long passes were off the same formation. tOSU had to decide to stop the long passes or stop the long runs. They decided to stop the long passes and UM broke for three long-running TDs in three possessions. At that point, the game was over. Donovan Edwards had 216 yards rushing on 22 carries for a 9.8 yards per carry average. To put that in perspective, PSU had a TOTAL of 111 yards rushing against tOSU.
 
The long passes were off the same formation. tOSU had to decide to stop the long passes or stop the long runs. They decided to stop the long passes and UM broke for three long-running TDs in three possessions. At that point, the game was over. Donovan Edwards had 216 yards rushing on 22 carries for a 9.8 yards per carry average. To put that in perspective, PSU had a TOTAL of 111 yards rushing against tOSU.
Yes, I understand your point (which is a good one) but the passes came first, opening up the runs.
 
Yes, I understand your point (which is a good one) but the passes came first, opening up the runs.
Right. I see. tOSU made the adjustment to stop the long pass. UM saw that they committed everyone in the defensive backfield to the side of the field where the bunched up WRs were. So they ran the ball back the other way. When the RB broke the LOS, there was simply nobody there. So tOSU had to decide to stop the run or stop the pass. They continued to try and stop the pass but it was really too late by then.

Fact is, there was a player in the tOSU backfield that was getting smoked. I can't recall his name. But he couldn't stop anyone one-on-one so he needed Safety help. That Safety had to go to that side of the field which left the other side wide open for a long run.
 
OSU was selling out to stop the run for most of the game.

That resulted in the long passing TDs in the first half and even the long TD runs late in the game. You often see teams on defense facing a 4th and short do everything to stop the run; and if the offense breaks that single line of defense, it can go all the way. Both of Edwards long runs were against OSU calling a run stopping D, as Michigan was attempting to burn the clock.

OSU not being prepared for something as simple as putting all wide outs to one side of the field is NOT why they lost. Their DBs are not as good as the rest of the team, and they asked them to cover without help.
 
A couple random thoughts on this:
1) If Ryan Day loses to Michigan again next year he's gone and there will be transition at Ohio State. A lot of OSU fans are already calling for his head. So stability at Ohio State becomes a question.

2) Harbaugh had to overhaul his offense AND defense to be competitive, and he's done it. In the end, Josh Gattis wasn't the answer but the UM offense still has a lot of stuff Gattis brought (which Gattis learned from Moorhead). But look how long it took Harbaugh to do this. It takes a while to build and rebuild until you get a program back up to the top.

3) Michigan never stopped recruiting dominant OL but now they're developing them better. Both Ohio State and Michigan are clearly superior to PSU now at OL and that is going to make it hard for PSU until Franklin can close the gap.

4) The other area where PSU is really lagging talent wise is wideout. PSU desperately needs size. It really struck me Saturday when I realized I would love to see those big Michigan State wideouts playing for PSU. Again, the lack of success (except for Hamler and Dotson) and coaching instability has really hurt recruiting. No disrespect to Parker W., he is a terrific college player but doesn't have the size or speed of the Ohio State or Michigan wideouts.
 
2) Harbaugh had to overhaul his offense AND defense to be competitive, and he's done it. In the end, Josh Gattis wasn't the answer but the UM offense still has a lot of stuff Gattis brought (which Gattis learned from Moorhead). But look how long it took Harbaugh to do this. It takes a while to build and rebuild until you get a program back up to the top.



4) The other area where PSU is really lagging talent wise is wideout. PSU desperately needs size. It really struck me Saturday when I realized I would love to see those big Michigan State wideouts playing for PSU. Again, the lack of success (except for Hamler and Dotson) and coaching instability has really hurt recruiting. No disrespect to Parker W., he is a terrific college player but doesn't have the size or speed of the Ohio State or Michigan wideouts.
PSU has had a lot of successful WRs during Franklin's tenure (not all were CJF recruits) many of whom are having good careers in NFL: Godwin, Hamler, Dotson, Hamilton. I think you can point to that NFL pedigree in recruiting (obviously OSU has put more WR in NFL during that same time period, but you can say that for most positions0.

But I agree having a 6'3 4.5 guy would be great.
 
We are a mean, nasty oline away from being a playoff team next year. With Olu coming back, it seems that there’s a lot of confidence inside Lasch that we will have a playoff caliber team next year. Hopefully all of the contributing underclassmen come back, we get a good bowl game against a good team, and smack them around. This year felt a lot like 1993 - a 10 win campaign sandwiched around losses to OSU and Michigan with the team really starting to come together in November.

We can run the table next year. Big picture, with Rhule at Nebraska, Fickel at Wisky, and USC coming in, the BIG is going to be TOUGH going forward.
 
A number of very valid points in this thread. I will add though that we have been just a touch behind Michigan on average in team talent composite but Ohio State is on another level from the rest of the conference and on par with only Alabama and Georgia.
I agree that Ohio State has the most talent in the Big Ten, hands down, so how has Michigan dominated them in the field two years in a row? Those are very impressive wins for Michigan. They are currently the only team in the Big Ten who can beat them. How are they able to do that?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Online Persona
Michigan has certainly looked very impressive this year and a lot is being made of their two straight wins over OSU.

There are articles about how PSU is now "chasing" Michigan rather than chasing OSU.

PSU is 2-2 vs Michigan over the last four years, including a very close loss (that probably should have been a win) in 2021. PSU has also played very close games against OSU over the past 6 years. My assessment is that PSU is not very far behind either program.

However, I would make three points about Michigan's recent success as they relate to PSU.

1) In the four years prior to Michigan's first playoff appearance, their records were: 8-5, 10-3, 9-4, 2-4 (all under Harbaugh). That's mediocre (ish) and not dissimilar from where PSU is.

2) While Michigan was (mostly) impressive this year, their 2021 results included a loss to MSU and squeaking by (1 score games) against Rutgers, Nebraska and PSU.

There is zero reason PSU can't also break through. Recruiting is similar, coaching is similar, facilities are similar, NIL is similar. Just a matter of time.
It's only fair that all 3 play in the same division.
 
  • Like
Reactions: bison13
We can run the table next year. Big picture, with Rhule at Nebraska, Fickel at Wisky, and USC coming in, the BIG is going to be TOUGH going forward.

Will be interesting to see how the conference handles scheduling. 10-2 should be enough to make the final 12 just about every season. 9-3 probably gets you in with the right matchups.
 
The long passes were off the same formation. tOSU had to decide to stop the long passes or stop the long runs. They decided to stop the long passes and UM broke for three long-running TDs in three possessions. At that point, the game was over. Donovan Edwards had 216 yards rushing on 22 carries for a 9.8 yards per carry average. To put that in perspective, PSU had a TOTAL of 111 yards rushing against tOSU.
If they were selling out on the pass why didn't they have any safety help over the top? Cover 0 seemed to be what burned them, once a player broke free, RB or WR, he was gone. I don't recall PSU running as much cover 0 against UM but my memory is fuzzy.
 
I agree that Ohio State has the most talent in the Big Ten, hands down, so how has Michigan dominated them in the field two years in a row? Those are very impressive wins for Michigan. They are currently the only team in the Big Ten who can beat them. How are they able to do that?
They match up well along the lines which sometimes is a crap shoot in recruiting. Stars don't always pan out. Michigan's best OL is their OC that was a rimmington trophy finalist at uva last year and a 2 star as a recruit. Michigan didn't develop him, they hit portal gold.

Also, Ohio St has underperformed with top 3 talent for years now. Remember Purdue blowing them out a couple years ago? Not one player for Purdue would have started for Ohio St that year but they were better coached.
 
  • Like
Reactions: PSU2UNC
If they were selling out on the pass why didn't they have any safety help over the top? Cover 0 seemed to be what burned them, once a player broke free, RB or WR, he was gone. I don't recall PSU running as much cover 0 against UM but my memory is fuzzy.
they were all over on the other side of the field trying to cover 3 or 4 wide outs.
 
they were all over on the other side of the field trying to cover 3 or 4 wide outs.

Seemed more like poor execution and poor coverage by OSU. They sold out to rush QB on first TD but JJ competed pass and OSU player whiffed on tackle. The long Cornelius Johnson TD was absolutely horrible coverage with kid getting turned and lost assignment. From there, it became clear that OSU was trying to cover too many bases - have to get to QB, watch the big pass play, watch for JJ run and watch for big RB run play. Really have to credit Jim. His offense can exploit multiple mismatches. Corum is the quick hit strong RB that makes them elite. They are very good even without him. Still, a better secondary would have not allowed those long TDs which opened up the game. At end of day, Jim used his NFL connections with his bro to right the ship. Most programs don't have that luxury, bringing in top-level DC from NFL to fix things up. The OL is dominant now and PSU / OSU left trying to win with pass happy fluffball. It does not work. We will trott out Allar, Kayron, Nick and "getting there" OL and they will push us around, stop run and beat us by 3 TDs. CJF fluffball is good for 3rd in BTE..woohoo.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Obliviax
A number of very valid points in this thread. I will add though that we have been just a touch behind Michigan on average in team talent composite but Ohio State is on another level from the rest of the conference and on par with only Alabama and Georgia.
Talent is as talent does. How did that overwhelming OSU talent get SMOKED at home by a less "talented" UM team?
 
Seemed more like poor execution and poor coverage by OSU. They sold out to rush QB on first TD but JJ competed pass and OSU player whiffed on tackle. The long Cornelius Johnson TD was absolutely horrible coverage with kid getting turned and lost assignment. From there, it became clear that OSU was trying to cover too many bases - have to get to QB, watch the big pass play, watch for JJ run and watch for big RB run play. Really have to credit Jim. His offense can exploit multiple mismatches. Corum is the quick hit strong RB that makes them elite. They are very good even without him. Still, a better secondary would have not allowed those long TDs which opened up the game. At end of day, Jim used his NFL connections with his bro to right the ship. Most programs don't have that luxury, bringing in top-level DC from NFL to fix things up. The OL is dominant now and PSU / OSU left trying to win with pass happy fluffball. It does not work. We will trott out Allar, Kayron, Nick and "getting there" OL and they will push us around, stop run and beat us by 3 TDs. CJF fluffball is good for 3rd in BTE..woohoo.
its a mix. There is strategy and execution. The DC's strategy was exploited by UM to UM's credit. But having outstanding athletes to cover when they don't have secondary support is also helpful. For example, the guy that got exploited one-on-one could have been better. The DL could have provided pressure without having to blitz. The DL could have tackled the RB to stop the long runs.

UM had a better OL as well as strategy. The QB, OL, and RBs executed against tOSU's D regardless of their strategy. UM was simply the better team, on that day.

Ohio U, for example, is well coached. But no matter the coaching, they don't have the athletes. So, my point is, it is a mix.
 
  • Like
Reactions: PSU2UNC
PSU has had a lot of successful WRs during Franklin's tenure (not all were CJF recruits) many of whom are having good careers in NFL: Godwin, Hamler, Dotson, Hamilton. I think you can point to that NFL pedigree in recruiting (obviously OSU has put more WR in NFL during that same time period, but you can say that for most positions0.

But I agree having a 6'3 4.5 guy would be great.
Franklin's first class (which was mostly the work of his predecessor) was his best wideout class with Godwin and Blacknall. He followed that up with Juwan Johnson and Irvin Charles. That's 4 jumbo receivers and they could all play (though Johnson kind of lost his confidence one year and Charles washed out off the field).

Since then Franklin's tried to recruit size (6-2 or better) without success. Dae Lun Darien, Shorter, George, Dunmore didn't pan out. At some point you have to question the wideout coaching going on because the hit rate on big receivers was so low.

PSU has a bunch of tall receivers on the roster but very little contribution this year. It would be great if 1 or 2 would pick it up next year but I'm not optimistic. Just one of those things....
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: PSU2UNC
A couple random thoughts on this:
1) If Ryan Day loses to Michigan again next year he's gone and there will be transition at Ohio State. A lot of OSU fans are already calling for his head. So stability at Ohio State becomes a question.

2) Harbaugh had to overhaul his offense AND defense to be competitive, and he's done it. In the end, Josh Gattis wasn't the answer but the UM offense still has a lot of stuff Gattis brought (which Gattis learned from Moorhead). But look how long it took Harbaugh to do this. It takes a while to build and rebuild until you get a program back up to the top.

3) Michigan never stopped recruiting dominant OL but now they're developing them better. Both Ohio State and Michigan are clearly superior to PSU now at OL and that is going to make it hard for PSU until Franklin can close the gap.

4) The other area where PSU is really lagging talent wise is wideout. PSU desperately needs size. It really struck me Saturday when I realized I would love to see those big Michigan State wideouts playing for PSU. Again, the lack of success (except for Hamler and Dotson) and coaching instability has really hurt recruiting. No disrespect to Parker W., he is a terrific college player but doesn't have the size or speed of the Ohio State or Michigan wideouts.
1. Ryan Day has 2 more shots at Michigan.
2. The weak spot on OSU's whole team is the DB's. They need a new DB coach/approach.
 
316539049_470585541879672_5328507850648415861_n.jpg
 
1. Ryan Day has 2 more shots at Michigan.
2. The weak spot on OSU's whole team is the DB's. They need a new DB coach/approach.
Yeah, I read the OSU boards quite a bit and to say that they're not happy with Day - and mostly his staff - is a vast understatement.

As for your statement about the DBs being the weak spot..... hasn't this been an ongoing issue for the last 3 or 4 years now ? It seems like OSU is somewhat solid on defense until an opposing offensive player gets past the first 7 into the secondary and then anything can happen. It's like OSU has no clue about what's supposed to happen in pass coverage and it's not a new issue. Everybody kills them in the passing game

And didn't Day just bring in a whole new defensive staff at the beginning of this year - including a new DB coach?
 
Yeah, I read the OSU boards quite a bit and to say that they're not happy with Day - and mostly his staff - is a vast understatement.

As for your statement about the DBs being the weak spot..... hasn't this been an ongoing issue for the last 3 or 4 years now ? It seems like OSU is somewhat solid on defense until an opposing offensive player gets past the first 7 into the secondary and then anything can happen. It's like OSU has no clue about what's supposed to happen in pass coverage and it's not a new issue. Everybody kills them in the passing game

And didn't Day just bring in a whole new defensive staff at the beginning of this year - including a new DB coach?
They are unhappy, but fans don't hire/fire.
OSU's defensive secondary is an ongoing mystery. They bring in loads of 4* DB's. The result is an ineffective unit. It has been going on for a while. Not sure of the answer.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Online Persona
We're still in a "playoff or bust" era. It's better than the BCS era...but it's still super exclusive.

Michigan is going to make the playoff two straight years. That automatically puts them in a different echelon than us. Even if they get skunked 59-0 against TCU...they've been to 2. We've been to zero.

The reality is...we're right there with Michigan. But they got over the OSU hump last year and this year...and we tripped up on the one-yard line twice--2017 and 2018. So close to "elite" but here we are , five years later...still trying to get there.
 
  • Like
Reactions: bourbon n blues
So I spoke to a person inside the tOSU program yesterday who told me this. tOSU couldn't handle UM's long passing game when they bunched up 3 or 4 receivers on one side of the field. To counter that, they had to take their entire defensive backfield over to cover them because the DC wanted to blitz the QB to keep him from being comfortable. UM countered with running plays to the weak side (plays on the side away from the bunched-up WRs) using a RB with world-class speed (for a RB). That kid kept breaking the runs for long gainers. tOSU simply could not stop both the WRs and the RB in that formation and that was the key to several long gainers for TDs that UM had. They didn't see this in film and feel UM put it in for the tOSU game.

Interestingly, UM also broke long runs for TDs to break the game open against us.


Regardless, my contact told me that had they prepared for that O, they would have won the game but that UM scored 5 TDs off that formation either running or passing.
then that's obviously coaching and though I hate to admit it..Harbaugh is a very very good coach...
 
  • Like
Reactions: Obliviax
It's only fair that all 3 play in the same division.
It is also fair the 2 anointed ones always get to face each other at the end of their seasons when they are seasoned and experienced, never early with 1 faced with a Big Ten road opener. Gotta keep them lilywhite and protect The Game.
 
  • Like
Reactions: bdgan
Michigan has certainly looked very impressive this year and a lot is being made of their two straight wins over OSU.

There are articles about how PSU is now "chasing" Michigan rather than chasing OSU.

PSU is 2-2 vs Michigan over the last four years, including a very close loss (that probably should have been a win) in 2021. PSU has also played very close games against OSU over the past 6 years. My assessment is that PSU is not very far behind either program.

However, I would make three points about Michigan's recent success as they relate to PSU.

1) In the four years prior to Michigan's first playoff appearance, their records were: 8-5, 10-3, 9-4, 2-4 (all under Harbaugh). That's mediocre (ish) and not dissimilar from where PSU is.

2) While Michigan was (mostly) impressive this year, their 2021 results included a loss to MSU and squeaking by (1 score games) against Rutgers, Nebraska and PSU.

There is zero reason PSU can't also break through. Recruiting is similar, coaching is similar, facilities are similar, NIL is similar. Just a matter of time.
Your overall assessment is logical however I am not sure we are real close to either one because of our line play. Michigan transformed themselves and now they are the best in the B10. I am not convinced Franklin can develop a mean and nasty offensive and defensive line. Did O$U have any sacks? How many sacks or pressures did Mich get?

McCarthy is a 5 star recruit and you see the difference he makes. Allar hopefully elevates us like that.
 
My take on all of the PSU-UM-OSU stuff. Actually, from an outsider's view, all 3 were pretty much equal. There is NO WAY Michigan was that much better than both PSU and OSU this year. Things just got away from both schools in the 2nd half and in OSU's case, it was strictly coaching and you could read into it from Urban after the game. Both Alabama and OSU wasted mega talented rosters this year. Plus, OSU has a QB that is too chicken-$hit to run when he has a wide open field in front of him and that's on their HC for putting up with that crap.

Keep in mind. PSU had OSU on the ropes until everything just blew up in the 4th quarter. PSU actually outplayed OSU and the final score doesn't indicate how close it was

And I'll also say this, if PSU and Michigan played again - right now - there is no way Michigan runs for that many yards again. It would be a heck of a game. Just seems like everything fell into place for Harbaugh and Michigan this year - it happens. He is a very good coach though.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Sullivan
Michigan has certainly looked very impressive this year and a lot is being made of their two straight wins over OSU.

There are articles about how PSU is now "chasing" Michigan rather than chasing OSU.

PSU is 2-2 vs Michigan over the last four years, including a very close loss (that probably should have been a win) in 2021. PSU has also played very close games against OSU over the past 6 years. My assessment is that PSU is not very far behind either program.

However, I would make three points about Michigan's recent success as they relate to PSU.

1) In the four years prior to Michigan's first playoff appearance, their records were: 8-5, 10-3, 9-4, 2-4 (all under Harbaugh). That's mediocre (ish) and not dissimilar from where PSU is.

2) While Michigan was (mostly) impressive this year, their 2021 results included a loss to MSU and squeaking by (1 score games) against Rutgers, Nebraska and PSU.

There is zero reason PSU can't also break through. Recruiting is similar, coaching is similar, facilities are similar, NIL is similar. Just a matter of time.
The biggest difference between PSU and Michigan and OSU is that PSU hasn’t had a difference maker at QB.
 
Your overall assessment is logical however I am not sure we are real close to either one because of our line play. Michigan transformed themselves and now they are the best in the B10. I am not convinced Franklin can develop a mean and nasty offensive and defensive line. Did O$U have any sacks? How many sacks or pressures did Mich get?

McCarthy is a 5 star recruit and you see the difference he makes. Allar hopefully elevates us like that.
PSU had more rushing and passing yards than OSU. I think PSU is building a good OL especially with Olu returning. They also seem to have good DEs but DT has been more of a problem. It also probably is the hardest position to recruit.
 
ADVERTISEMENT