Emmert on CBS right now (FULL INTERVIEW)
- Thread starter ChiTownLion
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The student athletes. Many of whom have to work out and practice (even on their own) damn near 24/7 so they can compete at that level. It’s a choice they make, sure, but I don’t see why simply because they are enrolled in college they cannot make money off of their efforts and talents. Anyone else can.
Correct, but the point I was seeing is that it's not entirely up to the school at large to make decisions like that if a single alum can independently choose to throw million dollar endorsement deals at players. Granted, as you said, very difficult academic standards mean it would still be tough to land the top players.
The NCAA is not and never has been about the student athletes, nor are the colleges. It's about the money.
Sure, I'll give you some reasons:
1. They already make money. It's called FREE COLLEGE (which includes tuition, room, board, books, supplies, computer, insurance, snacks, etc), along with FREE training from some of the best trainers available. In addition, they are now getting a stipend of about $4k per year for "run around" money.
2. Having a few "highly" paid individuals on a team would destroy the team and therefore destroy the sport. My guess (yes, my guess) is that those few athletes complaining are the ones with the lowest potential earnings. The couple of dozen that may make some money are probably working hard to prepare for their futures.
3. If any particular player is so valuable in the market place then they should leave school and enter the market. Nothing is stopping them from doing so today. Oh, a don't give me the 3 years after HS thing that the NFL enforces. If they are so valuable in the market, go to the market and wait until they are eligible. No problem.
4. People like me pay the bills because we enjoy watching college student/athletes compete and do well. If they start paying large sums I'll stop watching those teams altogether. I'm sure most other college fans would as well because that wouldn't be "college" but instead would be professional. I don't like actual pro sports much now and I really wouldn't like the half-ass version of college pro sports.
5. Because people like you with no vision or knowledge of history push your BS down everyone's throat without a single thought that there may be another side and that other side may just in fact be better than your agenda.
They do make money off their efforts along with a lot of other benefits that “regular” college students don’t get. Most kids work that hard so they can play college sports...that’s their goal, so now achieving their goal isn’t enough? Now they need to get paid more money for doing something they’ve wanted to do most of their lives?
1. If a college gives me a full academic scholarship I can still go out and get a job/internship and get paid from private companies. But student athletes can’t because it would ruin your enjoyment of the sport. Got it. So the university owns their “time” and their ability to earn a living because they are getting an athletic scholarship. Academic scholarships don’t work that way, but this is different because... .
2. Your opinion. Pro teams are full of people that earn a lot of money and people that earn the league minimum. So I don’t really get how a few players being able to get sponsorship deals would ruin a team or an entire sport.
3. That’s laughable. No player can sit out three years without playing or participating in practices and get drafted in such a highly competitive sport. Many kids in college that already work their asses off to make it to the pro’s don’t because it’s the elite of the elite in a league like the NFL.
4. You should be embarrassed that you even wrote that. You can’t earn a living, kid, because I like to see poor struggling young men play a sport. It’s more enjoyable for me that way.
5. Vision? Agenda? I’m simply talking about American citizens being allowed to earn a living off of the fruits of their labor like anyone else, even students receiving full rides to college for academic reasons. I’m not talking about whether the schools should have to pay the student-athletes like they’re employees. I’m on the fence about that because while they generate millions for their schools I’m not sure how they could be seen as being employees.
And some guys in those sports benefited from some time in college. Like Mike Schmidt for one. I have a feeling pitchers might too, as they would not be overworked. One reason, IMHO, that Nolan Ryan lasted so long with a lot of speed is that he did not pitch that many innings until after he was ca. 25 or so due to injuries. The bones are often still growing and that much velocity can cause damage during that time.
Some of this is no different than a lot of unions. They have an apprenticeship program. The kids in those programs do not make much money at all--because they are learning. Later on, they do.
I think Maurice Clarette is a good example of that. He was so banged up by his year in *college*....
I'm sorry. I didn't realize how clueless you are and I'll make sure to never again respond directly to you. What you typed is absolutely laughable.
I know of no one who has paid for their childs HS sports participation fee who expects them to gain a college ship. with it. I'm sure it happens but I have not witnessed it.
I think both school and student have obligations. If not met the contract is broken on either side but should be for a duration of the generally accepted length to graduation. If not it becomes a pro mentality not a student/athlete mentality.
It is immaterial what the goals of most student-athletes are. I’m talking about principal here. And I’m not kidding. American citizens (adults) are being told that they cannot be compensated for their labor beyond a scholarship because... . That’s what no one can answer. I don’t see how it’s legal to be quite honest with you. The NCAA is telling adults that they don’t own their own image (by image I mean an “image” that is created by their athletic feats, not just their likeness. Maybe that’s the wrong use of the word.) and cannot use their own image to make money because to do so would somehow ruin this thing we call amateurism. Meanwhile the universities, NCAA, television networks, apparel companies, et al can make millions off of their images and the fruits of their labor (their athletic prowess). This is why I don’t begrudge professional athletes, musicians, and actors for the millions they make. If they help generate the revenue they deserve to be compensated for it.
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Please explain why it’s laughable. If it’s so laughable you ought to be able to easily say why without resulting to ad hominem attacks. If you cannot then you’ve just betrayed how weak your position is.
This happens a lot with internships, frankly. Many are unpaid.
Yeah, but If you were in college and some company approached you and said we’ll pay you X to use your image...no one would tell you that you couldn’t, correct? That it would somehow ruin your “amateur” status as a scholarship student and mean you’d lose your scholarship and ability to attend college. But if you’re a student athlete all of the sudden the rules change and you can no longer profit from your likeness. That’s all I’m saying.
I think most universities have Presidents, not Principals. That's for high school.
It’s not the athletes bringing in the revenue, it’s the school. The athletes change every three to four years, but the sports revenue keeps coming in....I wonder why that is.
Sure. You’re right on one level. But people don’t fill the seats to watch a bunch of losers stink up the joint (see Pitt). So fielding a winning team is hugely important to the health of the program. Lose enough and they’ll be empty seats even in Beaver Stadium.
The agreements signed by athletes and schools are not contracts and are so vague or so loaded in favor of the schools than any attorney representing an athlete would be disbarred if he allowed his client to sign.
No, they absolutely have not. In the case of the NFL, I am certain and I can't believe the NBA would be so stupid not to follow that example.
They get more than a scholarship. They get incredible food, clothes, first class accomodations, 4k TVs, video games, tutoring, $1,000 bowl prizes, theme parks, etc. On top of that they get nearly $5k spending money each year. Very few if any regular students can match that with outside employment.
Why do people act like tuition and room and board is a compensation at actual value? The costs of those are so artificially jacked up it's ridiculous anyone could use that as a valid basis of compensation, especially when universities get to arbitrarily state what that number is.
But “regular” students could get equivalent benefits, or even more, if their skill set allowed them to, and it wouldn’t jeopardize their abilty to attend college, nor would they lose a scholarship that gave them the ability to attend college. I get that everyone is afraid that boosters will just buy players (although I’m sure as the FBI investigation is showing that that already happens). I just don’t understand how an adult can be kept from earning money from their likeness (image) and skills when those are an integral part of a multi-million dollar enterprise. In a situation like that they deserve to be compensated for their contributions to the millions of dollars being generated in revenue. Corporations like to refer to this as merit based pay. But let’s say they are not employees - I’m fine with that for the sake of this argument. If they’re not employees of the university or the NCAA then why/how can the NCAA deny them the right to earn money off of endorsements? It’s their skills and work that leads to companies wanting to endorse them, but they can’t earn anything from their images or the particular skill sets they possess because the NCAA says so...but never provides a compelling reason as to why that is a rule. Meanwhile (let’s use Barkley), Barkley’s image is used to promote games in ads, the Nike swoosh adorns the jersey and shoes he wears, Penn State probably used his image to sell tickets. They can all earn money off of his likeness and skills...but he can’t. Everyone can be compensated for what only he can do but him. I just don’t see how that is deemed fair in any sense of the word. Remember, these are adults not minors.
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Again, he is earning money even beyond tuition and room and board. And now look how much he’s making. I’d say it’s working out just fine for Barkley. These athletes live pretty darn well and a for the vast majority of them the school makes no money off their image or likeness. For every Barkley there’s hundreds of athletes who never see the field, or get their picture on anything, or even get recognized. Yet high school students come out in droves every year hoping to play a college sport. Must not be too bad of a gig.
I would agree with you 99.999%. Let's see how this guy we call the President of The Pennsylvania State University performs. Fore the most part so far, its been playing like an organ grinder monkey.I think most universities have Presidents, not Principals. That's for high school.
In the past, I would watch President Spanier on the Penn News channel deliver his yearly budget to the Commonwealth's committee. He was like a 5'8" wolverine. In fortunately, Corbett saw our President as a threat, an so the story begins more than six yrars ago after that meeting.
Colleges and televisions networks use the images of these student athletes all of the time in ads and you don’t think they earn money off of their skills or likenesses? If that was the case recruiting wouldn’t be such a big deal because the schools would rake in all this dough anyway. Barkley is making money now. Lucky for him he didn’t suffer a career ending injury. Some of you guys just don’t want to “get it.” These players contribute to a multi-billion dollar industry and get a scholarship as “payment.” That’s not okay and it will change. It has to. America - home of the meritocracy...except when it’s not.
This thought has crossed my mind several times.
NCAA is the biggest organized crime - free labor, billions in income. Criminal.
How about you just pay the kids in college whatever boosters want to give them and they can play for a school as long as they meet the scholastic requirements of the General school population.
The problem w/ earning money for likeness or any income outside the University or the pretend ncaa is that boosters will take advantage.
Are you ok if a freshman star to be puts a used t-shirt on ebay for $25K and a booster purchases it? Just like he promised him he would before signing day?
Are you ok if a freshman star to be puts a used t-shirt on ebay for $25K and a booster purchases it? Just like he promised him he would before signing day?
I appreciate both of these view points. I think a lot of athletes pursuit college careers in other sports because they love the game the play and want to test them self at the highest level they can possibly achieve.
And yes, the athletes do get perks that the general population does not enjoy. Hand picked course schedule, better accommodations, better meal plans, personal tutors, etc. I think that is fair, they also have time demands that the general population does not have as well.
And yes, there are many “nameless” football players whose image is not used, but they are still part of the machine.
I think the argument that their scholarship is their payment is antiquated. I say let the boosters give them whatever (it happens anyway). Just make them meet the scholastic standards of entrance that a regular student is subject to. That will make some of these places think hard and deep about what they want.
Finally - I do agree that what college football and basketball will be in 10 years or so will be vastly different than what we have right now
We are at such tipping points in so many facets at a society. A real change to many things is coming.
doing chores and running around today, I am getting a huge kick out of these radio talking heads acting like they are surprised by this. Seriously? I know two NBA players, a guy that used to be a financial agent, and a couple of guys that played at a high college level. I knew this stuff was going on but had no hard evidence. This has been talked about in hallways and camps for several decades.
Have you ever put a kid through college? The scholarship would be more than enough....please tell me what job a college student could get that pays that kind of money? Also, they get way more than just the scholarship. How much do you want these kids to make? I don’t think playing a college sport should make anyone rich. The idea of college is to get someone ready for their career....if that career is a sport, then college is getting them ready for it.
It works in the NHL and MLB, why not the NFL and NBA? Because of the money everyone around it is making. That’s why.
You talk about a swamp.. all HS athletes should have a choice to got to college or play ball professionally. You can’t do both. You go to school, you can come out whenever you want to. But you can’t go back. You choose to go pro, you likely go to the “minor” leagues and earn your way to the bigs but you still get paid, just like in baseball and hockey.
The NFL and the NBA need to set up a minor league feeder system and stock it with kids that want the paycheck. There’s a very slim chance any HS athletes will make it to the NBA and NFL right out of HS just like they don’t do it in hockey or baseball. Colleges need to be set aside for the student athlete. It can work. It’s a free market system. It’s not now!
You talk about a swamp.. all HS athletes should have a choice to got to college or play ball professionally. You can’t do both. You go to school, you can come out whenever you want to. But you can’t go back. You choose to go pro, you likely go to the “minor” leagues and earn your way to the bigs but you still get paid, just like in baseball and hockey.
The NFL and the NBA need to set up a minor league feeder system and stock it with kids that want the paycheck. There’s a very slim chance any HS athletes will make it to the NBA and NFL right out of HS just like they don’t do it in hockey or baseball. Colleges need to be set aside for the student athlete. It can work. It’s a free market system. It’s not now!
If we pay football players market value, what becomes of all the other sports and student athletes?
I haven’t. Saving to do so (mine are 7 and 2).
Just like capitalism, they should get whatever someone wants to give them. For those that can’t get any extra, the scholarship would have to be enough.
Hey, I don’t think it is right, but it goes on anyway. So why continue the charade that these athletes are “amateurs”. I agree, playing a couple of years at a college sport shouldn’t make you set for life. But If some booster wants to drop high five or low six figures on a kid so they attend his/her school, what is it to me or you (if they make it legal).
I used to be in the camp of the scholarship should be enough. But you know what, every one else is allowed to go and make money while in college, (and yes, it is not the same amount, but the athlete has a skill set that is coveted more) why should these guys not be in the same boat .
Make it legal and end these ridiculous debates .
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