ADVERTISEMENT

No PGA Championship discussion?

C

Cletus11

Well-Known Member
Aug 8, 2003
12,012
8,601
1
I thought the course was just too easy for these guys, just too many guys shooting in the mid 60's. I know the PGA is always the easiest of the 4 majors, but fairways were too wide, rough not thick enough, and greens just way to slow. Needed to be set up a little harder to at least provide a little bit more of a challenge. I thought the course itself was really nice right on the lake like that and could have easily had a few holes that were set up more challenging.

That said, the play was pretty good. I don't know Day from a whole in the ground, but he seems like a decent guy. Speith put his mark as the #1 player with his Saturday back 9. Justin Rose had a great year.

What can you say about Tiger, I do truly think he is done and just should accept that. There is not one part of his game right now that he can even build from. From driving to irons to putting, he has issues everywhere. I think he would be better off taking off the rest of the year and not playing at all for about 6 months to try and get healthy. Then come back playing some tour events that are not majors and not major events and just try to compete at the second level for a while to see if he can get his game back in some form.

I found it interesting that at one point, I think it was Nance who actually made the comment that there is a changing of the guard and golf has to get used to not having Tiger around (but he didn't actually say Tiger's name, I think he said 'the old guard'). And that there are a lot of marketable, new young players (he mentioned Speith and Rory) that have to become the new face of golf moving forward.
 
If Speith couldn't win, I'm glad Day could. He seems like a great guy and worked hard for that win. Second lowest round on Sunday. Plus, he's had enough runner-up finishes.
 
What happened to Z. Johnson? Missed the cut after winning the British. Surprised me there. Also Furyk who played so great at the Firestone last week plays good golf over the 4 days but 16 shots in arrears of Day. Winner of that one, Lowry also misses cut.

I like Day. He's a tough bastard. If you recall he was having the vertigo symptoms in the US Open, hit the deck on Saturday because of it and toughed it out to be within a few shots right up to the end. And when is D. Johnson going to win a major? He's Mr. Thursday.
 
That changing of the guard is an interesting concept. I was fortunate enough to get tickets to the Masters this year, and the scuttlebutt (read that as nothing more than what everyone was talking about on there on the course) was that Augusta wanted nothing more than for Spieth to take Tiger's scoring record down. Two more of Tiger's records fell yesterday, cumulative score below par at Majors (Spieth -54) and total score at a major (Day -20).

Now, whether or not that was a symptom of Augusta not dialing up the Stimp meter as much as they could have, or Whistling Straits keeping pins attainable. Now you also have to keep in mind that thunderstorm Friday night that softened everything up for the weekend. Couple that with the fact that winds just weren't blowing all that hard off the Lake (remember, without wind St. Andrew's can be taken to the woodshed too), those are ideal scoring conditions.

Also keep in mind that Straits has held the PGA twice before, 2004 where Vijay won with -8, and 2010 with Kaymer at -11. Can't say I recall any major differences between then and now, but it's not like it's consistently torn apart either.
 
Cletus11 said:
I thought the course was just too easy for these guys, just too many guys shooting in the mid 60's. I know the PGA is always the easiest of the 4 majors, but fairways were too wide, rough not thick enough, and greens just way to slow. Needed to be set up a little harder to at least provide a little bit more of a challenge. I thought the course itself was really nice right on the lake like that and could have easily had a few holes that were set up more challenging.

That said, the play was pretty good. I don't know Day from a whole in the ground, but he seems like a decent guy. Speith put his mark as the #1 player with his Saturday back 9. Justin Rose had a great year.

What can you say about Tiger, I do truly think he is done and just should accept that. There is not one part of his game right now that he can even build from. From driving to irons to putting, he has issues everywhere. I think he would be better off taking off the rest of the year and not playing at all for about 6 months to try and get healthy. Then come back playing some tour events that are not majors and not major events and just try to compete at the second level for a while to see if he can get his game back in some form.

I found it interesting that at one point, I think it was Nance who actually made the comment that there is a changing of the guard and golf has to get used to not having Tiger around (but he didn't actually say Tiger's name, I think he said 'the old guard'). And that there are a lot of marketable, new young players (he mentioned Speith and Rory) that have to become the new face of golf moving forward.
Click to expand...

I've never been to that course, but the fairways look to be pretty narrow. But these young guys can hit it beyond the choke points in the fairway, so with the length of the course, it wasn't enough. The greens were receptive, too. It was a very good event, though.

There is a changing of the guard. I still think Tiger has something left, he just has to find it but his era of domination is over. Phil is, what? 46 now? That's past the age for major championship titles. He hasn't won since the British Open in 2013. So that era is fading.

The new group to watch is McIlroy, Spieth, Day, Dustin Johnson, Fowler, with Stenson, Rose and Scott in the mix. I think McIlroy could break Jack's major records when it's all said and done.
 
delcoLion said:
I've never been to that course, but the fairways look to be pretty narrow. But these young guys can hit it beyond the choke points in the fairway, so with the length of the course, it wasn't enough. The greens were receptive, too. It was a very good event, though.

There is a changing of the guard. I still think Tiger has something left, he just has to find it but his era of domination is over. Phil is, what? 46 now? That's past the age for major championship titles. He hasn't won since the British Open in 2013. So that era is fading.

The new group to watch is McIlroy, Spieth, Day, Dustin Johnson, Fowler, with Stenson, Rose and Scott in the mix. I think McIlroy could break Jack's major records when it's all said and done.
Click to expand...

I like Rory and Jordan but after this years majors you have to go with Jordan having the best shot at beating Jack.
 
Yep, There are a bunch of young golfers like Speith, Day, Fowler, and Mcllroy, who I am glad to root for anytime I see them on the leaderboard, which is pretty often. They all seem like nice young men with a ton of talent and the poise to handle themselves. I also like Furyk because of his Lancaster county connection. The LPGA has a few I follow as well but I won't mention names for fear of incurring a 15 yard penalty.
 
  • Like
Reactions: OaktonDave
I can't believe they are counting out Tiger. After all, he says he is really really close to being back.
 
I agree the rain and lack of wind made the course that much easier, but I still think the set-up should have been more challenging for a few holes. Guys hitting 8 and 9 irons into Par 5's on their second shot with no major water or sand hazards should not happen in a major with that much regularity. The issue is that it was set up to play hard only if it was dry and windy.

I also agree that the equipment again has improved to the point where these guys are just too consistently outhitting the modern day courses. Obviously the 20 something golfers that were discussed are at a completely different level from what Tiger faced when he burst onto the scene in the late 90's. These guys are legit athletes that take fitness and practice to truly professional levels. Think about in the 90's with guys like Colin Montgomerie and David Love, etc...these guys were country club golfers that had minimal fitness level and Tiger just out-athleted and out competed them. Look at Day, Johnson, Speith, Rory, etc...these guys obviously spend legit time in the weight room and are finely conditioned athletes. That is why I think Tiger will never be competitive again, these guys are just too good and zero chance they get intimidated by Tiger like many golfers (including Phil) did when Tiger started playing well on the weekend in his prime.
 
I've played Whistling Straits and the course was "too easy" this week ONLY because Mother Nature was as cooperative as she could be. And it certainly wasn't too easy for everyone!

Just a little breezy Thurs afternoon.....and then the late Fri storm really softened the course. The conditions Sat & Sun could not have been more ideal. The chances of having back to back perfect days there on the weekend are about the same as getting a well officiated game when PSU plays tOSU or UMich.
 
  • Like
Reactions: CDLionFL
ILLINOISLION said:
I've played Whistling Straits and the course was "too easy" this week ONLY because Mother Nature was as cooperative as she could be. And it certainly wasn't too easy for everyone!

Just a little breezy Thurs afternoon.....and then the late Fri storm really softened the course. The conditions Sat & Sun could not have been more ideal. The chances of having back to back perfect days there on the weekend are about the same as getting a well officiated game when PSU plays tOSU or UMich.
Click to expand...


You hit the nail on the head, Illinois. That course is not easy. But you can't control what Mother Nature is going to do. The USGA set up Congressional in 2011 to play to its normal US Open-like difficulty but all the rain leading up to that week softened up the course and thus, Rory and others made mincemeat of it. Whistling Straits on Thursday afternoon was how the PGA wanted it to play -- difficult but fair. Other than Lingmerth, nobody else was taking it low on Thursday. Day was 5th in driving accuracy and 5th in distance for the week (3rd best total driving effort in a major since 1980) and when you're as locked in as he was, it's going to be easier to shoot low scores when you're always hitting wedge from the short grass.

People wondering about how good of guys these younger players are -- I can say that just about all of the ones I've come across have been great. This generation is more plugged in to social media and in turn, their fans. Plus, they're friends with each other whereas in the past, there were a lot of lone wolves (you weren't going to catch Phil and Vijay and Tiger hanging out with each other off the course unless it was some forced function).

As for Tiger, taking time off wouldn't help him one bit. He can beat balls all over his golf course down in Jupiter and that's not going to help him for tournament golf. Even though it's going to take a win at Wyndham to make the playoffs, it's good that he's playing there just so he can keep working on what needs to be done. Gone are the days when he said he'd only show up if he thought he could win. I don't think he's delusional enough (yet) to think he can win Wyndham. But if he sat out the rest of the year, it's likely not going to do much to improve his tournament game. So he'll play this week and then probably not again until mid-October on the West Coast.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ILLINOISLION
I disagree, I think Tiger needs a complete break from the game of golf for a while. Continuing to play and miss cuts and not be able to drive the ball or put or shoot in the 80's doesn't do him any good. He doesn't need practice, he needs to completely rework his game to play as a 40 year old with back and other physical related problems. Tiger still thinks mentally that if he continues to practice and play, it will magically come back, but it is not. He needs to take some legit time off, figure out what he wants to do with his life and if competitive golf is going to be a part of it or not. Then once he figures if he still wants to try and play, recognize he is not going to compete with Rory and Speith and Day and DJ on a week to week basis. he needs to rework his game to his strengths (whatever they might be) and recognize he needs to pick and choose his courses and shots to try and play the best game he can plan, regardless of what other people are doing. He needs to recognize that his best day might still not be good enough to be the new guys, but he still has to play within himself to shoot a 69 as that is the best he can do even if Rory and Speith, etc...are shooting in the mid 60's. Otherwise he will try for shots he cannot make and instead of shooting 69-70 he ends up shooting a 75-78.
 
Tiger needs to keep playing in tournaments. Agree with CDLion, hitting the range all day doesn't help him, he needs to hit shots in tournament conditions.

Loved the PGA this year- course looked great, it was fun to watch guys make birdies but be penalized for bad shots (you could say they should have changed #2 to a par 4, but it wouldn't really change anything). And was so happy to see Jason Day win, seems like a really good guy
 
Agree that Jack's record is safe. Too many good players and too much money make it hard to win big year after year.

As far as this week's scoring, Day hit it far and hit a lot of fairways. He also lag putted well. Very glad to see his name come off the list of best player not to win a major.
 
CDLionFL said:
The USGA set up Congressional in 2011 to play to its normal US Open-like difficulty but all the rain leading up to that week softened up the course and thus, Rory and others made mincemeat of it.

.
Click to expand...

The other problem at Congressional was that it had been very dry in the weeks leading up to the tournament and the rough was nowhere near what they wanted it to be. The rain came in the days immediately before the tournament started, and the timing could not have been worse. It softened the course, but it was too late for the rough to come in.

I really enjoy the new generation of golfers. They play a great brand of golf, and are anything but dull, stoic, carbon copies of each other. I'm glad to see it and think they will be good for the game.
 
I was there Wed-Sun. Thursday was the toughest with a strong east wind off the lake in the afternoon. Friday was hot muggy with a slight west breeze unit the storms came in around 5PM. Sat was as ideal as you can get. Sun was almost a repeat of Fri but slight overcast. Wind was very tricky on some holes all day.

FYI There are tee boxes on that course on some holes that were not used that will extend that course in the future and make it tougher. The course is centered around its bunkers that change year to year due to weather conditions. What you play in the fall won't be the same course you play next spring.

Beautiful course if you're a player, poor course if you're a spectator. We stayed mainly on 9 fairway and watched Jones hit over our heads into the corporate tent on Sat and Bjorn into the Wanamaker Club on Sun. Also Day's chunk chip trying to get onto green on Sun.

I'm not an autograph guy but lucked out and got Day's sig on Wed on the range. My son and I had a blast!
 
Young guys are doing to Tiger what he did to them 15 years ago. Question for everyone: What was more outrageous and sick, Day's 382 yd drive or the 168 yd wedge he hit to be on a 551 yd par 5 in 2! Un- freaking real!!!
 
bkmtnittany1 said:
Young guys are doing to Tiger what he did to them 15 years ago. Question for everyone: What was more outrageous and sick, Day's 382 yd drive or the 168 yd wedge he hit to be on a 551 yd par 5 in 2! Un- freaking real!!!
Click to expand...

It is not just Day, there are a lot of guys on the tour now hitting like that. That is what I was saying in the earlier post where the equipment has again outpaced the courses to the point where they are too short anymore. Same thing that Tiger did back in the late 90's. Bunkers and other obstacles these guys just outhit. You should not be hitting a wedge or even a 9 or 8 iron on the SECOND shot into a Par 5 unless it is an island green or something else that if you are not perfect, you are in big trouble.
 
I'd bet a beer that Nike told Tiger that "Your playing in the Wyndham. We are giving you 40 million a year and we want you in the Fed-Ex so you are playing."
 
bkmtnittany1 said:
I'd bet a beer that Nike told Tiger that "Your playing in the Wyndham. We are giving you 40 million a year and we want you in the Fed-Ex so you are playing."
Click to expand...

There is an interesting question. When Michael Jordan retired, his brand image was still huge (still is today even decades after playing). With Tiger's off the course issues and his play going to nothing, not even making cuts, etc...does Nike continue to give him big money or do they cut the cord. I just do not think that Tiger has the lasting appeal of Jordan or a few other guys who have had success in promoting brand post retirement.
 
I was up there on Wednesday.....and it was a perfect day in terms of comfort and challenge to the golfers because there was a nice strong breeze off the lake. And since all 8 lake holes run north/south it was a constant challenge in terms of cross winds....particularly on the par 3s.......we watched several golfers having trouble hitting the greens on Wednesday. As I understand it, Thursday was somewhat like that. We came back on Sunday and it was totally different. The winds were more out of the south/southwest, therefore not really a cross wind on the 8 lake holes....either at your back, or in your face....impacting distance, but not really location.....and I think Friday and Saturday were much like Sunday............so once it turned from an easterly wind to a southerly wind on Thursday, the entire play changed.......and with all 8 lake holes put in one wind-direction basket, all become difficult or easier depending on the wind.
 
cjrugger said:
Tiger needs to keep playing in tournaments. Agree with CDLion, hitting the range all day doesn't help him, he needs to hit shots in tournament conditions.

Loved the PGA this year- course looked great, it was fun to watch guys make birdies but be penalized for bad shots (you could say they should have changed #2 to a par 4, but it wouldn't really change anything). And was so happy to see Jason Day win, seems like a really good guy
Click to expand...

Tiger needs to put his swing back to the way it was in 2000. He was his own worst enemy -- ditching what was arguably an already perfect swing, and then, of course, the women -- while married to a virtual queen.

The guy is an idiot. What's hard to stomach is that he still has fans and sponsors willing to pay. I'm sick of the Tiger tournament coverage when he's doing nothing more than hacking around. Says a lot about our society.
 
KnightWhoSaysNit said:
I'm sick of the Tiger tournament coverage when he's doing nothing more than hacking around. Says a lot about our society.
Click to expand...

What's worse are the absolute throngs of folks that continue to follow him around the course, all the while sporting their blood red polos. Went to 2 tournaments this year and it continues to flabbergast me.

...I am not a Tiger guy.
 
Last edited:
Love how the last 2 guys have complained about the coverage Tiger gets while their entire post is about Tiger
 
bkmtnittany1 said:
I'd bet a beer that Nike told Tiger that "Your playing in the Wyndham. We are giving you 40 million a year and we want you in the Fed-Ex so you are playing."
Click to expand...
That's an interesting thought. Of course, Tiger *made* Nike golf and they have signed Rory to a deal so I don't think Nike is worried too much.
 
bkmtnittany1 said:
I'd bet a beer that Nike told Tiger that "Your playing in the Wyndham. We are giving you 40 million a year and we want you in the Fed-Ex so you are playing."
Click to expand...
That's an interesting thought. Of course, Tiger *made* Nike golf and they have signed Rory to a deal so I don't think Nike is worried too much.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Obliviax

Tiger dropping Nike and moving to TaylorMade

Replies
2
Views
398
Penn State Football
JR4PSU
JR4PSU
EdwardoCarrachio

Who or what inspires you?

Replies
29
Views
1K
Penn State Football
bdgan
bdgan
Obliviax

Sports betting

Replies
12
Views
489
Penn State Football
knickslions
K
N

O.T. - the Pittsburgh Penguins have hit rock bottom

Replies
21
Views
734
Penn State Football
Kasparaitis
K
Aardvark86

Uncle Joe (No, not that one. Or that one either.)

Replies
3
Views
122
Current Events Board
Aardvark86
Aardvark86
ADVERTISEMENT

Latest posts

ADVERTISEMENT
Top Bottom
Back