Natural Immunity 27 Times Stronger than Vaccines - Deserves some quick figures.

PSUEngineer89

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So, the theory is not without merit.

However, real world data shows that vaccination helps reduce disease severity and death.

I mean, I've done the calculations myself.

So, while it WAS POSSIBLE that this paper might have explained why vaccination wasn't a good idea, other factors obviously overcame that one factor.

Why? Because vaccinated people perform better against the coronavirus than unvaccinated people.

There can be no dispute on that issue.
 

WeR0206

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2020evidence.org
So, the theory is not without merit.

However, real world data shows that vaccination helps reduce disease severity and death.

I mean, I've done the calculations myself.

So, while it WAS POSSIBLE that this paper might have explained why vaccination wasn't a good idea, other factors obviously overcame that one factor.

Why? Because vaccinated people perform better against the coronavirus than unvaccinated people.

There can be no dispute on that issue.
It may decrease covid death but it increases all cause death for all age groups who receive it. When factoring that in the risk benefit analysis doesn’t make sense for any age group (when looking at all ages all cause mortality the shots are killing more people than they save).

https://www.skirsch.com/covid/VCage.pdf (Cost benefit by age analysis: The COVID vaccines kill more people than they save for all age groups)

https://www.unz.com/mwhitney/excess-deaths-point-to-depopulation-agenda (All cause mortality goes up everywhere following mass covid vaccinations)

Here’s pfizers own data from the trial of 40,000 incredibly healthy people, note the cardiac related deaths in both groups.

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/medrxiv/early/2021/07/28/2021.07.28.21261159/DC1/embed/media-1.pdf (See page 12 - pfizer trial shows 15 deaths in treatment group and 14 in the placebo)

There’s also this re: their trial:
https://www.bmj.com/content/375/bmj.n2635 (Covid-19: Researcher blows the whistle on data integrity issues in Pfizer’s vaccine trial)

The cherry on top is they were allowed to unblind their trial after just a few months which makes it impossible to track the vaccinated group against a placebo. How convenient!
 
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PSUEngineer89

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Updated info
Yes. Confirming the results of the original study.

Natural immunity is superior, and longest lasting.

Natural Immunity Infection Rate: 10.5 for up to 6 months, and 30 after 1 year.
Vaxx Rate: 69 for up to 6 months, 89 for up to 8 months.

When analyzed for severe rates, vaccination did even worse.

Interestingly, Natural plus Vaccine showed slightly worse than just Natural. So, my grandmother plus Arnold Schwarzenegger ARE NOT STRONGER than Arnold Schwarzenegger. Or just noise.
 
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interrobang

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If Twitter was serious about blocking misinformation (and not just anything that doesn't match the lefty agenda) this guy would have been banned long ago

 
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PaoliLion

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Observe over time 16,215 people from a group that had been fully vaccinated, and a group that had contracted Covid and recovered.

Contracted the disease (vaxxed / natural) = 238 vs 19.
Had some symptoms (vaxxed / natural) = 191 vs 8.

That's it. Very basic. Very easy - IF you want to know.

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.24.21262415v1.full-text

If you look hard enough, you’ll find that malaria medicine and horse de-wormer is, according to the misinformation network, an effective treatment (they aren’t). I know that some folks somewhere are trying to kill off Republicans, but I’m going to keep warning you about the misinformation out there.
 
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PSUEngineer89

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If you look hard enough, you’ll find that malaria medicine and horse de-wormer is, according to the misinformation network, an effective treatment (they aren’t). I know that some folks somewhere are trying to kill off Republicans, but I’m going to keep warning you about the misinformation out there.
I’ll keep working to explain things to people who want to understand.

You keep doing the Baghdad Bob routine.
 

PaoliLion

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I’ll keep working to explain things to people who want to understand.

You keep doing the Baghdad Bob routine.

You should reflect on why you Cons have been wrong about everything since day 1>>

Phase 1: “This will magically disappear”
Phase 2: “It’s a left wing hoax”
Phase 3: “HCQ is the answer”
Phase 4: “Herd immunity is imminent”
Phase 5: “Ivermectin is the new magic solution”
Phase 6: “Natural immunity is 27x better than the vaccine”

Like clockwork, you invent a new bogus reality every 3-months. How does it feel to be on the cutting edge of bullshit and misinformation?
 
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SLUPSU

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Yes. Confirming the results of the original study.

Natural immunity is superior, and longest lasting.

Natural Immunity Infection Rate: 10.5 for up to 6 months, and 30 after 1 year.
Vaxx Rate: 69 for up to 6 months, 89 for up to 8 months.

When analyzed for severe rates, vaccination did even worse.

Interestingly, Natural plus Vaccine showed slightly worse than just Natural. So, my grandmother plus Arnold Schwarzenegger ARE NOT STRONGER than Arnold Schwarzenegger. Or just noise.

Natural immunity waning or just weaker cross variant protection?

"In the unvaccinated recovered cohort, the infection rate was 10.5 per 100,000 person-days at risk, if previously infected 4-6 months before the study, but this went up three times, to 30, when those infected more than a year before the study were examined."

Booster is best where it counts.

"When only severe cases were analyzed, the number among the vaccinated was the highest. The crude rates for those aged 60 years or more were similar at around 0.5 per 100,000 for the recovered as well as the recovered then vaccinated cohorts, a little higher at 1.1 for the vaccinated then recovered, around ten times higher for the vaccinated cohort (at 4.6), falling to 0.4 in the booster cohort."

btw.... don't the numbers in the studies noted in this thread make the case that vaccines are extremely effective?
 
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LafayetteBear

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Bump. Let's not have the discussion again, OK?

Every theory, every previous observation, every data says that natural immunity should be stronger than any vaccine. And now, so does the data.

@PaoliLion
@WeR0206
@LafayetteBear
@interrobang
@Jason1743
@SLUPSU
@Steve G
I'm not sure why you have my handle listed above. I'm guessing it is because you want a response from me on your post. I'll credit you for at least acknowledging that the Covid-19 vaccine has a beneficial effect in reducing the risk of death or serious health impacts from Covid-19. (Dr. Conspiracy Guy is beyond hope in that regard. "The vaccine is STILL worse than going without." Jeebus.)

But your assertion that natural immunity is "27 times stronger" than the immunity produced by the Covid vaccine is beyond dubious. Math whiz or no, you simply cannot break that down into a fixed multiple.
 

Jason1743

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Hotshoe

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If you look hard enough, you’ll find that malaria medicine and horse de-wormer is, according to the misinformation network, an effective treatment (they aren’t). I know that some folks somewhere are trying to kill off Republicans, but I’m going to keep warning you about the misinformation out there.
You're the one spreading misinformation. You're nothing but a hack. De-wormer. It's human Ivermectin. Whether one believes it works or not, it's for humans. Nothing but a fraud.
 

LafayetteBear

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You're the one spreading misinformation. You're nothing but a hack. De-wormer. It's human Ivermectin. Whether one believes it works or not, it's for humans. Nothing but a fraud.

Yeah, for humans with worms or head lice. In other words, Hermy's would-be paramours.

Common question​

Is ivermectin FDA approved for COVID-19?


• The FDA has not authorized or approved ivermectin for use in preventing or treating COVID-19 in humans or animals. Ivermectin is approved for human use to treat infections caused by some parasitic worms and head lice and skin conditions like rosacea.

 

PaoliLion

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You're the one spreading misinformation. You're nothing but a hack. De-wormer. It's human Ivermectin. Whether one believes it works or not, it's for humans. Nothing but a fraud.

You folks get your panties in a wad about a few tornados, yet you’re not horrified by the 800K people that died last year because of COVID and how little Republicans have done to help.
 
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PSUEngineer89

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I'm not sure why you have my handle listed above. I'm guessing it is because you want a response from me on your post. I'll credit you for at least acknowledging that the Covid-19 vaccine has a beneficial effect in reducing the risk of death or serious health impacts from Covid-19. (Dr. Conspiracy Guy is beyond hope in that regard. "The vaccine is STILL worse than going without." Jeebus.)

But your assertion that natural immunity is "27 times stronger" than the immunity produced by the Covid vaccine is beyond dubious. Math whiz or no, you simply cannot break that down into a fixed multiple.

Nice straw man.

I surely said that for each age group and for every circumstance, the risk multiplier was 27.

Yeah, right.

The study proves, without dispute, that natural immunity is more than 10x times beneficial than vaccination.

Done. Period.
 

PSUEngineer89

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Natural immunity waning or just weaker cross variant protection?

"In the unvaccinated recovered cohort, the infection rate was 10.5 per 100,000 person-days at risk, if previously infected 4-6 months before the study, but this went up three times, to 30, when those infected more than a year before the study were examined."

Booster is best where it counts.

"When only severe cases were analyzed, the number among the vaccinated was the highest. The crude rates for those aged 60 years or more were similar at around 0.5 per 100,000 for the recovered as well as the recovered then vaccinated cohorts, a little higher at 1.1 for the vaccinated then recovered, around ten times higher for the vaccinated cohort (at 4.6), falling to 0.4 in the booster cohort."

btw.... don't the numbers in the studies noted in this thread make the case that vaccines are extremely effective?
My own calculations show that vaccines are effective.

I have said so a million times.

But people who are saying vaccines provide more protection are lying.

So I stop them.
 

Hotshoe

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You folks get your panties in a wad about a few tornados, yet you’re not horrified by the 800K people that died last year because of COVID and how little Republicans have done to help.
You're so fos and such a drama queen. Coming from the guy lying about Ivermectin. Wth do care if someone is taking Ivermectin prescribed by a doctor? Why? Yeah, no one cares but the little princess drama queen. Wah, wah, wah.
 

Hotshoe

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Yeah, for humans with worms or head lice. In other words, Hermy's would-be paramours.

Common question​

Is ivermectin FDA approved for COVID-19?


• The FDA has not authorized or approved ivermectin for use in preventing or treating COVID-19 in humans or animals. Ivermectin is approved for human use to treat infections caused by some parasitic worms and head lice and skin conditions like rosacea.

Yeah, the livestock version. Hello.
 

PSUEngineer89

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Your data DOES NOT address immunity following the booster shot. But, hey, you're just an engineer pretending to know what he is talking about.
I do know what I’m talking about.

And no, the data doesn’t address booster shots.

All of you lefties believed the nonsense from Walensky. You were wrong. Period.
I might look for data and address booster shots, but we need enough time to pass before those who have received boosters can be assessed.
 
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PaoliLion

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You're so fos and such a drama queen. Coming from the guy lying about Ivermectin. Wth do care if someone is taking Ivermectin prescribed by a doctor? Why? Yeah, no one cares but the little princess drama queen. Wah, wah, wah.

You folks are (presumably) grown men and have a responsibility to your family, friends and communities to get them vaccinated. We lost close to a million people over the last 18 months because of COVID and we’re going to lose roughly the same over the next 18 months.

As long as you’re pumping bullshit remedies + snake oil, you’re doing a massive disservice to this country. The fact that 55% of Republicans are vaccinated and >90% of Democrats shows you the impact of misinformation.
 
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Hotshoe

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I do know what I’m talking about.

And no, the data doesn’t address booster shots.

All of you lefties believed the nonsense from Walensky. You were wrong. Period.
I might look for data and address booster shots, but we need enough time to pass before those who have received boosters can be assessed.
You realize, I didn't write this, Jason did.
 

Hotshoe

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You folks are (presumably) grown men and have a responsibility to your family, friends and communities to get them vaccinated. We lost close to a million people over the last 18 months because of COVID and we’re going to lose roughly the same over the next 18 months.

As long as you’re pumping bullshit remedies + snake oil, you’re doing a massive disservice to this country. The fact that 55% of Republicans are vaccinated and >90% of Democrats shows you the impact of misinformation.
Not only are you lying in your posts, nowhere ever on this board, or anywhere, will you find me advising any treatment for Covid. You can't own your own lies. Just like the hoax nonsense. Go away. You're like a child.
 

PSUEngineer89

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So at the end of all the ridiculous nonsense, we all agree.

Natural immunity is more than 10x (that’s a full magnitude) better protection than full vaccination.

Glad I could clear that up.
 

PaoliLion

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Not only are you lying in your posts, nowhere ever on this board, or anywhere, will you find me advising any treatment for Covid. You can't own your own lies. Just like the hoax nonsense. Go away. You're like a child.

Dumb response
 

LioninHouston

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Not only are you lying in your posts, nowhere ever on this board, or anywhere, will you find me advising any treatment for Covid. You can't own your own lies. Just like the hoax nonsense. Go away. You're like a child.
The left is extremely concerned that they are going to catch Kung Flu from people who aren’t vaccinated, even though they are. They are even more afraid that there may be more than one way to treat/prevent Kung Flu. Why? Well, the only thing that explains the anger and resentment I see from leftists is that they have little tolerance for anyone who doesn’t agree with them. They have tremendous animosity toward anyone who doesn’t trust a vaccine that underwent no long-term testing and isn’t even needed by younger healthy people. It seems they are all about control, except when it involved killing unborn babies. My body, my choice, is their default position there.
 

bourbon n blues

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The left is extremely concerned that they are going to catch Kung Flu from people who aren’t vaccinated, even though they are. They are even more afraid that there may be more than one way to treat/prevent Kung Flu. Why? Well, the only thing that explains the anger and resentment I see from leftists is that they have little tolerance for anyone who doesn’t agree with them. They have tremendous animosity toward anyone who doesn’t trust a vaccine that underwent no long-term testing and isn’t even needed by younger healthy people. It seems they are all about control, except when it involved killing unborn babies. My body, my choice, is their default position there.
Very true.
 
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PSUEngineer89

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We're done with this, right?

Everyone agrees with the very basic statistics that show, without dispute, that immunity conferred via illness and recovery is more than a full magnitude greater than immunity conferred by vaccination.

We no longer have any person on this board who is STILL believing Dr. LowQ (Rachel Walensky), right?

I mean, as the people who have no training in science and math like to say: "follow the science".

Hahahahaha.
 

dailybuck777

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The fact we don't have cheap at home antibody tests is just criminal.
I just took an antibody test provided by LabCorp that cost me $6. My results came the next day. My second test. In mid September I had 886 antibody level and 4 days ago my antibody level was 490 for people here who might understand it. I really don't understand is that well, but I am tracking it to try to increase my knowledge.
 

Alphalion75

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My friends. I can only share with my own perception and experiences. Yesterday, my nephew passed away from Covid, succumbing after a two week fight. He was 62 years old and very fit for his age. He was an avid anti vaxxer. My wife, my son and my daughter in law all have tested positive for covid and survived with very little symptoms. All have been vaccinated. I have a musician friend, 58 years old, who is in an ICU at a local hospital with covid and fighting for his life. He has not been vaccinated. His wife is vaccinated, tested positive and has fully recovered with few symptoms. So for me, the evidence supporting the vaccinations is clear. These real life experiences make it more real to me than some medical reports or opinions. I highly recommend getting vaccinated and wish you all well.
 
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PSUEngineer89

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My friends. I can only share with my own perception and experiences. Yesterday, my nephew passed away from Covid, succumbing after a two week fight. He was 62 years old and very fit for his age. He was an avid anti vaxxer. My wife, my son and my daughter in law all have tested positive for covid and survived with very little symptoms. All have been vaccinated. I have a musician friend, 58 years old, who is in an ICU at a local hospital with covid and fighting for his life. He has not been vaccinated. His wife is vaccinated, tested positive and has fully recovered with few symptoms. So for me, the evidence supporting the vaccinations is clear. These real life experiences make it more real to me than some medical reports or opinions. I highly recommend getting vaccinated and wish you all well.
Yes.

All the evidence says this is true.

I don't want people to misunderstand what I'm saying - if you are old and vulnerable, you should absolutely get the vaccine.
 

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