Should be a great get for Northwestern .... He has 3 years left eligibility wise ...
FC: Hunter Johnson transferring to Northwestern
- Thread starter bwifan
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http://www.thestate.com/sports/college/acc/clemson-university/article212960704.html
For those you, like me, who needed a little more context....he is a (now former) Clemson QB who is from Indiana.
For those you, like me, who needed a little more context....he is a (now former) Clemson QB who is from Indiana.
That's about as good as it gets for landing a transfer. I know he already got beat out by that Trevor Lawrence down in Clemson, but you gotta think the kid can still sling it pretty good?
Sorry 'ro you are correct ... Bad assumption on my part. #1 recruit overall and a very good qb should be a really solid pickup for Fitz
Huge get for Fitz...Illinois and Northwestern were the first two schools that were mentioned for him. Thorson next year than possibly Hunter for 3....Northwestern could be relevant in the west
I always thought the name "Hunter Johnson" was a bad alternative porn name.
That's a huge get for NW. I believe we'll only play him once, though.
Too bad he didn't go to Michigan. He could have been eligible immediately!
Too bad he didn't go to Michigan. He could have been eligible immediately!
Glad to see it. Northwestern was a really dangerous team with mobile QBs like Kafka, Siemian.
But for some reason Fitz has gotten away from that and loves big tall pocket QBs now.
Thorson is pretty mobile for a big kid but he's not mobile enough when the pocket breaks down. Maybe NW is developing a Wisconsin type OL program but we didn't see much sign of that last year.
As for Johnson, I dunno, maybe he's a future NFL player but transfers like this consistently get overrated because people are looking at their high school accolades rather than their actual college performance.
Besides, Thorson is a good NFL QB prospect but that doesn't mean a whole lot when you have an OL that can't protect you and receivers who can't get open.
If I were coaching at any level of college football right now I would be recruiting QBs with mobility. That is where the game is right now and where it is likely to be for the next few years at least.
A mobile quarterback can break down secondaries with his feet, a mobile QB can get a few big first downs every game running the ball. Why would anybody give that up in this day and age? You'd think of all people the coach of Northwestern would see this.
To each their own with QB preference but I'm taking Georgia's offense if I'm picking a style. I think the best way for schools like NW to win is pro-stlye offenses. Be Wisconsin. Especially in the Big Ten. In the Big XII or ACC or even Pac XII I might agree with you but not in the Big Ten.
NW has been successful with Thorson. More than with any other QB that you mentioned. He's won 27 games in 3 years.
Also Johnson completed 18 of 22 (or something like that) in limited action last year. It isn't just based on HS numbers--he's shown flashes albeit in limited action.
I get the point you're making I just don't think it's valid in this scenario
NW will never have Georgia's offensive line and receivers. Heck they'll never have Iowa's offensive line, and Iowa's pro-style offense hasn't set the world on fire in recent years.
If you don't have a dominant line and two great wideouts, teams with a strong DL and a good secondary can completely stuff you, which is basically what PSU did to NW and Iowa last year.
On the other hand, if you have a mobile quarterback who can create plays -- a Kafka or McSorley, one great receiver and one pass-catching running back, and half of a good OL, you can sustain drives and score points on anybody.
Why do you think Kafka was better than Thorson when they were more successful with Thorson under center? Kafka went 8-5 in his only year as a starter. Thorson has won 10 games twice.
Other than Kain Colter they have always looked for passing first QBs. Kafka wasn't a dual threat guy--he was pass first. Kafka was throwing the ball nearly 40 times a game in 2009. Dan Persa wasn't a dual threat guy. He ran a decent amount in 2010 but almost none in 2011. Siemian, who you mentioned before, almost never ran the ball. Thorson ran more in his freshman year than Siemian ever did then Fitz put the reigns on him. I know I watch a lot more NW football than most but I think you're judging things when you see them play Penn State as opposed to their entire season and their actual success.
Northwestern's offensive plan has never changed. If he gets a QB like Kain Colter he'll utilize their running ability but he's getting the best QB available and going from there.
Northwestern doesn't have to get Georgia's talent to be successful--at least in their terms. You believe teams like Northwestern and Iowa would be better off in the Big Ten running a spread. I think that's absolutely wrong and that's why Iowa and Northwestern have been very consistent...even if that's only being competitive. No delusions of what their ceiling is
It amazes me anyone could see Northwestern signing Hunter Johnson and try to claim this is somehow not one of the best things that have happened to the Northwestern program in years. Johnson may or may not work out but this is a huge get and you want to say they should go back to a system they never ran
You realize Iowa almost beat us last year, yes? And Michigan State beat us with that style offense. Northwestern had no chance against us because they were still breaking in the young WRs (see how they progressed) and Justin Jackson wasn't completely healthy yet. We were also just significantly better. Check out what we did against the teams that run the spread in the Big Ten
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A really good post, especially the part pertaining to Fitzgerald recognizing that he needs more that a "minny skinny" QB who can throw for intermediate yardage and run for a few yards before going out of bounds.
Neither Kafka nor Siemian were running QBs.
Both were pocket QBs w/ enough mobility to extend plays (Kafka having the better legs), but neither were like Persa or Colter.
While Colter was fairly limited as a passer (was more like a RB playing the QB position), Persa was a true dual-threat QB.
Thorson has good straightline speed (faster than Kafka), but doesn't have the wiggle.
HJ did pretty well in the limited action he saw at Clemson and Dabo really wanted him to stay.
Plus, HJ is faster than Thorson (was on his all-state 4x400 relay team).
HJ is mobile enough.
The best thing for a QB playing behind a porous O-line is being able to read defenses and get rid of the ball quickly; plus, HJ is mobile enough to extend passing plays w/ his legs.
The problem w/ many so-called dual-threat QBs is that they really aren't dual-threat, as seen w/ Kain Colter or PSU's own experiences w/ Kevin Newsome, Rob Bolden and Paul Jones - all 4* DT QBs who couldn't beat out a walk-on pro-style QB.
To be fair, a lot of that had to do w/ the D; Kafka never got to play w/ a D as good as Thorson has (for 2 of those seasons, among the 3 best defenses since the Fitz led '95 and '96 seasons).
While Kafka wasn't a DT QB, he had pretty decent straightline speed.
Kafka set a school and B1G record for rushing by a QB (since broken) when he rushed for 217 yds on 27 attempts against Minny; and later in the season, ran for 83 yds against dOSU.
The next season, as Kafka was improved as a passer, there was less need to rely on his legs.
Persa was a true dual threat QB; in fact, could say that he was a triple-threat.
Was a threat passing the ball (from the pocket), a threat running the ball and a threat using his legs to extend plays for the passing game.
The reason why Persa didn't run much 2011 was b/c had had re-injured his achilles which had shortened his season the prior year, so had to stay in the pocket.
As for Siemian, he had enough mobility to extend plays w/ his legs, but for some reason, NU's OC kept Siemian in the pocket (like a sitting duck), until the towards the end of Trevor's SR season (when the OC finally allowed Trevor to move out of the pocket).
But Siemian, like Kafka and Thorson are pocket passers w/ enough mobility to extend plays w/ their legs and keep defenses honest.
Trevor was slower than Kafka and Thorson, but he was better at keeping passing plays alive; whenever he ran, he would keep his eyes down the field and look for an open receiver (something that Thorson needs to keep working on.
Colter was a tuck and run QB, and despite his more natural gifts as a runner, had a higher sack rate than Siemian.
One thing the addition of HJ may do is to attract more WR and O-line talent (tho, coaching may have large part to do w/ underwhelming NU trench play); HJ already will play w/ his top receiving target from HS (a 2019 commit).
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Katatonic, the only thing we really disagree about is Persa. Yes, Persa had the ability to run but I never considered him a true dual threat. Which I guess is all how you look at the term. He had the ability to throw the ball but he was a pass-first guy. I don't think I've missed a Northwestern game in over a decade. Kain Colter is the only QB I truly considered a "dual threat" guy though, yes, he was run first. Kafka, Thorson & Siemian all could run but that wasn't something they needed to be successful. Kafka didn't have the D around him that THorson has had but the point remains that when someone is saying that Northwestern was "more dangerous" with Kafka and Siemian than they have been with Thorson they aren't paying attention. Northwestern is very dangerous with Thorson as you know.
I think people around here are just so caught up in our offensive scheme right now they seem to think everyone must run that to be successful which doesn't make sense.
I think people around here are just so caught up in our offensive scheme right now they seem to think everyone must run that to be successful which doesn't make sense.
Well 78SR -
Dan, himself, would tell you that he considered himself a DT QB, as did all the recruiting sites (not that they are always accurate).
All QBs should be pass first; just that many so-called DT QB come into college relatively raw as passers w/ many never really developing that part of their game over the course of their career.
Persa's game reminded me of Russell Wilson's.
Both were pass 1st, and when they broke the pocket looked 1st to extend the pass play before tucking and running.
In his 4 years playing Wilson never broke 500 yds rushing (which Persa did before his injury).
Wilson also never had more than 143 rushing attempts (13 gms) and in his last year w/ Wisky, only had 79 rushing attmps (14 gms).
Before Persa blew his achilles, he had 164 rushing attmps in just 10 gms.
During Persa's SO season (when he played here and there), Dan had more rushing attmps (49) than attempted passes (34), as he was still learning to be a passer in the college game.
In HS, Persa was the first player in Pennsylvania history to throw for over 2,000 yards and rush for over 1,000 yards in a single season, and for his HS career, had 2,526 rushing yards.
As for Colter, while he was a running QB, wouldn't exactly consider him a DT QB, as he wasn't exactly a threat as a passer.
Just curious - is there a reason why you watch all the NU games?
Dan, himself, would tell you that he considered himself a DT QB, as did all the recruiting sites (not that they are always accurate).
All QBs should be pass first; just that many so-called DT QB come into college relatively raw as passers w/ many never really developing that part of their game over the course of their career.
Persa's game reminded me of Russell Wilson's.
Both were pass 1st, and when they broke the pocket looked 1st to extend the pass play before tucking and running.
In his 4 years playing Wilson never broke 500 yds rushing (which Persa did before his injury).
Wilson also never had more than 143 rushing attempts (13 gms) and in his last year w/ Wisky, only had 79 rushing attmps (14 gms).
Before Persa blew his achilles, he had 164 rushing attmps in just 10 gms.
During Persa's SO season (when he played here and there), Dan had more rushing attmps (49) than attempted passes (34), as he was still learning to be a passer in the college game.
In HS, Persa was the first player in Pennsylvania history to throw for over 2,000 yards and rush for over 1,000 yards in a single season, and for his HS career, had 2,526 rushing yards.
As for Colter, while he was a running QB, wouldn't exactly consider him a DT QB, as he wasn't exactly a threat as a passer.
Just curious - is there a reason why you watch all the NU games?
I will admit I have a narrow persepctive. I don't care about NW's overall record. Really I only care about NW as far as their ability to threaten PSU. They have been very pesky with mobile QBs. I think they are less of a threat with big tall NFL style QBs. If last year's game was an indication of what's to come in this series, I'm all for it. I guess I'm getting old but I could do with a few less nailbiters and a few more blowouts.
Northwestern has been my "second team" since the mid 90s. I loved the Rose Bowl run under Gary Barnett and Fitzgerald was my favorite player at the time. Just kept following him and Northwestern. They're a team that I always found very easy to root for. Dan Vitale is one of my all-time favorite players--same with Anthony Walker Jr and Colin Ellis. Ibraheim Campbell as well
I understand what you're saying with Colter being a "running QB" and I agree Persa could make plays with his legs when the play broke down but that's not a dual threat QB IMO. I mean, Thorson can run as well if not better than Persa IMO. Honestly, Persa might be one of my least favorite NW QBs in the past 20 years so I might be a little too harsh on him in the evaluation but never would but him in that "dual threat" box
I mean, Northwestern's goal shouldn't be to scheme to beat Penn State. It should just be to give them the best chance to win games. Someone could have just watched us against Michigan two years ago and said that we were better off with a NFL style QB instead of a dual threat guy like McSorley. Northwestern is doing things the right way IMO--you find the best possible players and alter scheme to fit their strengths. Pretty sure pro-style QBs have given us more trouble than dual threat guys. See our losses the past 2 years. Darnold, Lewerke, Barrett, Peterman and Speight are the QBs that have beat us. Only Barrett is a dual threat and he picked us apart in the air. Northwestern didn't lose to us because Thorson's a drop back passer. Personally, I'd rather face a dual threat QB than a great passer any day. JMO.
Same here (but reverse), Penn State is my 2nd team.
Well, we're just going to have to disagree about that.
A DT QB is one who can make plays w/ his arm or legs and Persa could do both (in addition to using his legs to set up making a play w/ his arm).
Opposing DC's fretted about Persa getting out of the box; while he didn't have great top speed, he was a crafty runner and a better runner than Thorson (who has pretty decent speed, but can pretty much only run in a straight line).
In addition, during his 2 years starting, Persa carried the NU team on his back.
The recruiting services listed Persa as a DT QB and during the 2010 season, Dan rushed for 9 TDs (in 10 gms).
The only other QB in the Top 25 for scoring (Top 15 in TDs) that season was Denard Robinson (14 TDs in 13 gms).
Persa was also 2nd in Total Offense (310 yds/gm).
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