So don't let the opponent push you out.
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- Thread starter jmadden1998
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I don't think I've EVER seen a guy straight up push someone out of bounds in Freestyle.
The only time I've seen something like that is when someone shoots, has a leg in the air, tries to finish, fails and walks the other guy out of bounds for a point. But, they've literally taken a shot and attempted a TD to get to that point.
I've seen plenty of guys get an underhook and run their opponent off the mat for a point without taking a shot.
Example.
The top man is required, by rule, to "improve his position" and "work toward scoring" - if he is clearly only riding to accumulate "riding time" and doing nothing to "improve and work toward scoring", he is stalling.
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yea, but you could also say don't let him ride you
Except that riding to just accumulate riding time and never attempting to improve your position toward scoring (i.e., breaking your opponent down and/or attempting to turn) is a rules violation called "stalling".
I'm sure these people hate the "correct throw" rule as well, but they are absolutely the better rules favoring the better "technical" wrestler. How often do we see in Folk where a wrestler backs up directly toward OB - and attempts to use OB as his friend - when an opponent has shot and has superior position on him (either in on a leg and he is attempting to back OB while continuing to scramble OR attempts to go backwards when opponent has superior throw position such that if a throw occurs, they will be OB). This is why Free has these rules - if you're trying to wrestle the edge, and use OB as your ally, your opponent deserves to be rewarded if you're using OB as a defensive weapon.... and the pushout rule and correct throw rules do just this - they benefit the wrestler who is wrestling correctly and not trying to use OB as a defensive crutch, which is stalling but rarely called in Folk (i.e., Folk often AWARDS the staller's bullshit tactics and effectively penalizes the guy wrestling correctly by giving them no reward despite out-wrestling their stalling opponent).
Backing Out-of-Bounds and constantly wrestling the edge with your back to the edge IS NOT WRESTLING!
Versus Nico scoring 3 actual takedowns, moves rewarded with points for gaining control of your opponent.
So you did see the pushouts from underhooks? I thought I might have been hallucinating since it has been claimed it doesn't happen and some have never seen it
I would be against having top stalling be a point of emphasis, for the refs. Way too many unintended consequences. It is very difficult to turn wrestlers in Division 1. Look at Zain, there were matches where he’d get a TD in the first, attempt a few turns - not happening, play catch and release, attempt a few more turns in the 2nd - not happening. As good as Zain was, there were matches that it took until the 3rd, after wearing down the opposing wrestler, before he finally was successful in getting his first turn. I certainly don’t trust a ref to not call stalling on Zain, during the first two periods, because it’s been made a point of emphasis and I certainly do not want to miss out on the quality action of Zain eventually securing the pin in the 3rd.
You keep saying this but I don't remember a single match where Zain didn't break his opponent down and belly them out (and attempt turns via turking a leg or arm bar, etc....). Zain did "improve his position" and worked toward attempting to turn his opponent. There is a huge difference between what Zain did and "top stallers" do - I've seen tons of matches where a wrestler will accumulate over 2 minutes of riding time and never have even broken their opponent down - just cling to them via spiral ride..... will have allowed their opponent to stand repeatedly and push or pull them off the mat... etc....
There is no comparison between what Zain did and what a "top staller" like Cassioppi does (which is what originally brought this topic up).
Yazdani tried a go behind right before the end of the first minute.
Also, Taylor got cautioned. The referee interpreted his actions as fleeing the hold, by backing out of bounds.
Not quite the same thing as what I envisioned when I made my statement, which is basically sumo-style pushing. Yazdani’s forward pressure and underhook generate offense against nearly everyone; most people (other than DT) aren’t willing to come within a caution of being DQd like that.
It can be a point of emphasis without punishing wrestlers like Zain or Dean. A turn isn't necessary, an attempt should be. Working the head, or bars even if initially ineffective is at least making an attempt.
Double thigh prys is not an attempt.
Claw ride is not an attempt.
Ankle hook is not an attempt.
Reading these threads proves this:
2 weeks between events is entirely too long. Lol.
2 weeks between events is entirely too long. Lol.
I really don't like the TD to a lace to 4 turns. If I want to see that I will watch gators spinning their prey on the discovery channel. My vote is limit a freestyle exposure sequence to 6 points.
I like the push out...a little.
Free is growing on me slowly as all of our goats move on I need to be flexible.
Folk is a superior test of a mastery in all three positions. Both wrestlers can score from all three as well.
For all the talk of stalling on top or on bottom, seeing the bottom guy in Free, spread eagle, is just plain boring. I know why they do it but it is not very entertaining. Too few guys can work in a gut once that position is established.
I like the push out...a little.
Free is growing on me slowly as all of our goats move on I need to be flexible.
Folk is a superior test of a mastery in all three positions. Both wrestlers can score from all three as well.
For all the talk of stalling on top or on bottom, seeing the bottom guy in Free, spread eagle, is just plain boring. I know why they do it but it is not very entertaining. Too few guys can work in a gut once that position is established.
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