OT/FC: New JZ Audio
- Thread starter MtNittany
- Start date
Not bad, but I would like to see JZ debate someone with more knowledge of the case, such as Scott Paterno, Jim Clemente, Sara Ganim, or someone from the “Blame the 2nd mile” cadre.
You really think any of those you listed would debate JZ? Maybe at gunpoint.
Ganim? I don't think she has much knowledge of the case other than what her Harrisburg friends fed her.
It's nice to see the Ziegler cult singing the praises of a certified nutjob.
I’d ignore that ass clown. He still thinks Joe Paterno was part of a cover up. That’s the level of ignorance we have here.
Well, someone who thinks a crime occurred in the Lasch showers would also think that the earth is flat. So your crazy is consistent.
Are you still waiting for that article by Ziegler to be published in Time magazine? You know the one that will expose the "truth" to the world and change everything. Gullible cult members believe everything
their dear leader tells them even after being lied to so m any times. Get a clue.
If the AG really thought something happened, there would have been a murder investigation. No statute of limitations on that. Yet that has never even been discussed. Not even by idiots like you.
If the "REAL" Victim 2 is "known only to God" as the AG claims, how is it that Allan Myers is claiming the "REAL" Victim Two's $ 7 million dollars without any fear of the "REAL" Victim Two showing up? What's he know that all the resources of Corbett's henchmen didn't? And if Myers ISN'T the "REAL" Victim Two, why is the AG's Office allowing him to extort $ 7 million dollars from one of the State's Public Universities?
One problem with Myers. He said nothing happened till he was paid off. Even wrote a letter to the acting State Attorney General to defend and support Sandusky. That in itself tells me this case is nothing more than a political hit job.
When the AG opens up a murder investigation to see what happened to the "REAL" Victim Two, you'll get my attention. Until then, you have nothing, so just shut the f-(k up.
I’ve actually heard that argument several times. “Maybe the real victim 2 has died, since CSA victims are prone to suicide and drug overdose”. What’s absurd about that is if a boy who did spend much time with Sandusky did OD or kill himself, the media would have been all over it, and would have tried to blame Joe as causing the boy’s death.
There was a second mile kid close to Sandusky, named Ryan Dixon, who did die young, but it was via a motorcycle crash. Interestingly, the sister of Mr. Dixon actually testified for the defense at Sandusky’s trial, saying the star accuser (Brett Swisher Houtz, aka Victim 4) was a notorious liar.
great information, I don't remember that or maybe forgot with all of the cross referencing and timelines of compiled information from our group of....... Paterno Patriots.
great information, I don't remember that or maybe forgot with all of the cross referencing and timelines of compiled information from our group of....... Paterno Patriots.
Yes, I wish someone could compile all the information discovered by Ziegler, Cipriano, Pendergrast, and Blehar (who I admit has discovered good information, I just disagree with many of his conclusions from said information) on an easy to navigate, Wikipedia-style website. JZs information is especially disorganized.
Much more credible answer to "...the real victim #2.." still being missing ---- ALIEN ABDUCTION.
This is a reason much closer to the truth than saying victim #2 is "still unknown".
There is a wealth of information on framingpaterno.com. You are absolutely correct that it is extremely disorganized.
While critics are loathe to debate Ziegler face to face, they are also loathe to debate the content of the material on his web site. I have yet to see anybody either in person or via words/video remotely counter Ziegler on the facts of the case including the Newsweek article, the evidence that AM is v2, and/or come up with a rationale explanation why 12 people who know AF the best are willing to go on the record in their own name to state that they believe AF is not telling the truth with what happened with his interactions with JS.
Not in the Jerry is definitely innocent camp, but you are correct. This guy is the worst poster on the board. Why anyone on this board, regardless of which stance one takes on this, would choose to align themselves with him is beyond me.
@Pinkhippo PeanutButter - Are you willing to debate Ziegler?
Can you refute any of the Newsweek article, provide a convincing argument that AM is not v2, or come up with a rationale reason why 12 people who know AF the best think he is lying?
He's definitely up there, it's hard to say he is the worst when there is so much competition.
What are the rules? Is there to be an independent judge?
I wouldn't even consider debating v2s identity.
On the other hand all of those "12" people have reasons outside this case to bash AF.
JZ is incapable of having a discussion. He immediately screams at people, calling them morons or other names. At that point, he is immediately tuned out regardless of whether he is valid points or not.
The problem with Dixon is that Myers admits to having known about the shower incident at the time it happened and was the one that Sandusky warned about possibly being questioned about the incident way back in 2001. How did Sandusky and Myers know way back in 2001 that the REAL Victim Two, or his parents, wouldn't show up in Spanier's or Raykovitz's office screaming "RAPE"!!!!?? If Myers isn't the "REAL" Victim Two, as the AG implies, why the crap isn't he being called in for questioning????
None of Myers's police interviews ever even hints at any questioning about foul play wrt someone else in the shower. In other words, if the AG REALLY believes Myers ISN'T the real Victim Two, they are not only possibly allowing an accomplice to murder go free, they are allowing him to extort millions of dollars from a partially taxpayer funded entity to do it.
The fact that the AG didn't even spend one microsecond into whatever happened to the REAL Victim Two is all you need to know about whether this case was nothing more than a Corbett induced political hit job.
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Well all he really has is victim shaming and if you've ever seen some of his other theories you kind of realize what he is and what he does. He needs hot button talking points and he doesn't care if he misleads people along the way. There is nothing to debate him about, the courtroom is where the debate occurred already.
Zig has this to say: http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...of-a-legend-and-fearing-a-dangerous-precedent
"Sandusky himself was seemingly disciplined only by being barred from bringing kids on campus. This fact may be the single most damning detail in this entire pathetic saga."
In 2012: JZ said: "I want to make it clear that it is quite possible that Joe Paterno did indeed know more than he let on and enough to justify him doing more than he did to stop the monster that was Jerry Sandusky. It is even possible that he actively helped cover it up."
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Didn't he also ask the Paterno's for $1 million to make a documentary exonerating Paterno? And only after being rebuffed, he went all-in on the Sandusky is innocent storyline?
Did he not buy in 100% to the Clemente report until Clemente (and Scott) said he should not out AM on national TV? Did he in fact out AM anyway on his website the next day? (Yes, he did). At that point he had painted himself into a corner and had to go whole-hog on Sandusky is innocent storyline.
The two above things happened almost simultaneously.
If there was ever a real debate to happen against Zig, it would focus on HIS motivations & why he feels the need to settle certain scores.
Did he not buy in 100% to the Clemente report until Clemente (and Scott) said he should not out AM on national TV? Did he in fact out AM anyway on his website the next day? (Yes, he did). At that point he had painted himself into a corner and had to go whole-hog on Sandusky is innocent storyline.
The two above things happened almost simultaneously.
If there was ever a real debate to happen against Zig, it would focus on HIS motivations & why he feels the need to settle certain scores.
I believe this is before his research began in earnest. He has admitted that before he started looking into Paterno's downfall (his original direction) he assumed JS was guilty. Then as he learned more, he changed his mind.
Then by all means, debate him. I'm sure he'd be elated to have you on and set him straight. Give me a heads up so I can listen. Thanks!
Cool explanation. Then why is he so hard on other people who had the same conclusion at the time? Or people who have changed their opinion over time?
At best his argument seems to be "I'm rubber you're glue, bounces off me & sticks to you"
Um, that was 6 years ago. A good and honest investigator goes where the evidence leads them.
He's actually pretty gracious to people who are willing to say "I didn't know that; that definitely makes me reconsider my opinions on this" which is exactly what happened during this latest debate.
There are many other reasons Dixon couldn’t be Victim 2. He was 16 or 17 at the time of the incident, and Sandusky would have certainly named him since he wasn’t alive therefore couldn’t refute Jerry’s story.
At this point, I must say people who think V2 is someone other than Myers are up there with flat earthers.
