That’s where i think that it will put the Giants in the quandary of taking Darnold at 2 and passing on Barkley. I know we think it’s crazy but they can let him sit behind Eli for a year then take over in 2019.
IMO Darnold is not a pro QB
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That’s where i think that it will put the Giants in the quandary of taking Darnold at 2 and passing on Barkley. I know we think it’s crazy but they can let him sit behind Eli for a year then take over in 2019.
If they are going for Allen, why not take Barkley 1st and Allen 4th. I don't see the Giants or the Jets or, anyone for that matter, taking Allen 2nd or 3rd.
You beat me too it. Here are the QBs from 2012 and their draft position-
Round 1-
1. Andrew Luck. (Indy)
2. Robert Griffin (Washington)
8. Ryan Tannehill. (Miami)
22. Branden Weeden (Cleveland)
Round 2-
57. Brock Osweiler (Denver)
Round 3-
75. Russel Wilson. (Seattle)
88. Nick Foles. (Philadelphia)
Round 4-
102. Kirk Cousins. (Washington)
It’s always a gamble trying to evaluate QBs. Plus much of it depends on where a player gets drafted and their team’s supporting cast. You pick the best QB but put him on a team with a poor O line, no running game and average receivers and he’s not going to look like the #1 pick (and why I hope Barkley stays out of Cleveland).
while all of what you say is true, Namath is in the HOF for beating the Colts. If you look at his 50% career comp %, a 65 passer rating and many more INT's than TD's (173 to 220), you have to conclude Joe was an average QB at best, who played a great game. with Matt Snell running the ball down their throats.
TOTAL 1,886 3,762 50.1 27,663 7.4 173 220 150 1,425 65.5 71 140 2.0 7 0 0
Namath is in the HOF because he deserved to be in the HOF. I watched him play nearly every game. And if he had 2 good knees I've little doubt he would have re-written the record book. Statistics do not tell the story with Namath. The man was a supremely talented passer.
I think that quote is perfect. And Dorsey taking Mahomes is exactly why I think they take Allen. I still think they should take Barkley or Chubb at 1 (whichever they prefer) and then take Allen, Mayfield or Darnold at 4 since apparently all 3 of them are being considered with the top pick.
i totally agree with all of that. Having said that, you've got a TON of NFL teams that have invested in young QB's right now. So they are playing, but don't know if they will eventually pan out. Here is a list of first rounders since 2010.
- Trubisky
- Mahomes
- Watson
- Goff
- Wentz
- Lynch
- Winston
- Mariota
- Bortles
- Maziel
- Bridgewater
- Manaul
- Luck
- RG3
- Tannehill
- Weeden
- Newton
- Locker
- Gabbert
- Ponder
- Bradford
- Tebow
Yes, great QBs usually go in in the draft and 6 likely go this year BUT how many of those QBs don't work out. There's a difference between taking guys like Eli, Rivers and Ben in 2004 in the top 10 and reaching for guys like Mayfield or even Rosen. Darnold's the only top 5 pick IMO and that's even borderline. Missing on a QB is just as bad as not taking one. Cleveland can't mess this up. I think their best decision would be Barkley & Chubb if both are available then take a QB in the second round but we may see something that sets a new standard for stupid. Multiple rumors about Cleveland taking "2 QBs with early picks"...think Washington with RG3 and Cousins though that worked out well
Agree, but they are going to get Barkley or Chubb at #4 even if taking a QB at #1. So the reverse logic holds true as well: Take the QB you most like, because your job depends on that, then take Barkley or Chubb because the Bills will take a QB at #3 and that will certainly leave one of the two, if not both, available at #4.
hey, what if they draft Chubb at #4, then Chubb (the RB from GA) later? Would that mean that the Browns got Chubby?
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I don't think it would be crazy. I just can't imagine NYG passing on Saquon. If they do he might actually fall to 7 and Detroit better be on the phone with Denver and Indianapolis trying to move up
I thought Roethlisberger was 14th, but you are correct at 11th. Still, outside the top 10
.That said pointing out that 20 of the 32 projected starting QBs were first rounders is not really the point. How many of those guys do you build a team around? That is what you expect if you are taking a QB at the top of the draft. Again, if you are a GM and you see that guy in this draft take him immediately. But if you don’t, you run a good chance of wasting a top pick and missing out on some elite talent while idling your franchise for some time.
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I have to agree. Namath gets my vote as one of the most over rated QB's of all time.
Watch that video I posted and you tell me how many guys that you've seen can make the throws he made in that game. Namath was a great passer and a gutty performer who played hurt and often on not the best teams. And he did win Super Bowl III when no one gave him a chance in hell. You and sluggo shouldn't blow that off. It was a MAJOR accomplishment. And again, did I mention he was a great passer? He was.
I thought Roethlisberger was 14th, but you are correct at 11th. Still, outside the top 10
That said pointing out that 20 of the 32 projected starting QBs were first rounders is not really the point. How many of those guys do you build a team around? That is what you expect if you are taking a QB at the top of the draft. Again, if you are a GM and you see that guy in this draft take him immediately. But if you don’t, you run a good chance of wasting a top pick and missing out on some elite talent while idling your franchise for some time.
But as you know QBs are such a vital position in the NFL, that they are always going to go higher than their grade. Just because the GMs have to take that chance on the kid they like in the first round.
The fact is that first rounders at any position is maybe only a 50% chance of actually being a good player. We tend to remember the QB busts more than the OL or DL or Safety bust.
But the GMs just feel if they are drafting so high in the first round they got the chance to take “their guy” without just hoping that they fall to them.
None of these QBs coming out are franchise type players. Allen, Darnold, Rosen listed as the best available player regardless of position may be in the middle to the end of the first round.
I did watch it and you are absolutely right those were some amazing passes he made that day. Agree that he was a gutty performer, especially the performer part, and played hurt. I'm not blowing that game off I guess I'm taking into account some of his others. Sorry its JMO, he was over rated. But then I also think Eli is over rated.¯\_(ツ)_/¯
You do realize that to be over rated means LOTS of people wouldn't think so. Perhaps you are under rating him.
In my quick poll of 3 I found that 2 of us believe he's over rated.
Edit I polled a 4th person and he said this...
>>I think that Joe Namath’s name is actually bigger than his actual accomplishments. Ok, so he led the underdog New York Jets to a Super Bowl victory upset against the Baltimore Colts in 1969, but in all honesty, the defense won that game for the Jets. The score was 16-7 and Namath didn’t have a single passing touchdown. With a retired Jets number and Hall of Fame credit we think, Joe may have won the NFL popularity contest. He has a career win-loss record of 62-63, led the league in interceptions on four occasions, and completed just 50.1% of his passes. Despite having just a 65.5 QB rating and throwing 220 interceptions to his 173 touchdowns. Regardless, we could understand why he is a New York Jets legend. I will give you this, I believe without his knee injury at Alabam, he may have went down as a top 5 all-time QB, sadly we will never know.<<
and this...
https://www.12up.com/posts/4835563-5-most-overrated-quarterbacks-of-all-time
Seems like all of the lists of overrated QB's have 1 thing in common....Namath is in the top 3
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it looks to me more like Rick Volk cant tackle!! That said, we different on Joe as far as being a great QB or even a good QB, yes he could throw the ball, but too often it went to the other team!! You can't be considered an elite QB with more INT's than TD passes, and that was the original posters point, that SB are won with elite QB's.
JMO but I think Super Bowls are won with "elite" teams. Not necessarily the QB. I can think of some past Superbowls that were won by what many would call mediocre to good QB's. Joe Flacco, Brad Johnson and Trent Dilfer are the first that come to mind. In Flacco's and Dilfers case it was an ELITE defense that won those Super Bowls.
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Right now, no he's not an NFL QB. After Thursday night he will be though.
won(one) I agree. Football is the ultimate team sport. The team with the best players doesnt always win, the team that plays the best wins!! This is why it is such a great game!
Mark Sanchez looked great also against us in the 2009 Rose Bowl, but was also a bust for a QB taken that high.
My sentiments exactly; none of these QB's are overwhelming. Take the best offensive player in the draft-Barkley and the best defensive player in the draft-Chubb and live with Tyrod Taylor for a year.
To say Darnold "isn't a pro QB" though is just ridiculous. He's absolutely the prototypical NFL QB. Whether he can put it all together and have success at a high level is another question. Baker Mayfield may not be a pro QB. Lamar Jackson may not be a pro QB. Darnold is--the question is honestly "how good of one"
I think you're underestimating Allen's stock. Though it does sound like the Jets won't take him. Just comes down to if NYG trades out of that spot if Barkley is gone and they don't want a QB/Chubb. For all we know NYG wants Allen not Darnold/Rosen/Barkley/Chubb. Allen's the #2 QB IMO
Thanks for posting that game, Howie. Joe Willie definitely deserves to be in the Hall of Fame. The game was different back then, and Joe was ahead of his time.
And the defensive line coach, one James David Buddy Ryan.In my quick poll of 3 I found that 2 of us believe he's over rated.
Edit I polled a 4th person and he said this...
>>I think that Joe Namath’s name is actually bigger than his actual accomplishments. Ok, so he led the underdog New York Jets to a Super Bowl victory upset against the Baltimore Colts in 1969, but in all honesty, the defense won that game for the Jets. The score was 16-7 and Namath didn’t have a single passing touchdown. With a retired Jets number and Hall of Fame credit we think, Joe may have won the NFL popularity contest. He has a career win-loss record of 62-63, led the league in interceptions on four occasions, and completed just 50.1% of his passes. Despite having just a 65.5 QB rating and throwing 220 interceptions to his 173 touchdowns. Regardless, we could understand why he is a New York Jets legend. I will give you this, I believe without his knee injury at Alabam, he may have went down as a top 5 all-time QB, sadly we will never know.<<
and this...
https://www.12up.com/posts/4835563-5-most-overrated-quarterbacks-of-all-time
Seems like all of the lists of overrated QB's have 1 thing in common....Namath is in the top 3
era smara, you can't have career losing record, more int than td's and a 50% completion avg and be a great QB, in any era, imo. He did play well at times, and others?? Well...
from someone else....
The problem is this: Namath won Super Bowl III when he was 25 years old. He’d play nine more seasons, three riddled by injuries, and win more than five games in a season just twice. After the 1969 campaign, the year after winning the Super Bowl, Namath never finished a season with more touchdowns than interceptions. He lost more games than he won, retiring in 1977 with a career record of 62-63-4.
Terry Bradshaw is a career 51% passer and has like 212 TD’s to 210 interceptions. He played with arguably the greatest D in NFL history for 8-10 years and very good offensive weapons.
Still confused about what this has to do with Darnold but Bradshaw's numbers are better and winning, for a QB, matters even with an elite defense.
It was in comparison to Namath duh. Bradshaw had similar stats, but played with like a dozen hall of famers. How do you not understand?
Because winning matters...there's no comparison between Namath and Bradshaw. I think Bradshaw is someone overrated but it's a joke to compare them
LOL at comparing Darnold to Namath...that's one of the dumbest things ever done.
Did not make it, had things I had to get done. Taped it and watched it a few times.
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