Lots of issues facing EVs.......

The Spin Meister

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Nov 27, 2012
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An altered state
So GM put out multiple warnings for people that own/drive Chevy Volts as it seems they are prone to fires.

So don’t park within fifty feet of anything. Don’t want fires to spread.

Only park on top floor of parking garages. Don’t want smoke and toxic fumes throughout parking garages.

Never leave unattended when charging. So does that mean you have to stay up at night?

Never charge over 90% and never drive below the 70 miles left warning.....that will really cut your range!

It takes up to 40,000 gallons of water to fight these fires. You can‘t put them out.....just keep them cool until they burn out so it doesn’t spread.

In Germany many areas are banning all EVs from parking on ground floors of office buildings and apartment buildings. A fire in one of those could be catastrophic as the fumes would poison those inside. Could this be the next terrorist tool? And where can people then park? There is very little parking now without eliminating parking garages.

UK will require all new charging units to shut off from 8 AM to 11 Am and from 4PM to 10 PM because the grid can’t handle the extra demand. Not too good if you are traveling and need to charge. Or on way to catch a flight or a medical procedure or a business meeting or........

My, my, my. Unintended consequences. Unseen complications. Unkown unknowns.

 

NJPSU

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May 29, 2001
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So GM put out multiple warnings for people that own/drive Chevy Volts as it seems they are prone to fires.

So don’t park within fifty feet of anything. Don’t want fires to spread.

Only park on top floor of parking garages. Don’t want smoke and toxic fumes throughout parking garages.

Never leave unattended when charging. So does that mean you have to stay up at night?

Never charge over 90% and never drive below the 70 miles left warning.....that will really cut your range!

It takes up to 40,000 gallons of water to fight these fires. You can‘t put them out.....just keep them cool until they burn out so it doesn’t spread.

In Germany many areas are banning all EVs from parking on ground floors of office buildings and apartment buildings. A fire in one of those could be catastrophic as the fumes would poison those inside. Could this be the next terrorist tool? And where can people then park? There is very little parking now without eliminating parking garages.

UK will require all new charging units to shut off from 8 AM to 11 Am and from 4PM to 10 PM because the grid can’t handle the extra demand. Not too good if you are traveling and need to charge. Or on way to catch a flight or a medical procedure or a business meeting or........

My, my, my. Unintended consequences. Unseen complications. Unkown unknowns.

Sounds like you found an unbiased source.
 
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83wuzme

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My brother in law has a Bolt. I got to drive it and I liked it. The problems ; the batteries can ignite if they are overcharged or depleted to a low level and finding chargers remains a problem ( they could not find a suitable charger for the car in State College ! ?).
The dealer promised a fix for the battery fire issue, but for now they have the keep the battery charge within a specified range.
Tesla seems to have solved the battery Fire problem, so I imagine it will get fixed. The charging network scarcity appears to be a longer term problem. The practice of having different chargers for different vehicles is really stupid if you expect people to adopt this technology. I won’t even get to the battery recycling and disposal problem.
 

rumble_lion

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Aug 7, 2011
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So GM put out multiple warnings for people that own/drive Chevy Volts as it seems they are prone to fires.

So don’t park within fifty feet of anything. Don’t want fires to spread.

Only park on top floor of parking garages. Don’t want smoke and toxic fumes throughout parking garages.

Never leave unattended when charging. So does that mean you have to stay up at night?

Never charge over 90% and never drive below the 70 miles left warning.....that will really cut your range!

It takes up to 40,000 gallons of water to fight these fires. You can‘t put them out.....just keep them cool until they burn out so it doesn’t spread.

In Germany many areas are banning all EVs from parking on ground floors of office buildings and apartment buildings. A fire in one of those could be catastrophic as the fumes would poison those inside. Could this be the next terrorist tool? And where can people then park? There is very little parking now without eliminating parking garages.

UK will require all new charging units to shut off from 8 AM to 11 Am and from 4PM to 10 PM because the grid can’t handle the extra demand. Not too good if you are traveling and need to charge. Or on way to catch a flight or a medical procedure or a business meeting or........

My, my, my. Unintended consequences. Unseen complications. Unkown unknowns.


Well I wouldn't exactly say that Chevy Bolts represents all EVs. You are taking one incompetent manufacturer and smearing all EVs.

Secondly I think you will find that internal combustion engine cars catch fire far more often than Evs do. They even have "combustion" in the name so no real surprise there.
 

Fayette_LION

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Well I wouldn't exactly say that Chevy Bolts represents all EVs. You are taking one incompetent manufacturer and smearing all EVs.

Secondly I think you will find that internal combustion engine cars catch fire far more often than Evs do. They even have "combustion" in the name so no real surprise there.
I never heard of an internal combustion engine “combust” when parked and not running. One thing about battery voltage, low E equates to higher R. I’ve seen a number of battery fires due to low voltage. They do burn until the fire source is exhausted.
 

rumble_lion

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I never heard of an internal combustion engine “combust” when parked and not running. One thing about battery voltage, low E equates to higher R. I’ve seen a number of battery fires due to low voltage. They do burn until the fire source is exhausted.


Happens all the time. Park the vehicle after driving it. You have hot engine parts - all you need is a fuel leak to have a fire.

I remember this story from not so long ago.

A fire that killed a Madison County woman and her two children started in the home’s carport, where the family’s sport-utility vehicle was parked.​
Motor vehicle registration records show that the family owned a 2001 Ford Expedition.​
That model and 9.6 million other Ford vehicles have been under a recall since 2005 due to a faulty cruise-control switch that can “lead to a vehicle fire at any time,” according to the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration.​
Peter Romans, who survived the fire that killed his wife and children, told state investigators that the fire started in his parked sport-utility vehicle.​
Several dwelling fires have been attributed to the faulty cruise-control switch, which can overheat and spark a fire, according to a NHTSA consumer advisory issued Feb. 28.​
The early Sunday fire killed Billi Romans, 51; Ami Romans, 16; and Caleb Romans, 12. Their bodies were found near the back door of the house on Lilly Chapel Opossum Run Road south of West Jefferson.​
Mr. Romans, 47, escaped with minor burns and smoke inhalation and was released after being treated at a Columbus hospital.​
 
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rumble_lion

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My brother in law has a Bolt. I got to drive it and I liked it. The problems ; the batteries can ignite if they are overcharged or depleted to a low level and finding chargers remains a problem ( they could not find a suitable charger for the car in State College ! ?).
The dealer promised a fix for the battery fire issue, but for now they have the keep the battery charge within a specified range.
Tesla seems to have solved the battery Fire problem, so I imagine it will get fixed. The charging network scarcity appears to be a longer term problem. The practice of having different chargers for different vehicles is really stupid if you expect people to adopt this technology. I won’t even get to the battery recycling and disposal problem.


Tesla seems to have solved the battery Fire problem, so I imagine it will get fixed.

Hmmm, well there is no general "battery fire problem", so there is nothing for Tesla to fix.

Here is the Chevy Bolt problem as I see it.

GM wanted to get an electric car to market fast so they outsourced the entire drive train for the Bolt to LG Chem. Batteries, electric motor, inverter, battery management system, chargers, the whole shebang all done by LG. All GM does when building Bolt is add all the LG parts onto the car.

So great, GM gets the Bolt out to market fast. Problem is that when LG was building the batteries they experience two separate manufacturing defects. Both defects are pretty rare but if they both happen to occur in the same battery module that module may eventually catch on fire. This as we see is very bad for business.

Rather than recall all the batteries GM decided to create some software that would allow it to detect the bad batteries before they combusted. That would allow them to replace far, far fewer batteries than a total recall. They started installing the upgraded software months ago. Within no time at all several cars that had received the upgraded software caught fire and burned. Plan A was a complete failure. About the same time I believe GM discovered that the rare manufacturing defect could still be occurring latest battery packs.

GM changed course and initiated a complete battery recall. Every pack ever made will be replaced. They shut down the Bolt production line for several months and stopped selling the cars that had been produced because the battery packs fresh off the assembly line could still have the manufacturing defects.

Now they are "negotiating" with LG Chem over who pays what portion of the 1.8 billion dollars it will cost to replace all the Bolt batteries.

Complicating matters even more for GM is the their new next generation Ultium battery pack that will be used in all their future EVs. Guess who is the sole manufacture for the battery cells for the GM Ultium batteries? Yep, LG Chem. GM can't really throw LG under the bus here as it would jeopardize their future pack plans.

I would chalk the whole mess up to very poor GM management.
 
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HartfordLlion

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Well I wouldn't exactly say that Chevy Bolts represents all EVs. You are taking one incompetent manufacturer and smearing all EVs.

Secondly I think you will find that internal combustion engine cars catch fire far more often than Evs do. They even have "combustion" in the name so no real surprise there.

Funny how this incompetent manufacture is set to dominate the EV landscape. At least according to an article put up on Yahoo Finance today.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/tesl...ils-electric-vehicle-landscape-124811083.html

Also to note, it was behind the WSJ pay wall, Musk is telling us we need to double our electrical generation just to accommodate the projected growth of EVs. This will not end well. Since renewables are nt projected to expand fast enough to remotely accommodate this growth. guess what we will be burning to charge these EVs. Another case of unintended consequences.
 
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rumble_lion

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Funny how this incompetent manufacture is set to dominate the EV landscape. At least according to an article put up on Yahoo Finance today.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/tesl...ils-electric-vehicle-landscape-124811083.html

Also to note, it was behind the WSJ pay wall, Musk is telling us we need to double our electrical generation just to accommodate the projected growth of EVs. This will not end well. Since renewables are nt projected to expand fast enough to remotely accommodate this growth. guess what we will be burning to charge these EVs. Another case of unintended consequences.

What part of the Bolt battery fire saga inspires confidence that GM can "lead" anything?

Funny how this incompetent manufacture is set to dominate the EV landscape. At least according to an article put up on Yahoo Finance today.

It doesn't' really say that now does it?

Among traditional automotive OEMs, GM is certainly the current BEV front-runner in the U.S., and possibly worldwide, as it remains in close competition with Volkswagen (VW) for the latter designation,” the paper said.​

Kind of like being the tallest midget isn't it? It's a great thing no doubt but still ain't getting you into the NBA.

If you think GM or Ford or Chrysler/Stellantis or whatever their name is the month is going to dominate the EV landscape you are as clueless as their management is.

Speaking of Volkswagon I do think their CEO is one of the few that realizes what is going on. He is frantically trying to change the course at that company but it's trying to get a huge oil tanker to do a 180 degree turn. It ain't happening quickly.

According to BI sources Herbert Diess and Brand CEO Ralf Brandstätter called a crisis meeting with all 120 top managers at the company, on Thursday, 8/30/2021.​
Diess stated the following:​
Compared to Tesla and Chinese manufacturers VW is too expensive, slow, unproductive, and not competitive.​
We need to take up the "fight against Grünheide"​
If everything remains as it is, VW will no longer be competitive.​
We have a great responsibility for this site. We have to embrace the new competition.​
It is urgently necessary that a new course is set in Wolfsburg. Future competition with Tesla's new Giga factory will be brutal. The electric car pioneer sets new standards in car production.​
A Model 3 is built in 10 hours, more than 3 times as fast as a VW ID.3 in Zwickau. This puts Tesla in another dimension in terms of productivity and profitability.​
We need a will to live and a jolt at the site.​
Trinity has to take the site to a new competitive level, has to revolutionize it. Also with new processes.​
Note, the board says the designs for the project so far don't go far enough.​
 

rumble_lion

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Aug 7, 2011
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Funny how this incompetent manufacture is set to dominate the EV landscape. At least according to an article put up on Yahoo Finance today.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/tesl...ils-electric-vehicle-landscape-124811083.html

Also to note, it was behind the WSJ pay wall, Musk is telling us we need to double our electrical generation just to accommodate the projected growth of EVs. This will not end well. Since renewables are nt projected to expand fast enough to remotely accommodate this growth. guess what we will be burning to charge these EVs. Another case of unintended consequences.

Also to note, it was behind the WSJ pay wall, Musk is telling us we need to double our electrical generation just to accommodate the projected growth of EVs. This will not end well. Since renewables are nt projected to expand fast enough to remotely accommodate this growth. guess what we will be burning to charge these EVs. Another case of unintended consequences

Nice, it will create lots of US based jobs.
 

HartfordLlion

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Also to note, it was behind the WSJ pay wall, Musk is telling us we need to double our electrical generation just to accommodate the projected growth of EVs. This will not end well. Since renewables are nt projected to expand fast enough to remotely accommodate this growth. guess what we will be burning to charge these EVs. Another case of unintended consequences

Nice, it will create lots of US based jobs.

And does little for CO2 reduction. Isn't this all about being green???
 
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Steve G

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So GM put out multiple warnings for people that own/drive Chevy Volts as it seems they are prone to fires.

So don’t park within fifty feet of anything. Don’t want fires to spread.

Only park on top floor of parking garages. Don’t want smoke and toxic fumes throughout parking garages.

Never leave unattended when charging. So does that mean you have to stay up at night?

Never charge over 90% and never drive below the 70 miles left warning.....that will really cut your range!

It takes up to 40,000 gallons of water to fight these fires. You can‘t put them out.....just keep them cool until they burn out so it doesn’t spread.

In Germany many areas are banning all EVs from parking on ground floors of office buildings and apartment buildings. A fire in one of those could be catastrophic as the fumes would poison those inside. Could this be the next terrorist tool? And where can people then park? There is very little parking now without eliminating parking garages.

UK will require all new charging units to shut off from 8 AM to 11 Am and from 4PM to 10 PM because the grid can’t handle the extra demand. Not too good if you are traveling and need to charge. Or on way to catch a flight or a medical procedure or a business meeting or........

My, my, my. Unintended consequences. Unseen complications. Unkown unknowns.

to summarize. GM built a defective product and then tried to cheap out on the fix. Color me shocked.........
 

rumble_lion

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Aug 7, 2011
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Well no one mentions Germany banning EVs in parking garages. So must be just more than GM. Or the UK severely restricting hours of charging.

Probably because it's just a bunch of anti ev fud being spread by shaledirectories.com. Who would be dumb enough to believe it?

Or the UK severely restricting hours of charging.

That's just not true. As you can see commercial charging is not restricted at all.

Under regulations that will come into force in May, new chargers in the home and workplace will be automatically set not to function from 8am to 11am and 4pm to 10pm. Public chargers and rapid chargers, on motorways and A-roads, will be exempt.​
When you are charging at home you don't need to charge during peak usage times. That's a huge advantage for Evs, they can be charged late at night when electricity usage is very low. This helps even out the demand during the day for the electrical generators and lets them obtain better efficiency.

Well no one mentions Germany banning EVs in parking garages

A Facebook video post claims Germany has banned electric vehicles from parking underground because of the risk of fire.​
The video shows several electric vehicles (EVs) parked at a charging station. After 10 seconds, smoke emerges from beneath a van before a fire rages quickly and moves to a truck alongside. The blaze engulfs the truck and begins to burn a third vehicle.​
The post’s caption reads: “Charging station for electric vehicles in Germany shows why Germany will not let you park electric cars underground. A shorting battery cell causes a fire which takes 1:15 sec to destroy three cars!”​
At the time of writing, the July 5 post by an Australian user had been shared more than 9,500 times and the video had been viewed over 190,000 times.​

THE ANALYSIS​

The fire seen in the Facebook video may be a dramatic electric vehicle fire, but it’s not from Germany – nor has the European nation introduced a ban on electric cars being parked underground.​
The blaze seen in the video took place in the city of Dongguan in China’s Guangdong province on May 8, 2020, an incident reported on alongside the same video by outlets including Yahoo!News and an EV industry website at the time.​
The incident was also covered by the Chinese media site Sixth Tone, which revealed the fire-damaged EV was manufactured by Zhengzhou Nissan, a joint venture company. Chinese characters are visible on the vehicles in the video.​
The fire was completely unrelated to temporary decisions by two German car parks, in the states of Bavaria and Baden-Wurttemberg, to ban EVs from parking underground this year. Both decisions were the result of internal combustion engine (ICE) vehicle fires, and were not part of a national policy on the safe storage of EVs.​
A spokeswoman from Germany’s Federal Ministry for Transport and Digital Infrastructure confirmed to AAP FactCheck via email that it had not introduced any ban on electric vehicles from being parked underground due to the risk of fires.​
She noted that fire protection and fighting was the responsibility of each state, pointing to the city of Kulmbach’s ban following an ICE vehicle fire.​
“The ban on electric and hybrid vehicles entering that parking facility was imposed as a transitional measure and has been already repealed again,” she said.​
“In principle, the owner can regulate or restrict the use of his public or private garage (parking garage, underground garage) on his own authority.”​
A news report on the Kulmbach car park reopening in February said the fire on September 7, 2020 involved an old VW Golf. It also explained the reason behind the ban on EVs, quoting Michael Kuhnlein from the city’s civil engineering department.​
“In future, electric and hybrid cars will no longer be allowed to park in the underground car park. The fire brigade cannot extinguish such vehicles, they have to let them burn out. The underground car park is also not high enough to pull out burning cars with heavy equipment,” Mr Kuhnlein told inFranken.de.​
A report from German news agency DPA added details on the bans in Kulmbach and Leonberg in Baden-Wuerttemberg, saying that Teslas and other EVs as well as petrol and diesel hybrids were not allowed to use the two underground car parks. The Leonberg car park reopened to electric and hybrid cars on March 30, according to the city’s website.​
Thomas Neumann, a policy officer with Avere, the European Association for Electromobility, said the bans were limited to the two examples – which were widely reported on at the time.​
“No broader pattern of such bans has emerged since. The German Parking Association, automotive association VDA, and the German Firefighters’ Association are all of the opinion that such a ban is not necessary, given EVs do not pose a more significant fire hazard than ICE vehicles and EV fires can be extinguished safely and effectively,” he said.​
Eva Siegfried, of VDA, the German Association of the Automotive Industry, confirmed to AAP FactCheck that the Kulmbach ban had been lifted in May, and that no federal restriction on EVs being parked underground was in place in Germany.​
 

rumble_lion

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Aug 7, 2011
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Your little cartoon is precious. Some of the same processes that give us gasoline also give us some of the fossil fuel, oil, NG that burns in a powerplants that power EV.

We don't even burn oil to generate electricity and natural gas does not follow the same process. Per the eai .4% of electricity in the US was generated in 2020 via burn petroleum.

https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=427&t=3
 

Still in State College

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Mar 8, 2002
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I like to look at the EV wave as more like building a better mouse trap. I don't think it is any more ecological, maybe it is just a better car moving forward. The "Green" tag is only a sales pitch because nobody cares about start to finish views, only catch phrases. Everybody I know that has a Telsa loves it. They think it is a great car. They are not preaching the saving the world angle.
 

83wuzme

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Apr 27, 2005
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I never heard of an internal combustion engine “combust” when parked and not running. One thing about battery voltage, low E equates to higher R. I’ve seen a number of battery fires due to low voltage. They do burn until the fire source is exhausted.
SAC, or Spontaneous Automotive Combustion, is not widely reported in the media.
 

rumble_lion

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SAC, or Spontaneous Automotive Combustion, is not widely reported in the media.

Vehicles fires are pretty common and not newsworthy.

Each year, from 2014 to 2016, an estimated 171,500 highway vehicle fires occurred in the United States, resulting in an annual average of 345 deaths; 1,300 injuries; and $1.1 billion in property loss.1 These highway vehicle fires accounted for 13 percent of fires responded to by fire departments across the nation.2 The term “highway vehicle fires” includes fires in passenger road vehicles (e.g., cars, motorcycles and off-road recreational vehicles), freight road transport vehicles (e.g., dump trucks, fire apparatus and tank trucks), and agricultural and construction vehicles.​
https://www.usfa.fema.gov/downloads/pdf/statistics/v19i2.pdf
And what are you? lol......

What I have posted above that is not true?
 

HartfordLlion

Well-Known Member
Sep 28, 2001
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You are just a fountain of anti ev and renewable fud.

Sorry, reality bites.

Besides I'm really starting to dig this climate change here in the northeast. It was hot this summer but not that bad, lots of rain and high CO2 levels has made everything really green this year, October is on the warm side. What's not to like???
 
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bdroc

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Aug 23, 2021
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Funny how this incompetent manufacture is set to dominate the EV landscape. At least according to an article put up on Yahoo Finance today.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/tesl...ils-electric-vehicle-landscape-124811083.html

Also to note, it was behind the WSJ pay wall, Musk is telling us we need to double our electrical generation just to accommodate the projected growth of EVs. This will not end well. Since renewables are nt projected to expand fast enough to remotely accommodate this growth. guess what we will be burning to charge these EVs. Another case of unintended consequences.
The chip shortage might be nothing compared to the shortage of rare earth minerals needed for battery production.
 
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rumble_lion

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The chip shortage might be nothing compared to the shortage of rare earth minerals needed for battery production.

Tesla just increased production 70% in the last quarter compared to the same quarter a year ago. They have provided guidance stating that they will increase yearly production at 50% per year for the foreseeable future. Shortages of rare earth minerals oddly doesn't appear to be affecting them.
 

Cosmos

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Tesla just increased production 70% in the last quarter compared to the same quarter a year ago. They have provided guidance stating that they will increase yearly production at 50% per year for the foreseeable future. Shortages of rare earth minerals oddly doesn't appear to be affecting them.
Could it be because they cut a deal with China? Share technology for rare earth minerals? As you know you don't get to do business in China without giving up your first born. Liberals call it "free trade."
 

Cosmos

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These highway vehicle fires accounted for 13 percent of fires responded to by fire departments across the nation.2

Holy schnikes! I have an attached garage. Should I start parking my vehicles outside in the driveway.
 

The Spin Meister

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Nov 27, 2012
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An altered state
Vehicles fires are pretty common and not newsworthy.

Each year, from 2014 to 2016, an estimated 171,500 highway vehicle fires occurred in the United States, resulting in an annual average of 345 deaths; 1,300 injuries; and $1.1 billion in property loss.1 These highway vehicle fires accounted for 13 percent of fires responded to by fire departments across the nation.2 The term “highway vehicle fires” includes fires in passenger road vehicles (e.g., cars, motorcycles and off-road recreational vehicles), freight road transport vehicles (e.g., dump trucks, fire apparatus and tank trucks), and agricultural and construction vehicles.​
https://www.usfa.fema.gov/downloads/pdf/statistics/v19i2.pdf


What I have posted above that is not true?
And the vast majority are the result of traffic accidents.
 

The Spin Meister

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Nov 27, 2012
19,437
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An altered state
Probably because it's just a bunch of anti ev fud being spread by shaledirectories.com. Who would be dumb enough to believe it?

Or the UK severely restricting hours of charging.

That's just not true. As you can see commercial charging is not restricted at all.

Under regulations that will come into force in May, new chargers in the home and workplace will be automatically set not to function from 8am to 11am and 4pm to 10pm. Public chargers and rapid chargers, on motorways and A-roads, will be exempt.​
When you are charging at home you don't need to charge during peak usage times. That's a huge advantage for Evs, they can be charged late at night when electricity usage is very low. This helps even out the demand during the day for the electrical generators and lets them obtain better efficiency.

Well no one mentions Germany banning EVs in parking garages

A Facebook video post claims Germany has banned electric vehicles from parking underground because of the risk of fire.​
The video shows several electric vehicles (EVs) parked at a charging station. After 10 seconds, smoke emerges from beneath a van before a fire rages quickly and moves to a truck alongside. The blaze engulfs the truck and begins to burn a third vehicle.​
The post’s caption reads: “Charging station for electric vehicles in Germany shows why Germany will not let you park electric cars underground. A shorting battery cell causes a fire which takes 1:15 sec to destroy three cars!”​
At the time of writing, the July 5 post by an Australian user had been shared more than 9,500 times and the video had been viewed over 190,000 times.​

THE ANALYSIS​

The fire seen in the Facebook video may be a dramatic electric vehicle fire, but it’s not from Germany – nor has the European nation introduced a ban on electric cars being parked underground.​
The blaze seen in the video took place in the city of Dongguan in China’s Guangdong province on May 8, 2020, an incident reported on alongside the same video by outlets including Yahoo!News and an EV industry website at the time.​
The incident was also covered by the Chinese media site Sixth Tone, which revealed the fire-damaged EV was manufactured by Zhengzhou Nissan, a joint venture company. Chinese characters are visible on the vehicles in the video.​
The fire was completely unrelated to temporary decisions by two German car parks, in the states of Bavaria and Baden-Wurttemberg, to ban EVs from parking underground this year. Both decisions were the result of internal combustion engine (ICE) vehicle fires, and were not part of a national policy on the safe storage of EVs.​
A spokeswoman from Germany’s Federal Ministry for Transport and Digital Infrastructure confirmed to AAP FactCheck via email that it had not introduced any ban on electric vehicles from being parked underground due to the risk of fires.​
She noted that fire protection and fighting was the responsibility of each state, pointing to the city of Kulmbach’s ban following an ICE vehicle fire.​
“The ban on electric and hybrid vehicles entering that parking facility was imposed as a transitional measure and has been already repealed again,” she said.​
“In principle, the owner can regulate or restrict the use of his public or private garage (parking garage, underground garage) on his own authority.”​
A news report on the Kulmbach car park reopening in February said the fire on September 7, 2020 involved an old VW Golf. It also explained the reason behind the ban on EVs, quoting Michael Kuhnlein from the city’s civil engineering department.​
“In future, electric and hybrid cars will no longer be allowed to park in the underground car park. The fire brigade cannot extinguish such vehicles, they have to let them burn out. The underground car park is also not high enough to pull out burning cars with heavy equipment,” Mr Kuhnlein told inFranken.de.​
A report from German news agency DPA added details on the bans in Kulmbach and Leonberg in Baden-Wuerttemberg, saying that Teslas and other EVs as well as petrol and diesel hybrids were not allowed to use the two underground car parks. The Leonberg car park reopened to electric and hybrid cars on March 30, according to the city’s website.​
Thomas Neumann, a policy officer with Avere, the European Association for Electromobility, said the bans were limited to the two examples – which were widely reported on at the time.​
“No broader pattern of such bans has emerged since. The German Parking Association, automotive association VDA, and the German Firefighters’ Association are all of the opinion that such a ban is not necessary, given EVs do not pose a more significant fire hazard than ICE vehicles and EV fires can be extinguished safely and effectively,” he said.​
Eva Siegfried, of VDA, the German Association of the Automotive Industry, confirmed to AAP FactCheck that the Kulmbach ban had been lifted in May, and that no federal restriction on EVs being parked underground was in place in Germany.​
Wait until one ignites somewhere in a garage and the building implodes. Or people above die from the fumes. They will be banned.
 

MtNittany

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May 29, 2001
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34,758
1
Wait until one ignites somewhere in a garage and the building implodes. Or people above die from the fumes. They will be banned.
iu
 

bdroc

Well-Known Member
Aug 23, 2021
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Tesla just increased production 70% in the last quarter compared to the same quarter a year ago. They have provided guidance stating that they will increase yearly production at 50% per year for the foreseeable future. Shortages of rare earth minerals oddly doesn't appear to be affecting them.
They've navigated the shortage well to this point but the bottom line is that a lot of new EVs are coming out in the next few years and the rare earth minerals have to come from somewhere.
 

PSUEngineer89

Well-Known Member
Aug 14, 2021
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It truly is brainwashing on a large scale.

We have a society, with lots of "leaders" included, who have been brainwashed into this.

Sheeple (all liberal arts majors, or bad engineers) are dedicating their careers and lives to making very minor impacts to a problem that doesn't exist.

Think about this - even a back of the envelope calculation shows that all of these efforts are futile because of China and India.

And every piece of evidence we have indicates that whatever warming we will get will be beneficial, EVEN IF THIS WOULD ACTUALLY MAKE A MEANIGFUL DIFFERENCE (which it will not).
 

rumble_lion

Well-Known Member
Aug 7, 2011
20,307
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They've navigated the shortage well to this point but the bottom line is that a lot of new EVs are coming out in the next few years and the rare earth minerals have to come from somewhere.

Yeah, it's real mystery as how these needed minerals will be mined. I guess we will all have to sit around looking at each other until someone figures it out.
 

rumble_lion

Well-Known Member
Aug 7, 2011
20,307
4,634
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What part of the Bolt battery fire saga inspires confidence that GM can "lead" anything?

Funny how this incompetent manufacture is set to dominate the EV landscape. At least according to an article put up on Yahoo Finance today.

It doesn't' really say that now does it?

Among traditional automotive OEMs, GM is certainly the current BEV front-runner in the U.S., and possibly worldwide, as it remains in close competition with Volkswagen (VW) for the latter designation,” the paper said.​

Kind of like being the tallest midget isn't it? It's a great thing no doubt but still ain't getting you into the NBA.

If you think GM or Ford or Chrysler/Stellantis or whatever their name is the month is going to dominate the EV landscape you are as clueless as their management is.

Speaking of Volkswagon I do think their CEO is one of the few that realizes what is going on. He is frantically trying to change the course at that company but it's trying to get a huge oil tanker to do a 180 degree turn. It ain't happening quickly.

According to BI sources Herbert Diess and Brand CEO Ralf Brandstätter called a crisis meeting with all 120 top managers at the company, on Thursday, 8/30/2021.​
Diess stated the following:​
Compared to Tesla and Chinese manufacturers VW is too expensive, slow, unproductive, and not competitive.​
We need to take up the "fight against Grünheide"​
If everything remains as it is, VW will no longer be competitive.​
We have a great responsibility for this site. We have to embrace the new competition.​
It is urgently necessary that a new course is set in Wolfsburg. Future competition with Tesla's new Giga factory will be brutal. The electric car pioneer sets new standards in car production.​
A Model 3 is built in 10 hours, more than 3 times as fast as a VW ID.3 in Zwickau. This puts Tesla in another dimension in terms of productivity and profitability.​
We need a will to live and a jolt at the site.​
Trinity has to take the site to a new competitive level, has to revolutionize it. Also with new processes.​
Note, the board says the designs for the project so far don't go far enough.​

More not so good news for Volkswagen, looks like they are buying emissions credits in China from Tesla.

BEIJING -- Tesla is expected to earn about $390 million this year from automobile emissions credits in China, while Volkswagen looks to be the biggest loser in the carbon trading scheme.​
Automakers and auto importers operating in China are required to manufacture and sell a certain ratio of new-energy vehicles, which include electric cars and plug-in hybrids. Companies receive credit points for surpassing the goal, set at 12% of total sales volumes in 2020. Trading of those credit points started this year.​
China's industry ministry recently released data on the number of credits allotted to automakers in 2020. Tesla, which makes electric vehicles in Shanghai, is the top recipient of the credits. The U.S. automaker attained 890,000 points, including those earned by its import and distribution center in Beijing.​
The amount of income Tesla earned by selling the credits has not been disclosed. But Chinese media reports indicate the company may reap roughly 2.5 billion yuan ($387 million). LMC Automotive, a British market intelligence firm, estimates that each credit was worth 3,000 yuan on average in 2020.​
Two of Volkswagen's joint ventures compiled the most negative credits. FAW-Volkswagen Automotive was slapped with 130,000 negative points, the most of all automakers, due to its sparse selection of new-energy vehicles.​
FAW-Volkswagen will need to purchase 400 million yuan worth of credits, according to some media reports. Some speculate that the company has already bought credits from Tesla.​
 

The Spin Meister

Well-Known Member
Nov 27, 2012
19,437
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An altered state
More not so good news for Volkswagen, looks like they are buying emissions credits in China from Tesla.

BEIJING -- Tesla is expected to earn about $390 million this year from automobile emissions credits in China, while Volkswagen looks to be the biggest loser in the carbon trading scheme.
Automakers and auto importers operating in China are required to manufacture and sell a certain ratio of new-energy vehicles, which include electric cars and plug-in hybrids. Companies receive credit points for surpassing the goal, set at 12% of total sales volumes in 2020. Trading of those credit points started this year.​
China's industry ministry recently released data on the number of credits allotted to automakers in 2020. Tesla, which makes electric vehicles in Shanghai, is the top recipient of the credits. The U.S. automaker attained 890,000 points, including those earned by its import and distribution center in Beijing.​
The amount of income Tesla earned by selling the credits has not been disclosed. But Chinese media reports indicate the company may reap roughly 2.5 billion yuan ($387 million). LMC Automotive, a British market intelligence firm, estimates that each credit was worth 3,000 yuan on average in 2020.​
Two of Volkswagen's joint ventures compiled the most negative credits. FAW-Volkswagen Automotive was slapped with 130,000 negative points, the most of all automakers, due to its sparse selection of new-energy vehicles.​
FAW-Volkswagen will need to purchase 400 million yuan worth of credits, according to some media reports. Some speculate that the company has already bought credits from Tesla.​
They both one part right....the carbon trading scheme. VW has stated they are going all electric post haste but it takes time and money. Especially money, lots of it for new designs, mew factories, new tooling, training employees and more. So this scheme penalizes a large firm that is going all in on electric hundreds of millions of dollars. Money that could be going to accelerate their conversion to electric.

Makes a lot of sense to take away hundreds of millions of dollars and delay the production of more electric vehicles.......only in the mind of a big government prog.