OT: 2 Hours of JZ (audio link)

[LaJolla Lion]

You have it all wrong. Nothing at all wrong w/ throwing an old man in jail based on memory repression therapy. It's settled science. I guess. Or not.

Saying it a lot doesn't make it true...hard concept for you to follow. Therapists at the trial stated this wasn't he case, but your boy did...so of course you believe him.

 

[marshall23]

You have it all wrong. Nothing at all wrong w/ throwing an old man in jail based on memory repression therapy. It's settled science. I guess. Or not.

Hey, it sounds perfectly plausible that a 16-17 year old was hitch hiking in the 70s....got picked up by JS , smoked dope, chugged some beers and was forcibly raped by Sandusky. My favorite is the individual that shared those "special" lunches that the two "best" friends were famous for. LOL

 

[Pinkhippo PeanutButter]

Jerry Sandusky was the face of TSM for 30 years. Are you saying that the only children who were impacted by his charity were those who claim to have been abused? Despite "easy money" and "don't ask, don't tell" I believe there were 36 "claimants."

It seems like that's what they are saying. There is no evidence anywhere of a TSM kid who Jerry took special interest in who spoken up on Jerry's behalf and denied grooming or molestation took place. Amazing. Every single young man Jerry worked closely with, EVERY SINGLE ONE, went for the money.

If he's innocent he must be the worst role model/father figure/charity leader of all time.

 

[LaJolla Lion]

It seems like that's what they are saying. There is no evidence anywhere of a TSM kid who Jerry took special interest in who spoken up on Jerry's behalf and denied grooming or molestation took place. Amazing. Every single young man Jerry worked closely with, EVERY SINGLE ONE, went for the money.

If he's innocent he must be the worst role model/father figure/charity leader of all time.

They must have really hated him a lot to do this to him. Yet he was a hero to them all...but the money got in the way. It's a great defense line, but it failed.

 

[marshall23]

It seems like that's what they are saying. There is no evidence anywhere of a TSM kid who Jerry took special interest in who spoken up on Jerry's behalf and denied grooming or molestation took place. Amazing. Every single young man Jerry worked closely with, EVERY SINGLE ONE, went for the money.

If he's innocent he must be the worst role model/father figure/charity leader of all time.

Of course they went for the money.After they changed their initial statements praising JS. Look at what alternatives their lives offered them? They were told Sandusky is going to prison anyway. Have you ever worked in a prison? Do you understand what the value system is like for people who come from disadvantaged back rounds?

 

[Pinkhippo PeanutButter]

Of course they went for the money.After they changed their initial statements praising JS. Look at what alternatives their

I get what you are saying. You are saying that all disadvantaged kids have no morals or honor.

 

[jerot]

But you do acknowledge that victims 2 and 8 were the only instances that had an independent witness, right? I find it odd that those two instances happen to be the ones for which there is no victim. And to complicate it even more, one of those witnesses couldn't even testify, because when he was interviewed by police he stated that it wasn't Sandusky, so he must have had dementia (but I'm sure if he said it was Sandusky, they would have put him on the stand).

Nope, nothing odd there at all.

The janitor was the best witness of all.

Petrosky said he was working in the Lasch Football Building in 2000 when he saw Sandusky leaving the locker room area, holding the hand of a boy while walking down a hallway.

Later, Petrosky testified, another member of the cleaning crew, Jim Calhoun, appeared noticeably shaken and said he had seen something he would never forget.

“He said that Sandusky was holding that boy up, licking on his privates,” Petrosky testified.

Earlier, John McQueary testified that his son was “distraught” when he told him he had witnessed Sandusky molesting a boy in the same locker room in January 2001.

The elder McQueary said his son called him directly after seeing the incident. “His description to me was a slapping, rhythmic kind of thrusting, slapping sound,” John McQueary said. That is similar to the description of the incident Mike McQueary provided to the court on Tuesday.


John McQueary said he and his son agreed the incident should be reported.

“We determined that it was imperative to report this to the authorities at Penn State,” John McQueary said. They agreed to report it to head football coach Joe Paterno.

 

[Connorpozlee]

Of course they went for the money.After they changed their initial statements praising JS. Look at what alternatives their lives offered them? They were told Sandusky is going to prison anyway. Have you ever worked in a prison? Do you understand what the value system is like for people who come from disadvantaged back rounds?

Of course they went for the money? How do you know that?
Those last two questions you asked are kind of astounding.

 

[MtNittany]

Of course they went for the money? How do you know that?
Those last two questions you asked are kind of astounding.

Serious questions Connorpozlee - have you been to Clinton County in the last 20 years? Have you ever been there? Do you even know where it's at? Do you know the story of the Piper plant moving to Vero Beach?

 

[Chris92]

The janitor was the best witness of all.

Then you must not have followed the case at all. His trial testimony is completely different than his GJ testimony. But, at least both of his versions were in the same building.

 

[marshall23]

I get what you are saying. You are saying that all disadvantaged kids have no morals or honor.

Not all, but the percentage is pretty high for convicts.

 

[lionville]

How many TSM kids that verifiably spent as much time with Jerry as did say V1 or V2 have spoken up to defend him?

Zero.

If he was really innocent, and really working to help young troubled boys, surely loads of them would have come forward to say that he changed their lives, that they weren't molested or even groomed, and that none of their friends were either.

How come these guys (there must be a ton, if Jerry is innocent) haven't come forward and made pleas on his behalf?

One could infer the 600 that were interviewed by the state police.

 

[Connorpozlee]

Serious questions Connorpozlee - have you been to Clinton County in the last 20 years? Have you ever been there? Do you even know where it's at? Do you know the story of the Piper plant moving to Vero Beach?

Nope

 

[MtNittany]

Nope

...then you're "readin' w/out your spectacles on."

 

[marshall23]

Of course they went for the money? How do you know that?
Those last two questions you asked are kind of astounding.

How do I know they went for the money? I think we all know the answer to that. I'm not aware on any accusers who refused the money, but if you know some, I will gladly admit I am wrong.

 

[lionville]

The janitor was the best witness of all.

Petrosky said he was working in the Lasch Football Building in 2000 when he saw Sandusky leaving the locker room area, holding the hand of a boy while walking down a hallway.

Later, Petrosky testified, another member of the cleaning crew, Jim Calhoun, appeared noticeably shaken and said he had seen something he would never forget.

“He said that Sandusky was holding that boy up, licking on his privates,” Petrosky testified.

Earlier, John McQueary testified that his son was “distraught” when he told him he had witnessed Sandusky molesting a boy in the same locker room in January 2001.

The elder McQueary said his son called him directly after seeing the incident. “His description to me was a slapping, rhythmic kind of thrusting, slapping sound,” John McQueary said. That is similar to the description of the incident Mike McQueary provided to the court on Tuesday.


John McQueary said he and his son agreed the incident should be reported.

“We determined that it was imperative to report this to the authorities at Penn State,” John McQueary said. They agreed to report it to head football coach Joe Paterno.

Jesus Christmas. Report it to the authorities..... of all the peopl, they pick the football coach. SMH.

 

[indynittany]

"Independently?????" Sure.

You're naive to think Ziegler hasn't tried to vett both of them on numerous occasions and continues to do so. He didn't start out thinking Sandusky was innocent. The opposite.

Maybe Jerry and Dottie have him fooled, but that seems less likely than the OAG convincing MM that a bunch of children were abused because he didn't do enough in '01 and he can make up for that by putting Sandusky away. Oh, and there's a whistle blower suit in it for you if you play your cards right.

 

[MtNittany]

You're naive to think Ziegler hasn't tried to vett both of them on numerous occasions and continues to do so. He didn't start out thinking Sandusky was innocent. The opposite.

Maybe Jerry and Dottie have him fooled, but that seems less likely than the OAG convincing MM that a bunch of children were abused because he didn't do enough in '01 and he can make up for that by putting Sandusky away. Oh, and there's a whistle blower suit in it for you if you play your cards right.

 

[Chris92]

Nope

A recent PennLive piece showed 42% of Lock Haven's residents are living in poverty, the 2nd highest rate in the commonwealth's towns.

 

[jerot]

Jesus Christmas. Report it to the authorities..... of all the peopl, they pick the football coach. SMH.

It gets better.
Fellow Office of Physical Plant employee Ronald Petrosky was also working that evening and recalls that it was football season of 2000 and it was a Thursday or Friday evening, because the football team was away for its game. Petrosky, whose job it was to clean the showers, first heard water running in the assistant coaches' shower room. He then saw that two people were in the assistant coaches' shower room. He could only see two pairs of feet; the upper bodies were blocked. Petrosky waited for the two persons to exit the shower so he could clean it.
He later saw Jerry Sandusky exit the locker room with a boy, who he described as being between the ages of ll and 13. They were carrying bags and their hair was wet. Petrosky said good evening and was acknowledged by Sandusky and the boy. He noted that the hallway in the Lasch building at that point is long and that Sandusky took the boy's hand and the two of them walked out hand in hand. Petrosky began to clean the shower that Sandusky and the boy had vacated.
As he worked, Jim approached him. Petrosky described Jim as being upset and crying. Jim reported that he had seen Sandusky, whose name was not known to him, holding the boy up against the wall and licking on him. Jim said he had "fought in the [Korean] war seen people with their guts blowed out, arms just witnessed something in there I'1l never forget." And he described Sandusky performing oral sex on the boy. Petrosky testified that Jim was shaking and he and his fellow employees feared Jim might have a heart attack.
Petrosky testified that all the employees working that night except Witherite were relatively new employees. In discussions held later that shift, the employees expressed concern that if they reported what Jim had seen, they might lose their jobs. Jim's fellow employees had him tell Jay Witherite what he had seen.
Jay Witherite was Jim's immediate supervisor. Witherite testified that Jim was "very emotionally upset", "very distraught", to the point that Witherite "was afraid the man was going to have a heart attack or something the way he was acting." Jim reported to Witherite that he had observed Sandusky performing oral sex on the boy in the showers. Witherite tried to calm Jim, who was cursing and remained upset throughout the shift. Witherite told him to whom he should report the incident, if he chose to report it.
Witherite testified that later that same evening, Jim found him and told him that the man he had seen in the shower with the young boy was sitting in the Lasch building parking lot, in a car. Witherite confirmed visually that it was Sandusky who was sitting in his car in the parking lot. Witherite says that this was between 10:00 p.m. and 12:30 a.m. Petrosky also saw Sandusky drive very slowly through the parking lot about 2 to 3 hours after the incident was reported to him by Jim, at approximately 11:30 p.m. to 12:00 a.m. Petrosky recognized Sandusky in his vehicle. Petrosky testified that Sandusky drove by another time, about two hours later, again driving by very slowly but not stopping. The second drive-by was between 2:00 and 3:00 a.m. Petrosky testified that Sandusky did not enter the building either time. The area is well lit and the coaches' cars were known to Petrosky.
Jim was a temporary employee at the Lasch Building, working there for approximately 8 months. No report was ever made by Jim Calhoun. Jim presently suffers from dementia, resides in a nursing home and is incompetent to testify.
Victim 8's identity is unknown.

 

[RussianEagle]

It seems like that's what they are saying. There is no evidence anywhere of a TSM kid who Jerry took special interest in who spoken up on Jerry's behalf and denied grooming or molestation took place. Amazing. Every single young man Jerry worked closely with, EVERY SINGLE ONE, went for the money.

If he's innocent he must be the worst role model/father figure/charity leader of all time.

Read the trial testimony of Dave Hilton. Also, what about the 5 adopted kids not named Matt.

I find it ironic that people will call those who publicly claim Jerry’s innocence as pedophile enablers, but then say that the relative lack of people publicly defending him proves he’s guilty.

 

[Connorpozlee]

How do I know they went for the money? I think we all know the answer to that. I'm not aware on any accusers who refused the money, but if you know some, I will gladly admit I am wrong.

I know that many got paid. I read that as you saying they only claimed abuse because they wanted the money. Not sure if that was the intent or not.

 

[Connorpozlee]

Serious questions Connorpozlee - have you been to Clinton County in the last 20 years? Have you ever been there? Do you even know where it's at? Do you know the story of the Piper plant moving to Vero Beach?

I work with disadvantaged families and find their value systems to be as varied as the value systems of people from advantaged backgrounds. What the post I initially responded to seems to imply that all people from disadvantaged backgrounds will lie for a buck. I disagree strongly with that, if that was your intent.

 

[MtNittany]

I work with disadvantaged families and find their value systems to be as varied as the value systems of people from advantaged backgrounds. What the post I initially responded to seems to imply that all people from disadvantaged backgrounds will lie for a buck. I disagree strongly with that, if that was your intent.

My brush isn't that broad. Another question - don't you find it odd that no JS victim came forward who persevered and rose above the abuse to become a successful businessman? Firefighter? Policeman? Anything?

 

[marshall23]

Remember that the investigation of Sandusky lasted years. LE had great difficulty finding anyone who would corroborate AF's accusations. Isn't it a fact that most of those who eventually became accusers, at first vehemently denied any issues with JS? Some under oath.
Then there was a gold rush in Centre County. How many prospectors? All of them? Most of them? Some of them? I don't know. But I can't help but be skeptical.

 

[Connorpozlee]

My brush isn't that broad. Another question - don't you find it odd that no JS victim came forward who persevered and rose above the abuse to become a successful businessman? Firefighter? Policeman? Anything?

I absolutely find a lot odd about the whole thing. I am still open to any possibility, which is why I bother reading threads like this one. I still want answers. I’m open to the idea that some of the people who received payouts were just looking for a windfall. I still feel like we’ve barely moved towards getting the full truth.

 

[MtNittany]

I absolutely find a lot odd about the whole thing. I am still open to any possibility, which is why I bother reading threads like this one. I still want answers. I’m open to the idea that some of the people who received payouts were just looking for a windfall. I still feel like we’ve barely moved towards getting the full truth.

Hey - you're open, up front, polite, not an idiot - you do nothing but help find the truth. Keep digging. We all are.

 

[Lattner]

A recent PennLive piece showed 42% of Lock Haven's residents are living in poverty, the 2nd highest rate in the commonwealth's towns.

A new list has been produced recently, by PennLive.com, of the 35 communities in Pennsylvania “with the highest percentage of residents living in poverty.”

Lock Haven was listed as No. 2.

The list was created from a quick tally of three numbers for each community: its population, percentage of residents living in poverty, and the number of people living in poverty.

Up-to-date statistics can be found in the U.S. Census Bureau’s 2012-2016 American Community Survey Five-Year Estimates.

Lock Haven’s population is 9,724, according to these estimates.

When figuring the number of residents living in poverty, the Census Bureau did not use people who live in institutions, like Susque-View. Once they are removed, the estimates show 3,310 city residents live in poverty. This is a total of 42 percent of the population counted for these particular estimates.

It sounds dire. Is Lock Haven really the second “poorest”community in Pennsylvania, as the PennLive headline states? No, it isn’t, according to Lock Haven City Manager Gregory J. Wilson.

It does have “the second highest rate of poverty,” he said, and that is not the same thing.

The numbers are alarming at first glance, but according to Wilson, they reflect a few simple facts about our city, things that make Lock Haven the community it is.

Lock Haven University is one of the largest factors. LHU students who live off campus count as city residents for these poverty statistics, Wilson said — 1,378 students. (Those who live on campus are considered to be living in an institution, so they aren’t counted for these estimates.)

Most students don’t hold down a full-time job while taking a full load of classes, so they are generally below the poverty line.

 

[Chris92]

A new list has been produced recently, by PennLive.com, of the 35 communities in Pennsylvania “with the highest percentage of residents living in poverty.”

Lock Haven was listed as No. 2.

The list was created from a quick tally of three numbers for each community: its population, percentage of residents living in poverty, and the number of people living in poverty.

Up-to-date statistics can be found in the U.S. Census Bureau’s 2012-2016 American Community Survey Five-Year Estimates.

Lock Haven’s population is 9,724, according to these estimates.

When figuring the number of residents living in poverty, the Census Bureau did not use people who live in institutions, like Susque-View. Once they are removed, the estimates show 3,310 city residents live in poverty. This is a total of 42 percent of the population counted for these particular estimates.

It sounds dire. Is Lock Haven really the second “poorest”community in Pennsylvania, as the PennLive headline states? No, it isn’t, according to Lock Haven City Manager Gregory J. Wilson.

It does have “the second highest rate of poverty,” he said, and that is not the same thing.

The numbers are alarming at first glance, but according to Wilson, they reflect a few simple facts about our city, things that make Lock Haven the community it is.

Lock Haven University is one of the largest factors. LHU students who live off campus count as city residents for these poverty statistics, Wilson said — 1,378 students. (Those who live on campus are considered to be living in an institution, so they aren’t counted for these estimates.)

Most students don’t hold down a full-time job while taking a full load of classes, so they are generally below the poverty line.

Good find. But, how many college towns are there in PA? Too many to count.