Is anyone here looking at purchasing an EV in 2023 or 2024?

Delco Lion

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I’m going to be buying an EV in 2023 or 2024 and I’m curious if others here can offer any tips on evolving technologies, batteries, buying in 2023 vs 2024, things to consider, “watch out fors“, thoughts on “higher end” models?
 

87 Penn St8

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In 2019 we visited a cousin in Seattle and my wife fell in love with her powder blue Fiat EV. We both have short commutes- me 2.5 miles and she 5 each way. EV is how we will go with the new incentives in your timetable.

We researched buying used but it seems too risky. Technology is developing so fast and most older cars seem to have some flaw which is not worth the saved money. Fiat doesn't even make the model my bride loved in the US anymore so parts would be harder to get and more $.

From what I've heard it's all about how you use and your mileage requirements. The battery charging speed is critical. Our son's roommate drove a 100% electric Tesla from the Bay Area to LA. Had to stop and do a 2 hour charge in the middle. Turned a 5 hour journey into a 7 hour trip. THAT would make me absolutely nuts! Plus finding a charger during a "must have it" time isn't always easy he says...places near an interstate are busy and often full. There are apps to reserve spots but I'm way to old to deal with that shit...

Our Rav4 is only a 2017 so it will be our road trip car until the electrics become more fully ingrained into the logistics services of longer travel. For us it will be a local vehicle only and we are in no hurry but excited to see the future!
 
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Obliviax

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I just bought a Jeep Wrangler 4xe. Love it so far.

Of the USA makers, the best of the lot seems to be the Mustang. For foreign makers, the Kia Hyundai ones seem to be getting good reviews. The VW one is soon to be made in Tennessee and the price is rumored to be coming down in the next year.

For a nicer car, I am looking at the Caddy Lyriq and the Genisys EV. I hear good things about Polestar.

You can pick up a Model 3 Tesla for $46k. That brings up AWD or RWD. I am told that the makers are frustrated that AWD is being desired but they feel RWD is fine. The issue is that FWD and AWD were desired in snow during winter. They feel the RWD, given the even weight distribution and computer control of slippage, is just as good. Better if the driver knows how to kick out the rear end to do a tokyo drift.

I do know of people who do not garage their cars in very cold areas, getting a major cut in battery efficiency. I was talking to a woman who bought an EV last fall with a 210 mile battery. During the polar vortex and -20 weather, her range dropped below 100 miles.
 

Achowalogan

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I’m going to be buying an EV in 2023 or 2024 and I’m curious if others here can offer any tips on evolving technologies, batteries, buying in 2023 vs 2024, things to consider, “watch out fors“, thoughts on “higher end” models?
If you wait a little longer, Biden will be giving them away free to anyone who has a car payment…
 

psulongago

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If you wait a little longer, Biden will be giving them away free to anyone who has a car payment…
No plans myself, did see an Australian Bank has plans for no new auto loans for gas or diesel cars. Wonder how I could have made the drive from FL to PHL in an EV. Guess you have to schedule fill ups and how long would that take?
 
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Obliviax

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No plans myself, did see an Australian Bank has plans for no new auto loans for gas or diesel cars. Wonder how I could have made the drive from FL to PHL in an EV. Guess you have to schedule fill ups and how long would that take?
There are superchargers along the way and several tools to track them. The newer EVs are publishing a 20-minute recharge time. So if you can go 300 miles and then recharge, a 20 minute break is not so bad.

Two caveats: My experience (not superchargers but level 2 chargers) were broken and didn't work at my hotel. I guess at $2 charge, when one breaks, they aren't in a hurry to fix it. Second, there have been reports of lines on peak travel seasons in certain high volume vacation spots. Also, in CA during rolling blackouts.
 

The Spin Meister

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An altered state
I’m going to be buying an EV in 2023 or 2024 and I’m curious if others here can offer any tips on evolving technologies, batteries, buying in 2023 vs 2024, things to consider, “watch out fors“, thoughts on “higher end” models?
Was considering one but then heard that Coach James Franklin drives one so changed my mind!
 

Wallace Breen

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We looked at a Nissan Leaf as a daily commuter for kids. Solid little car. We didn't end up buying one however. We are probably ten years out from an EV at this point unless something radical happens, like all the manufactures pull their heads out of their collective fourth points of contact and implement a fast charge standard and offer hot-swappable batteries to increase the functional range of the vehicle.
 

Obliviax

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Well they just offered $7k credits in this new bill passed but of course that means most EV makers have already raised their prices by $6k to $9k. Gotta love the government thinking they can pick winners and losers.
You better check the fine print on that
 

PSUPride1

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I’m going to be buying an EV in 2023 or 2024 and I’m curious if others here can offer any tips on evolving technologies, batteries, buying in 2023 vs 2024, things to consider, “watch out fors“, thoughts on “higher end” models?
No.
 
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Obliviax

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There are NO BEV's that will be eligible for the full 7000k credit in 2023 because the batteries will not comply with component sourcing requirements. All the BEV's assembled in the US will be eligible for half the credit.
Deb Stabenow, US Senator from MI said the bill was written by people who "do not understand the car industry or do but don't care". When I read what the requirements were, I thought the same thing. For example, you have income caps. We'll good luck buying a $60k car when you need a second car in case the grid is down a few days or you have to take a long trip. Good luck finding a used EV for less than $25,000. Good luck finding cars and batteries made in the USA.

I think the bill will be modified, quietly.

Secondly, I think there are a lot of people buying EVs to get the tax credit, drive it for six months and sell it with 4,000 miles or so. You guy the car for $60k, you sell it for $58k, and you pocket a $7500 tax credit. its kind of crazy.

 
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SLUPSU

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Deb Stabenow, US Senator from MI said the bill was written by people who "do not understand the car industry or do but don't care". When I read what the requirements were, I thought the same thing. For example, you have income caps. We'll good luck buying a $60k car when you need a second car in case the grid is down a few days or you have to take a long trip. Good luck finding a used EV for less than $25,000. Good luck finding cars and batteries made in the USA.

I think the bill will be modified, quietly.

Secondly, I think there are a lot of people buying EVs to get the tax credit, drive it for six months and sell it with 4,000 miles or so. You guy the car for $60k, you sell it for $58k, and you pocket a $7500 tax credit. its kind of crazy.

This is what Manchin wanted.
 
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Obliviax

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This is what Manchin wanted.
Could be...not sure why though. But the real issue, that nobody seems to want to talk about, what happens when we get to 40% + EVs? Where is the new electrical demand going to come from? What initiatives are going to yield that kind of electrical power in five to ten years? And this is a local problem meaning, WTF is going to happen in California? They already have rolling blackouts.
 
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ryoder1

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I’m going to be buying an EV in 2023 or 2024 and I’m curious if others here can offer any tips on evolving technologies, batteries, buying in 2023 vs 2024, things to consider, “watch out fors“, thoughts on “higher end” models?
James Franklin has 2 EVs so you better reconsider your strategy because as you well know and propagate every decision he makes is the wrong one. Plus he is so helplessly incompetent that you could not possibly do anything remotely close to what he did.
 

The Spin Meister

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Deb Stabenow, US Senator from MI said the bill was written by people who "do not understand the car industry or do but don't care". When I read what the requirements were, I thought the same thing. For example, you have income caps. We'll good luck buying a $60k car when you need a second car in case the grid is down a few days or you have to take a long trip. Good luck finding a used EV for less than $25,000. Good luck finding cars and batteries made in the USA.

I think the bill will be modified, quietly.

Secondly, I think there are a lot of people buying EVs to get the tax credit, drive it for six months and sell it with 4,000 miles or so. You guy the car for $60k, you sell it for $58k, and you pocket a $7500 tax credit. its kind of crazy.

i
They don’t know AND they don’t care. They saw a chance to ram something through that they can campaign on so they took it. That’s all that really matters.

And yes, they will quietly slide something through buried deep onto some other bill that is popular.
 

SLUPSU

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Could be...not sure why though. But the real issue, that nobody seems to want to talk about, what happens when we get to 40% + EVs? Where is the new electrical demand going to come from? What initiatives are going to yield that kind of electrical power in five to ten years? And this is a local problem meaning, WTF is going to happen in California? They already have rolling blackouts.
The electrical demand issue is just overblown scare tactics, we now have 40% +/- available capacity every night when charging is typically done.
 

Obliviax

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The electrical demand issue is just overblown scare tactics, we now have 40% +/- available capacity every night when charging is typically done.
LOL. Do you think the grid can just absorb the entire gas energy gap? Seriously?

Do you know both CA and TX have both had major issues in the last two years without 1% plus EVs?
 

SLUPSU

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LOL. Do you think the grid can just absorb the entire gas energy gap? Seriously?

Do you know both CA and TX have both had major issues in the last two years without 1% plus EVs?

Please, you're smarter than that. The nighttime capacity we have now will not handle 100% EV adoption, but I think we can make up the difference over the next 30 years or however long it takes to get there. By that time I think we'll have batteries that are much lighter, smaller, with 400+ miles of range that can be charged in 5 minutes. Stop being so short-sighted.

There isn't excess nighttime capacity available in TX or CA?? That's news to me.
 

Wallace Breen

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The electrical demand issue is just overblown scare tactics, we now have 40% +/- available capacity every night when charging is typically done.
No. Full stop. We do not have excess capacity in most places. Why? Our aging grid doesn't support it. In ten years, sure. But not now and not for the foreseeable future.
 

SLUPSU

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No. Full stop. We do not have excess capacity in most places. Why? Our aging grid doesn't support it. In ten years, sure. But not now and not for the foreseeable future.
We have excess available capacity after midnight, you know when everyone is sleeping, the lights are out, the AC's running much less, and when businesses and schools are closed. You don't really need to change behaviors as most charging occurs at night anyway. Period. Full Stop.
 

Wallace Breen

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We have excess available capacity after midnight, you know when everyone is sleeping, the lights are out, the AC's running much less, and when businesses and schools are closed. You don't really need to change behaviors as most charging occurs at night anyway. Period. Full Stop.
You do not know what you are talking about. What you are saying applies to some very specific places, but not most.
 

The Spin Meister

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We have excess available capacity after midnight, you know when everyone is sleeping, the lights are out, the AC's running much less, and when businesses and schools are closed. You don't really need to change behaviors as most charging occurs at night anyway. Period. Full Stop.
Xeptin EVs need ten to twelve hours to charge. And after about 6PM a solar power shuts down yet air conditioners are still running, including businesses. And wind usually slows or stops in the evening so wind power drops dramatically. Thank God for nuclear, nat gas, coal, and hydro.
 

BringBackStoneys

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I’m going to be buying an EV in 2023 or 2024 and I’m curious if others here can offer any tips on evolving technologies, batteries, buying in 2023 vs 2024, things to consider, “watch out fors“, thoughts on “higher end” models?
I have 2 EVs (2018 Tesla Model 3 and 2021 Tesla Model Y SUV) and haven’t bought gas (besides filling up a rental car on occasions) since 2020. Zero regrets. Tesla’s charging infrastructure and battery tech is still years ahead of the completion in my opinion.

If you get a BEV, you will want to install a Level 2 charger at home. It’s like having a gas pump at home that generates gas at $0.80/ gallon but only pumps about 2 gallons per hour. If you have any capacity to evolve your habits (e.g. plugging in overnight when needed) and relish the idea of giving zero sh!ts about the global price of oil or the local price of gas - you will love it.
 

84Lion

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The only way I'd buy an EV is if the only other choice was walking or using a bicycle. Unless and until EVs can be fully recharged in 15 minutes, they are useless to take on a long trip. And they are expensive. And I expect electricity costs to rise as more people plug these things in and the grid is pushed to the limit and beyond. It is going to cost big bucks to beef up the grid enough to handle all these EVs - and everyone will be paying for it. The whole idea of EVs is just utter insanity.
 

SLUPSU

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Xeptin EVs need ten to twelve hours to charge. And after about 6PM a solar power shuts down yet air conditioners are still running, including businesses. And wind usually slows or stops in the evening so wind power drops dramatically. Thank God for nuclear, nat gas, coal, and hydro.

Xeptin you'd be wrong, most people don't let their BEV's drain to zero before charging, so charging for 10-12 hours isn't the typical situation, in fact, most Teslas don't even take 10-12 hours for a full charge. Your typical BEV user will likely "top off" for a limited number of hours every night. Most Teslas take about one hour to go from 40% to 80% on a L2 charger. Keep dreaming up those skies are falling situations, I like your AC's are still running example, last I heard AC's don't run as much because the temps are 20 degrees cooler, or maybe a business, if they're smart, have higher set points at night.

Keep'em coming.
 

The Spin Meister

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Xeptin you'd be wrong, most people don't let their BEV's drain to zero before charging, so charging for 10-12 hours isn't the typical situation, in fact, most Teslas don't even take 10-12 hours for a full charge. Your typical BEV user will likely "top off" for a limited number of hours every night. Most Teslas take about one hour to go from 40% to 80% on a L2 charger. Keep dreaming up those skies are falling situations, I like your AC's are still running example, last I heard AC's don't run as much because the temps are 20 degrees cooler, or maybe a business, if they're smart, have higher set points at night.

Keep'em coming.
So people wait until midnight to plug them in? Or do they have timers to restrict charging times?

Temps don’t fall very quickly until late at night. Especially in concrete cities known as heat islands.
 

SLUPSU

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So people wait until midnight to plug them in? Or do they have timers to restrict charging times?

Temps don’t fall very quickly until late at night. Especially in concrete cities known as heat islands.
FFS.... The EV's give you the ability to set times to program a charging schedule.

Here's a pretty graphic to show you everything you need to see how wrong you are, pay attention to the yellow lines for July.

 

BringBackStoneys

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The only way I'd buy an EV is if the only other choice was walking or using a bicycle. Unless and until EVs can be fully recharged in 15 minutes, they are useless to take on a long trip. And they are expensive. And I expect electricity costs to rise as more people plug these things in and the grid is pushed to the limit and beyond. It is going to cost big bucks to beef up the grid enough to handle all these EVs - and everyone will be paying for it. The whole idea of EVs is just utter insanity.
To each his own. What you fail to consider is the 10-20 times you spend 5-15 minutes filling up at your local gas station, for each time you need to fill up on a long trip. Unless you are doing monthly cross-country trips, EV charging is a net time savings.

Regarding cost, EVs are not expensive if you understand cost of ownership.

And, lastly, it’s funny that you sit around wringing your hands about the grid, while the global oil market has been a war-inducing, geopolitical roller coaster for 50 years - but that is just no big deal to you.
 

The Spin Meister

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FFS.... The EV's give you the ability to set times to program a charging schedule.

Here's a pretty graphic to show you everything you need to see how wrong you are, pay attention to the yellow lines for July.

Every chart for every area in every season shows demand doesn’t drop significantly until 9-10 PM. And I do trust people to set timers. Either needs a serious late night discount or timing must be set remotely by either the RV manufacturer or the utilities.
 

Obliviax

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Please, you're smarter than that. The nighttime capacity we have now will not handle 100% EV adoption, but I think we can make up the difference over the next 30 years or however long it takes to get there. By that time I think we'll have batteries that are much lighter, smaller, with 400+ miles of range that can be charged in 5 minutes. Stop being so short-sighted.

There isn't excess nighttime capacity available in TX or CA?? That's news to me.
Riiiight. CA just passed a law requiring all new EVs for new car purchases by 2035. That’sa little over 10 years. Plus, you’ll have the nicest paperweight in your garage when there is a three day power outage
 

SLUPSU

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Every chart for every area in every season shows demand doesn’t drop significantly until 9-10 PM. And I do trust people to set timers. Either needs a serious late night discount or timing must be set remotely by either the RV manufacturer or the utilities.

So finally you're backing off your lack of nighttime excess capacity panic now?

Lots of utilities already provide incentives of lower costs for off-peak charging. My utility will be installing smart meters in my neighborhood in the next few months. I will have the ability to get off-peak rates that are significantly cheaper. My normal summertime rate is 13 cents per kwh, I can reduce that to 4.8 cents per kwh for off-peak usage.
When the EPA calculates eMPG I believe they use 13 cents as a national average, so EV owners using off-peak pricing where I live can reduce their costs by 63%!!!