Hard to argue against Maryland being a good addition to the BT.

[BUFFALO LION]

What I was trying to say is that overall more people want to watch good teams (Florida, Alabama, etc) play than want to watch not so good teams (Rutgers, etc) play. And as time passes we're moving more and more to people being able to pay for what they want to watch instead of being forced to pay for something just because of where they live.

What if all the conferences eventually have to go to a pay-per-view model for their conference TV network? Then people are going to pay for what they want, not what is foisted upon them. A lot of people live in New Jersey but it's not overflowing with college football fans and lots of the college football fans there are want to see the good teams play even if said teams are far away.

The old Big East football conference used to have Rutgers (New Jersey), Boston College (New England), Temple (Philly), Miami (South Florida) and Syracuse (New York). They should have been killing with those big markets, right? But no, because nobody wants to watch a lot of those teams play. Alabama-Auburn probably gets bigger ratings than BC-Syracuse even in New York and New England, not to mention the rest of the country.

ETA: The cable companies making money however they can is one thing, the sports conferences doing it is another. The cable companies are going to look out for themselves, not for the sports conferences. If a cable company can make more money by pushing SEC football in New England, or whatever, they're going to do it.

That's one of the reasons why the Big Ten wants to go with State Flagship Universities. They want to have the entire State involved. Not just a region. Syracuse, Temple, Miami, and Boston College are not State Flagship Universities.

Believe it or not, if the Bills would have been bought by an out of town owner and moved to Los Angeles, The University of Buffalo would have been a more attractive long term addition to the Big Ten than Syracuse. They had already started the rebranding process to "The University of New York" anticipating that possibility. But that's a subject for another thread.

It seems that you are comingling Cable and First Tier Rights. Cable and First Tier Rights are two different subjects. Not sure what your point is. But I can assure you that having a team located in the Number 1 DMA in the Country is an enormous Plus. Let's use Rutgers and ONLY the New York City DMA as an example.

The Big Ten doesn't just shop Rutgers to potential networks and advertisers. They shop the New York City DMA. The Number 1 DMA in the United States of America. The Big Ten (Rutgers) would get preferential treatment, everything else being equal, just by being located in that DMA.

Without a team located in the New York City DMA, our negotiating power in relation to advertising and first tier negotiations, and our potential third tier media subscribers, is reduced drastically.

As just one extreme and unrealistic example of the Big Ten's new found advantage (to illustrate the point) - if, as you say, Alabama was playing Auburn, and Rutgers was playing Slippery Rock, and both were CBS regional games being played at the same time, Rutgers would be shown throughout the New York City DMA on CBS's main feed. Not Alabama (unless they were being shown on a secondary outlet). Rutgers and the Big Ten would get that primary exposure on CBS's main feed.

No doubt the number 4 DMA (Philadelphia) would also carry Rutgers in that scenario. So the Big Ten would get preferential major network exposure against the SEC's best game in the Number 1 and Number 4 DMA in the Country even if Rutgers was only playing Slippery Rock.

When a Conference can hypothetically shop Slippery Rock/Rutgers over Alabama/Auburn to potential networks and advertisers in the Number 1 and Number 4 DMAs in the Country, you have a negotiating advantage.

Now to move on to a more realistic scenario, the Big Ten, being the Home Conference of Rutgers (and Maryland), would get preferential treatment, everything else being equal, in all the NEW Big Ten DMA's IN ADDITION to the old Big Ten DMAs. The Big Ten has just put the number of TV Households in Florida, Georgia, Alabama, and Mississippi in their negotiating and advertising quiver.

 

[BUFFALO LION]

Have you seen the ratings in those DMAs? They suck major ****ing ass, even for the games the BTN ballyhoos. Were it otherwise, Fox would already own the BTN outright.

There is going to be no bidding war. No single network will lay out the kind of money Delany is talking about. Negotiations will be over who gets what pieces for how much, and then Fox steals the BTN and farms out the third-tier rights to its regional networks in the Midwest.

I have to admit Art. That's pretty funny.

 

[dawgduice]

The addition of Maryland and Rutgers WILL "pay" off. I do not think this is really very complicated. PSU, OSU and Michigan will drive much of this. "Playing" those teams every year and "recruiting" those areas. I just hope we can hold back Michigan !!!! OSU recruits "different" guys for the most part.

 

[Art]

The addition of Maryland and Rutgers WILL "pay" off. I do not think this is really very complicated. PSU, OSU and Michigan will drive much of this. "Playing" those teams every year and "recruiting" those areas. I just hope we can hold back Michigan !!!! OSU recruits "different" guys for the most part.

How does it pay-off? As Apex pointed out, this cannot be proven.

 

[dawgduice]

How does it pay-off? As Apex pointed out, this cannot be proven.

Art, I "think" in the long run. It appears to be a really thoughtful expansion. Obviously time will tell. Maryland, for the most part is already there academically and athletically. Rutgers meets the academic level, sports well that will be a challenge. Their history is one where sports have NOT been supported by the students or faculty. That is why I believe they need to hire "personalities" to recruit.
I do know a decent amount about both schools, my son and daughter-in-law are both graduates of Rutgers. My brother is on the teaching staff at Maryland (35 years) and my nephew is a graduate. Does any of that mean anything? Probably not

 

[Art]

Art, I "think" in the long run. It appears to be a really thoughtful expansion. Obviously time will tell. Maryland, for the most part is already there academically and athletically. Rutgers meets the academic level, sports well that will be a challenge. Their history is one where sports have NOT been supported by the students or faculty. That is why I believe they need to hire "personalities" to recruit.
I do know a decent amount about both schools, my son and daughter-in-law are both graduates of Rutgers. My brother is on the teaching staff at Maryland (35 years) and my nephew is a graduate. Does any of that mean anything? Probably not

Let's make one thing clear: neither Rutgers or Maryland were added to the Big Ten for academic reasons, no matter what the suits in the tower say. That notion is entirely preposterous. The reason is athletics and more precisely to the point the cash, (yeah, filthy lucre) that the conference will derive from their . membership. So if you want demonstrate that the additions were good, in the immortal words of Rod Tidwell, "Show me the money!"

 

[BUFFALO LION]

Let's make one thing clear: neither Rutgers or Maryland were added to the Big Ten for academic reasons, no matter what the suits in the tower say. That notion is entirely preposterous. The reason is athletics and more precisely to the point the cash, (yeah, filthy lucre) that the conference will derive from their . membership. So if you want demonstrate that the additions were good, in the immortal words of Rod Tidwell, "Show me the money!"

Oh, you'll see the money. And a LOT of it. But I have a hunch you already know that.

I agree with dawg that they both offer the Conference much more than money. We have already seen things open up in Basketball recruiting.

We have two DC area kids from Oak Hill Academy that would have never looked at us in years past. Plus, because of Rutgers, Philadelphia has seemed to open up more. It's now OK to go to Penn State and play basketball if you are a kid in the I-95 corridor.

As far as Academics go, try to get a good athletic program, average academic University, like West Virginia or Louisville past the votes of the Big Ten Presidents (if those schools were available). I got News for you Art. It would never happen.

 

[Op2]

By the way, for those that think Rutgers was such a great addition because of TV set numbers, ask yourself why it is that the ACC added Syracuse, Virginia Tech, Boston College, Miami and Pitt when they could have added Rutgers. Some of those TV markets are big and some not but none are remotely as big as the Rutgers market.

 

[Art]

Oh, you'll see the money. And a LOT of it. But I have a hunch you already know that.

I agree with dawg that they both offer the Conference much more than money. We have already seen things open up in Basketball recruiting.

We have two DC area kids from Oak Hill Academy that would have never looked at us in years past. Plus, because of Rutgers, Philadelphia has seemed to open up more. It's now OK to go to Penn State and play basketball if you are a kid in the I-95 corridor.

As far as Academics go, try to get a good athletic program, average academic University, like West Virginia or Louisville past the votes of the Big Ten Presidents (if those schools were available). I got News for you Art. It would never happen.

Let's see: The Rutgers-Maryland football game gets a 0.1 TV rating. Networks are going to tear into each other for those sorts of ratings.

So Philadelphia has "opened up" to PSU basketball recruiting because of Rutgers? First off, Rutgers is in the NYC DMA, not the Philadelphia DMA and there was no increase in exposure in the latter after Rutgers joined. Additionally, Rutgers has no players from the PA side of the Philly metro area on its roster and the two from the Jersey side are walk-ons.

Both Reaves and Hampton committed to PSU before any increase in Big Ten exposure in the DC metro area resulting from the Maryland addition took place.

If Delany could show that adding Robert Morris would contribute major dollars to Big Ten coffers, the presidents would daintily pinch their noses and raise their hand in the affirmative. Hell, they voted in Nebraska while throwing them out of the AAU.

 

[BUFFALO LION]

Let's see: The Rutgers-Maryland football game gets a 0.1 TV rating. Networks are going to tear into each other for those sorts of ratings.

So Philadelphia has "opened up" to PSU basketball recruiting because of Rutgers? First off, Rutgers is in the NYC DMA, not the Philadelphia DMA and there was no increase in exposure in the latter after Rutgers joined. Additionally, Rutgers has no players from the PA side of the Philly metro area on its roster and the two from the Jersey side are walk-ons.

Both Reaves and Hampton committed to PSU before any increase in Big Ten exposure in the DC metro area resulting from the Maryland addition took place.

If Delany could show that adding Robert Morris would contribute major dollars to Big Ten coffers, the presidents would daintily pinch their noses and raise their hand in the affirmative. Hell, they voted in Nebraska while throwing them out of the AAU.

You mean a .1 National rating buried on ESPNU, a station that lots of people don't even get? On a weekend they are up against Ohio State/Michigan, Alabama/Auburn, Notre Dame/USC, and every other end of the year rivalry game shown on ABC, CBS, and ESPN? Other than Illinois/Northwestern, no one had higher than a .1 rating on ESPNU that week. And Illinois /Northwestern only got a .2.

Rutgers/Maryland is never going to trump Ohio State/Michigan in the Big Ten's preferred time slot on that weekend. But if either one or both are competing for a Divisional Championship, they will be promoted up the ladder. New York City has proven they will watch if Rutgers is really good.

Both Hampton and Reaves committed to Penn State after Maryland was an official member of the Big Ten (Reaves actually committed the very day Maryland joined). I'm in the DC, Baltimore, and New York City areas all the time. Nothing was cooler this spring than being outside of Baltimore, and having an entire bar rooting for Wisconsin and Michigan State on Saturday, and then two nights later, Wisconsin against Duke as if Wisconsin and Michigan State were their Home teams. That kind of Conference loyalty can influence a lot of kids.

Rutgers has opened up the ENTIRE state of New Jersey and New York City Metro to recruiting. Not JUST the New York City DMA as you insinuate. The added exposure the Big Ten gets throughout the state of New Jersey AND the New York City Metro draws Penn State closer to the East Coast.

Whereas before, as it relates to basketball, a kid from Jersey or Philly wouldn't look two seconds at us. Now we can become a real player in the I-95 corridor. Increased exposure is priceless. That's something we never had before in that area on a big time basis. Seems like that's something you're against for some strange reason.

Nebraska was an AAU University when they were admitted. And AAU affiliation is preferred. However, under the right set of circumstances, a Non-AAU school could some day get an invite.

The Conference wants to go to 16 teams eventually, and a couple of schools where there is mutual interest are not AAU affiliated. However, they are stronger research Universities than some current AAU members.

Will they ever get invites? Who knows. There are a couple of other potential invitees higher on the totem pole that are currently tied up with GOR's. If it's true there is an escape clause in 2017 when the ACC has their look-in with ESPN (no ACC Network), you may see some future movement.

 

[BUFFALO LION]

By the way, for those that think Rutgers was such a great addition because of TV set numbers, ask yourself why it is that the ACC added Syracuse, Virginia Tech, Boston College, Miami and Pitt when they could have added Rutgers. Some of those TV markets are big and some not but none are remotely as big as the Rutgers market.

The Big Ten model is different than the ACC model.

Number one, the ACC doesn't have, and may never have an over the air Broadcast Network like BTN, SECN, or Pac 12 Network. Therefore, Satellite and Cable subscriptions aren't as important.

Number two, The Big Ten Presidents prefer to be associated with large major State Flagship Universities that are heavily research oriented and preferably have AAU affiliation. The ACC is a mix of smaller Private and Public Universities that are more Undergraduate oriented. Rutgers enrolls roughly 10,000 more students than Boston College, Miami, and Syracuse combined. Rutgers also has AAU membership, something Big Ten Presidents value highly. The CIC/Big Ten has a higher percentage of AAU Universities than any Athletic Conference in the United States of America, and that includes the Ivy League. Big Ten Presidents are very proud of that.

Number three, the ACC was looking for basketball oriented athletic programs. The Big Ten was looking for more football oriented programs with large markets and good recruiting bases. Rutgers has gone bowling 9 of the last 10 years and have a record of 6-3. Better than many Big Ten or ACC Schools. Last year, as a member of the Big Ten, they hammered the ACC's North Carolina by a score of 40-21 in a game that wasn't nearly that close. Rutgers led North Carolina 40-7 in the 4th quarter before they called the dogs off.

If Nebraska wouldn't have fallen in the Big Ten's lap at the last minute in 2010, Rutgers would have been member number 12. Their metrics as they related to what the Big Ten was looking for at the time were better than Missouri's, Pitt's, Syracuse's, or anyone else's. The Big Ten could have had both Syracuse and Pitt in 2010, but didn't want them. Neither would have been able to deliver the long term package potential Rutgers offered.

 

[WPB_lion]

I hope you guys are right. So far we're 0-3 in the revenue sports against them. They mock us, have zero respect and have no reason not to. I know all about the history, I lived it. 77-0, etc. Those days are over. There is parity now, and this conference has proved to have weakened us and strengthened everybody else, except for wrestling, women's volleyball and soccer, and so on. We will see. I'll happily be proven wrong.

While we have become weaker since joining the Big Ten, I do not believe our decline is the result of our joining the BIG. IMO, our decline in the 2000s was primarily the result of an aging coaching staff and the Sandusky scandal is the primary reason for our most recent decline in strength.

 

[Art]

You mean a .1 National rating buried on ESPNU, a station that lots of people don't even get? On a weekend they are up against Ohio State/Michigan, Alabama/Auburn, Notre Dame/USC, and every other end of the year rivalry game shown on ABC, CBS, and ESPN? Other than Illinois/Northwestern, no one had higher than a .1 rating on ESPNU that week. And Illinois /Northwestern only got a .2.

Rutgers/Maryland is never going to trump Ohio State/Michigan in the Big Ten's preferred time slot on that weekend. But if either one or both are competing for a Divisional Championship, they will be promoted up the ladder. New York City has proven they will watch if Rutgers is really good.

Both Hampton and Reaves committed to Penn State after Maryland was an official member of the Big Ten (Reaves actually committed the very day Maryland joined). I'm in the DC, Baltimore, and New York City areas all the time. Nothing was cooler this spring than being outside of Baltimore, and having an entire bar rooting for Wisconsin and Michigan State on Saturday, and then two nights later, Wisconsin against Duke as if Wisconsin and Michigan State were their Home teams. That kind of Conference loyalty can influence a lot of kids.

Rutgers has opened up the ENTIRE state of New Jersey and New York City Metro to recruiting. Not JUST the New York City DMA as you insinuate. The added exposure the Big Ten gets throughout the state of New Jersey AND the New York City Metro draws Penn State closer to the East Coast.

Whereas before, as it relates to basketball, a kid from Jersey or Philly wouldn't look two seconds at us. Now we can become a real player in the I-95 corridor. Increased exposure is priceless. That's something we never had before in that area on a big time basis. Seems like that's something you're against for some strange reason.

Nebraska was an AAU University when they were admitted. And AAU affiliation is preferred. However, under the right set of circumstances, a Non-AAU school could some day get an invite.

The Conference wants to go to 16 teams eventually, and a couple of schools where there is mutual interest are not AAU affiliated. However, they are stronger research Universities than some current AAU members.

Will they ever get invites? Who knows. There are a couple of other potential invitees higher on the totem pole that are currently tied up with GOR's. If it's true there is an escape clause in 2017 when the ACC has their look-in with ESPN (no ACC Network), you may see some future movement.

So Disney Sports buried a game involving teams with major rooting interest in large DMAs on a backwater channel? Wonder why they did this. Northern NJ, not the rest of the NYC DMA, will watch Rutgers if it is good........on a weekday night when no other games are on.

Rutgers has opened the entire state of NJ to PSU basketball recruiting? Who has PSU landed from the Garden State?

You do know that there is a difference between coincidence and causality? Wait, probably too much to ask.

 

[BigLou]

Could you please elaborate on the Legrand situation? What did I miss?

An example of a story taken out of context. The school later admitted it was a miscommunication and that while
LeGrand was being invited to speak it was not intended that he be the only speaker. I think Eric went public too soon with the news. He did end up speaking as the student representative and was given his diploma by the University President.
There's a lot of things that Rutgers can be criticized for. The school's support of Eric LeGrand is not one of them.

 

[Op2]

The Big Ten model is different than the ACC model.

Number one, the ACC doesn't have, and may never have an over the air Broadcast Network like BTN, SECN, or Pac 12 Network. Therefore, Satellite and Cable subscriptions aren't as important.

Number two, The Big Ten Presidents prefer to be associated with large major State Flagship Universities that are heavily research oriented and preferably have AAU affiliation. The ACC is a mix of smaller Private and Public Universities that are more Undergraduate oriented. Rutgers enrolls roughly 10,000 more students than Boston College, Miami, and Syracuse combined. Rutgers also has AAU membership, something Big Ten Presidents value highly. The CIC/Big Ten has a higher percentage of AAU Universities than any Athletic Conference in the United States of America, and that includes the Ivy League. Big Ten Presidents are very proud of that.

Number three, the ACC was looking for basketball oriented athletic programs. The Big Ten was looking for more football oriented programs with large markets and good recruiting bases. Rutgers has gone bowling 9 of the last 10 years and have a record of 6-3. Better than many Big Ten or ACC Schools. Last year, as a member of the Big Ten, they hammered the ACC's North Carolina by a score of 40-21 in a game that wasn't nearly that close. Rutgers led North Carolina 40-7 in the 4th quarter before they called the dogs off.

If Nebraska wouldn't have fallen in the Big Ten's lap at the last minute in 2010, Rutgers would have been member number 12. Their metrics as they related to what the Big Ten was looking for at the time were better than Missouri's, Pitt's, Syracuse's, or anyone else's. The Big Ten could have had both Syracuse and Pitt in 2010, but didn't want them. Neither would have been able to deliver the long term package potential Rutgers offered.

I don't know exactly what you mean by an over the air broadcast network but the ACC has a network on my Roku right now. The ACC and Big Ten and SEC are going to do whatever they can to make money.

As far as the ACC wanting basketball oriented schools, the ACC is on record as having wanted PSU when PSU joined the Big Ten.

http://www.pennlive.com/sports/index.ssf/2013/07/penn_state_in_acc_not_big_ten.html

 

[NittPicker]

I don't know exactly what you mean by an over the air broadcast network but the ACC has a network on my Roku right now. The ACC and Big Ten and SEC are going to do whatever they can to make money.

As far as the ACC wanting basketball oriented schools, the ACC is on record as having wanted PSU when PSU joined the Big Ten.

http://www.pennlive.com/sports/index.ssf/2013/07/penn_state_in_acc_not_big_ten.html

I don't pretend to know much about television contracts but if your argument is the ACCN is viable because it can be found on your Roku then you've lost any credibility you may have had. Maybe I'll stumble across it when I'm searching through the cooking channels. Please tell me know much money a Roku user pays to see the ACCN and how much of that money is given to the conference. Roku for the ACCN because nobody else wanted it?? Funny stuff.

 

[Op2]

I don't pretend to know much about television contracts but if your argument is the ACCN is viable because it can be found on your Roku then you've lost any credibility you may have had. Maybe I'll stumble across it when I'm searching through the cooking channels. Please tell me know much money a Roku user pays to see the ACCN and how much of that money is given to the conference. Roku for the ACCN?? Funny stuff.

The other guy said that the ACC doesn't have an over the air network thus TV sets aren't important and thus the ACC wouldn't want Rutgers. But my point is that the ACC, like other conferences, are going to get money however they can, from an over the air network or whatever. If the ACC doesn't have an over the air network now then it's because they don't think they can make money from it, not because they're somehow philosophically against it. If adding Rutgers TV sets were enough to help the ACC then the ACC would have added Rutgers. It's not like a bunch of TV sets help one conference but not another.

ETA: The ACC does now have a network aside from that on Roku.

 

[Art]

The other guy said that the ACC doesn't have an over the air network thus TV sets aren't important and thus the ACC wouldn't want Rutgers. But my point is that the ACC, like other conferences, are going to get money however they can, from an over the air network or whatever. If the ACC doesn't have an over the air network now then it's because they don't think they can make money from it, not because they're somehow philosophically against it. If adding Rutgers TV sets were enough to help the ACC then the ACC would have added Rutgers. It's not like a bunch of TV sets help one conference but not another.

ETA: The ACC does now have a network aside from that on Roku.

Not really. The so-called ACC Network is not a dedicated 24/7 entity like the BTN or SEC Network. Instead, Raycom syndicates ACC games on an ad-hoc basis, primarily to over-the-air stations. Rights fees are peanuts.

 

[Op2]

Not really. The so-called ACC Network is not a dedicated 24/7 entity like the BTN or SEC Network. Instead, Raycom syndicates ACC games on an ad-hoc basis, primarily to over-the-air stations. Rights fees are peanuts.

Okay, it's not like the BTN or the SEC but the point is they have one and they're trying to make money on it and TVs matter to them so Rutgers' TV would matter to them if they added Rutgers. But part of my initial point, way back early in the thread, is that one way that TV sets are mattering less and less is that a network, BTN or whatever, is included in cable packages with the BT getting a cut each month. People are tired of paying for more and more stuff they don't watch and as a result we're seeing more stuff like Sling TV or people buying only HBO or whatever, instead of getting stuck with a million channels you don't want.

If you can stick people with a million channels they don't want then having all those New Jersey TVs is good but because the Big Ten gets a cut of that each month. But if people start getting to choose what they pay for then the fact that all those TVs are in in New Jersey doesn't help anymore and instead it comes down to who wants to pay for it, not who has to pay for it.

My folks in PA have paid for the BTN for years. Not only do they not watch it, they don't even know it's on their cable system. But that stuff is slowly coming to an end because consumers are saying "Enough."

 

[BoilerBulldog]

Carriage is far more important than ratings and in network carriage is significantly more important than out of network. Rutgers got BTN on in network coverage in NYC on Time Warner and Cablevision almost overnight. Those two deals by themselves more than paid the cover charge for both RU and MD to get in. NJ and Balt/DC are just gravy. And when we negotiate our tier 1 and 2 contracts next year, they will be the most lucrative college broadcast contracts ever. And the SEC is locked in to theirs until 2024. I agree the cut the cord crowd will continue to rise, but we will lock in before it reaches a critical mass. The other conferences may not be so lucky.

 

[Art]

Carriage is far more important than ratings and in network carriage is significantly more important than out of network. Rutgers got BTN on in network coverage in NYC on Time Warner and Cablevision almost overnight. Those two deals by themselves more than paid the cover charge for both RU and MD to get in. NJ and Balt/DC are just gravy. And when we negotiate our tier 1 and 2 contracts next year, they will be the most lucrative college broadcast contracts ever. And the SEC is locked in to theirs until 2024. I agree the cut the cord crowd will continue to rise, but we will lock in before it reaches a critical mass. The other conferences may not be so lucky.

No they didn't.

 

[Op2]

Carriage is far more important than ratings and in network carriage is significantly more important than out of network. Rutgers got BTN on in network coverage in NYC on Time Warner and Cablevision almost overnight. Those two deals by themselves more than paid the cover charge for both RU and MD to get in. NJ and Balt/DC are just gravy. And when we negotiate our tier 1 and 2 contracts next year, they will be the most lucrative college broadcast contracts ever. And the SEC is locked in to theirs until 2024. I agree the cut the cord crowd will continue to rise, but we will lock in before it reaches a critical mass. The other conferences may not be so lucky.

You can lock in a contract for the next ten years or whatever but the larger point is that cable carriage is going to matter less and less as time passes and as a result Rutgers, which is now locked in to the Big Ten, will be less and less beneficial (unless they should somehow manage to grow a real following in that part of the country, which is unlikely but not impossible).

 

[BoilerBulldog]

No they didn't.

The first deal was $48M incremental. I don't have the other deals but they were similar.

 

[BoilerBulldog]

Www.frankthetank.me

Look up the details of the deal there.

 

[BoilerBulldog]

You can lock in a contract for the next ten years or whatever but the larger point is that cable carriage is going to matter less and less as time passes and as a result Rutgers, which is now locked in to the Big Ten, will be less and less beneficial (unless they should somehow manage to grow a real following in that part of the country, which is unlikely but not impossible).

I agree. The contract after the next will be very interesting.

 

[Art]

The first deal was $48M incremental. I don't have the other deals but they were similar.

Ah, the infamous "back of the napkin" calculation done by the awfulannouncing blog. Here's some news for you, pilgrim, not even close.

 

[Art]

Www.frankthetank.me

Look up the details of the deal there.

Ah, the joys of the Internet. One ignoramus quotes another and because the public is too stupid or lazy to conduct its own reality check misinformation becomes gospel.

 

[BoilerBulldog]

Ah, the joys of the Internet. One ignoramus quotes another and because the public is too stupid or lazy to conduct its own reality check misinformation becomes gospel.

If you typed in all caps you might have convinced me. Unless you have data, and based on your 30,000 posts to a free football board I assume you've heard of Google, show me your facts.

 

[dawgduice]

Let's see: The Rutgers-Maryland football game gets a 0.1 TV rating. Networks are going to tear into each other for those sorts of ratings.

So Philadelphia has "opened up" to PSU basketball recruiting because of Rutgers? First off, Rutgers is in the NYC DMA, not the Philadelphia DMA and there was no increase in exposure in the latter after Rutgers joined. Additionally, Rutgers has no players from the PA side of the Philly metro area on its roster and the two from the Jersey side are walk-ons.

Both Reaves and Hampton committed to PSU before any increase in Big Ten exposure in the DC metro area resulting from the Maryland addition took place.

If Delany could show that adding Robert Morris would contribute major dollars to Big Ten coffers, the presidents would daintily pinch their noses and raise their hand in the affirmative. Hell, they voted in Nebraska while throwing them out of the AAU.

Art, not true on Rutgers, they have a "substantial" presence with a Campus in Southern NJ about 2 minutes from Philadelphia. So it does "open up" all of NJ and Philadelphia. North Jersey is a NY suberb and South Jersey is a Philadelphia suburb. Given the decline with almost zero population growth of the mid-west the States of NJ and Maryland (in particular) continue to grow. To me a far better "expansion" than a Missouri ???? But, I guess, we will have to agree to disagree
Rutgers BB "only" needs a "dynamic" coach and 1-2 kids from their area, maybe St. Anthony's. Time will tell.

 

[BoilerBulldog]

Ah, the joys of the Internet. One ignoramus quotes another and because the public is too stupid or lazy to conduct its own reality check misinformation becomes gospel.

Only because I'm bored waiting on the perpetually late Daily bus at BWI, I helped with your research.

http://awfulannouncing.com/2014/big...ackpot-worth-tens-of-millions-of-dollars.html

 

[Art]

Only because I'm bored waiting on the perpetually late Daily bus at BWI, I helped with your research.

http://awfulannouncing.com/2014/big...ackpot-worth-tens-of-millions-of-dollars.html

Nice try, bonehead. You present no data, just repeated estimates from the uniformed like you.

 

[Art]

Art, not true on Rutgers, they have a "substantial" presence with a Campus in Southern NJ about 2 minutes from Philadelphia. So it does "open up" all of NJ and Philadelphia. North Jersey is a NY suberb and South Jersey is a Philadelphia suburb. Given the decline with almost zero population growth of the mid-west the States of NJ and Maryland (in particular) continue to grow. To me a far better "expansion" than a Missouri ???? But, I guess, we will have to agree to disagree
Rutgers BB "only" needs a "dynamic" coach and 1-2 kids from their area, maybe St. Anthony's. Time will tell.

Huh? Camden and seven other counties in South Jersey are part of the Philadelphia DMA and were part of the Big Ten media footprint, by virtue of PSU's membership, before Rutgers was admitted. No change in exposure in that area.

 

[BoilerBulldog]

Nice try, bonehead. You present no data, just repeated estimates from the uniformed like you.

I apologize for using math. How about multiple choice:

The net income disbursements on a per school basis from the BTN to member schools in '14/'15 will (a) go up (b) stay the same or (c) go down.

The T1/T2 broadcast media contract for B1G to be negotiated in '16 for the '17 season will be (a) much higher (b) essentially the same or (c) be less.

Since you seem unable to make any objective support for your claims, I hope this will be easier for you.

I say (A) and (A). Your argument, from what I can infer by sifting through the ad hominems, is that MD/RU is ultimately going to hurt the conference financially. Do you agree? If not, what exactly do you think the result will be? Show your math.

Fortunately we should know the BTN revenues soon for this past school year. And I believe strongly the contract we negotiate next year will be the largest T1/T2 contract ever negotiated by a conference.

 

[BoilerBulldog]

Huh? Camden and seven other counties in South Jersey are part of the Philadelphia DMA and were part of the Big Ten media footprint, by virtue of PSU's membership, before Rutgers was admitted. No change in exposure in that area.

This is actually incorrect. It will take some digging but there was a NJ cable provider in south Jersey that changed from out of market to into market with RU. Maybe someone on the board from south Jersey could provide background but I believe Comcast in SNJ was treated as out of market for PSU, while the Philly carriers were obviously considered in market.

 

[BoilerBulldog]

Here's another take on the value of RU from five years ago (from someone in industry):

http://frankthetank.me/2010/04/19/the-value-of-expansion-candidates-to-the-big-ten-network/

 

[dawgduice]

Huh? Camden and seven other counties in South Jersey are part of the Philadelphia DMA and were part of the Big Ten media footprint, by virtue of PSU's membership, before Rutgers was admitted. No change in exposure in that area.

Not sure why you do not see adding Rutgers will give PSU a higher profile in the Philadelphia and NY regions? Other than the PSU alum. The connection brings PSU closer to the "BIG CITIES". That "will" have a payoff in recruiting. PSU has been viewed as a "farm" school to Big City BB players forever. Chambers, whom I love, gets that. Adding Rutgers merely extends the "physical" presence of the Big 10 AND we are in the Big 10. "Numbers" will change drastically.
Amazing how "some" of the Rutgers fans now talk about the Big 10 especially OSU, Michigan and PSU. Plus there are a "few" Rutgers alum in Phila and NY, plus some in NJ
Well, at least that's my opinion.

 

[SEPATOPTEN]

I hope you guys are right. So far we're 0-3 in the revenue sports against them. They mock us, have zero respect and have no reason not to. I know all about the history, I lived it. 77-0, etc. Those days are over. There is parity now, and this conference has proved to have weakened us and strengthened everybody else, except for wrestling, women's volleyball and soccer, and so on. We will see. I'll happily be proven wrong.

Where has Penn St. been weakened? We have not been as good in football but that was do to an aging coach and wrongful sanctions in my opinion.I don't see it.

 

[BUFFALO LION]

So Disney Sports buried a game involving teams with major rooting interest in large DMAs on a backwater channel? Wonder why they did this. Northern NJ, not the rest of the NYC DMA, will watch Rutgers if it is good........on a weekday night when no other games are on.

Rutgers has opened the entire state of NJ to PSU basketball recruiting? Who has PSU landed from the Garden State?

You do know that there is a difference between coincidence and causality? Wait, probably too much to ask.

Wonder why they did it? I thought I explained that in my prior post. You are talking about the end of the season. Division, Conference, and National Championships are on the line.

In the Big Ten, Ohio State and Michigan State are fighting for a Final 4 Slot in the National Championship Playoffs. Add to that the fact both are playing ratings friendly Michigan and Penn State, and of course ABC will select them over Rutgers/Maryland, who were playing for nothing. Both were already Bowl eligible. ABC would have been out of their minds to give them top billing.

If Rutgers and/or Maryland would have been in the same positions as Ohio State or Michigan State, playing for a spot in the 4 team Playoff, you can bet your sweet behind they would have gotten a better billing. As it was, their game was the 6th most meaningful game of the 7 games played in the Big Ten that weekend. Every other game except Purdue/Indiana had one team or both actually fighting for something.

Rutgers proved its worth earlier in the year, ratings wise, when they played us. The combined muscle of Penn State/Rutgers in the New York City DMA proved to advertisers that the Big Ten is the ratings King in the New York City DMA, everything else being equal. It was a huge game for BTN. They were doing cartwheels in the hallways when the ratings came out.

When an obscure network like BTN can outdraw a competitive Notre Dame game on NBC in the same time slot in the New York City DMA, it is meaningful. Especially when it drew viewers away from a Big 4 Network game that had Notre Dame's number 3 regular season rating the year before.

And yes. Penn State does now have, and will have a FAR greater basketball presence in the New York City to DC I-95 corridor. I can tell you from experience that New York to DC has switched 180 degrees from being ACC/Big East centric to being Big Ten/Big East Centric. And the BE has lost a LOT of steam since the break up. It's like the ACC doesn't even exist anymore.

If we ever added UConn, we would own the Northeast in basketball. They are literally begging us for an invite, and would prefer the Big Ten exponentially over the ACC. But that's a story for another day.

 

[BUFFALO LION]

I don't know exactly what you mean by an over the air broadcast network but the ACC has a network on my Roku right now. The ACC and Big Ten and SEC are going to do whatever they can to make money.

As far as the ACC wanting basketball oriented schools, the ACC is on record as having wanted PSU when PSU joined the Big Ten.

http://www.pennlive.com/sports/index.ssf/2013/07/penn_state_in_acc_not_big_ten.html

Tell me you're not serious??? If you're talking about the ACCDN, try getting a LIVE ACC football game on there for free. It ain't going to happen. Last I saw, you can add the app to get live ACC football game feeds for $7.99 per season. I pay .40 cents from September to December to get the BTN live football game feeds anywhere in the World on BTN2Go. So you're paying 20 times more than I am for live Big Ten football games if you are getting actual live regular season ACC football games. Congratulations!!

Ya. The ACC is "on record as having wanted PSU when PSU joined the Big Ten". One big problem. They never asked us.

 

[Op2]

Tell me you're not serious??? If you're talking about the ACCDN, try getting a LIVE ACC football game on there for free. It ain't going to happen. Last I saw, you can add the app to get live ACC football game feeds for $7.99 per season. I pay .40 cents from September to December to get the BTN live football game feeds anywhere in the World on BTN2Go. So you're paying 20 times more than I am for live Big Ten football games if you are getting actual live regular season ACC football games. Congratulations!!

Ya. The ACC is "on record as having wanted PSU when PSU joined the Big Ten". One big problem. They never asked us.

The ACC didn't know PSU was available or else they would. The article I linked to isn't the first I've heard of it, rather it has been public record for decades that the ACC would have invited PSU had they knew it was a possibility PSU would accept.

I'm not sure what you're getting at re. the BTN and the ACC Network. I'm not saying the ACC Network is as big as the BTN but rather that whatever benefit the Rutgers TV sets have for the Big Ten could have been had by the ACC.