Football Penn State lands pair of PWO commitments

[Dylan Callaghan-Croley]

The Beckham Dee PWO commitment is especially a big one.

Happy Valley Insider - Penn State lands pair of PWO commitments

Over the last two days, Penn State has received a pair of preferred walk-on commitments.

pennstate.rivals.com

 

[Psubiomed]

2 EXCELLENT gets. Both players are better than the typical walk on quality.

 

[RickinDayton]

2 EXCELLENT gets. Both players are better than the typical walk on quality.

Cool.

 

[The Spin Meister]

This leads to a question I have often wondered. Suppose a top kid is from a wealthy family and paying tuition is drop in the bucket. He could volunteer to be a PWO so the team can use a scholly for another player.

Now with NIL, lots of kids could pass on getting a scholly to help the team. And if the team is much better the stars look better. Which would help them in the long run.

Think Manning. He certainly doesn’t need scholly money. And he will make millions in NIL even as a walkon. Imagine five or ten kids doing this on some team that then loads up on linemen or defensemen.

Is that a legal loop hole or is it prohibited?

 

[voltz99]

This leads to a question I have often wondered. Suppose a top kid is from a wealthy family and paying tuition is drop in the bucket. He could volunteer to be a PWO so the team can use a scholly for another player.

Now with NIL, lots of kids could pass on getting a scholly to help the team. And if the team is much better the stars look better. Which would help them in the long run.

Think Manning. He certainly doesn’t need scholly money. And he will make millions in NIL even as a walkon. Imagine five or ten kids doing this on some team that then loads up on linemen or defensemen.

Is that a legal loop hole or is it prohibited?

I have wondered that too. A kid could give up a scholy and then get more in nil. Probably prohibited since we don't see it already happening.

 

[87 Penn St8]

This leads to a question I have often wondered. Suppose a top kid is from a wealthy family and paying tuition is drop in the bucket. He could volunteer to be a PWO so the team can use a scholly for another player.

Now with NIL, lots of kids could pass on getting a scholly to help the team. And if the team is much better the stars look better. Which would help them in the long run.

Think Manning. He certainly doesn’t need scholly money. And he will make millions in NIL even as a walkon. Imagine five or ten kids doing this on some team that then loads up on linemen or defensemen.

Is that a legal loop hole or is it prohibited?

Good thoughts...anymore IDK. I remember way back when- maybe Titcus Pettigrew, the idea of giving him a basketball scholarship and then having him play football too was floated out there but didn't calculate. Maybe same with Jordan Norwood?

If I recall then they wouldn't get tobeat meals w the team. Anymore who knows?

 

[voltz99]

Good thoughts...anymore IDK. I remember way back when- maybe Titcus Pettigrew, the idea of giving him a basketball scholarship and then having him play football too was floated out there but didn't calculate. Maybe same with Jordan Norwood?

If I recall then they wouldn't get tobeat meals w the team. Anymore who knows?

If a scholly player plays two sports he counts against both teams scholarship limits.

 

[Erial_Lion]

If a scholly player plays two sports he counts against both teams scholarship limits.

That's not correct...there is a hierarchy as to how they are counted. Football comes first, then basketball, then hockey, then it gets messy. Football guys that also played basketball after the season were counted for football.

 

[Erial_Lion]

This leads to a question I have often wondered. Suppose a top kid is from a wealthy family and paying tuition is drop in the bucket. He could volunteer to be a PWO so the team can use a scholly for another player.

Now with NIL, lots of kids could pass on getting a scholly to help the team. And if the team is much better the stars look better. Which would help them in the long run.

Think Manning. He certainly doesn’t need scholly money. And he will make millions in NIL even as a walkon. Imagine five or ten kids doing this on some team that then loads up on linemen or defensemen.

Is that a legal loop hole or is it prohibited?

It would be allowed, but even those that are rich will rarely look to leave $ on the table (as we see every day in pro sports where taking less $ on a salary capped sport would help out the rest of the team, yet you rarely see it).

 

[lazydave841]

It would be allowed, but even those that are rich will rarely look to leave $ on the table (as we see every day in pro sports where taking less $ on a salary capped sport would help out the rest of the team, yet you rarely see it).

Isn't there a roster limitation of 105 (110 with a waiver)? Seems like I remember reading that somewhere this year.

If there was a way to legally obtain these kids (and convince them to do so), Saban/Smart/Day would have another 15-4* kids walking on to compete with the 25-28 kids he gave scholarships to and let attrition work itself out.

 

[IANit]

This leads to a question I have often wondered. Suppose a top kid is from a wealthy family and paying tuition is drop in the bucket. He could volunteer to be a PWO so the team can use a scholly for another player.

Now with NIL, lots of kids could pass on getting a scholly to help the team. And if the team is much better the stars look better. Which would help them in the long run.

Think Manning. He certainly doesn’t need scholly money. And he will make millions in NIL even as a walkon. Imagine five or ten kids doing this on some team that then loads up on linemen or defensemen.

Is that a legal loop hole or is it prohibited?

At what point is PSU tuition a drop in the bucket? I am curious what the Venn Diagram would look like for families with that kind of wealth and those who allow their kids to play Big Time college football and those of the first group who would leave money on the table to help the team. Guessing it would be a very small shaded area.

 

[PSUcup1]

This leads to a question I have often wondered. Suppose a top kid is from a wealthy family and paying tuition is drop in the bucket. He could volunteer to be a PWO so the team can use a scholly for another player.

Now with NIL, lots of kids could pass on getting a scholly to help the team. And if the team is much better the stars look better. Which would help them in the long run.

Think Manning. He certainly doesn’t need scholly money. And he will make millions in NIL even as a walkon. Imagine five or ten kids doing this on some team that then loads up on linemen or defensemen.

Is that a legal loop hole or is it prohibited?

If memory serves me. If you are recruited as a scholarship athlete you will count against the scholly limit. However I am Not sure what the criteria is …

 

[The Spin Meister]

If memory serves me. If you are recruited as a scholarship athlete you will count against the scholly limit. However I am Not sure what the criteria is …

Are you saying that if a kid is offered multiple schools by other schools then he will be counted even if he enrolls as a PWO? Or if PSU offers him a scholly that he turns down he will still be counted?

 

[Erial_Lion]

There isn't anything that would make a kid count against the scholarship limits unless he ends up getting aid from the school. You could be recruited as a scholarship player, and end up walking on.

 

[Erial_Lion]

Isn't there a roster limitation of 105 (110 with a waiver)? Seems like I remember reading that somewhere this year.

If there was a way to legally obtain these kids (and convince them to do so), Saban/Smart/Day would have another 15-4* kids walking on to compete with the 25-28 kids he gave scholarships to and let attrition work itself out.

Teams can only have 110 players on the roster when classes start (or a week before the first game, but the classes starting is the one that usually applies).

There is nothing stopping them from trying to get additional kids to walk on that could have gone elsewhere on scholarship.

 

[The Spin Meister]

Teams can only have 110 players on the roster when classes start (or a week before the first game, but the classes starting is the one that usually applies).

There is nothing stopping them from trying to get additional kids to walk on that could have gone elsewhere on scholarship.

Do you mean 110 scholarship players? It’s up to 25/yr with a max of 110? (Really screwed up with the Wuhan sixth yr guys) They can have as many walk ons as they want?

 

[Erial_Lion]

Do you mean 110 scholarship players? It’s up to 25/yr with a max of 110? (Really screwed up with the Wuhan sixth yr guys) They can have as many walk ons as they want?

85 scholarship players (which is always the max at any moment, outside of the short-term covid changes in 2020-2021)...110 total players on the first day of classes.

 

[LMTLION]

With NIL, why do scholarships even matter anymore? Can the system be gamed by the collective paying tuition / room and board?

 

[Erial_Lion]

With NIL, why do scholarships even matter anymore? Can the system be gamed by the collective paying tuition / room and board?

Sure, if the collective has unlimited resources. But for every walk on you're trying to get on board, that's that much money being diverted away from $ to give a star player.

 

[lazydave841]

With NIL, why do scholarships even matter anymore? Can the system be gamed by the collective paying tuition / room and board?

Kids on scholarship don't want to stay at schools and be 5th string. Good luck finding starter quality players who want to be 6th, maybe 7th string without a 'ship hopeful that some collective is going to foot the bill without concern.

 

[87 Penn St8]

At what point is PSU tuition a drop in the bucket? I am curious what the Venn Diagram would look like for families with that kind of wealth and those who allow their kids to play Big Time college football and those of the first group who would leave money on the table to help the team. Guessing it would be a very small shaded area.

Maybe- but with the whole Youth Sports boom- Travel this/ Select that/ "Showcases" around the country- there could well be people who would pay for their kid to get their shot at DI.

Our high school has a football player who is a current DI Preferred walk on paying full tuition at a large conference school. He chose that over some smaller places that offered him money (waiving out of state tuition fee) but for FCS teams.

Those roadside Hampton Inns (and every other brand) have made a mint off of Travel sports. At what point do parents realize that their kid ISN'T D I Scholly material and just save the $ and pay for college themselves??????

Typical delusional folks don't see what those of us like Bison who are around these little vignettes year after year do. Division I athletes are SPECIAL. You see it early- at the latest 10th grade. They are head and shoulders above their competition but it is even more than that. They have a PRESENCE- along with the Size/Skills etc. Usually their heads are screwed on pretty well, and they have a family/mentor who is guiding them away from the pratfalls.

Some kids grow into the role- like a Shane Conlan from back in my day. Each year at the Super Bowl they always show where players went to college. Many are NOT premier programs. So they were late bloomers or those who slipped through cracks.

But you are probably right- money talks- and those who have spent it to get to the point of possibly achieving whatever professional goal they are shooting for- see $ as their "right."

 

[IANit]

Maybe- but with the whole Youth Sports boom- Travel this/ Select that/ "Showcases" around the country- there could well be people who would pay for their kid to get their shot at DI.

Our high school has a football player who is a current DI Preferred walk on paying full tuition at a large conference school. He chose that over some smaller places that offered him money (waiving out of state tuition fee) but for FCS teams.

Those roadside Hampton Inns (and every other brand) have made a mint off of Travel sports. At what point do parents realize that their kid ISN'T D I Scholly material and just save the $ and pay for college themselves??????

Typical delusional folks don't see what those of us like Bison who are around these little vignettes year after year do. Division I athletes are SPECIAL. You see it early- at the latest 10th grade. They are head and shoulders above their competition but it is even more than that. They have a PRESENCE- along with the Size/Skills etc. Usually their heads are screwed on pretty well, and they have a family/mentor who is guiding them away from the pratfalls.

Some kids grow into the role- like a Shane Conlan from back in my day. Each year at the Super Bowl they always show where players went to college. Many are NOT premier programs. So they were late bloomers or those who slipped through cracks.

But you are probably right- money talks- and those who have spent it to get to the point of possibly achieving whatever professional goal they are shooting for- see $ as their "right."

I think that example's a little different. The typical PWO is someone who may be a tweener - they are maybe at least FCS scholarship good but not for sure P5 good. I don't know how that determination gets made - whether it's measurables from camps, the level of media coverage a prospect receives or the level of competition faced. In that case the parent is taking a risk that their son will prove himself worthy of a scholarship. Penn State may also be a better school than their options that would give them money. We've had a few players like that through the yeas that have turned out to be at least good enough to get a scholarship for their later years and maybe some have been NFL good, but that's the exception.

For someone who is for sure good enough for a P5 scholarship out of high school to not take it when available because they don't need the money and want to free up the money for someone else seems unlikely to me, but then I don't know a lot of D1 prospects or extremely wealthy people. I guess I'm thinking of my daughter's roommate at Syracuse whose father has millions and balks about writing an $80k/year check.

I don't know if it's even allowed as it would be a way around the 85-scholarship limit. Though I wonder how much longer that will even be a thing.

I'm not sure I'd even recommend it for someone who could. A little different example, but Tom Brady frequently left money on the table to help his team be able to get better players. His thanks was basically being told not to let the door hit him on the way out. Are some college coaches a little more appreciative? Maybe. But loyalty isn't as big as it once was in this sport, unfortunately.

 

[87 Penn St8]

I have a current student who has tied his whole life into being a scholarship qb. He has camped everywhere since an early age, clinics, 7 vs 7 etc etc etc.

He has paid for private coaches, and private school for part of high school all to be a qb. Now he is getting recruited, but at the NEC level (St. Francis league) but primarily as a WR or Athlete.

Money is not really an issue for the family- but the kid is sure conscious of it. Mpre important for him is the CHANCE to compete at qb. If he doesn't succeed he will try another position, which other than some DB this year he has NEVER played.

Once actual offers are on the table in early January we'll see which way he goes. My strong gut is the family will take qb shot for less scholly $. Does he actually stay if it doesn't work out? THAT is the question..

Great young man- we'll see.