Insight into Clifford

africamurphy

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Clifford was calm and controlled...basically, ever since the final drive against Purdue...Ohio and Auburn and first drive or two against CMU. But CMU pushed back a little and the "blowout" that everyone expected after a week of inflated hype. Clifford still was spot on though until...

the drops. Two perfectly passed balls were dropped. One by Harrison, I think, and one by Tinsley. Drives stalled and CMU scored and the blowout suddenly looked unlikely.

And then Cliff started pressing. His efficiency then plummeted. "Bad Cliff" came out for a good portion of the 2nd and 3rd quarters. High throws. Bad reads.

It's mental with him. Rather than "let the game come to him" he presses. Happy feet. Flustered in the pocket. He gets nervous.

The drops were NOT his fault. He was doing EXACTLY what he needed to do, but he let the receivers failures influence his mindset and it cost the team.
 

tckpsu58

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He definitely got exposed by CMU. He got hit hard a couple of times and CMU defense took away the underneath stuff and short passing game. Penn State did not have a very successful and consistent day running the ball. Sean can be a super QB without any pressure/adverse situations but as soon as that happens he is just not very good. He should be running the ball more but I am guessing the staff doesn't want him to...If CMU defense can cause him to struggle Penn State will go on a three game losing streak starting the 15th...
 
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Gitzit

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I think he has played good this year. He doesn't have Tom Brady accuracy, and does get happy feet, but his experience is making a difference this year. Clifford getting the OL lined up properly could be one reason they are playing better also.
During the Auburn game ,Clifford started getting happy feet when he knew he was holding the ball too long and just before he got swarmed under he threw it to i think Tinsley crossing in front of him. You could tell he didn't see him, or if he did, it wasn't more than a flash ,but knew he should be there through experience.
I will be shocked if his game declines like last year unless he get's injured. But all QB have good games and bad.
 

Gitzit

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He didn't have the good running game against CMU, as he has had against the other teams, HUGE difference!
 

jimarnp

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Clifford was calm and controlled...basically, ever since the final drive against Purdue...Ohio and Auburn and first drive or two against CMU. But CMU pushed back a little and the "blowout" that everyone expected after a week of inflated hype. Clifford still was spot on though until...

the drops. Two perfectly passed balls were dropped. One by Harrison, I think, and one by Tinsley. Drives stalled and CMU scored and the blowout suddenly looked unlikely.

And then Cliff started pressing. His efficiency then plummeted. "Bad Cliff" came out for a good portion of the 2nd and 3rd quarters. High throws. Bad reads.

It's mental with him. Rather than "let the game come to him" he presses. Happy feet. Flustered in the pocket. He gets nervous.

The drops were NOT his fault. He was doing EXACTLY what he needed to do, but he let the receivers failures influence his mindset and it cost the team.
Agree. Clifford is a smart, good to very good quarterback , and a reasonably good athlete. If his surrounding cast are doing their jobs, his game management/decision making and overall ceiling is high. If his supporting cast is playing “out of sync” , Clifford’s incidence of errors increase markedly. He seems to want to try to “carry” the team by himself, and subsequently forces things which increase errors. There are very few QB’s that can “carry” team for extended periods simply with their athletic ability….and Clifford’s not one. That’s not a knock on him... He shouldn’t have to. —He’s got the keys to a high performance sports car . All he should have to do is drive it…and he does that very well when the skill players and OL are hitting on all cylinders . — There is much youth here, and they are making slow, steady progress toward high level consistency. Hopefully by Michigan, they’ll reach their potential, and will be a consistent high level force
 

bourbon n blues

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He definitely got exposed by CMU. He got hit hard a couple of times and CMU defense took away the underneath stuff and short passing game. Penn State did not have a very successful and consistent day running the ball. Sean can be a super QB without any pressure/adverse situations but as soon as that happens he is just not very good. He should be running the ball more but I am guessing the staff doesn't want him to...If CMU defense can cause him to struggle Penn State will go on a three game losing streak starting the 15th...
Exposed ? Isn’t it his sixth year, I think opposing teams have an idea of Clifford’s strengths and weaknesses by now.
 

Obliviax

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I posted, pre-game, that PSU's inability to complete long passes was a glaring weakness. What did CMU do? They packed the LOS and dared PSU to throw long. We couldn't do it. There were several runs that were very close to being broken for long gainers but, again, our deep passing game was ineffective.

Having said that, the problem wasn't the O, it was the D & ST. We gave up 363 Total yards (4.7 yards per play) and (again) had a couple of 2nd or 3rd and longs that we gave up. We did get 4 turnovers, though. Not sure if those are us or were self-inflicted.

We should have had at least another five points since we missed an easy FG and an extra point (causing us to go for two and fail). That would have made the score 38 - 14 and much more comfortable.
 
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00southpaw

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He definitely got exposed by CMU. He got hit hard a couple of times and CMU defense took away the underneath stuff and short passing game. Penn State did not have a very successful and consistent day running the ball. Sean can be a super QB without any pressure/adverse situations but as soon as that happens he is just not very good. He should be running the ball more but I am guessing the staff doesn't want him to...If CMU defense can cause him to struggle Penn State will go on a three game losing streak starting the 15th...
So you're saying a QB who's receivers dropped balls, was getting pressured, had no running game or check downs actually struggled a bit? Interesting.
 

scrivener

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I posted, pre-game, that PSU's inability to complete long passes was a glaring weakness. What did CMU do? They packed the LOS and dared PSU to throw long. We couldn't do it. There were several runs that were very close to being broken for long gainers but, again, our deep passing game was ineffective.

Having said that, the problem wasn't the O, it was the D & ST. We gave up 363 Total yards (4.7 yards per play) and (again) had a couple of 2nd or 3rd and longs that we gave up. We did get 4 turnovers, though. Not sure if those are us or were self-inflicted.

We should have had at least another five points since we missed an easy FG and an extra point (causing us to go for two and fail). That would have made the score 38 - 14 and much more comfortable.
Good first paragraph which not many have talked about...our deep passing game is pretty much null. I can't remember so far in this early season a true deep ball on a go route that we have connected on. Sure we've had crossing routes and dump-off's go for long gains, especially to Brenton, but without Dotson, we just don't seem to have the downfield speed. Once the schedule heats up, our inability to stretch the field will surely be tested...not having that requires extreme efficiency on first downs (not getting stuffed on runs) which has been commonplace under JF, and Sean can't have quarters worth of struggles or that Michigan game in particular could get ugly. The offense got a gift TD on that fumbled punt -- take that away and it was a lackluster 26 pts vs CMU. Really wasn't a great day for any facet of the offense.
As to your point about the defense, in Manny's style, they will give up 3rd and longs unfortunately, but if the turnover rate continues, I'll take it.
I think at the end of the day, the Michigan game will show the true litmus test for all involved, the OL, DL, etc. They will be the best team we face at that point, defending B1G champs, and a physical mentality that can run the ball at will. If we pass that test, then things are looking way up. Sans the covid year, I believe JF is 0-3 at the big house....that needs to change and soon.
 

Obliviax

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Good first paragraph which not many have talked about...our deep passing game is pretty much null. I can't remember so far in this early season a true deep ball on a go route that we have connected on. Sure we've had crossing routes and dump-off's go for long gains, especially to Brenton, but without Dotson, we just don't seem to have the downfield speed. Once the schedule heats up, our inability to stretch the field will surely be tested...not having that requires extreme efficiency on first downs (not getting stuffed on runs) which has been commonplace under JF, and Sean can't have quarters worth of struggles or that Michigan game in particular could get ugly. The offense got a gift TD on that fumbled punt -- take that away and it was a lackluster 26 pts vs CMU. Really wasn't a great day for any facet of the offense.
As to your point about the defense, in Manny's style, they will give up 3rd and longs unfortunately, but if the turnover rate continues, I'll take it.
I think at the end of the day, the Michigan game will show the true litmus test for all involved, the OL, DL, etc. They will be the best team we face at that point, defending B1G champs, and a physical mentality that can run the ball at will. If we pass that test, then things are looking way up. Sans the covid year, I believe JF is 0-3 at the big house....that needs to change and soon.
I think that is exactly what CJF was talking about in his post-game regarding cover zero. He's going to put a lot of time into that this week as NW will surely do the same thing.
 

CJFisJoePaII

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He definitely got exposed by CMU. He got hit hard a couple of times and CMU defense took away the underneath stuff and short passing game. Penn State did not have a very successful and consistent day running the ball. Sean can be a super QB without any pressure/adverse situations but as soon as that happens he is just not very good. He should be running the ball more but I am guessing the staff doesn't want him to...If CMU defense can cause him to struggle Penn State will go on a three game losing streak starting the 15th...

Disagree regarding running game. Running game was quite consistent in 2nd Half and the reason we were never in danger of losing the game (consistent running coupled with the defense pitching a shutout in the 2nd Half). The RBs went 153 yards on 25 carries, 6.12 YPC (Allen had 13 carries for 111 yards and Singleton had 12 carries for 42 yards).

Our offense seems to go as Cliff goes... and Cliff is very streaky, so the offense wasn't super consistent, but did move the ball okay (we ended up with 403 yards of Offense - not awesome, but not utterly putrid either. ).
 
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scrivener

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I think that is exactly what CJF was talking about in his post-game regarding cover zero. He's going to put a lot of time into that this week as NW will surely do the same thing.
For sure...and I do think our WR corps is very solid...Tinsley and PW are reliable. It's unfortunate that nobody has really grabbed hold of that third spot. KLS, who at times shows the ability, has had a very slow start to the year with drops. Meiga (who was hyped in the preseason) has barely played. Hopefully Evans and/or Wallace can emerge and soon.
 
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Online Persona

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Wonder if we aren't running cliff because we didn't need to yet (he did run some against Purdue and Auburn early) or because he took that huge shot against Auburn right away when running. If you don't need that in the offense against Ohio or CMU to get it done, why do it?
 

palmettolion

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He definitely got exposed by CMU. He got hit hard a couple of times and CMU defense took away the underneath stuff and short passing game.

There were 3 plays in the 2nd quarter where he had a man open in the flat and nobody within 15-20 yards. He never even looked, just chucked it deep to a double covered wide receiver. Incomplete all 3 times.
 

SR108

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I posted, pre-game, that PSU's inability to complete long passes was a glaring weakness. What did CMU do? They packed the LOS and dared PSU to throw long. We couldn't do it. There were several runs that were very close to being broken for long gainers but, again, our deep passing game was ineffective.

Having said that, the problem wasn't the O, it was the D & ST. We gave up 363 Total yards (4.7 yards per play) and (again) had a couple of 2nd or 3rd and longs that we gave up. We did get 4 turnovers, though. Not sure if those are us or were self-inflicted.

We should have had at least another five points since we missed an easy FG and an extra point (causing us to go for two and fail). That would have made the score 38 - 14 and much more comfortable.
We are what we are at this point, high risk, high reward defense (at times), and a streaky inconsistent offense. (With some play makers)

The goal should be more consistency on both sides of the ball. I am encouraged by the improved running game, something we have been lacking.
 

jimarnp

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I think that is exactly what CJF was talking about in his post-game regarding cover zero. He's going to put a lot of time into that this week as NW will surely do the same thing.
Exactly. Cover zero should have this team salivating. It is a massive opportunity for the many very good to excellent athletes on this team.If the defense brings up both safeties to play run, the DB’s are on an island with man to man coverage. With the athletes on this team, the WR’s should be getting quick inside position off the ball , and Clifford should be able to exploit this more times than not. This is a big play waiting to happen —The WR’s are good, but they need to get better….and they can. Their ceiling is high, but they need to develop a little more quickly, to provide consistency. A couple of the speedy freshmen need to evolve enough to “take off the top” of the defense. When this finally happens, the entire offense becomes very dangerous. Every run and every pass are then “in play”. If the defense overloads against one, the other will be exploited. — We’re getting there slowly, and I too believe Franklin will be pushing hard for the exploitation of cover zero in practice this week. —Once this happens, our games with the Michigan’s and the OSU’s become “toss ups” , at worst
 

GregInPitt

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For sure...and I do think our WR corps is very solid...Tinsley and PW are reliable. It's unfortunate that nobody has really grabbed hold of that third spot. KLS, who at times shows the ability, has had a very slow start to the year with drops. Meiga (who was hyped in the preseason) has barely played. Hopefully Evans and/or Wallace can emerge and soon.
I was high on KLS grabbing hold of the 3rd WR spot the first couple of games. But his lack of physicality and toughness has shown up regularly with his inability to block effectively and hold onto the ball. He doesn't seem to make many contested catches either, but he does have the burst needed for turning short routes into long gains. Wallace has also had some drops and who knows what's going on with Meiga. At this point maybe Saunders or Clifford will make a few more catches and be given a chance at the 3rd starting spot, but with all of th Spring and Fall practices gone by it's sad that with all the WR's on the roster that a 3rd WR hasn't stepped up. And now after a third of the season has gone by it seems that the WR group may just limp along through the rest of the season. :(
 
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scrivener

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I was high on KLS grabbing hold of the 3rd WR spot the first couple of games. But his lack of physicality and toughness has shown up regularly with his inability to block effectively and hold onto the ball. He doesn't seem to make many contested catches either, but he does have the burst needed for turning short routes into long gains. Wallace has also had some drops and who knows what's going on with Meiga. At this point maybe Saunders or Clifford will make a few more catches and be given a chance at the 3rd starting spot, but with all of th Spring and Fall practices gone by it's sad that with all the WR's on the roster that a 3rd WR hasn't stepped up. And now after a third of the season has gone by it seems that the WR group may just limp along through the rest of the season. :(
Good points...I mean really finding 3rd and 4th WR's that can contribute fairly consistently is kind of the norm now...and I don't think we have even a third. But, the TE room is an extension of that and can make up for it at times. I feel the same way at RT and with the struggles of the OL heading into this season. But, especially at RT, it seems like we have recruited so many guys at that position and yet, CW is the starter to come out of that group with Effner getting the other reps...jeez...not the best scenario. It's all we got, so hopefully they make progress
 
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SR108

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I was high on KLS grabbing hold of the 3rd WR spot the first couple of games. But his lack of physicality and toughness has shown up regularly with his inability to block effectively and hold onto the ball. He doesn't seem to make many contested catches either, but he does have the burst needed for turning short routes into long gains. Wallace has also had some drops and who knows what's going on with Meiga. At this point maybe Saunders or Clifford will make a few more catches and be given a chance at the 3rd starting spot, but with all of th Spring and Fall practices gone by it's sad that with all the WR's on the roster that a 3rd WR hasn't stepped up. And now after a third of the season has gone by it seems that the WR group may just limp along through the rest of the season. :(
KLS has the tools, he needs to step it up and give Clifford confidence to look for him.
 
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GregInPitt

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Good points...I mean really finding 3rd and 4th WR's that can contribute fairly consistently is kind of the norm now...and I don't think we have even a third. But, the TE room is an extension of that and can make up for it at times. I feel the same way at RT and with the struggles of the OL heading into this season. But, especially at RT, it seems like we have recruited so many guys at that position and yet, CW is the starter to come out of that group with Effner getting the other reps...jeez...not the best scenario. It's all we got, so hopefully they make progress
Sometimes it seems that Franklin's personnel stratege is "hope", and responding with the word "hope" where I finished my career would be responded to with "hope is not a business strategy...".

I'm more disappointed in RT than WR, as at least there are a good many WR's that are getting a good many game reps and are getting a chance to produce/impress.

At RT Wallace has had had what seems like 2+ years long try out in the games and he has consistently come up short. The staff must feel that Effner has limitations as well, likely mainly in run blocking. I was "hoping" that Drew Shelton would get moved to RT to get reps there with the possibility of him being the starter by mid-season. Shelton has reportedly impressed the staff and if he got 50% of the snaps and proved capable at least he still has the potential to get better and end up as an above average RT, versus Wallace and Effner who seem to have peaked at mediocrity or less.....
 
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GregInPitt

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KLS has the tools, he needs to step it up and give Clifford confidence to look for him.
Yep, he has the speed and insticts with the ball in his hands, i.e. if he catches it. But as a 3rd year player he doesn't seem to have made the progress in the S&C program that he possibly could have. It would seem that if he had anothr 15-20 lbs of muscle some of his performance issues would be solved.
 

scrivener

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Sometimes it seems that Franklin's personnel stratege is "hope", and responding with the word "hope" where I finished my career would be responded to with "hope is not a business strategy...".

I'm more disappointed in RT than WR, as at least there are a good many WR's that are getting a good many game reps and are getting a chance to produce/impress.

At RT Wallace has had had what seems like a years long try out in the games and he has consistently come up short. The staff must feel that Effner has limitations as well, likely mainly in run blocking. I was "hoping" that Drew Shelton would get moved to RT to get reps there with the possibility of him being the starter by mid-season. Shelton has reportedly impressed the staff and if he got 50% of the snaps and proved capable at least he still has the potential to get better and end up as an above average RT, versus Wallace and Effner who seem to have peaked at mediocrity or less.....
Absolutely...unless there is a seismic, in-season jump, we know what CW is...mediocre and hope he doesn't get Cliff and/or the RB's destroyed. Whether it be Dawkins, Traore, Christ, etc., it's hard to believe as you point out that none of those are capable of getting 50% or heck even 25% of snaps in games, just to see what they have. JF has done a very good job this year compared to the past of mixing guys in and out, and trying to build depth at certain positions. I get it's a little harder to do on the OL b/c of timing and comfortability with the QB, but the RT spot is pretty darn important when you start facing B1G competition...like Michigan for example which probably won't even need to load up on that side.
 

Fayette_LION

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Clifford was calm and controlled...basically, ever since the final drive against Purdue...Ohio and Auburn and first drive or two against CMU. But CMU pushed back a little and the "blowout" that everyone expected after a week of inflated hype. Clifford still was spot on though until...

the drops. Two perfectly passed balls were dropped. One by Harrison, I think, and one by Tinsley. Drives stalled and CMU scored and the blowout suddenly looked unlikely.

And then Cliff started pressing. His efficiency then plummeted. "Bad Cliff" came out for a good portion of the 2nd and 3rd quarters. High throws. Bad reads.

It's mental with him. Rather than "let the game come to him" he presses. Happy feet. Flustered in the pocket. He gets nervous.

The drops were NOT his fault. He was doing EXACTLY what he needed to do, but he let the receivers failures influence his mindset and it cost the team.
It makes on hell of a difference when you receivers catch any and everything thrown close to them. See Ahia State!
 
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BudatPSU

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If they would drag out a wide block of cement each play at least that would make the defensive lineman have to go around it to get in the backfield.
 

PSU2UNC

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Clifford was calm and controlled...basically, ever since the final drive against Purdue...Ohio and Auburn and first drive or two against CMU. But CMU pushed back a little and the "blowout" that everyone expected after a week of inflated hype. Clifford still was spot on though until...

the drops. Two perfectly passed balls were dropped. One by Harrison, I think, and one by Tinsley. Drives stalled and CMU scored and the blowout suddenly looked unlikely.

And then Cliff started pressing. His efficiency then plummeted. "Bad Cliff" came out for a good portion of the 2nd and 3rd quarters. High throws. Bad reads.

It's mental with him. Rather than "let the game come to him" he presses. Happy feet. Flustered in the pocket. He gets nervous.

The drops were NOT his fault. He was doing EXACTLY what he needed to do, but he let the receivers failures influence his mindset and it cost the team.
Clifford does have consistency issues, but even Clifford at his "one standard deviation below the mean" level is still pretty decent. What I think is frustrating to fans is that we have seen him play at an elite level in big games (see: both Auburn games, first half against Iowa, etc). He is not consistently elite, but few QBs are.

If his inconsistency does not result in turnovers (with the one glaring Purdue exception so far this has been this case this year), I think PSU's defense is good enough to win most games if PSU score 30+ (which they should with a decent RB and a decent Clifford).
 

m.knox

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Clifford was calm and controlled...basically, ever since the final drive against Purdue...Ohio and Auburn and first drive or two against CMU. But CMU pushed back a little and the "blowout" that everyone expected after a week of inflated hype. Clifford still was spot on though until...

the drops. Two perfectly passed balls were dropped. One by Harrison, I think, and one by Tinsley. Drives stalled and CMU scored and the blowout suddenly looked unlikely.

And then Cliff started pressing. His efficiency then plummeted. "Bad Cliff" came out for a good portion of the 2nd and 3rd quarters. High throws. Bad reads.

It's mental with him. Rather than "let the game come to him" he presses. Happy feet. Flustered in the pocket. He gets nervous.

The drops were NOT his fault. He was doing EXACTLY what he needed to do, but he let the receivers failures influence his mindset and it cost the team.

He took a nasty hit too. That seemed to be at the inflection point as well. But yeah, it all seemed to break the mojo.
 
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Crusher1950

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The guy is 25 years old playing against mostly 19 to 21 year olds players he shouldn’t get the monkies during the game Allar should be getting more time
 
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