Wrestling LIVE THREAD: Penn State vs. Michigan State 1/21

[slushhead]

Dean is giving up size. Brucki is huge and was going to be a challenge early, but everyone knew his tank would go by the 3rd, which is why there was no sense of urgency for Max to get 2 in the last :30 of the 2nd period the other night. Staff and he knew he could ride out and get the TD in OT.

Caffey also has gas issues, but has the added advantage of length and extreme flexibility, which Brucki doesn’t. Even if gassed, Caffey could wear Dean down if the latter spent too much time trying to secure the legs. Add in the challenge of staying “on” mentally after the big Friday night showdown, and the ingredients were there for Dean to have a tough match.

 

[CSauertiegPSU]

Imagine Dean will be fine. Hard to get up for a dual against MSU after a big one Friday. We see it almost every year, and the odds Max entered the NCAA tournament undefeated was always a bit unlikely. If he wins Big Tens he’d still be the No. 2 seed

 

[psualt]

So the guy's in a cradle and no takedown either?

He had a takedown

 

[BruceK-PSU83]

Now the announcers who cried for stalling calls are asking the coaches to throw the brick so Caffey can catch his breath.

Yeah, I'm not sure what the coaches would even challenge. Make something up, I guess.

And as much as the MSU announcers were whining about stalling, they were notably silent when both Malczewski and Caffey were bellied out on the Resilite and doing nothing but sucking wind.

 

[diggerpup]

Go back and watch 174. Carter didn’t have NF. The beginning was cut off but he didn’t have exposure.

Agreed. Hit rewind & rewatch the sequence.
Carter had the cradle, but never got the exposure past 90 degrees.
Didn't matter in the long run.

 

[mcpat]

Agreed. Hit rewind & rewatch the sequence.
Carter had the cradle, but never got the exposure past 90 degrees.
Didn't matter in the long run.

Impossible. Because then a bunch of us would be wrong.

 

[nerfstate]

It’s official, Michigan State, Army, Oregon State, Rutgers, Indiana and Penn all did better against Penn State than Michigan did. Third ranked in the Country......Meh!

Duals are like that. Michigan is still top 3 in March, IMO. Just definitely not top 1. Also our team has upgraded since a lot of those duals.

 

[BruceK-PSU83]

Good learning match for Dean. Relying too much on rideout. No concern he beats the hell out of Caffey next time

Dean tried to get TDs, and had a couple good chances, but could not finish. As noted previously, Caffey is athletic and flexible, and is tough to take down without a really clean/crisp finish.

And I doubt Dean will "beat the hell out of Caffey" next time. I'll settle for a nice, controlled decision.

 

[Chickenman Testa]

Dean has been unimpressive so far. Maybe I just didnt pay enough attention to him in the past, but I’ve seen very little offense so far, and no offense vs upper caliber kids. For entertainment value alone, I’ll take a kid that loses trying to score points than someone who tries to win on ride time alone.

Didn’t even have to go to HR to read a ridiculous post today. Dean has been our closer all year - with lots of bonus plus other clutch wins. He lost to a tough guy 1 1/2 days after a good win in their biggest dual to date.

 

[Lovethissport]

It’s impossible to not have NF, right? I mean he was on his back for like 10 secs!!!!

Is Angel Rivera the ref again today?!

 

[BOSCO2]

He had a takedown

My bad. Edit: I just watched the replay and Carter wasn't awarded a TD until there was about 2:30 left in the period. He cradled him at about the 2:58 mark.

 

[Grass]

MSU has improved. It showed against Purdue and Rutgers earlier. They have a pretty good group of guys who compete. I started watching them closer when Willie Miklus became an assistant coach there. I'm happy for them to be improving and there isn't a nicer young man than Miklus.

They have come a long way.

 

[pish69]

Dean tried to get TDs, and had a couple good chances, but could not finish. As noted previously, Caffey is athletic and flexible, and is tough to take down without a really clean/crisp finish.

And I doubt Dean will "beat the hell out of Caffey" next time. I'll settle for a nice, controlled decision.

Beard “beat the hell out of Caffey” and I have no doubt if Max converts one or two of those early take downs, he rides him wears him out, turns him, etc.

 

[McScoreley]

Historically guys, Cael let's the team taper and peak for one big dual a year. A dual where we somehow look in March form for a day. Then it's back to full intensity for a bit.

It makes me wonder if we even trained through Michigan and are feeling the effects now. Let's not act like any dual but Iowa @ CHA is the one Cael would want to peak for.

 

[NittanyLion84]

Beard “beat the hell out of Caffey” and I have no doubt if Max converts one or two of those early take downs, he rides him wears him out, turns him, etc.

I think Beard’s problem is getting past Dean’s gas tank, during wrestle offs. Dean just appears to be a bad match up for Beard.

 

[okinburg1]

Keep in mind that AB beat Caffey 3-2 to win his first B1G title. Caffey, on his day, can go with anyone. Super flexible, funky guy.

This x 100. If Max gets him again I think he will adapt and have more success.

 

[CJFisJoePaII]

If you guys want an example of Max's ability to adjust, he lost 13-6 to Zavatsky in 2019 then beat him 9-0 later.

He lost to MyMar by 10 then 7 before he upset him.

Biggest dings on Max imho is that he isn't the most dynamic Neutral wrestler - his Neutral Offense is pretty bland coupled with good defensive skills but not bulletproof. Very difficult to control a match against elite opponents when you can't score from Neutral. Leads to a lot of low scoring matches in 3rd period.... you can't be relying on a riding-time point over and over.... it's going to catch up with you sooner or later, especially in a Tournament Format.

 

[Waxman1607]

Are we looking for someone in the portal to fill the whole we have at 197? Sarcasm

 

[McScoreley]

The guy Drew majored has never given up bonus. Drew is shaping up nicely and I expect him to continue to improve as he works with Cody, RBY and Gilman.

 

[nitlion6]

I thought it Friday night and was thinking it again now but Dean looked lethargic. Like he’s either sick or been training hard. Doesn’t matter cuz he lost but I think it’ll eventually turn into a good loss. One you build upon for a March run.

I bet we see a fully energized Max on Friday, and then maybe "I am not impressed with Dean" will feel appropriately silly.

 

[El-Jefe]

Didn’t even have to go to HR to read a ridiculous post today. Dean has been our closer all year - with lots of bonus plus other clutch wins. He lost to a tough guy 1 1/2 days after a good win in their biggest dual to date.

But we all knew that post was coming after Dean's first loss, right? Just a matter of who.

@CSauertiegPSU is right -- B10 champ Dean gets the 2 seed at nationals. Today didn't matter in the long run.

For reference, there are 2 unbeaten 197s left, and nobody's worried about Jay Aiello.

 

[NothingMeaningful]

Biggest dings on Max imho is that he isn't the most dynamic Neutral wrestler - his Neutral Offense is pretty bland coupled with good defensive skills but not bulletproof. Very difficult to control a match against elite opponents when you can't score from Neutral. Leads to a lot of low scoring matches in 3rd period.... you can't be relying on a riding-time point over and over.... it's going to catch up with you sooner or later, especially in a Tournament Format.

Just ask Drew Foster.

 

[dunkej01]

But we all knew that post was coming after Dean's first loss, right? Just a matter of who.

@CSauertiegPSU is right -- B10 champ Dean gets the 2 seed at nationals. Today didn't matter in the long run.

For reference, there are 2 unbeaten 197s left, and nobody's worried about Jay Aiello.

 

[CJFisJoePaII]

I bet we see a fully energized Max on Friday, and then maybe "I am not impressed with Dean" will feel appropriately silly.

I'm not terribly impressed with Warner's Neutral Offense and Warner is an atrocious 3rd Period wrestler, so I think Warner is a pretty good matchup for Max. I'm impressed with Max and think he's a great wrestler, but his "style" is not great for Tournaments where you have to win multiple consecutive matches against very good wrestlers to win either bracket.

 

[pointingdogsrule]

Keep in mind that AB beat Caffey 3-2 to win his first B1G title. Caffey, on his day, can go with anyone. Super flexible, funky guy.

Exactly!! When Dean had him down on the edge he was in a full split!! How he didn't pill a muscle is out of this world.

 

[nitlion6]

They have come a long way.

You can't be as bad as they were without trying really hard to be that bad.

 

[a_mshaffer]

But we all knew that post was coming after Dean's first loss, right? Just a matter of who.

@CSauertiegPSU is right -- B10 champ Dean gets the 2 seed at nationals. Today didn't matter in the long run.

For reference, there are 2 unbeaten 197s left, and nobody's worried about Jay Aiello.

I know I'm not getting down on Max. I hate to see the undersized statements but I think the bottom line is that there are a handful of 197 pounders that can all keep it close with each other - based on this seasons results. Not discounting Amos yet either. I still think 167 is going to be the most fun.

 

[CSauertiegPSU]

I'm not terribly impressed with Warner's Neutral Offense and Warner is an atrocious 3rd Period wrestler, so I think Warner is a pretty good matchup for Max. I'm impressed with Max and think he's a great wrestler, but his "style" is not great for Tournaments where you have to win multiple consecutive matches against very good wrestlers to win either bracket.

In what sense? He’s good in all three positions and has looked great almost all year?

 

[nitlion6]

I'm not terribly impressed with Warner's Neutral Offense and Warner is an atrocious 3rd Period wrestler, so I think Warner is a pretty good matchup for Max. I'm impressed with Max and think he's a great wrestler, but his "style" is not great for Tournaments where you have to win multiple consecutive matches against very good wrestlers to win either bracket.

Yet somehow in the two NCAAs he has wrestled he has AAed twice and managed to stumble his way into the finals once. Must be the blind dude acorn theory.

 

[creamery freak]

It’s official, Michigan State, Army, Oregon State, Rutgers, Indiana and Penn all did better against Penn State than Michigan did. Third ranked in the Country......Meh!

Michigan can always use the excuse ' we weren't trying ' .
Just a thought, would PSU have traveled to Michigan State Saturday and had a practice in their room yesterday? I almost believe they did and they looked a little spent today.

 

[McScoreley]

This board underrates Warner way too much. Probably because Iowa fans hyped him up as a potential 4 timer and the Reenan fiasco. He is not what he was hyped to be but he is indeed a very physically gifted and positionally sound wrestler who is a very safe bet to AA in March. We talk like he's going to bounce R16 because he wrestles some guys to 6-5 decisions that I do think Max would bonus. His style is boring as hell (and I bet he would tell you that even lol) and I'm fairly confident won't notch a single bonus point at NCAAs but for the most part, he is pretty matchup proof (part of it is because he plays so safe lol) whereas Max actually isn't.

Irrelevant to his wrestling, he seems like a pretty good kid also.

 

[NittanyChris]

This board underrates Warner way too much. Probably because Iowa fans hyped him up as a potential 4 timer and the Reenan fiasco. He is not what he was hyped to be but he is indeed a very physically gifted and positionally sound wrestler who is a very safe bet to AA in March. We talk like he's going to bounce R16 because he wrestles some guys to 6-5 decisions that I do think Max would bonus. His style is boring as hell (and I bet he would tell you that even lol) and I'm fairly confident won't notch a single bonus point at NCAAs but for the most part, he is pretty matchup proof (part of it is because he plays so safe lol) whereas Max actually isn't.

Irrelevant to his wrestling, he seems like a pretty good kid also.

Maybe I’m proving your point, but give me Dean all day over Warner this week.

 

[jmadden1998]

Maybe I’m proving your point, but give me Dean all day over Warner this week.

 

[CJFisJoePaII]

Yet somehow in the two NCAAs he has wrestled he has AAed twice and managed to stumble his way into the finals once. Must be the blind dude acorn theory.

Nope, he is an incredibly elite defensive wrestler in Neutral. Very good rider as well. He does have big-time gas-tank issues in close, physical matches. BTW, he was gifted a win in the Championship Bracket last year in one of the worst officiated matches I have ever seen.

He is basically Brown or Evan's without the gas-tank.

 

[BruceK-PSU83]

Yet somehow in the two NCAAs he has wrestled he has AAed twice and managed to stumble his way into the finals once. Must be the blind dude acorn theory.

Nope, he is an incredibly elite defensive wrestler in Neutral. Very good rider as well. He does have big-time gas-tank issues in close, physical matches. BTW, he was gifted a win in the Championship Bracket last year in one of the worst officiated matches I have ever seen.

He is basically Brown or Evan's without the gas-tank.

The first post above refers to Max Dean. But your response apparently refers to Jacob Warner (Dean wasn't in the NCAA tournament last season).

And Warner in no way reminds me of Matt Brown.

 

[The Kid Twist]

I bet we see a fully energized Max on Friday, and then maybe "I am not impressed with Dean" will feel appropriately silly.

I am looking for that bow and arrow splaying out that slug Warner!!!! Max will brutalize Warner next week! Warner already has one bad black eye. Max will give him the matching set!

 

[apoharrow]

Micic sitting again today.

 

[NittanyChris]

View embedded media

Let’s chat after 197 on Friday.

 

[CJFisJoePaII]

The first post above refers to Max Dean. But your response apparently refers to Jacob Warner (Dean wasn't in the NCAA tournament last season).

And Warner in no way reminds me of Matt Brown.

Max's Neutral Offense was much better against top 84 lbers than what we've seen against top 97 lbers. It really doesn't bother me in the least if you disagree. Warner does have elite Neutral Defense skills (albeit his Neutral Offense goes to zero when he puts the shields up). He doesn't have the gas tank to wrestle 1-point matches though.... I'll take Dean in another match that goes into 3rd very low scoring.

 

[RealMicah]