ESU adds women’s wrestling
- Thread starter Chickenman Testa
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If I have heard correct one of the reasons men's wrestling is limited to 9.9 is due to Title IX. This is one area where big time football hurts everything else.
If women's wrestling takes off, could it possibly open up wrestling to get a more reasonable 15 scholarships per team? Isn't the 9.9 limitation due more to title IX than affordability or budget? Anyone out there have a good handle on this question?
I assume both teams then need to share facilities, how is that working out for the schools where there is a woman's W team today? Split the room? Of course a lot of sports share facilities.
If women's wrestling takes off, could it possibly open up wrestling to get a more reasonable 15 scholarships per team? Isn't the 9.9 limitation due more to title IX than affordability or budget? Anyone out there have a good handle on this question?
I assume both teams then need to share facilities, how is that working out for the schools where there is a woman's W team today? Split the room? Of course a lot of sports share facilities.
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Some fyi's...
If women's wrestling takes off
Long, long, long way to go. The Emerging Sports for Women process requires, I believe, 20 schools to show a commitment to a sport, which has a long laundry list of requirements. And that just gets the sport on the list of Emerging Sports, which Women's Wrestling is not today. That is followed by continued annual evaluations until there's evidence that the sport can be sustained by enough NCAA member schools to warrant support. It's a slow, slow process.
9.9 limitation
Wrestling is an equivalency sport that went from 11 to 9.9 equivalent scholarships, at the same time all men's equivalency sports took a 10% hit (yes, related to Title IX). We only talk wrestling here, but it's not in some kind of silo...it's connected, by virtue of NCAA rules, to all other sports. 15 scholarships isn't close to "reasonable", and even a minor tick up has wide-ranging consequences in the bigger picture. 9.9 is here to stay (normally I'd add a "imo" here, though in this case I say it with confidence). Someone above mentioned that many D1 schools aren't fully funded too...another factor against increasing scholarships.
share facilities
I do believe Women's Wrestling will become an NCAA sport. My age may start with an "8" when it happens, though I may see it grow and become an Emerging Sport by the time I'm 70...time will tell. Resources (practice facilities, coaching staffs, venue for competitions, etc.) are an issue, and are related to the commitment noted above for the schools committing to an Emerging Sport.
Lastly, the comment above that big time football hurts everything else just isn't true, imo. Re. football scholarships, they went to 105 (1973), to 95 (1978), to 85 (1992), where they are today, so Title IX impacted football too. And for most schools, football, along with possibly men's basketball, are the revenue sports that allow the wrestlings of the world to even exist.
From a money standpoint, men's and women's wrestling would be pretty cheap to do. It is not like say track where they need a stadium, track, pole vaults,and a bunch of other equipment. Women's wrestling would definitely help the men's stay stable and also grow. I hope it happens.
I think Football is going to start declining and will be less prevalent at the smaller schools (low to mid tier) in the near future. That also will free up some money and resources for wrestling. Football is starting to be attacked by the liberals under the guise of concerned moms and doctors trying to prevent concussions and who knows who else. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.
I think Football is going to start declining and will be less prevalent at the smaller schools (low to mid tier) in the near future. That also will free up some money and resources for wrestling. Football is starting to be attacked by the liberals under the guise of concerned moms and doctors trying to prevent concussions and who knows who else. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.
I'm an independent voter and I'm concerned about concussions. Andre Waters and Junior Seau were a couple of my favorite players. I don't see it as political.
You're talking about having available facilities, which is a critical piece for schools that are limited.
We are very blessed at PSU to have what we have, facility-wise...but maybe the money side of things would surprise some...
By recent filings, wrestling is the 4th highest EXPENSE sport at PSU, behind football, men's and women's basketball, and men's ice hockey, and on par with women's ice hockey and women's volleyball. On the REVENUE side, wrestling is 4th highest among men's sports, again behind football, men's basketball and men's ice hockey.
Yeah, I believe we've hit peak football, and maybe liberals are leading the charge RE concussions, but the fact that more and more a-list type athletes are retiring early--you know moms and dads of all political persuasions are going to follow suit. Of course, the national anthem/Kapernick debate isn't helping the NFL's bottom line either.
I mean, it's not like you'll find many (conservative or otherwise) parents willing to spritz their kids with DDT before going outside anymore. How long the decline is, or how far down it goes is definitely an open question, but I can tell you in my household, wrestling is a "ok, fine" discussion regarding my boys--but football is another matter altogether. So maybe our beloved sport has an opportunity.
It might surprise some that wrestling has a higher competition concussion rate than football. According to statistics compiled by the NCAA, wrestling has a 3.2 concussions per 1000 athlete-exposures, while football is at 3.0 and men's hockey at 2.3. As I understand it, athlete-exposures are based on games/matches. Football, having far more student-athletes involved in a game, than wrestlers at a match/tournament, have far more concussions, therefore gets a ton of press, particularly with what's happening in pro football.
I just thought the RATE of concussions in wrestling was surprising.
Roar, do you have a link to those financial numbers? I'd like to see those. Surprised women's volleyball expenses are not higher than wrestling, just due to the travel involved with having more matches.
That is interesting. Though with CTE, the research is showing that the major concussions may not be the major factor originally assumed--rather many "micro events" over the course of a career. Maybe the rate of those is higher in wrestling too, but I kinda doubt it.
No idea. It appears to me the study of concussion-related injury/illness is advancing rapidly, after many years of what I'll call denial by some.
From an NCAA standpoint, I believe Sports-Related Concussion info started appearing in print as a health/safety concern about 1994. Recent additions to the wrestling rulebook re. protocol for possible concussion showed up just last year (I think that's right).
I would think Track and Field would be more expensive as well do to the large size of the teams.
Seems the concerns are
1. Number and severity of the concussions
2. Frequency of the concussions, getting another one while not recovered
3. Repeated small blows to the head
To me common sense would indicate that banging your head especially with a developing brain is not good for your brain. Of course some things are unavoidable.
Lots of folks share these concerns, regardless of political persuasions. There are ways to make things better without mandates from some know nothing politician or know nothing NCAA flunky. That said, sometimes that is exactly what is needed to jump start the discussion.
Americans love competitive sports......I don’t think football or any sport for that matter is going anywhere......except to grow. Which is good. Technology will continue to increase the number of folks watching, while those watching live will shrink. Follow the money
You may not want ncaa or political flunkies to make the decisions, but you also don't want the people running the money sports making them either. There is a lot of good information in the medical literature regarding brain injuries, although we certainly don't know it all. I have been to a number of meetings in this regard. In the NFL in particular, but in many other sports as well, the medical information/recommendations are ignored when the conclusions are not for the benefit of the league. Many NFL players are permitted to play with head injuries under the guise of "they are adults and they knew the risks and wanted to play anyway"
If there is to be any headway in this field, we will need to actually make decisions based on the medical facts. In many ways this discussion mirrors what I have heard in the past about climate change. Overall we want what we want, but ultimately the facts/reality will prevail.
If there is to be any headway in this field, we will need to actually make decisions based on the medical facts. In many ways this discussion mirrors what I have heard in the past about climate change. Overall we want what we want, but ultimately the facts/reality will prevail.
Maybe I should not have made it sound like only liberals were leading the charge against football. The problems have existed for a long time. My point is that once the liberal media starts to attack it, the end is probably coming. They get organized and preach it and make sure we hear the info they want us to hear. They are fairly effective with shaping public opinion in a lot of cases. They do a good job of showing the side of an issue they want to show. My point was now the attacks will become more prevalent and the strength and power of football will diminish. Maybe Alabama and PSU and some other big programs will thrive, but it won't be as popular as it was. Peak football is a good term.
My brothers or I nor any of my children played football. The reason is it is too dangerous in my opinion and my parents. Did not mean to offend anyone who considers themselves a liberal. Sorry, if I did.
My brothers or I nor any of my children played football. The reason is it is too dangerous in my opinion and my parents. Did not mean to offend anyone who considers themselves a liberal. Sorry, if I did.
I live in Colorado, Colorado Mesa just added Women's wrestling here. Took my kids to the first dual, it was awesome. Bo Piphers sister is on the team.
The facts and medical truth are very good at shaping public opinion. Thank god for the 4th estate and the fine work they do for the Untied States reporting these facts and then letting us make decisions based on them.
Gannon university in Erie started womens wrestling also. Div 2 of the psac. Season is currently underway.
who is going to pay for women's wrestling at PSU? The AD is already hemorrhaging money. The only way PSU can add any teams at this point is if a Terry Pegula type benefactor steps up and funds the entire operation for the new team.
Article by Phil Anastasia in the Philadelphia Inquirer today about girls wrestling exploding at Kingsway in NJ.
http://www2.philly.com/high-school-...new-jersey-high-school-kingsway-20181212.html
May be behind a paywal for those of you that have used up your free articles on here for the month, but the gist of the story is that in the first year that the NJSIAA has sponsored girls wrestling, Kingsway has FORTY girls on their team. You read that right.
Quoted in the article are team members Alexis Firestone (sister of RU wrestler Zach) and Morgan Atkinson (sister of Kingsway regional champ Stanley). Others quoted include Upper Dublin HS coach Joe Stabilito, Jr. who has been pushing the PIAA on this issue for years. Looks like this is really gaining traction here. Very cool article.
http://www2.philly.com/high-school-...new-jersey-high-school-kingsway-20181212.html
May be behind a paywal for those of you that have used up your free articles on here for the month, but the gist of the story is that in the first year that the NJSIAA has sponsored girls wrestling, Kingsway has FORTY girls on their team. You read that right.
Quoted in the article are team members Alexis Firestone (sister of RU wrestler Zach) and Morgan Atkinson (sister of Kingsway regional champ Stanley). Others quoted include Upper Dublin HS coach Joe Stabilito, Jr. who has been pushing the PIAA on this issue for years. Looks like this is really gaining traction here. Very cool article.
Out here in WA the girls wrestle right next to the boys at state. Its booming with something like 1200 girls. They are taking about splitting state between large schools and small to accommodate the numbers. Our coach didn't really like girls wrestling 4 years ago but then one joined the team and now he's recruiting girls. If he gets three more they can add a head coach.
When the grassroots (middle school, high school) programs exist in enough states, and gain popularity with fans, I believe we'll start seeing more D1 colleges get on board. Facilities and other resources, as was discussed earlier, will be issues...more at some schools than others, but still an issue.
Re. Pennsylvania, I remember Wyoming Seminary announcing a high school women's wrestling start-up. Are there others?
Re. Pennsylvania, I remember Wyoming Seminary announcing a high school women's wrestling start-up. Are there others?
Sounds like the woman you live with is attacking football under the guise of being a concerned mom.
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