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I am Concerned

manmythlegend1

Well-Known Member
Jan 5, 2014
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I know this topic has come up before, and many have said it will work out fine (I tend to agree as I am sure Cael has a plan) but I have to admit that I am officially starting to worry about 125 and 133 after this season. I was really hoping for a Verbal commit by now From Suriano or Redd. What concerns me is that some wrestlers are gonna want a Redshirt, not all wrestlers are like Nico and Retherford. This may be why these two would choose another school?? We are gonna have a serious hole if we lose out on some of these top kids in the next class because only a few of them are ready to have an impact as a True Freshman in my opinion. A hole that could really cost the team as the Three N's come into their own.

Question, Assuming Guilibon goes to 141 and stays there-- Seriously, who would be starting 125,133 if a True Freshman is not given the Job??
 
You do realize, I presume, we basically had this same discussion 9 days ago. Heck, you even posted in that thread.

I don't think any of us have learned anything new in the last 9 days.

I'm not at all concerned by the issues you raised. The coaching staff tends to plan things out about 2 years in advance. Many of us would have been more comfortable if they had gotten a couple of guys that could redshirt this coming season, and then get plugged into the lineup the following season. The coaching staff did make plays for a few lightweights, but did not seem too concerned that they didn't land them. I infer from their actions that they have a good deal of confidence in whatever their plan is. They seem to be in good/very good/great shape with several excellent prospects at 125 and 133, and there is that guy from Franklin Regional who is two seasons away that also has to be factored into any plans they have.

FWIW, PSU rarely gets verbals before July 1, as that's the 1st day they can officially offer prospects. Thomas Haines was an exception to that, and look what happened with him.

Why fret about things over which you have no control? Seems to me that it makes more sense to trust in those whose jobs depend on their having solutions to any "problems," and who have shown over their careers that they are stunningly competitive and have a track record up delivering/coming up with solutions to just about any issue that they face.
 
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I feel like we are going to get one of these guys (Red, Suriano, Pletcher) right after July 1st. If we don't then maybe I'll be getting concerned. I'm not going to get all worked up if we have a "hole" in the lineup at one weight (125 or 133) for one year as we hopefully wait for the arrival of someone like Lee or Fix. We have won NC's before with more than one weight not scoring any points. Unless we switch to the dual format for determing the NC, I don't think it is a huge issue. Not ideal, but not huge.

We do need to start back filling these two weights immediately, though. Need to get at least one high, high level recruit there this year. And then keep them coming for a year or two.
 
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You do realize, I presume, we basically had this same discussion 9 days ago. Heck, you even posted in that thread.

I don't think any of us have learned anything new in the last 9 days.

I'm not at all concerned by the issues you raised. The coaching staff tends to plan things out about 2 years in advance. Many of us would have been more comfortable if they had gotten a couple of guys that could redshirt this coming season, and then get plugged into the lineup the following season. The coaching staff did make plays for a few lightweights, but did not seem too concerned that they didn't land them. I infer from their actions that they have a good deal of confidence in whatever their plan is. They seem to be in good/very good/great shape with several excellent prospects at 125 and 133, and there is that guy from Franklin Regional who is two seasons away that also has to be factored into any plans they have.

FWIW, PSU rarely gets verbals before July 1, as that's the 1st day they can officially offer prospects. Thomas Haines was an exception to that, and look what happened with him.

Why fret about things over which you have no control? Seems to me that it makes more sense to trust in those whose jobs depend on their having solutions to any "problems," and who have shown over their careers that they are stunningly competitive and have a track record up delivering/coming up with solutions to just about any issue that they face.

Yes I do Realize that..lol I am just really getting antsy about the situation..lol On another note... I would not be happy if Pletcher is the one guy they get from that class. He would be good in my opinion, but I am not sold on his ceiling?? Especially if he is forced into starting as a true freshman.
 
Wait -- isn't this still the "unofficially starting to worry" period? Thought the "officially starting to worry" period doesn't start yet. When did that change?
 
FWIW, PSU rarely gets verbals before July 1, as that's the 1st day they can officially offer prospects. Thomas Haines was an exception to that, and look what happened with him.

Practically never. The full list of public verbals prior to SR 7/1 since Cael came to PSU: Haines and Manville. (Maybe McCutcheon, can't remember exact timing. He's the only other possibility.) Almost forgot whats-his-name heavy from Illinois who "verbaled" and then was never heard from again.

So that's 2 (or maybe 3) legitimate early verbals since 2009. With a track record like that, how has Cael managed to keep landing the likes of Nico, Zain, Conaway, Gulibon, Cenzo, Nolf, Nickal, Nevills, Smack, the Altons (etc.)?
 
On another note... I would not be happy if Pletcher is the one guy they get from that class. He would be good in my opinion, but I am not sold on his ceiling?? Especially if he is forced into starting as a true freshman.

I disagree. Pletch is an excellent wrestler -- really elite. Willie had a really nice comment about him after FloNationals (I think that was the event), about how he just lets it all hang out there/goes for it, and isn't concerned about rankings.

Are you concerned because Pletch got pinned by Red at FloNationals? He had a great tourney until that point, and made a mistake not unlike what DT did against Bubba at Nationals in 2011. Pletch had a great run at States, but ended up losing in ultimate tiebreaker to AC Headlee. The SV period in that match was just amazing. How Pletch avoided the TD by Headlee is beyond me, and then how he didn't score a TD himself was a stunner (give some credit to Headlee). Pletch has pretty much dominated everyone for a few years, with the exception of the aforementioned, and his 2014 FloNationals final against Nick Piccininni. IMHO, you are splitting hairs where it isn't really warranted. Piccininni seemed all-world at the time of the '14 FloNationals match, but he hasn't been all-world since that match.

Excluding Spencer Lee, I don't think any of the top lightweight guys are off-the-charts, guaranteed future NCAA champs. There are a few of them, including the ones I mentioned above and Pletch, that are likely to be in contention to AA or win at NCAAs for 3/4 years at 125, 133, 141.

I've stated many times that I dislike projecting weights, as it's so difficult to do unless you have a lot of inside info about a kid's weight, his parents, etc. With that caveat, it's my uninformed opinion that Pletch would have a tough time making 125 in college. I see him at 133, with 141 a possibility. To me, that's a good thing (for PSU) as my projections for Spencer Lee are that he'll never exceed 125 in college. My hope is that PSU gets a verbal from somebody that can go 125, and somebody that can go 133 as true freshman, and then lands Spencer and has the aforementioned do a combination of redshirting or moving up a weight class.

There are so many ways this can play out. IMHO, all of the names that we've discussed on this board would be excellent additions to the roster, and would do a great job for PSU at 125 and 133.
 
Very talented crop of lightweights coming out of high school the next couple years and I think the coaches just decided to hold off despite some obvious short term needs. They really couldn't commit a whole lot of money for 125 &133 and then turn around and go hard after Suriano, Pletcher, Red and Lee.
 
I know this topic has come up before, and many have said it will work out fine (I tend to agree as I am sure Cael has a plan) but I have to admit that I am officially starting to worry about 125 and 133 after this season. I was really hoping for a Verbal commit by now From Suriano or Redd. What concerns me is that some wrestlers are gonna want a Redshirt, not all wrestlers are like Nico and Retherford. This may be why these two would choose another school?? We are gonna have a serious hole if we lose out on some of these top kids in the next class because only a few of them are ready to have an impact as a True Freshman in my opinion. A hole that could really cost the team as the Three N's come into their own.

Question, Assuming Guilibon goes to 141 and stays there-- Seriously, who would be starting 125,133 if a True Freshman is not given the Job??
Why can't JG go back to 133 for 2017?
 
He could if the coaches want him to compete undersized. I think that's highly unlikely, and it makes little sense for him to eat + lift for one year, then cut it all away one year later. (By now there's ample evidence that Cael believes in growth and maintenance over cutting.)
 
:)
I disagree. Pletch is an excellent wrestler -- really elite. Willie had a really nice comment about him after FloNationals (I think that was the event), about how he just lets it all hang out there/goes for it, and isn't concerned about rankings.

Are you concerned because Pletch got pinned by Red at FloNationals? He had a great tourney until that point, and made a mistake not unlike what DT did against Bubba at Nationals in 2011. Pletch had a great run at States, but ended up losing in ultimate tiebreaker to AC Headlee. The SV period in that match was just amazing. How Pletch avoided the TD by Headlee is beyond me, and then how he didn't score a TD himself was a stunner (give some credit to Headlee). Pletch has pretty much dominated everyone for a few years, with the exception of the aforementioned, and his 2014 FloNationals final against Nick Piccininni. IMHO, you are splitting hairs where it isn't really warranted. Piccininni seemed all-world at the time of the '14 FloNationals match, but he hasn't been all-world since that match.

Excluding Spencer Lee, I don't think any of the top lightweight guys are off-the-charts, guaranteed future NCAA champs. There are a few of them, including the ones I mentioned above and Pletch, that are likely to be in contention to AA or win at NCAAs for 3/4 years at 125, 133, 141.

I've stated many times that I dislike projecting weights, as it's so difficult to do unless you have a lot of inside info about a kid's weight, his parents, etc. With that caveat, it's my uninformed opinion that Pletch would have a tough time making 125 in college. I see him at 133, with 141 a possibility. To me, that's a good thing (for PSU) as my projections for Spencer Lee are that he'll never exceed 125 in college. My hope is that PSU gets a verbal from somebody that can go 125, and somebody that can go 133 as true freshman, and then lands Spencer and has the aforementioned do a combination of redshirting or moving up a weight class.

There are so many ways this can play out. IMHO, all of the names that we've discussed on this board would be excellent additions to the roster, and would do a great job for PSU at 125 and 133.


Very well written explanation of why I may be wrong about Pletcher, I can buy into what your selling there:):):):)

It is an interesting situation needing what may be 2 true freshman to come in and start immediately at 125 and 133 if Guilibon is in fact going to 141. I don't feel great about that fact but many of you are making me feel better about it. I guess of all the weights, 125 and 133 are the 2 where true freshman can have the biggest impact.
 
Wait -- isn't this still the "unofficially starting to worry" period? Thought the "officially starting to worry" period doesn't start yet. When did that change?

I am officially worried but unofficially ok with it, but officially you are not supposed to know so I unofficially told you if anyone asks...ok:rolleyes:
 
Our biggest problem is who to take between Suriano, Red, and Pletcher to surround a cast of future Champs and All Americans. It's a tough situation to be in but Cael is ok with it I guess.
 
I don't get this talk about JG moving up to 141 and moving back to 133 the year after. We need 2 guys who can go 125 and 133 next year as freshman. That's the year after this year. JG would stay at 141 for his final year with the 2 freshman filling in. then the following year after that the 2 freshman, now sophomores move up a weight to make room for Lee.
 
I don't know enough about Suriano to project weight but it seems to me like Red and Pletcher would be able to go 125 (Probably Red) and 133 (Pletcher) their freshman year and then each bump up a weight if (hopefully when) Lee comes in in 2017-2018
 
Nice summary Tom. It's tough to know weights a year from now any way it turns out it will be a very solid line up.
 
I would expect PSU to get at least one of the Pletcher, Suriano, Redd trio. A lot of the chips will fall in the first couple of weeks in July
 
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